Santons, Val D, is it ever a pleasure

A snowHead

Hi all, as our daily skiing routes are dictated by what we think the wife is capable of, we have never actually skied Santons, partly because me and the kids want to take Face down while she takes the Olympic down, and partly because it's often shut.

It's reputation at the end of a day, full of scared novices trying to ski back to Val has kept us away, but what is it like early in the morning? Is it always pisted, does it ever get the sun?

It would be great to be able to ski from Tignes over to the Solaise all together.

A snowHead

Wife takes lift down?

Santons is a blue. Not sure what your issue with it is.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

La face was easier than Santons most of the time in my limited experience. Clearly not saying that is always the case, but Santons has to be the worst blue graded run I have ever experienced.

Posts like this from this forum, that's why I'm asking the question.

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Santons is fine for decent "intermediates"(assuming this is your wife????) when open(sometimes a rarity). It is usually pisted. The answer to your question partly depends on the time of year you are skiing, snow conditions, temps and the time of day. If she doesn't like lumpy bumpy excitement then avoid after 1.30 pm- when it will be totally cut up by skier numbers. Also may also be best to avoid until 10.30-11ish so it isn't a complete early ice rattlefest. If you catch it right it can be a brilliant run...but that applies to virtually every run in the Alps!

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

It's narrow, in a gully and the snow is often a bit crispy, it doesn't get much sun. But it's not steep. I would imagine it's only tricky if it's busy with slow people as there's not much space to overtake.

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If your wife is anything like my wife, it will always be too steep, and what's worse its my fault.
You know what I mean Sad

After all it is free

My wife is a competent skier and will always ski down the le face instead of santons as it's not so much the slope more the out of control idiots that hate down it at a million miles an hour with no regard for the safety of others..
After being sent flying by an idiot of a bloke on snowblades about 6 years ago we now always go down le face as she can't bear the thought of santons.
Personally I love it. As long as it's early morning and no one is on it. Almost like a mini half pipe you can glide from side to side all the way down.

top bit is fine, but you have to keep moving which can tire people out...... last bit can be narrow, bumps and generally not very pleasant....i often straight line it so i don't have to walk at the end but i would imagine that your wife wouldn't fancy that....... i would take her down it early on in the day rather than at the end so she can have a look in better conditions....

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@johnE, as you will know the piste grading in the espace killy can be interesting so although it is a blue it would certainly not be classed as an easy blue.... the width would put a lot of beginner / intermediates off

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@Coco, a very sensible question!

Santons is one of those runs which almost always has a couple near the end having a bit of an argument. The other classic is Comborciers in les Arcs where this is then set out to all those on the very slow chair lift over it.

Whilst it is the 'obvious' choice down. It is almost always a bit of a nightmare at the bottom, where the gully narrows and steepens just a bit. I don't think /i've ever been down it without at least one small group being just a bit stuck with legs akimbo and invariably there are raised voices and recriminations.

I think if you have to ask the question.......

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Of all the pistes I've skied it is second only to that horrible green run back into L2A for being scary due to the other people on it rather than the piste itself.

@swiftoid, yep that is also a Fitzwilliam

You know it makes sense.

I wouldn't do it first thing (pisted but frozen solid), or after 3pm. I've been down it with no-one on it and no bumps, just before lunch. It was a bit scratchy but good fun whizzing up and down the walls and not steep. I would use the Face as a home run every time over Santons - but usually I end up at La Daille end as the stade slalom is so nice...

Many years ago my parents had a massive argument on it after dad made the mistake of taking mum down it. Gloves were thrown Laughing

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I'd take Epaule over Santons if there's any volume of traffic.

A snowHead

George Jones,

I think the OP's issue is that Santons is a battlefield that belies its blue status. Whenever I've skied it (which is several dozen times) it has always been a scene of carnage - with good sized moguls, bodies strewn and many seemingly-nervous skiers appearing to be out of their depth.

A snowHead

Just had a look at Santons on YouTube. Bet that's absolute carnage when it gets busy. No wonder my mate was whinging about some blue run half pipe back to Val D. Even better than Desmoisselles home run at LDA. Has added carnage potential, what with the walls of the half pipe and all that. Although Desmoisselles was always good for people falling off the side...

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

To really appreciate it you have to have flat light, thats when it really gets fun. Twisted Evil

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It's my least favourite run in the EK so much so that I refuse to take my 2 boys (who are very competent skiers) down it. A shame really as I do quite like its location, shape and where you end up in the end ... As others has said it's a nice run (but let's face it not a patch on say Arcelle, the Face, OK or Cascades). I would encourage your wife to ski it during midday and as soon as it's clear that ski schools etc have all gone down it for lunch, a much better experience that the inevitable carnage that ensues from about 3PM.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Probably my least favourite run anywhere, sometimes look across from Solaise thinking what a dark horrid run!

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It can be quiet and enjoyable on a bad-weather day when few are out. Best avoided otherwise. As for its being "blue", I think the Face is easier or at least less stressful. Objectively, it is only blue so that Val d'Isere can claim there is a blue down to Centre Ville.

If you want to stay together as a family, take the OK or Orange down to La Daille and the bus back to the lifts up to Solaise.

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@T Bar, I bet it's fun in flat light.... Toofy Grin

After all it is free

@Coco, I can only recall doing one good run down Santons. Late morning, sunny, mid March, temp about 3-4c, nobody in my way. I must have skied it 40+ times over the years and mostly found it frustrating.
I find Epaule highly variable depending on conditions. When pisted with decent snow cover, it can be easier than Santons. If mogulled and hard/icy (or slushy) it can be more challenging than Face.
My wife makes her own decisions about which runs to ski wink

Good suggestion from Dogwatch if you fancy sticking together.

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@intermediate, the big problem with Epaule is the long flat section at the end I have never managed with serious poling. The route usually has big moguls and is fairly steep, but it is a black.

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If you have skied long enough, it is likely that at some point, you will find yourself all alone on the mountain and think you are going to die. My such moment was on the Santons.

It was a few years ago now and the last day of our family holiday. We were staying at the Crystal "Hotel" Le Lavachey (which my sister-in-law rather rudely renamed The Lavatory) in Tignes Lac and awoke to find that there had been over a foot of snow during the night....but the high winds, flat light and snow flurries were still very evident.

The kids were duly dispatched to ski school and myself and the good Lady Fartbag headed out into the blizzard.

The skiing was difficult, with gusts of wind that were strong enough to blow wobbly intermediates over, like traffic cones. It was also strong enough to blow the snow sideways, as you were going forwards. This meant that if you looked down while skiing, it messed with your balance, by making you dizzy...and this is what happened to the good lady. After spending the first half hour falling over, she sensibly packed it in.

Being more intrepid (foolhardy?), I decided to keep the arrangement that I had made to meet a friend after his lesson, in Val D'Isere...so thought I would play in the foot of powder that covered the pistes, while making my way over.

I ended up taking the "Marmottes" chair to the top of Bellvardes, with the intention of skiing the Red run (now a virtual offpiste run) towards the Santons and then getting the Fontaine Froide chair back up, before taking the Olympique bubble down to Val D'Isere.

Well, my plan started to unravel when the Fontaines Froide chair closed while I was on my way down to it....the wind, if anything had got stronger and the visibility had now deteriorated to a few yards. I skied over to the lift and asked the guys when the lift was due to start again. The answer was an uninterested raise of the shoulders. I asked what I was now to do. I was told to ski down on the Santons. This shocked me, as the Santons shuts at the drop of a hat, which I assume is because it looks like an avalanche chute...and it was now unpisted with well over a foot of snow on it. I questioned the wisdom of this, but he continued to say it was OK, so in the absence of any other viable plan, off I set.

At this stage, I was totally alone, couldn't see worth a damn, found myself in a depth of snow that was well above my knees and was in a cold sweat, worrying about triggering an avalanche. I found turning difficult, as I was on narrow skis (X Screams) and couldn't go faster than a crawl, due to the visibility.

After what seemed like an eternity, but was probably just a few minutes, the light improved enough for me to get my bearings. To my surprise, I found myself half way up the right hand banking...I simply had no idea where I was. I then spotted two other buck-eejuts struggling below me, who had both fallen on their heads. The relief I felt was palpable...at least I wasn't going to die alone.

I skied over to them, helped pick them up and then as a small group, had a wonderful ski back into Val D'Isere, as the light continued to improve.

I finally met up with my friend and his group and went for lunch to recover.

Apologies for the length of this yarn, but the talk of the Santons brought it all back to me.

I've done it three times about 10-11am (the time you'd do it if you were heading from Tignes to the Val glacier). On all occasions it has been quite a nice run, though I think we had to walk out at the bottom the first time as the snow ran out. (Finding a €20 note at the top made it the best run of the week!) On no occasion have I skied it with anything other than a low intermediate.

I understand it shuts in the afternoons as it is an avalanche chute when the snow above warms up.

You know it makes sense.

@johnE,

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I think it's a blue because it's not that steep but it's so narrow and crowded and often has poor snow that I would rather come down the Face. I wouldn't take a beginner on either though.

A snowHead

Firstly, treat the avalanche warnings seriously, if its closed don't duck the ropes!

But in a good season, if there is a good base (maybe like now) and its quiet it can be a great run for swooping up and down the banks.

So in a good snow season on a Saturday morning it can be one of my favourite runs.

On a weekday afternoon in high season avoid like the plague. Very Happy

A snowHead

@SkiTsar,

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@SkiTsar,

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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

did a season in Val d'Isere a few years ago so have seen Santons in all conditions. It's not a difficult run in decent conditions. It only gets challenging when there's moguls or it's congested. I'd question whether the Face is an easier return home. Possibly if you're a confident skier it is, but there's definitely more potential to get out of control on the Face, particularly if the snow is firm.

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Santons does remind me of one of the home run reds in La Thuile. When I was there, this was one of the only few runs open and it turned into a bit of a half pipe - nowhere near the "chute effect" of Santons but a nasty 'orrid run back to resort

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@Old Fartbag,

Loved reading your account, we've all been there (not necessarily on Santons) ...

After all it is free

I've ridden it plenty of times and had more good runs than bad. It's only bad when it's mogulled late in the day, or when it's full of ski school chains, no one looking beyond the person in front's bum. Then you just have to sit on the side and let them get out of the way. I've regularly clocked over 100kph on a board, on the flat section. A few times, I have made the path into Val without unclipping, but this is rare and more down to someone having already wiped out the chicane.

It can be a good fun piste.

More to the point though, I would rather take a lift down (Olympic) than ski/board a piste I really didn't like. There is no point ending the day on a bad note just to ski the last few km.

I've only ridden Epaules at it's worst and avoid it when I can. Mogulled black pistes are not much fun on a board.

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Santons, Val D, is it ever a pleasure

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