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Interesting Phil Smith Article re ski insurance.

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
https://www.snoworks.co.uk/blog/ski-insurance-what-you-need-to-know/?fbclid=IwAR3iMMpsyj2LwS_NEGMqMOf_Du3M4W27IrWYDN9j8E2Hla6GS-sAvlUHbe0
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Yep quite interesting until it got to the point where they can't tell you what policies have what clauses as they aren't insurance brokers. So back to square one for everyone.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
...and no mention of costs...as they say, it may well be possible to insure against almost anything, but at what cost?
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@Dave of the Marmottes, like I said in one of the other threads my OH will be interviewing one of the top Ski brokers, what questions would you and others like to be asked etc
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Which policy covers what circumstance with a rough guide to pricing?

Personally I'm not that bothered about cancellation costs but I really wouldn't want to have medical cover invalidated because BoJo's buffoons have my destination with a much lower infection rate than the UK on the FCO non essential travel list.

Some clarity on how they'll handle the valid EHIC condition post 1 Jan would also be useful.
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Dave of the Marmottes wrote:
Which policy covers what circumstance with a rough guide to pricing?

Personally I'm not that bothered about cancellation costs but I really wouldn't want to have medical cover invalidated because BoJo's buffoons have my destination with a much lower infection rate than the UK on the FCO non essential travel list.



This is exactly my thoughts
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Weathercam,
As above - just simply - will we be able to get medical / accident insurance if travelling against FCO advice - including for the over 50's please!
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
What gets me is that the insurers are the experts - why do they find it so hard to explain what the issues are and what they can/can't cover? It's worse than dealing with HMRC i.e. they have all the knowledge but you have to ask exactly the right questions to get any meaningful answer.

Remember force majeur? What similar blanket exclusions are built-in to the current generation of policies, and those that will be in force 1.1.21 onwards? We now know from experience that a Q&A with a telephone rep' is no substitute for clear Ts & Cs explained in simple, but explicit terms.


Last edited by After all it is free Go on u know u want to! on Sat 10-10-20 11:45; edited 2 times in total
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@LaForet, The cynical answer is because the Insurance Industry makes money out of not being transparent and HMRC simply don`t care/are incompetent.
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@CaravanSkier, I've always found HMRC to be very helpful and competent.
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j b wrote:
Yes, that was exactly my question, and the chap said in view of the current situation they were providing continued cover.

In fact my question was going to go on to a technicality, except that he answered me first, since there are two FCO categories of advice against "all travel" and "all but essential travel". Most places are currently in the second category, and only war zones (e.g. Syria) are in the first. The policy document only referred to "all travel" and I was going to ask whether they intended a distinction.


This is a copy of the answerJB gave on another thread re the cover provided by Nationwide
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Dippy wrote:
@Weathercam,
As above - just simply - will we be able to get medical / accident insurance if travelling against FCO advice - including for the over 50's please!


+1
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@Weathercam I'd add third party liability to medical/accident. These are the potentially ruinous costs for most people.

Not really bothered about baggage / valuables. And not sure it is reasonable in the current circumstances to expect insurers to provide cancellation cover - without charging something close to the holiday cost!
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Dave of the Marmottes wrote:
Yep quite interesting until it got to the point where they can't tell you what policies have what clauses as they aren't insurance brokers. So back to square one for everyone.


Quite. Not useful at all in fact. They did recommend one on the Facebook page but the comment has since disappeared - a Spanish online insurer not authorised or regulated by the FCA so, should you have a dispute there would be no FOS to take it up with. Now they are saying they will tell you which insurers if you email them. If it were me I'd be encouraging customers to do their own research.

If they are going to get into this territory I think they need to spell out much more clearly what, for example, Carre Neige will or won't cover and what gaps that leaves you to fill with other insurance. I can see massive gaps in what they are suggesting.

In the case of somewhere like France you CAN travel against FCO advice, but all the insurers happy for you to do that, as far as I can tell, won't cover you for the very reason France is on the list - Covid. So break a leg and you're covered. Contract a nice big viral load of Covid while in the hospital with your broken leg and you're not covered for the stay in the ICU and repatriation. Just an extreme example there but that could happen as people do seem to pick up Covid while in hospital for other things.

LaForet wrote:
Remember force majeur? What similar blanket exclusions are built-in to the current generation of policies, and those that will be in force 1.1.21 onwards? We now know from experience that a Q&A with a telephone rep' is no substitute for clear Ts & Cs explained in simple, but explicit terms.


In law, Force Majeur means 'unforeseeable circumstances that prevent someone from fulfilling a contract'. A pandemic is not unforeseeable, some companies habitually insured against it, like Wimbledon tennis tournament for example. In fact, by the time March came round it was highly forseeable. The insurance business applied the term correctly. The travel business, on the other hand, tried using it to not pay refunds which was not correct.

holidayloverxx wrote:
@CaravanSkier, I've always found HMRC to be very helpful and competent.


Yes, me too. People are just getting their knickers in a twist because they can't have what they want and because they can't invest a bit of time doing their own research.

Weathercam wrote:
@Dave of the Marmottes, like I said in one of the other threads my OH will be interviewing one of the top Ski brokers, what questions would you and others like to be asked etc


There's a clue in the word 'broker' (ie middle man) as to why you may not get the answers you hope for - they can't move outside what their underwriters have laid down. The FCO issue is hard to circumnavigate IMO.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
It seems to me that anyone who wants all the potential risks to be covered by someone else, for not very much money, probably ought to ski in Wales or Scotland this coming winter.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@DaveD, thanks for quoting me, but I am not an authority! Simply relaying, because I thought others would find it useful, what one particular insurer actually covers. We have only been with Nationwide a few months, on the recommendation of someone on this forum (possibly @holidayloverxx, if so many thanks) so don't know how they perform in practice but was grateful for the clear advice on the phone.

The most important point, relevant to @Pruman above, is that in the case of Nationwide they said they would cover medical costs including hospitalisation for Covid if you went to a country on the FCO "all but essential travel" list (one requiring quarantining on return) but wouldn't cover costs of cancellation or alteration of travel and accommodation.

And I agree with @holidayloverxx, HMRC does have some very helpful people on the end of the phone. However they seem to make working out how to contact them a real challenge, the useful telephone numbers aren't in any of their obvious websites.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
j b wrote:
@DaveD, thanks for quoting me, but I am not an authority! Simply relaying, because I thought others would find it useful, what one particular insurer actually covers. We have only been with Nationwide a few months, on the recommendation of someone on this forum (possibly @holidayloverxx, if so many thanks) so don't know how they perform in practice but was grateful for the clear advice on the phone.



I have used the "bank" insurance for many years and it seems that both the Nationwide and the RBS use the same insurance company UK insurance ..they own Direct Line ..I had a claim last year with Nationwide in Italy , my partner had a fall and did her ACL and a knee fracture..we were treated efficiently and promptly and really cannot find anyting to complain about...which is unusual for me.. Very Happy
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Regarding Nationwide travel insurance they say on website you are not covered if when you book to go to a country the FCO advice against it . Not to sure what this means if the FCO subsequently changes to say ok to go?
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Dippy wrote:
@Weathercam,
As above - just simply - will we be able to get medical / accident insurance if travelling against FCO advice - including for the over 50's please!


I got my Direct Line home insurance renewal, and apparently it includes annual travel insurance. Having checked the t&cs of DL Travel Insurance it says you won’t be covered if the FCO advise against “all travel” (their quote marks). Having checked the FCO website that’s not the same as “all but essential travel” (they have two grades of warning). So as far as I can see,, whilst the warning is “all but essential” that policy would still cover me (obviously it doesn’t help with quarantine, but I do wonder whether they’ll have some sort of testing solution in place fairly soon).
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
snowxxx wrote:
Regarding Nationwide travel insurance they say on website you are not covered if when you book to go to a country the FCO advice against it . Not to sure what this means if the FCO subsequently changes to say ok to go?


My (AXA) bank cover is similarly vague (ie “if the FCO advise against travel”) - but the Direct Line t&cs are more specific - they exclude travel where FCO advise against “all travel”, which by omission I read as you ARE covered if the FCO advice is “all but essential”.
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@andy from embsay, ooh I didn’t know that, my home insurance is with Direct Line. Will have a look.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
VolklAttivaS5 wrote:
@andy from embsay, ooh I didn’t know that, my home insurance is with Direct Line. Will have a look.


I think you have to have the “home plus” and have had it for a few years - they don’t seem to offer it on new policies.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I will check as I have had mine years and it has renewed every year. Car insurance is with them as well as I’ve never found a better deal elsewhere
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I only spotted it because it was on my renewal letter - I can’t really find any reference to it on the website (which is pretty limited).
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I have Nationwide Flex Plus Travel Insurance. From the FAQs:

"What if I’m travelling through a country where Government advice is against ‘all but essential travel’?- select this to hide related content
Policy cover"??

Your policy still covers you as long as you are not travelling against doctor’s advice and aren’t travelling to an area when the FCO has advised against ‘all travel’.

Your policy will also cover you for any trip disruption. However, you might want to travel using a different route, if possible.

Medical expenses will be covered as long as you are not travelling against doctor’s advice and aren’t travelling to an area when the FCO has advised against ‘all travel’, then you’ll be covered for emergency medical and reasonable additional travel expenses that you may incur as a result of becoming ill.

If the FCO advice changes while you’re on your trip, you’ll still be covered if you need to claim for medical expenses.

Cancelling the trip

There is no cover for cancelling a trip where the FCO advice doesn’t apply to your destination. Speak to your travel provider to understand the options available to you.
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@colinstone, yes, but what I was told when I phoned a few days ago (recounted above) implied that "trip disruption" would not in this case include trip disruption due to Covid. And that it would include "being in that country" as well as "travelling through".

While that obviously creates financial risks, we at least hope that these are ones we can mitigate (e.g. booking late, and taking extra precautions against infection in advance of that - as well of course as preparing to quarantine on return).
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