 Poster: A snowHead
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With todays temperature in Nottingham pushing 20C it was time to swap my winter tyres for summers. I've run a second set of rims fitted with winters for decades and long before I started driving to the mountains. If anyone doubts the benefit of winters here's a tread comparison pic:
And whilst we're talking end-of-season stuff, don't forget to remove batteries from transceivers/avi packs/Resqski's etc.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@spyderjon, yep, a chum tried to get up our old hill on similar to your summers in deep December snow . not a chance.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Weird, yesterday I put snow tyres and racks on my truck, put two sets of chains in the back and charged up my airbag ready for the weekend 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I could never go back to winging it on summers since trying my first set of winter tyres in 2010 ish (a 300bhp rwd bmw that winter especially was a baptism of fire)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I’ll stick to flying.
Does remind me I need to pack my stuff up though.
Hung everything up to air weeks ago!
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I don't change mine anymore, marginal difference at legal speeds, winters are better in wet/cold conditions anyway. No difference in wear as far as I can see. They are also much better on off road tracks which I negotiate in summer a fair bit.
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@spyderjon, ah...it's 'all change' weekend here as well.
@nevis1003, agreed re marginal difference - ours are a bit more squirmy on the Yeti since we go with the VAG recommendation of 16 rather than 17 inch rims for the winter set, and 205 not 215.
BUT there is quite a difference re tyre wear. Indeed if you do a lot of offroad tracks in the summer the trade off is probably fine, but I monitor (with a simple plunge needle tyre depth gauge) the rate of wear on winters and it does increase significantly above 15 deg C on the Yeti (currently Conti WinterContact but going over to Dunlop WinterSport for the next season).
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@hang11, damn the inclination of the Earth....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| valais2 wrote: |
@spyderjon, ah...it's 'all change' weekend here as well.
@nevis1003, agreed re marginal difference - ours are a bit more squirmy on the Yeti since we go with the VAG recommendation of 16 rather than 17 inch rims for the winter set, and 205 not 215.
BUT there is quite a difference re tyre wear. Indeed if you do a lot of offroad tracks in the summer the trade off is probably fine, but I monitor (with a simple plunge needle tyre depth gauge) the rate of wear on winters and it does increase significantly above 15 deg C on the Yeti (currently Conti WinterContact but going over to Dunlop WinterSport for the next season). |
I have heard this many times re the tyre wear, but the last few sets I have had have done 20k, roughly, so I don't think it is worth changing over anymore due to the costs now charged by garages, some are £20 a tyre, so significant if you change very summer/winter. Perhaps mine don't wear out because I don't buy expensive tyres though, I don't think you can tell the difference with expensive tyres unless you're cornering hard or driving well over the speed limit. I need the summer off road ability so no point in changing, as you say.
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| nevis1003 wrote: |
| valais2 wrote: |
@spyderjon, ah...it's 'all change' weekend here as well.
@nevis1003, agreed re marginal difference - ours are a bit more squirmy on the Yeti since we go with the VAG recommendation of 16 rather than 17 inch rims for the winter set, and 205 not 215.
BUT there is quite a difference re tyre wear. Indeed if you do a lot of offroad tracks in the summer the trade off is probably fine, but I monitor (with a simple plunge needle tyre depth gauge) the rate of wear on winters and it does increase significantly above 15 deg C on the Yeti (currently Conti WinterContact but going over to Dunlop WinterSport for the next season). |
I have heard this many times re the tyre wear, but the last few sets I have had have done 20k, roughly, so I don't think it is worth changing over anymore due to the costs now charged by garages, some are £20 a tyre, so significant if you change every summer/winter. Perhaps mine don't wear out because I don't buy expensive tyres though. I need the summer off road ability so no point in changing, as you say. |
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| valais2 wrote: |
| @hang11, damn the inclination of the Earth.... |
Yes it’s a PITA but at least I live on the top of it
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Just swapped mine ‘round too. Here’s my summer vs winter tyre comparison below. Tyre place said I had some light wheel damage from potholes and commented that almost half their private car customers have damaged wheelso some degree when they bring a car in. This used to be much rarer than it is now, if confirmation of our worsening roads was needed …
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@LaForet, …in rural Cambridgeshire we seem to have outstandingly deep potholes .. 30cms is common…bizarre…
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
Tyre place said I had some light wheel damage from potholes and commented that almost half their private car customers have damaged wheelso some degree when they bring a car in.
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Mate of mine took his Merc in to have the tyres changed over and was told he had 2 cracked wheels. £1k each to replace, apparently. And he has had to replace the other 2 wheels at some point in the last year because they also cracked. Expensive car, bad roads, and very low profile tyres...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| valais2 wrote: |
| @LaForet, …in rural Cambridgeshire we seem to have outstandingly deep potholes .. 30cms is common…bizarre… |
That’s because the Cambridgeshire authorities appear to hate motorists with a passion. There is no other explanation for the criminal state of the roads and very odd traffic planning decisions, which tend to be the opposite of what a sane person would do.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
| ... in rural Cambridgeshire we seem to have outstandingly deep potholes .....the Cambridgeshire authorities appear to hate motorists with a passion. |
The county runs the roads. It's Tory.
They actually hate cyclists, for whom potholes - created by drivers - are a matter of life and death.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'd swap ours, but I need to visit Blackcircles to replace the rotten rubber on the summer set.
**update** RUDDY HELLFIRE! Tyres have gone up a bit!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| nevis1003 wrote: |
| I don't change mine anymore, marginal difference at legal speeds, winters are better in wet/cold conditions anyway. No difference in wear as far as I can see. They are also much better on off road tracks which I negotiate in summer a fair bit. |
On a nice summer road on a nice summer tyre the level of grip is far superior to a proper winter tyre. I will always change them.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Must get round to nipping in to the garage to get them to swap back to my summer tyres on the van!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Richard_Sideways, they must have become “inflated”
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Legend., +1
Well not that we live anywhere near as extreme as the Lake District  but a fair % here in the Hautes Alpes do change their tyres over, though a lot does depend on how much driving you actually do, many here will hardly leave the valley anyway.
No one has mentioned the sound issues that winter tyres have vs summer, you only have to look at the difference in treads in the top photo to understand why.
And driving a van, even though mine is sound-proofed there is a staggering difference between winters and summers in terms of noise and comfort, especially when hacking back n'forth on the autoroute.
We notice in the summer that we don't hear the traffic as much as in the winter and that's down to people on summer's.
Mine are being changed over tomorrow as I'm heading back to the UK next week, and I'm just putting on some cheapos as I'm not doing too much mileage back in the UK and hope that it's just the one trip back this year, and then my expensive Winters, as that's what you spend the money on here will go back on circa November.
Ironically looks like a major cold snap and +40cm of snow next week just after I leave, though that will only hang around as short while, even if the forecasts hold true.
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@Weathercam, we have used winters for decades …it does seem that I have ‘fewer days in anger’ though in the Alps (although used them a lot in uk this year in the cold snap).
Ten years ago, everything trip involved some reliance on winters due to virgin snow on road, including all through France. Four winter trips per annum.
Last year - about three days in total including one in Jura on the way at Easter.
This year - about 100m getting into the car park at Nax at Christmas. And that was it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I carry a hi-lift jack, chains for front and back wheels and recovery tracks in winter if I’m going off the beaten track, and have a winch on the front as well, although often not many places to winch off.
Usually end up using it all at least a couple of times a year.
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@hang11, blimey that’s prep’d for proper adventure…
@Weathercam, great photos and storyline…Syncro….nice. Stupidly capable. I saw a syncro beat a discovery up a Yorkshire hillclimb. I bought a Yeti with Haldex 4by and my partner moaned about it being a tin box. Until two things happened. One, we were the only vehicle moving amongst a catastrophe of sliding cars up the local hill. And secondly, she discovered the heated seat button. Toasty.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@valais2, you just mentioned the H word !!!
I've mentioned it before on here.
I had an absolute nightmare(s) with my Haldex pump, and probably spent nigh on two seasons with questionable 4x4.
I used to go back to the UK for my van service as it was under warranty to explain that I had issues, and they'd say nothing was wrong. Then after the warranty expired at the following service, I was told it had failed, and it was very expensive!
The thing is they use laptop diagnostics, as they can't actually test, in terms of looking at all four wheels going around!
Then I got stuck in some snow the following season, and the OH said my rear wheels were stationary, so I went to the local VW garage here, and he was an old school mechanic, in that, he put the van up on the inspection gantry and then put his ear by the pump, as he could hear if it was working or not, not a laptop in sight, and he said it was not pumping in that it was quiet.
He then fiddled above it and said that the electrics craddle/saddle was not connected well, he tried it again and could hear it pumping, we then went out in the van to an icy gradient where he made sure all wheels were working.
The haldex pumps are renowned for failure and most do need an oil change and seals - so it's worth getting them checked.
More here https://www.haldexrepairs.co.uk/guide-generation-4-haldex-trouble-shooting/
And ironically this morning we're out on the road bikes cycling up to where that top photo was taken to see how far we can get up the valley, as there might be a window of touring weather later this week.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Weathercam, it’s always great to find someone who has much accumulated knowledge - I like iain Tyrell who still tunes exotic engines with a pipe to his ear, listening to the harmonics in the air intakes….
Re Haldex I have a slight problem that my system takes about 30 seconds to pressurise up … after starting the car there’s always a little ‘bump’ in the transmission as the system comes on stream - I assumed a Haldex oil service would sort it but it still has that little eccentricity. Goes up a hill like a squirrel chased by a terrier, though.
I also have access to a Jimny in CH - grief that’s a capable little car. Horrible over a distance, highly capable on silly rocky off road. Everything feels like in will fall apart but goodness it’s an eager thing when in 4WD and low ratio box.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@hang11, …it can swim!!! Look at that schnorkel….
@ski3, THAT is a very good question re internal HALDEX filter. Did not know it had one. I will ask them. Great too many thanks.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| valais2 wrote: |
@hang11, …it can swim!!! Look at that schnorkel….
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It can sorta swim  I’ve had water inside it up to the bottom of the seats a couple of times. And I found out the first time I got stuck in deep water that a 6’2” hunk of kiwi athletic perfection is too big to climb out the little windows, so had to nicely ask a mate to wade through waist deep mud to get a snatch strap attached.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I reckon the best use I had out of the winter tyres this season was in the car park at Gloucester Ski Centre a week after it had snowed!
Beyond that, there wasn't much to worry about in Tignes/Val over Christmas, and no snow at all for the 5 weeks in March and April I was away that I needed to worry about.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@valais2, yes you'd expect a honest service agent to do this as required, but many do avoid it as evidenced by car forum unfortunately.
You'd not expect to find too much debris for example in the engine oil filter (you're in trouble if you do as most of the materials should remain where the manufacturer put them ) but Haldex has clutch plates in friction running in oil, the by product of which is a quantified amount of expected wear particles, to be caught by filter as part of design strategy.
The balance being, that the finer the filter the more the flow restriction ramps upward as those elements accumulate. Planned mileage changes are particularly important in this scenario to maintain pressure and flow on command characteristics.
It's an odd analysis, as if not changed it's an easy corrective fix to get it back to full speed operation. If genuinely it has been serviced as guidelines, then that would be more of a concern.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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When Haldex goes wrong, it can be £££ quite quickly. Our Skoda Octavia Scout needed a new haldex pump in Aug 22 (£850ish), and then a new rear diff in Apr 23 (£4.5k). Fortunately covered by warranty. Car is 2016 with 105k on clock, full dealer service history. Am v glad I happened to take out extended warranty to cover all that! A fried with similar aged identical car was less fortunate.
The 4wd option via haldex has been v useful (live in highlands and commute over the Lecht 1-3 times a week through the winter, as well as rough farm/ forest roads) but not sure I’d get it again - too much to go wrong.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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We've put around 300000km on our two Haldex-equipped cars (VW Passat R36 and Audi TT Roadster) with nothing more than routine dealer servicing, they've served us very well for 15 ad 13 years respectively.
Just saying.
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@ski3, …very helpful….good craft knowledge thanks for sharing
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
We've put around 300000km on our two Haldex-equipped cars (VW Passat R36 and Audi TT Roadster) with nothing more than routine dealer servicing, they've served us very well for 15 ad 13 years respectively.
Just saying. |
Certainly agree with you in regard of VAG engineering, we've two in immediate family with accumulation of 397 thousand km currently, without any real concerns. Both without Haldex though. I trust them completely to cover journey without issue.
The Haldex is the anomaly though, I believe. It's more how it's perceived out in the field and some very suspect maintenance attention that seems to give poor example in use. The resulting failures usually charged out to unsuspecting owners if the workshop can get away with it.
The first video posted above is a case in point, the unit coming from a main dealer swap/repair and shows no real sign of failure in it's engineering components. I was watching it and thinking what a waste of fine engineering .
It just looks like the pump had failed on that one. There would have been diagnostic support record in there, but many just don't understand what the logs tell them, and so replacement ensues with someone picking up the tab.
Unusually it uses a "non lubricating" oil (think that's tne translation for it from German) to run specific frictuon characteristics in the clutch pack, the plates are effectively a wear item in most clutch systems. The oil needs to be swapped to remove the washout debris.
The differential is a very different oil with very high anti wear properties and in completely separate compartment. Of course nobody in trade confuses the two do they especially as the clutcg pack oil is expensive.
The pump motor runs continuously I understand, as soon as the key is turned and has reasonable life of that electrical component, but it will ultimately wear out.
Results are typically expected if the service agent doesn't know why they're doing some things.
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@ski3, also many people, that have no need of 4x4 in daily use, are simply driving around unaware that their Haldex has failed and that they're just driving with FWD.
Most people that drive out to the Alps for their holidays tend to, once in a resort, not use their vehicle, so it's only on departure/transfer day, that should conditions arise, the car gets used in "anger" to quote @valais2, or if you're somewhere like here where the valley stretches for 10km and accommodation is all over the villages which then requires transport (navettes/buses are used), that's if you're not within walking distance of a lift.
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FAQ
