 Poster: A snowHead
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Hey fellow members
I'm planning our family trip to Europe (from NZ) for about 5-6 weeks at the end of Dec till end of Jan 2024 (summer school holidays).
We are two adults and one 9yo child of intermediate-advanced level (on our last trip to US we comfortably skied blacks at all resorts we visited and double blacks at Breckenridge).
Me and my wife last skied in Europe more than 10 years ago.
I would appreciate your views and advice on the following:
1. Ideally we are looking for a 4-5 weeks of skiing in total. Our approach on our last trip was to ski Mon-Fri and relax/sightseeing on weekends to avoid crowds. Any suggestions on an itinerary that would fit this description?
2. Probably the only thing that I really wanted to do is ski Dolomites, but unsure whether we want to spend the whole trip there.
3. Recommendations for uncrowded places/resorts for Christmas-NY period in the Alps. I understand that this is one of the worst periods, so I was thinking of an 'off the beaten path' resorts where we can ski for 2-3 days on each of these two weeks combined with some sightseeing.
4. Good value ski pass. I understand that there are still no European equivalent of Epic/Ikon pass?
5. If we were on Ikon (Zermatt, Chamonix, Dolomites, Kitzbuhel) - in what order would you do them given our timeframes?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@keezaa, welcome to SHs 
1. Hah hah! too broad a question other than generally avoid popular French destinations for xmas and NY.
2. I am sure you could spend your whole time in the Dolomites (although I don't know them that well) but that seems a little, well, unadventurous?
3. Italy tends to be less crowded. No idea re Austria. France probs to be avoided if the options exist.
4. No, there are no direct equivalents, which is a good thing as afaics epic/ikon evolved to get round the ridiculous walk up prices in US resorts and are patently not a good thing/a somewhat stupid system. That said, there are regional passes, e.g. for the Valais, Aosta valley (not sure how good value) etc.
5. Don't do Chamonix at New Year. Be aware that travel between these 4 destinations is not necessarily very straightforward. e.g. Chamonix-Cortina (as an example) is at least a 6 1/2 hour drive. Car probably essential.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Places we have been Saturdays are quiet days to ski.
You could spend a lot of time in the Dolomites and a lot of it on one ski pass.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Dolomites ski pass is good value if you do more than about 21days its worth getting a season pass early. Massive area and worth staying in a few resorts especially to explore areas off the sella ronda.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Austria is very busy the week from Christmas and the entire first week of January, due to Austrian and German school holidays. Lift queues aplenty even in small villages.
Perhaps make Kitzbuhel last due to its low altitude, arriving just after the manic WC Streif weekend? Imho pick accommodation on the side of the town nearest the mountain.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Look at some of the smaller French ski resorts which are not overly busy at Xmas and you could also look at the Skiogrande card that costs €7 but gives you 20% off the daily tickets in the 17 Maurienne Valley ski resorts and a free day after skiing 7 days. From this valley you can also easily cross into Italy for Bardonnechia and several other resorts as maybe a stopover en route to the Dolomites with a bit of sightseeing in Turin and Milan.
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Nearest thing to Epic/ Ikon are the Austrian super Salzberger and Tirol Card and the Swiss Magic Pass.
Of course as you've identified Epic / Ikon get you quite a lot. Epic would give you 3V, Verbier 4V, Brenta Dolimiti and unlimited Andermatt/Dissentis. Plus Arlberg but you have to stay in such expensive hotels there it's not much of a perk.
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@Dave of the Marmottes, I get the impression that Epic/Ikon aren't really intended as Europe only things?
Mind you, Chamonix full of Americans this season, presumably on Ikons.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| under a new name wrote: |
@Dave of the Marmottes, I get the impression that Epic/Ikon aren't really intended as Europe only things?
Mind you, Chamonix full of Americans this season, presumably on Ikons. |
True but I think you can at least breakeven fairly easily on Europe alone.
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| keezaa wrote: |
...(on our last trip to US we comfortably skied blacks at all resorts we visited and double blacks at Breckenridge).
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If you like North American single and double diamonds, you may find European piste skiing quite tame by comparison. Moguls and ungroomed runs are sadly very rare in most European resorts, and you are unlikely to find any gladed skiing at all. If you enjoy these, or typically head straight for the open bowls supplemented by the occasional chute, couloir or cornice, you will need to go off piste. Unlike the USA, off-piste is only an option if you hire a guide, either as part of a larger group or for a private session. That will add to the cost considerably, but will give you a unique experience that you won't have enjoyed in the USA.
Having said that, European blacks may challenge you in a different way, as many are turned by groomers and skiers into near-vertical ice-sheets of a kind that I have never encountered in the USA. All are good fun; they're just a different kind of fun.
| keezaa wrote: |
Good value ski pass. I understand that there are still no European equivalent of Epic/Ikon pass?
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Day passes are much cheaper in most European resorts than in the USA. Even over 4-6 weeks, you may find that the total cost of your day passes is no more than than an Ikon/Epic pass, especially if you are only skiing 5 days/week and spend some of your time in smaller resorts.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@keezaa,
Which airport(s) would you be looking to fly in & out of? Would you be hiring a car or using local transport? What sort of accommodation & board are you looking at? And what is your budget?
In many European resorts the weekends are the quietest days on the slopes & busiest on the roads.
Xmas & New Year are early season, so I'd recommend a high resort - Zermatt would fit the bill, but is expensive
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