Let sleeping SNOWTRAINS lie?

A snowHead

Given that there are no longer public sleeper trains from Paris to the main Alpine resorts via Moutiers, Aime, Bourg St Maurice (only Briançon remains for S.Chevalier), and given that air travel is now an exceedingly unpleasant experience, do you think the guys that operated The Snowtrain should strongly consider resurrecting it?

The overnight train that goes to the Alps at the moment has upright seats and a no alcohol policy, i.e. starts the ski holiday on the wrong foot with a crooked neck and foul mood, especially given a real bed, upon which one longs to recover, isn't available for several hours.

A chartered sleeper train could operate just a few times each season, and so should be able to ensure full occupancy. But then, maybe the operators of the overnight 'dry coach' train would get uppity and scupper it.

A snowHead

I'd certainly use such a service, if it came back.
Having tried overnight in both a normal and a biz class seat with the current option, sleep proved very elusive for our whole party. This was even after a little liquid contraband was consumed....

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I used the old Snowtrain service a few times, the one with the infamous disco carriage. Hardly ever managed to get to sleep, and once had to spend a few hours curled up on top of suitcases in the luggage compartment as a result of overindulging in the aforementioned disco carriage. I’d have no interest if the service was resurrected. Eurostar’s daytime service, on the other hand, is a brilliant way to get to the Tarentaise resorts, and it would be good to see that extended to other destinations or a more frequent service.

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Having been on the direct overnight sleeper from Calais; then Eurostar and overnight sleeper from Paris; and then direct overnight Eurostar I would happily return to the sleeper service.

But it won't happen. Crying or Very sad

It was largely dropped because the rolling stock was/is decrepit; and as it becomes worse the few remaining services will probably fall away. It isn't worth replacing, given that they would now only be used for perhaps 30 journeys a year as the French are largely happy with the TGV options. I think the best we can hope for is high speed trains (to France or elsewhere) with more comfortable seats

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Well I used it a fair few times back then, both to BSM and to St Anton and Innsbruck - yep there were two routes. It was an adventure every time that's for sure and perhaps you've forgotten how goddam awful it was. For one thing you had to get from wherever you lived in the UK to Calais. For me that meant a train into London, coach to Dover and then had to haul my gear up the gang plank on to the ferry and then catch a coach from Calais ferry terminal to the train station and wait a good few hours before the train rattled and creaked it's way alpwards at about 50mph. Door to door from home via Victoria Coach Station was about 20 hours. There was always a crush to stow gear, the disco carriage had only one barman and I can vividly remember people sliding around on fresh puke. And everyone smoked. Put it this way, 3rd class passengers from Delhi to Calcutta felt sorry for us. We did it because it was cheap and offered an extra day or maybe two of skiing. The return journey was just as hellish. Please don't bring it back.

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There is now a direct sleeper service between Brussels and Innsbruck, I watched it depart from Innsbruck last night. Bunk beds and no restrictions on booze (it is run by Austrians!). No idea how many days a week it runs but if you want a sleeper train to get you the the alps it should be perfect. Eurostar to Brussels, the sleeper train departs from the same station so no treks across the city on the RER. Once in Innsbruck easy to get to St Anton, Zillertal, Ischgl, Kitzbühel even Dolomites.

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@munich_irish, Sounds bl**dy excellent.
Shrinking airline seats* and baggage policies pish me off and they're only getting worse.

(*partly self-inflicted

)

After all it is free

@munich_irish, the sleeper service from Brussels does sound interesting, thanks for that. snowHead

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Having done 2 x day trips on Eurostar to Les Arcs in a seat overnight each way...for the adventure (it was fine).... i prefer to sleep in my bed the night before a skiing trip. I came home from Flachau last Sunday. Left the flat at 8am and walked in the door at 1.00pm. The outbound was a bit meh....leave the house at 4 15am arrive at the flat at 11.45, having gone shopping en route and reported damaged bag at the airport

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I'd take an overnight service and with the increased attention to climate issues I think it's only a matter of time before overnight sleepers become popular to various locations. Only at the weekend the Swedes announced a daily sleeper from Malmo to Cologne with connections on elsewhere.

I took an overnight sleeper train from Gothenburg to Åre at Christmas. It didn't have a disco carriage but it is a great way to travel IMO.

You know it makes sense.

@clarky999, There were not that many folk getting on the train last night and there seemed to be plenty of room. There was a post here before Christmas were someone had used the sleeper from Vienna to St Anton, it was busy and space for storage was at a premium. The carriages had not been built with skis in mind!

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Several years ago there was a snowHeads weekend meet up at Aviemore (for skiing on Cairngorm) and as I recall several of the London based sHs came up on the overnight sleeper from Euston.

A snowHead

@Alastair Pink, me...but I couldn't afford the sleeping compartment so slept in the reclining seat. I did manage to blag my way into the sleeper only bar to be wirh everyone.

A snowHead

There's apparently a Dutch snowtrain from Amsterdam to Langen in the Vorarlberg, via Innsbruck, Oetztal and St Anton. The Alpen-Express...

[url=]https://twitter.com/StuartKenny/status/1215708689983819776[/url]

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I really loved the snow train. I would be knackered from work, put earplugs in and eye mask on, then crash out and wake up at about 5am somewhere near Moutieres. I have slept the entire journey on the way back. You would always have a few drunks sliding the doors open and trying to get into the wrong bunk. You would also have people still wobbly the next morning taking the wrong holdalls and boot bags - I had to rescue my boots and holdall on one occasion. It was far better than the current overnight Eurostar which I have used loads of times. The daytime Eurostar service is brilliant but I kept on going overnight hoping for that extra powder day - which I have scored on a few occasions. Ski Meribel used to do an overnight coach with fully reclining seats, I thought this was excellent but it is not running anymore either.

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if you are in the North, the worst part of the journey is getting to Dover. Europe is a comparative doddle, either by road or rail. We live a 10 min taxi journey from Liverpool airport, with 3 flights a day to Geneva, - perfect! lucky I accept.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

https://www.nightjet.com/en looks pretty interesting ...

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I always get the Nightjet to Austria with the kids for Feb half term. Easy change at Wels for anywhere in the Ski Amade area. 8 days on the slopes. Brilliant. We buy a whole 4 berth couchette compartment, €199 each way. My experience a lot of Flemish or Dutch families (not sure which) use this train.

At the moment you Eurostar to Brussels, then take a German ICE train to Cologne (2 hours). The new service extension to Brussels will cut the ICE train out.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

See Admin, since he's traveled it to get to one of the BBs I believe, but there is also the

https://www.thello.com/en/paris-venice/ which might make Dolomite skiing veerrrry attractive by train (and with great prices!)

I've done the original 'vomit comet' from Calais a few times, which was as above, quite an 'experience'. You only went to the disco bar once. As a schoolkid we also did Calais to Landeck 3 years in a row - For some reason we used to park up in sidings near Basel for a few hours as I recall.

But the one I regret most is the Paris: Bourg overnight couchettes: leaving at 11pm from Gare D'Austerlitz meant you could get to Paris, have a nice dinner in town, and then go to bed , wake up in the mountains. Highly civilized, sadly missed. ( And it ran daily: often on 'boys weeks', people couldn't make a full week, so there'd be people arriving / departing throughout. Easy with a train, not so easy with an airport transfer requried)

And indeed 'sadly missed' on the last time we tried to catch it before it was taken out of service, thanks to E-star delays. Still, they put us up at the Gare de Lyon Mecure, then onto an 8am train next morning. But it wasn't the same...

After all it is free

@Pruman, I used the snow train a few times in the early 90’s, must admit I loved it, but then I was in my early 20’s and it was always a group of blokes.
Used to load up with duty free from the ferry on the way out, the lone Barman never seemed to be on a bonus system!!!!
The disco bar on the way back was (not surprisingly after a weeks skiing and drinking) generally a slightly quieter affair!!!

Must admit looking back now, it was a bit of a faff getting from south London to Victoria, then the old rattler train to Dover priory(?), passport control, shuttle bus on to ferry, (from memory the baggage stayed on the bus, but I could be wrong) then off the other side and embark on the train.
But that is how I went on my first ever ski holiday to val thorens, and a couple afterwards, so really didn’t know any difference.
memories of waking up/coming round( Toofy Grin

) near chambery, with snow on the ground at stupid o’clock in the morning, as the train did some sort of turn around manoeuvre

Personally, am far too old for it now, I prefer driving because I cannot stand faffing around in airports.

Happy days though!!!!!!

Just reading this thread and I travelled on the overnight train from Calais to Moutiers about 15 years ago. It was an experience to say the least. managed to find an old pic of the disco cariage. I remember it stopping at almost every station it went through during the night. It was nice to have a bed though compared to the overnight Eurostar.

I can also remember in the morning that the disco carriage was sloshing around with sick everywhere Sad

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I am a fan of the daytime Eurostar service - particularly the return from Moutiers, which leaves at 10.14 and arrives at 16.13. I also found the Ski Weekends overnight coach service from Victoria to Brides relatively painless, particularly if you had the premium seats. I never tried the Ski Meribel coach service. Would be interested to hear if anyone has had experience of the Snow Express coach service. FYI, I believe that the overnight sleeper train from Chiang Mai to Bangkok still has a disco car (with a glitter ball), which gets quite lively - and it only costs £19 for a second class sleeper.

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Yah, the Snowtrain was great fun... bring it back I say.

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@Legend., the Swedish proposal is just an idea at this stage, there are a whole host of issues to sort (not least that Swedish sleepers are apparently too wide for continental tracks!

The night train up to Åre is great: zero stress, a good night's sleep and wake up in central Åre. If only it was so easy elsewhere.

You know it makes sense.

We did the Chaing Mai to Bangkok Sleeper over Xmas, no disco carriage, no armed guard but strong coffee and strong smelling toilets on our one. We did the snow train back in the 90's, disco carriage closed down due to a minor punch up.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/20/brussels-vienna-night-train-returns-as-europe-eyes-flying-alternatives

A snowHead

Took the overnight “sleeper” with the disco car many years ago with some mates when much younger. Not much sleeping done on the way out and some very sore heads in the morning.

Such was the experience that I and a few others decided to take the Eurostar day train for the way back despite having paid for a return. And thats when I was young enough to supposedly stand such rigours!

A snowHead

Sure I read that the Brussels - Vienna is only Thurs night this year but opening to every night from next winter.
Really want to give it a try.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@dazzle109, the Guardian article says two nights a week in each direction

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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@dazzle109, @munich_irish, Thursday and Monday

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@munich_irish,

OBB train from Brussels to Vienna via Innsbruck runs 2 times a week there and 2 times a week return.

They also start Amsterdam to Vienna later this year..

OBB is now the largest night train operator in Europe.

It bought all the night trains from Deucthebahn (who stopped) and refurbished them.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

I can recommend the Orient Express to Venice (or Verona) for proper first class wink

There are French sleeper trains to Ax les Thermes and Gare d'Andorre-L'Hospitalet in the Pyrenees. Considering how much snow they are getting right now and the fact that that line alwasy seems to be a bit cheaper, it's tempting!

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Help!!

Let sleeping SNOWTRAINS lie?

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