 Poster: A snowHead
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So I need a new ski jacket. My old Nike ACG is a medium and erm I am no longer 
I'm on a budget and have a choice of NF GTZ Gore Tex Summit Series or NF HyVent Borovets jackets (both in EB sale and I received an EB gift card for Christmas). Does anyone have experience of either and would care to venture an opinion as to their preference or otherwise. I like both but there are pros and cons for both:
The Gore Tex jacket is a pure hard shell
It is longer
Pit zips run longitudinal and are mesh backed as my old jacket
The hood is not removable
The HyVent is insulated
Pit zips run transverse and are not mesh backed so could get full of snow if (when) I fall over. Also not sure about the heat dumping efficiency with transverse vents
The hood is removable
Opinions as to quality, durability, vfm etc...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@halfhand, I had a GTZ goretex and it suited me great, and only got put to the back of the wardrobe because of the mammut I won. I would say though that I am generally too warm, even on very cold days. If you are a cooler person, make sure it's big enough to get layers underneath, because the jacket itself is not the warmest out there. But I loved mine, Strong, practical and the non removable hood never bothered me.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Goretex guarantee would always swing it for me....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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'eeeeeyyy. Naturally I have always thought you were the Fonz's cousin. Sure you'll know when you get them both. I liked the longer jacket to cover my ar$e, not because it gets cold though. 
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The Hyvent will breathe much better than the Goretex so maybe the zips won't need to be used as much.
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Gore Tex every time for me.
I prefer shells, as it allows the flexibility of layering.
I've been skiing with a non removable/stowable hood for 12-15 years without a problem.
'Longer' as long as you don't trip over it when you are dancing you'll be ok.
my advice is choose the brightest colour 
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my advice is choose the brightest colour
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Ha, ha. I deliberately left that bit out 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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+1 for Goretex.Have TNF Thinker jacket and simply loving it.
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I have the TNF free thinker, new this year, absolutely brilliant. A guy skied over me and didn't leave a mark on the jacket (gave me a great bruise)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I had a free thinker for years, absolutely brilliant Jacket
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Slightly OT, but Can someone please explain to me the benefits of Goretex when it comes to skiing jackets? Goretex is a wonderful fabric, but I tend to think of the main advantage as being waterproofness. How does that help when skiing? If it's pissing down with rain that much them most of aren't likeley to ski. If you spend so long lying down in slush that The damp comes through then you have greater problems than getting wet, and in temps below 1 degree then the snow just brushes off. Never had a Goretex jacket and never yet got wet. (not I hasten to add because I'm a great skier. I'm not!). Goretex gloves, maybe, but jackets?
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You know it makes sense.
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@Bob, Yes buying mine in the EB sale good reductions to be had.
I did wonder whether sitting on wet chair lifts, benches etc.. would the HyVent jacket let through the water more readily than the Gore Tex.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Def GoreTex. You need to get the Summit Series stuff from TNF if you wan't quality - much of the rest is overpriced hughstreet stuff.
Which is probably we they named the other jacket after a crappy Bulgarian resort; it doesn't exactly scream high quality
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| foxtrotzulu wrote: |
| Slightly OT, but Can someone please explain to me the benefits of Goretex when it comes to skiing jackets? Goretex is a wonderful fabric, but I tend to think of the main advantage as being waterproofness. How does that help when skiing? If it's pissing down with rain that much them most of aren't likeley to ski. If you spend so long lying down in slush that The damp comes through then you have greater problems than getting wet, and in temps below 1 degree then the snow just brushes off. Never had a Goretex jacket and never yet got wet. (not I hasten to add because I'm a great skier. I'm not!). Goretex gloves, maybe, but jackets? |
Warm wet snow, sitting on chairlifts, or going inside crowded cable cars and having snow melt, etc. Raining in the village but snowing higher up. Using the same jacket all year for whatever activity.
Plus due to Gore's testing (before allowing people to use their membranes) you are guaranteed excellent quality and durability, with an excellent warranty if something does go wrong.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@clarky999,
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Warm wet snow, sitting on chairlifts, or going inside crowded cable cars and having snow melt, etc. Raining in the village but snowing higher up.
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Yes, I can see that makes sense, but in reality is it actually a problem? I've never, ever got wet while skiing. Well, not that I can remember. And that includes having a nice lie down on the piste now and then to let the sloe gin settle.
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Plus due to Gore's testing (before allowing people to use their membranes) you are guaranteed excellent quality and durability, with an excellent warranty if something does go wrong.
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Also makes sense, but I can't ever remember wanting to claim on a warranty because an item of clothing as 'failed.'
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@foxtrotzulu, yeah, it can be. I was with my family in Morzine a couple of years back, and their salopettes (which were rated 10k waterproof) were getting soaked through while sitting on chairlifts in a snow storm at around 0 degrees. Plus if you're doing laps at somewhere like Nordkette on a pow day then you've got 10 minutes uplift on a PACKED, steamy and sweaty cable everytime you want to go up, so any snow you take in melts instantly. I also use my shell jacket year round for hiking too, so keeping summer rain storms at bay is nice!
The second, I guess it depends how much you use your gear. I buy a jacket expecting to get several (full) seasons of hard use out of it, including skiing through tight trees with pointy branches. If it's something you use a couple of weeks a year you're less likely to test the durability too much, I guess. Only thing I've ever actually had to warranty were a pair of TNF gloves in 08/09, which were replaced on warranty twice just in that season!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
Can someone please explain to me the benefits of Goretex when it comes to skiing jackets? Goretex is a wonderful fabric, but I tend to think of the main advantage as being waterproofness.
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Most skiing jackets are waterproof. The main advantage of goretex is it is more breathable than other waterproof jackets. Also there are other fabrics which are more waterproof than goretex, but don't offer the breathability. So the advantage isn't solely its waterproofness, its that it is both waterproof and breathable
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@alex99,
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So the advantage isn't solely its waterproofness, its that it is both waterproof and breathable
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Makes sense. I've never had a problem with water ingress, but on many days I've wished my jacket was more breathable.
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| alex99 wrote: |
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Can someone please explain to me the benefits of Goretex when it comes to skiing jackets? Goretex is a wonderful fabric, but I tend to think of the main advantage as being waterproofness.
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Most skiing jackets are waterproof. The main advantage of goretex is it is more breathable than other waterproof jackets. Also there are other fabrics which are more waterproof than goretex, but don't offer the breathability. So the advantage isn't solely its waterproofness, its that it is both waterproof and breathable |
But jimmjimm above reckons HyVent is more breathable than Gore Tex. I guess more breathable will mean more prone to wetting out no?
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@halfhand, shouldn't do really, but I don't think HyVent is actually more breathable (would be interested to hear more if so though!).
Not that GoreTex is actually all that breathable either though...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Goretex is 28k waterproof/10k breathability.
Hyvent is 10k/10k. If the science is right goretex clearly will out perform hyvent but generally at a greater cost!
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Typo-goretex offers 20k breathability!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Bit late for the OP but I have Gortex, Event, Conduit SL, Venturi and Hyvent jackets and find they all performe pretty similiar in everyday use if you look after them. I think for most it comes down to cost and or what fits you best.
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@speed098, Not too late no. Both types are sitting on my dining room table and I've got a few days left to decide. I think for my needs (mostly on-piste with the occasional foray under a chair lift or off to the side of the piste) either jacket is likely to perform equally well. Costs are similar, the HyVent actually feels a bit more comfortable and less stiff (obvious considering the different technologies involved).
Interesting that neither of the tags give details of the waterproof/breathability rating nor can I find these details on EB, or Gore Tex websites other than to say that HyVent waterproofness appears to be expressed in psi rather than mm and a reference to retaining 60PSI after 20 wash cycles (this would be around 42,000mm if the conversion on this link is to be believed http://www.evo.com/waterproof-ratings-and-breathability-guide.aspx, which seems unlikely) on the North Face site is claimed. Although another part of the site reckons HyVent is waterproof to 25PSI (17,600mm).
Here's an interesting article from the uk climbing website http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=4556 on testing waterproofness.
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You know it makes sense.
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Hyvent is the fabric TNF use on their cheaper jackets, they use Goretex on their more expensive ones.
I've used both, my experience is that Goretex breathes much better than Hyvent when the jacket is dry. When the outer surface of the jackets is wet, the performance between Hyvent and Goretex is similar.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Oceanic, The Gore Tex one is actually cheaper.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@halfhand, then no question, take the GoreTex. There's a reason why TNF pay Gore to use their membranes rather than just using HyVent on everything (and it's not just the marketing power of the brand  ).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I just had a look at the EB website. Is the shell jacket you are looking at made from Goretex Active Shell? There is quite a difference between Goretex Active Shell and the more common forms of Goretex (Goretex Pro, Goretex PacLite etc).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
There is quite a difference between Goretex Active Shell and the more common forms of Goretex (Goretex Pro, Goretex PacLite etc).
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Or so the marketing blurb would tell you
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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No, really there is a big difference. Goretex Active is thinner, more breathable, less durable. Also, and this might be crucial, Gore impose some design criteria on manufacturers who want to use Goretex active, one of these criteria is that the garments should be close fitting (to keep the wight down). You often can't fit many layers under a Goretex Active shell.
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GoreTex is much longer lasting! It was developed originally for use as artificial veins/arteries, after all. It will retain its waterproof quality wash after wash (especially if you buy proper GT wash detergent), whereas Hyvent and other "DWR" finishes only last about 20 washings, as they are only a COATING; GT is a MEMBRANE.
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@Dirt&SnowGirl, old thread but hyvent(now dryvent) isn't just a wash in coating like dwr.
I've got several outdoor items and I'd say goretex is no better than any other. I'm out in the elements recreating a lot in the mountains and hills of the UK
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Hmm. That's not what I read... but ty for updating me.
Good to know, since I am looking for a ski jacket, after a long absence from the sport (kids, lol).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Dirt&SnowGirl, why don't you start your own thread? and with a nice informative title/question?
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FAQ
anyway 
