 Poster: A snowHead
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To avoid topic drift on the other thread. Be as creative/nasty as you want.
I'll start with a few ideas:-
Have their own ski/board school & charge instructors at all the other schools extortionate prices for their lift passes.
Ski school priority lines only for their ski school.
Have their own hire places & undercut the competition.
Discounted lift pass & kit hire if using their school.
Close pistes that pass hold out mountain restaurants, or just don't bash them.
Random closing of links to/from hold out linked resorts. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hasn't Vail already bought control of Crans-Montana? If so, won't their actions at Crans be an indicator of their strategy after any buy-out of Verbier?
So.do we yet have any concrete evidence for changes in operational management coming out of Crans?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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They can’t?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Enormous opportunity for independent instructors/restaurants/etc?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Do they tend to buy hotels over time too?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
Have their own ski/board school & charge instructors at all the other schools extortionate prices for their lift passes.
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But there’s no way they can justify charging MORE for instructor’s lift pass than the general public.
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Ski school priority lines only for their ski school.
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That would work if there’s an orderly “queue”, which doesn’t seem to be the case in European lifts.
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Discounted lift pass & kit hire if using their school.
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I don’t see what’s wrong about that, especially the equipment hire part. There’s also nothing to prevent other ski school to form such an alliance with any independent hire place and offer similar discounts.
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Close pistes that pass hold out mountain restaurants, or just don't bash them.
Random closing of links to/from hold out linked resorts.
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If they do that, people will simply not go there at all. (At least people who cares about mountain restaurants, which is probably the majority, will simply not go there)
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@abc, why couldn’t Vail charge more for a lift pass for non-VR instructors. Plenty of precedents in other field where there is a differentiation between personal vs commercial use.
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Are they selecting Switzerland to avoid EU laws and courts? In addition, do French municipalities/departements/regions aggressively protect their historical influence?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| ulmerhutte wrote: |
| @abc, why couldn’t Vail charge more for a lift pass for non-VR instructors. Plenty of precedents in other field where there is a differentiation between personal vs commercial use. |
Other fields, yes. But not in European ski mountains. So they would have to justify it.
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Have they done/attempted any of these things in Andermatt? Surely looking there would be more productive indication of their intentions.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| adithorp wrote: |
| Have they done/attempted any of these things in Andermatt? Surely looking there would be more productive indication of their intentions. |
Agreed.Plus I think the Crans deal is only going through during this season, so it won't be until next year at the earliest that we see any operational changes.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Switzerland's ski industry is Americanizing.
That means...
1. Price of everything will go up and up and up
2. You will see more celebrities on the slopes
3. Everything inresort must be Instagrammable
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| Whitegold wrote: |
Switzerland's ski industry is Americanizing.
That means...
1. Price of everything will go up and up and up
2. You will see more celebrities on the slopes
3. Everything inresort must be Instagrammable |
So no change then 
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You know it makes sense.
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| Whitegold wrote: |
Switzerland's ski industry is Americanizing.
That means...
1. Price of everything will go up and up and up
2. You will see more celebrities on the slopes
3. Everything inresort must be Instagrammable |
what's the difference?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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How they will do it (have done it in the US) is very cheap season/early passes and very expensive day tickets will mean a much higher percentage of visitors are using those season/early passes.
They then offer discounts for pass holders for early booking of rental equipment and lessons with the shops and ski schools they own. It’s hard for independents to compete if a large chunk of their customer base has pre-booked everything in November.
For restaurants it’s harder for them but they could just try to buy as many as possible on the mountain. A restaurant is worth more to a big operator than an independent because once they have bought enough of them they can price monopolistically.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| hold_my_biere wrote: |
How they will do it (have done it in the US) is very cheap season/early passes and very expensive day tickets will mean a much higher percentage of visitors are using those season/early passes.
They then offer discounts for pass holders for early booking of rental equipment and lessons with the shops and ski schools they own. It’s hard for independents to compete if a large chunk of their customer base has pre-booked everything in November.
For restaurants it’s harder for them but they could just try to buy as many as possible on the mountain. A restaurant is worth more to a big operator than an independent because once they have bought enough of them they can price monopolistically. |
That seems logical but not sure the can buy the ESS which is the biggest ski school and not part of Televerbier AIUI and the ski shops are all independent with prices pretty much uniform. Similarly the best restaurants are Independent and the ones owned by Televerbier not very good. One would think they have thought through this and have a clear strategy though… can’t see it being great for local skiers and businesses though if profits are being raked off and going pondside
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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If they raise the pass prices at Andermatt, the weeknd visitors from Zurich (who I suspect make up a big chunk of their custom) will just drive instead to Engelberg or Lenzerheide or Murren etc.
Besides, Andermatt is already quite pricey at 89 CHF a day.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| abc wrote: |
| Quote: |
Ski school priority lines only for their ski school.
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That would work if there’s an orderly “queue”, which doesn’t seem to be the case in European lifts.
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Ski school priority exists and works in most European resorts despite the chaotic queuing. The ski school just have a different entrance which is respected.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| BobinCH wrote: |
| hold_my_biere wrote: |
How they will do it (have done it in the US) is very cheap season/early passes and very expensive day tickets will mean a much higher percentage of visitors are using those season/early passes.
They then offer discounts for pass holders for early booking of rental equipment and lessons with the shops and ski schools they own. It’s hard for independents to compete if a large chunk of their customer base has pre-booked everything in November.
For restaurants it’s harder for them but they could just try to buy as many as possible on the mountain. A restaurant is worth more to a big operator than an independent because once they have bought enough of them they can price monopolistically. |
That seems logical but not sure the can buy the ESS which is the biggest ski school and not part of Televerbier AIUI and the ski shops are all independent with prices pretty much uniform. Similarly the best restaurants are Independent and the ones owned by Televerbier not very good. One would think they have thought through this and have a clear strategy though… can’t see it being great for local skiers and businesses though if profits are being raked off and going pondside |
Ski schools and rental shops they can set up from scratch if they have to. Mountain restaurants, regardless of whether they are good or not, they will have to buy, but they will take a carrot and stick approach by offering a decent price, and simultaneously using their control of the lifts and infrastructure to make the independents life harder operationally.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Lets not pretend Televerbier dont have previous with trying to make life difficult for independent operators! They've already tried excluding some ski schools from priority queues (but not any more).... Maybe they just got more relaxed over the years but I suspect there was at least the threat of legal action..... and a new owner would face the same pushback
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Long standing second home at Mollens, just below Crans Montana - we haven’t seen any practical changes yet - still in transition. But lots of discussion. We may get to a position where we only go to other places - all within 30-60 mins driving. Right now we have to buy annual local pass (550chf) and Magic Pass (400chf) for each of the family to get the access we like. We’re keeping an eye on it. But nothing concrete yet. Commune suing previous owner and operator….gulp.
But Katie is still one of the pisteurs at Aminona….no change being felt yet.
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Yep there are some wealthy people in Verbier and the legal system in Switzerland does not work swiftly in favour of the entity trying to force change - see the Savoleyres lift fiasco for evidence. Everything is possible but I’m not sure it would be so easy for them. But TVRB share price keeps on going up so the smart money suggests it’s happening
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Reality Check:
My next door neighbor works for Televerbier.
She showed my an email from the CEO saying this is all speculation. He has had zero contact from Vail.
Vail have made no statements.
TV has two major shareholders: One that owns something like 40pct, the Commune which owns 25pct.
The word is that the Commune would not countenance Vail buying a controlling stake and that in extremis the Commune would buy out the other big holder.
Apparently the commune is the richest in Switzerland!
Oh...there are no priority lift lanes for ski schools anymore, not for some years.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@rungsp, didn’t Vaucher and the TV Board President go to Vail for a week in January?
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No idea about that @BobinCH.
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FAQ
