 Poster: A snowHead
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This article by Evelyn French for FirstTracksOnline raises some scary points about conventional ski wax, in terms of deposition in the snowpack and toxic fumes from melting it. She states (while pointing out that the chemical mixes are secret) that Teflon is used, and describes that chemical's potential impact on human and animal health.
She proposes alternative forms of wax that could be less harmful to the environment, in particular 'Bio-ester' wax.
The article's well worth reading in full ...
http://www.firsttracksonline.com/News/2010/9/13/Ski-Waxing-for-a-Greener-Tomorrow/
... but it would also be interesting to know of any additional or contrary wisdom on this.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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alarmist nonsense. if we all eat it from our pots and pans it can't be that bad or we'd all be dead already. also the inhalation theory is chuff. it basically says it can make you ill if you super heat your wax and inhale it. who would do that?
It is interesting to hear about the natural alternatives and how they perform however. Must look into that when my current block of wax wears out.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Teflon is bad for you we use it in cooking pans
Aluminium is bad for you we use it in cooking pans
etc etc
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Once again facts are wrong, scaremongering, she assumes that ski wax is 100% Teflon and that everybody puts 3/4 oz (21.262 grams) on their skis 
In my 10 weeks of skiing last season I used only 40 grams of wax. Oh, and my waxing iron cannot reach the temperatures she quotes that the fumes are harmful at.
David E Goldsmith as a journalist I would have expected you to have read the whole article and perhaps have been a little inquisitive about her facts.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Dypcdiver, as David E Goldsmith, states elsewhere, he is just the link monkey 
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No, it's not safe. I was skiing yesterday on a pair of skis where one of them was waxed (with a race prep, including go-fast flouro pastes and powders) and one of them was as dry as a bone. It was a most unpleasant experience and I definitely felt unsafe.
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I like the monkey bit 
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| Dypcdiver wrote: |
David E Goldsmith as a journalist I would have expected you to have read the whole article and perhaps have been a little inquisitive about her facts. |
It strikes me as quite a revelatory piece, which doesn't quite nail some key facts. That's why I invited others to express counterpoints.
There's a basic truth to be extrapolated ... which is that the global production of ski wax ends up in groundwater or the fragile soils of mountainsides.
I'm not convinced that ski wax is necessary at all.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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IIRC soldering with teflon-coated wire needs precautions. Dupont themselves say
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WARNING! VAPORS CAN BE LIBERATED THAT MAY BE HAZARDOUS IF INHALED
.... Vapors and fumes liberated during hot processing should be exhausted completely from the work area... |
So if wax has Teflon in it, it seems sensible to me to use it in a well-ventilated area, or have fume extraction.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| David E Goldsmith wrote: |
| ends up in groundwater or the fragile soils of mountainsides. |
Roughly translated means, 'don't eat yellow snow'
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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No qualification in science to claim - only that she is a ski racer, no testamonials or references, no peer review, no back up peer reviewed evidence that is linked to. A tad alarmist IMV
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I don't have time nor wish reading this article, but stating waxing is dangerous is not such nonsense as some are trying to tell. Waxing normal waxes (read non-fluoro waxes) is quite harmless, but fluoro waxes are different. Back in my days of wax tech in our WC team, I was one of first ones to use gas mask when waxing. Today, good 10 years later, you won't see anyone in WC wax rooms without gas mask, and all wax manufacturer also have gas masks in their production line (most likely, they don't manufacture them on their own, but all racing service catalogs, Briko/Maplus, Swix, Toko etc, have gas masks there).
And another story back from my days... We were waxing some high fluoro powders when one of coaches entered wax room (rooms are normally quite small, and most of time everything but great vented, so with 3 or 4 people waxing 30+ pairs of skis, you get really "great" air inthere). He lit cigarette, and next second, he was laying on floor trying to get back his conscious. After we took him out, he recovered quite fast, but this tells you something 
So no, waxing once or twice won't kill you, but if you do it more regularly, and especially if you use high fluoro waxes, gas mask is only way to go.
PS: Fluoro powders get really toxic after heating them over 130-140c.
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You know it makes sense.
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Good grief a snowhead who axtually knows what he is talking about!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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It depends on who the target audience is. However, I would imagine professional users these days should have the benefit of a SDS
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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altis, surely the downside to steel scraping is that your skis only have a limited amount they can be scraped, i.e. there will be sod all left of them if you do it too much, or cock up when you do it.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Dypcdiver, yes, only Wiki, but reasonably accurate as far as it goes.
PTFE is inert at room temperature, and does not degrade, so cannot release anything nasty. Its toxicity is "virtually nil". So the PTFE in your wax residues in the snow isn't going to do much, and certainly not going to release PFOA. Don't know what else is in the wax - but other components might be released to water or air.
When you're actually waxing skis, now that's a different matter - if you get it hot enough, PTFE will degrade, and will gas you with all sorts of seriously nasty chemicals! However, I'm surprised that you can get your skis hot enough to degrade PTFE without turning your ski bases to charred mush - suspect it's not the PTFE that's degrading, but some other component of the wax
primoz's coach probably sucked some undegraded fluoro powder into his ciggie - that powder then degraded at very high temperature at the ciggie tip, and he got a lungful of the degradation products - ouch! The same phenomenon is described in some of the Wiki references
I seem to remember a spy novel from a long time ago when the baddie killed someone by spiking their cigarette with a lump of Teflon!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The really damaging stuff is the use of PFCs in race wax, and certainly used heavily in x country skiing. Thank god it is not used on mass by the industry.
It will be interesting to see if we can find any eco-solutions that match the performance. The need is growing, the EU looks set to ban pfcs in ski wax over the coming years.
https://onetreeatatime.fr/2019/10/17/how-damaging-is-ski-wax-to-the-environment
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Holy thread resurrection!
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I smell green spam.
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Many decades ago I did a lot of solerding of PTFE encased wires. No fume cupboard or anything.
Had one hell of a headache for a few days and felt quite ill. Turns out it was the PTFE fumes, so I agree they can be nasty in certain circumstances and volumes.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Funny how they ban lots of things that MAY be dangerous but dont ban fags, I cant think why that is
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