 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi all - first time poster but regular visitor. 
I'd be grateful if any of you wise ones could take a minute to give me some feedback on something I'm thinking of embarking on..... Oooh, sounds mysterious!
I'm at a bit of a crossroads, work wise. You know - job I don't like very much, boss who seems to be put here to irritate me, surrounded by semi-neanderthals etc., and am thinking of making a fresh start.
My idea is to put to good use the 20-odd years experience I have of researching, planning, and booking ski trips. I've done this for groups ranging from two people to over twenty; single twenty-somethings on the razz, older groups of couples, families with babies, children and grandparent baby-sitters. Some have been groups of friends and others have been snow-virgin friends of friends who have approached me and asked for help, guidance, enlightenment (OK not the last). The trips have ranged from all-in packages with TOs, to independently booked long weekends and full week/fortnight in small hotels, bigger hotels, pensions and fully catered chalets. I've dealt with no snow, too much snow, snow that keeps drifting, transfer buses that don't arrive or leave passengers in isolated town squares at 10 p.m awaiting reps who are propping up the bar in the Bier Haus, injuries (theirs not mine), sick children, hung over parents, stroppy ski instructors, resolutely non-English speaking hire shop owners. etc. The point of this ramble is to demonstrate that I do know a fair bit about the subject. I am also a very experienced PA and administrator with many years of bossing people around under my belt.
I am preparing to approach some regional corporate event/hospitality companies (close to my home area) whose portfolio currently doesn't appear to offer ski trips. I would plan to either suggest we begin marketing the product and develop this side for them on a freelance basis, or offer my PA skills with a view to being on hand when enquiries are made for ski trips. I do know some execs and MD's who have tried to find this service outside London and been unable, which suggests it may be a gap in the market.
(Nearly finished - stick with me). Can any of you offer me your views on whether this might be a goer? Not for the likes of you lot obviously, as you are huge vats of experience and information and don't need hand-holding, but for newbies to the fine art of ski-ing. Constructive suggestions / comments will be very welcome. Don't let my current vulnerability and crisis of confidence make you hold back  Thanks!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Madaboutsnow, welcome to snowHeads - As a poster!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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laundryman, Thanks!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Madaboutsnow, It would seem you have more experience then me in this matter already. Welcome, but no advice I'm afraid.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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How would you make money doing this?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Madaboutsnow, I wonder if working for or with one or more conference companies would have any mileage: skiing 9-3, lectures/presentations 3.30 - 7.30, dinner/après 8-late?
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... or the marmotte ate my homework. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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gregh, Depending on what comes about when I make the proposal, either a 'normal' job with one events company exclusively, generally administering their usual business (depends on who/what they have in place already) and then dealing with the ski-specific enquiries (this would be preferable) or freelancing for one or more, on either a 'chargeable hours' basis or pre-agreed job cost, dependent on the amount of work needed to make it happen. It may be seen as a risky or low-interest option to have in their portfolio, but a couple of successful events would make the difference.
laundryman, This is the type of option I'm going to suggest. The types of events companies I'm targeting deal with all sorts of corporate and non-corporate events (conferences, team-building, straightforward beanos)
Thanks all so far - keep 'em coming!
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Frosty the Snowman, laundryman, 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Madaboutsnow wrote: |
| (Nearly finished - stick with me). Can any of you offer me your views on whether this might be a goer? Not for the likes of you lot obviously, as you are huge vats of experience and information |
Madaboutsnow welcome. I cannot offer any advice.
Ps 'the huge vats of experience and information' are normally known on here as 'the lardy lot'. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Hi. One at least of the more up market TOs (Powder Byrne?) offers a 'corporate trip' ski service, so there's presumably some sort of market (they run it alongside their regular hols, so they don't have to rely on it, I assume).
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Jonpim attends his anaesthetics conference in january each year, in La Plagne. That is probably give you an idea. He's not about much, but i'll try and find some threads on it.
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You know it makes sense.
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Latchigo, Thanks!richmond, I'm thinking on these lines for the companies I will approach - smaller, regional companies with a successful 'usual' business in Race Days, Henley, Golf competitions etc., but the ski offerings aren't there. The question will be is that because there's no interest or because the events company have no experience or knowledge. I'll know soon!
Thanks again -
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Helen Beaumont, thank you too! Very kind!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
Jonpim attends his anaesthetics conference in january each year, in La Plagne
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delightfully nicknmed "anaesthepiste"
I have been on a GP ski conference organised by a guy called Tony Davis, the business named Wider Horizons. I don't think they run any more, but Tony might be willing to part with his mailing list for a consideration. I will pm you last know contact details. As you know we GPs are now fabulously wealthy (don't believe everything the papers tell you!) and so there would almost certainly be a market for something like this
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Madaboutsnow, It sounds like a great idea to me. I come from a small TO side of things and we had a corporate group that came out last year to our chalet and it was a real success. For us finding someone who could be the middle person linking the people who want to go on the corporate trips and the people who want to have them would be great. As far as I am aware none of the larger agencies focus particularly on corporate groups (alright there are probably one or two but none of the major ones that we deal with) and if they do it is just one department and if you are a small company like us you tend to be a small fish in a big pond! The other thing that I have heard a lot is people working for the types of companies that would have the potential to offer ski trips saying how much they would like to do it, but as there is not a dedicated person who has time at work to research and organise such things it invariably never happens. If you could do all the hard work for a company like that and then just present them with a package I think a lot more people would go for it. I'm sure that there must be potential to make money out of it. Presumably you would make commission from the TO's and then perhaps an organising fee from the groups? Another way of blostering your income at the start if you were to work free lance might be to investigate being a home based sales person for someone like Skiline. It would just be dealing with normal ski holidays but would allow you to have a bit more of a steady income and would also not be unrelated to the area that you are trying to expand your business into! Go for it! 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Wow guys! I knew it was a good idea to ask you lot! Thanks for all the positive feedback and direction - I'm feeling much more confident now! (There's no emoticon for blowing a kiss so - MWAH!)
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Martin Nicholas, katski, Grateful for any leads and info so thanks again!
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An interventional-radiologist friend of mine goes to a relevant conference in Val d'Isere each year.
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Madaboutsnow, I also think it would be a really good idea. I'm sure there's a niche there that's currently waiting to be filled.
It would also be a good summer thing for team-building. Just think - skiing in the am, via ferrata/canyoning/rafting/climbing wall whatever in the afternoon. We have a conference centre here now too!!
Problem from the point of view of the small local business is the cost of advertising to get to the corporate market, and I suspect that because the companies don't get flooded with advertising they don't think about it much. I think the lack of corporate ski is often to do with the whole package, and also the "image" of skiing. For major events the local tourist offices would need to be involved, and as long as it wasn't high season I should think the local response would be more than positive. I should think you could make money booking privately and take a cut from the companies.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Helen Beaumont, easiski, katski, - thanks so much - getting such a positive response from people who own and run businesses already is a great boost! Will keep you updated if you don't mind - you never know, we could do business!
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Just to put a dampener on things I know major US resorts actively target the conference market directly but then they do have a fair budget for marketing spend - I'd expect the more savvy European resorts to be doing the same. I certainly know of a number of chalet companies also keen to get their sticky fingers into this pie - just try walking around the ski show saying your looking for a corporate trip for 30+ people and they'll positivley prostrate themselves.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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fatbob, noted - I know, it is a consideration. I'm thinking of the groups who might want to do this, aren't part of a company beano or corporate thingy but don't have the first idean where to look or what to look for. From experience, people are often put off by ski-ing's 'elite' image and think they can't afford it, won't fit in, will be cold etc., when we all know that ain't necessarily so! I'm thinking of hen or stag weekends (mature and well-behaved only of course), 1st time family trips (loads of knowledge of this) and generally the types of group who will fall between the interests of the big TO's and bigger corporate hospitality companies.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Very concentrated market. In my immediate vicinity there are 35 people in my office. 4 would go for it. Most people dont have any experience of skiing.
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Could be a good way for some people who have never thought of it to give it a try though? Perhaps these are the sort of people that most need someone like Madaboutsnow 
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You know it makes sense.
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I held a company Christmas Party at Wycombe Summit a few years ago - before it burnt down, it was ideal for this with the large chalet having space to cater for plenty. Most of the staff had never been on skis before - so they got lessons. I got very positive feedback afterwards.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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katski, That's my thought exactly! I didn't know anything about it before I went and I planned the whole thing myself (didn't stop me having sleepless nights for weeks beforehand though) and I would have loved to have someone to steer me and advise me and just tell me where to turn up! I'd love to be able to take the worry out of a first ski holiday, especially perhaps for 1st time families, and have them feel they were taking much less of a risk than just trusting a brochure. Speaking to someone who has been there and done it is a great settler of worry! 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Alastair, Fab idea! Interesting to know if it lead to people biting the bullet and going for the real thing! I've know lots of converts (converted after being on one of my trips!) who thought they're not sporty so coudn't do it, hate the cold (very popular misconception), might hurt themselves etc etc. One friend in particular is now buying a place in Spain with easy access to the mountains because she loves ski-ing so much - and you've never met anyone less sporty/more cold/or more cowardly!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Madaboutsnow, I wish the Chartered Accontants would follow the line of the medics in having their CPD ( Continued Professional Development ) conferences in ski resorts rather than boring central London hotels, although Goodwood was not too bad last week.
Yes, I ceratinly think that there is an untapped market for Accountants ( three main UK bodies - ICAEW, ACCA, ACMA ) as conferences are held in the UK and are serviced either by the tutors hired by these bodies, and indeed forms a good part of their commercial activities income. Personally as a skier I love the idea!. Go do it before the others cotton-on to its commercial potential.
And there is another good reason - if it is structured properly it is a tax deductible business expense saving tax at 22%/40%. Not bad, ehh!.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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hibernia, and all who have troubled to respond - Woo Hoo! I'm now very excited about my little idea and will start the process forthwith! Thanks again guys - you are all stars!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Madaboutsnow, Keep us posted on how you get on and good luck!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Madaboutsnow, I don't know if many decided to go for the real thing later - a few did say they might.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Madaboutsnow, also look at www.eurekaski.com , I know Mel , and she may be keen on the idea too.
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Helen Beaumont, Helen, that link is not opening.
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It is now...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Madaboutsnow, what about trying the alps in the summer as well - loads to do other than just skiing?
I can find accommodation for this if ever you do need it....
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