 Poster: A snowHead
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Over the weekend, France’s minister in charge of sports, Roxana Maracineanu, has confirmed that cross country skiing is now permitted in a decree published on Saturday, 28th November, allowing the sport to be practised until 15th December.
"It must be carried out within a 20km radius of a person’s home and for an overall period of no longer than three hours per day (including travel time). However, downhill skiing and other snow sports that rely on mountains are not allowed."
And last Thursday an announcement made by the Prefects of the Haute-Savoie, Alain Espinasse, and the Savoie, Pascal Bolot stating that at the end of confinement and travel restrictions visitors to ski resorts will be able to take part in cross country skiing/ski de fond, snow showing and hiking.
Trouble is that in their announcement they use the word randonné (hiking/walking) but I have been unable to find ski randonné being one of the accepted activities.
It is only in the Le Dauphine where they state Haute-Savoie : ski de rando, fond, raquettes… autorisés le 15 décembre.
There's more on all this in a feature here.
And a note of thanks to Chocksaway for a point he made which we've incorporated.
And if it is authorised what can resorts do to make sure it doesn't end up getting banned?
We've asked the top dude we know at Serre Chevalier what their understanding is and whether they will be opening up their In-Resort ski-touring trails etc
Obviously all the above is subject to snow !!!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Weathercam, Reading the text, I'd be pretty sure that they mean ski rando. I would be comfortable confronting a gendarme over it. Looks like I may have that opportunity next week 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
There's more on all this in a feature here.
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Thanks for sharing very good read
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| Quote: |
whether they will be opening up their In-Resort ski-touring trails etc
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I can't see it happening in the current model of free to use ski touring trails. Perhaps if they can charge for it in some way, although seems like it would be hard to enforce.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Thanks - I see from the article you mention lifts staying closed until “mid-January” - a phrase I’ve seen in a few places, but nothing official from Macron, Castex et al - only that lifts won’t be opening over xmas/new year. I’ve got my super-optimistic trousers on and was hoping they might let people get back to work and maybe open some lifts after new year (naked self-interest - I’m planning a weekend 9/10 Jan), particularly as the Swiss are going to bus people from Chatel into Morgins! I assume we should hear something official this week as that’ll be ten days or so from Macron’s presser last week?
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The mayor of Tignes has issued a notice that ski touring is allowed in the resort but certain pistes are closed.
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And this just in from Chamonix Press Office
Chamonix Mont-Blanc is of course open to visitors and winter is just around the corner. The lifts might not be running in the immediate future, but ski touring, Nordic skiing, snowshoeing, ice skating, sledging, Spas, shopping...and having fun are all authorised activities ! We are confident that the valley will retain its festive buzz as we prepare to leap into another year.
It's all a tad reminiscent of cycling in the last lock-down in France when cycling was supposedly banned, and I came in for a lot of abuse on the "Cyclists in France FB Group" when I said I was still cycling (keeping to the 1km radius 1hr from home) as the Prefect of the Hautes Alpes said it was ok and the Gendarmes were cool about it, only stopping me to see my attestation and that I was indeed keeping to 1km from home.
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@Weathercam,
The 20k is much more generous. I think that's about 1256 square killometeres 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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There was a resort manager in the news yesterday, I think it was from Les Menuires, that confirmed that he expected people to go on "individual skiing practices" and so had to employ pisteurs to secure the domain.
So from Dec 15th skinning is in. Or from now if you stay within 20km of home.
Obviously the main issue becomes the lack of snow so far...
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I read somewhere a couple of days ago that cross country pistes can be groomed. None here though.
Snow line is pretty high here, about 2500m or more. I hiked up to 2100m a couple of days ago and saw none. It is snowing in town atm though. My touring skis need servicing, I'll get that done this week. There is a hiking/snowshoe/ski touring route up Vallée Blanche here. 450m of elevation and very mellow.
The forecast is for a reasonable amount of snow this week, we need it.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@Weathercam, from your article above
"There is also the little factor of no snow in the vast percentage of French ski resorts and little chance of any up to at least 8th December."
"Just look out the feckin window".....was that one of your phrases? 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Hmm, it's snowing quite heavily here atm  45cm forecast up to end of weekend in town, 1650m.
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It's even snowing in Morzine, snowline down to 500m in the NW......higher altitude resorts are likely to see -15c next week in France, steady top ups and low temps should be good for the base
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You know it makes sense.
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@patrick!, slightly odd to fire up ski patrol if resort’s not “open”... “marked” rando routes obvs different.
Unless something changes, I intend to be out once the snow is deep enough. 20km radius is pretty big.
And Chamonix is getting the XC track ready with quite a lot of snow making ....
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Weathercam wrote: |
And at best a slight dusting up at the Col du Lautaret, so looks like a North / South split ?
Anyway without turning this into a weather thread, at valley level I'm not seeing any substantial "dumps" just quite a few "dribbles", will be interesting to see if the resorts that do have snow will start to build XC pistes etc as vast percentage do not have snow making facilities especially those XC areas that are not in ski domains, but the way they're all harping on social media about what a great time you can expect if you come for Christmas I think they're dropping the ball on this?
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Here's Chamrousse, a light dusting for now but there may be 10-20cm if the rain/snow keeps up all day.
https://www.skaping.com/chamrousse/recoin/video
Given how cold it has been it could be a reasonable base although there has been a big inversion the last days and it was warm at altitude. I don't think that will be enough to tour on though and of course the resorts are not running the snowmaking now.
With WFH expect a lot more ski tourers out and about during the day though. Your days of peace are over this winter 
Quite a lot of resorts in the Northern Alps have snowmaking for XC pistes and also do snowfarming. Gieres and Bessans are open currently. What they do is make snow in one or two spots and then move the snow around with piste bashers. Obviously they can't cover 100km of pistes like this.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Looks like 40cm approx across all the french alps by the weekend.....hard to see how any non-lift activity would be viable, a few instructors / guides / hire shops might get a little work but without bars and restaurants open there's not much spending going on.
Be interesting to see how much piste management will be done next week....might put pressure on officials if the resorts are ready, even if just working towards a Jan opening
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Last season we interviewed Cédric Perretier, Directeur du service des pistes et de la sécurité for Serre Che, this was following on from a couple of pre-season major avalanche incidents in the resort where maybe the pisteurs had been a little too enthusiastic with their control
Also, we were keen to learn why with all the pre-season snow they were still running the canon 24x7 as they harp on about being so "green".
And his answer to this was that the snow canon snow will be the base for the end of the season, little structure to the crystals so air does not flow etc and snow tightly packed so keeps cold and that's the reason you see the strips of snow coming down the piste where snow canon have been doing their thing right past the end of the season.
And all through May when walking the dogs across that snow on the valley floor at 1,400m I always remembered that!
@davidof, what's your interpretation of the Sports Minister's decree?
Roxana Maracineanu, has confirmed that cross country skiing is now permitted in a decree published on Saturday, 28th November, allowing the sport to be practised until 15th December.
"It must be carried out within a 20km radius of a person’s home and for an overall period of no longer than three hours per day (including travel time). However, downhill skiing and other snow sports that rely on mountains are not allowed."
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Tue 1-12-20 10:47; edited 1 time in total
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BTW Ski touring is possible in the Western Pyrenees atm as there was a storm that blew in at the weekend. Also in the Northern Alps but you have to go above 2100 meters so Val Thorens, Tignes, les Arcs 2000 are possible.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@davidof, slightly further than your 20km and 3hrs inc travel then 
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I went for a little "hike" in the snow on Vallée Blanche here this morning on the hiking/snowshoe/touring path. This is at 1800m and I walked up as far as 1900. No snow to speak of to ski down on though. It's snowing again now. Last November when we had a big dump the Diable Black was completely tracked out through people skinning up and skiing down.
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A good read here rasing quite a few issues
https://amp-lefigaro-fr.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/amp.lefigaro.fr/voyages/montagne/sans-ski-alpin-ce-que-l-on-pourra-faire-en-station-a-noel-20201126
And a few tourist offices proclaiming that they'll be open for ski touring etc
Même si les pistes et les remontées mécaniques sont fermées, on pourra, au départ de la station, remonter des pentes à peaux de phoque, et les descendre ensuite, comme au bon vieux temps. Le ski de randonnée a le vent en poupe, c'est peut-être l'hiver où jamais de s'y essayer. «Quand les pistes sont ouvertes, cette pratique est interdite par arrêté municipal, mais quand elles sont fermées, rien ne l'interdit, explique Michel Charlet, l'ancien maire de Chamonix (Haute-Savoie). D'ailleurs ici, début décembre, avant l'ouverture des pistes, tout le monde fait de la peau de phoque ».
Even if the slopes and the ski lifts are closed, you will be able, from the station, to go up slopes with sealskin, and then descend them, as in the good old days. Ski touring is on the rise, it might be winter or never to try it out. "When the slopes are open, this practice is prohibited by municipal decree, but when they are closed, nothing prohibits it," explains Michel Charlet, the former mayor of Chamonix (Haute-Savoie). Besides, here, at the beginning of December, before the slopes open, everyone is wearing sealskin ”.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| under a new name wrote: |
| @patrick!, slightly odd to fire up ski patrol if resort’s not “open”... “marked” rando routes obvs different. |
I'll try to find the exact source.
On the plus side snow's here at last! More tomorrow!
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@Weathercam, do you have the original text of the Maracineanu text please? ta. (I have had a bit of a look but only found an interview in FranceBleu) and no décrets ...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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ok it is not bottomless pow but
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@davidof, no FOMO yet
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Weathercam, thanks, most helpful. So with google to aid the typing, from the gov sports link, "The practice of all land, water and air sports is thus authorized while respecting the distance between people."
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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That's a nice new French word - which I shall attempt to work into my next online French lesson.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Weathercam wrote: |
However, the 20km and three-hour rule is still in place so that limits the hordes from Grenoble and Lyon as to where they can go and that was evident from the lack of cars at the Col du Lautaret on the webcam there over the weekend as I kept checking. |
Do you really think those TRs you posted respected the 3hr / 20km rule?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@davidof, like I said B all people up at the Col though that was quite an obvious point for a control!
Though why would anyone post their sorties on a public site like SkiTour.fr if they were ignoring that rule, but that's probably only a tiny % or the numbers that were actually out for that very reason.
And think that goes to show how the Grenoblois were out in the likes of the Chartreuse and Belledonne as opposed to further afield.
Just looked at the Cucumelle Cam and someone having a good day and it's possible to do that in under three hours depending on where you live 1,100m elevation.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Lot of people skinning up here over the weekend. I did a bit yesterday. I snowshoed on Saturday too, about 10km.
However it is being strongly discouraged here, nothing being done to make it easier or encourage it. In fact the Isère Prefet has just issued this.
COMMUNIQUÉ DE PRESSE PRÉFECTURE DE L’ISÈRE
Chute de neige et randonnée en montagne : rappel des limitations de déplacements et appel à la prudence Les chutes de neige de ces dernières heure peuvent inciter à la reprise de la randonné en ski, en raquettes ou à pied dans les massifs isérois, les remontées mécaniques demeurant, pour leur part, fermées dans le cadre de l'état d'urgence sanitaire.
Il est important de rappeler que les restrictions de circulation demeurent jusqu'au 15 décembre et que donc le respect d'une distance de 20 km autour de son domicile ainsi qu'une limite de temps de 3 heures s'appliquent.
En outre, les conditions d'enneigement doivent inciter à la prudence, le manteau neigeux n'étant pas
stabilisé, le risque d'avalanche est important notamment en zone hors piste.
S'agissant des domaines skiables, si les remontées mécaniques demeurent fermées dans le cadre de la crise sanitaire, il est de la responsabilité des maires d'autoriser l'ouverture des domaines skiables notamment nordiques (ski de fond) et dans ce cas de mettre en place le dispositif de secours afférant et de sécuriser les pistes. Si le domaine skiable n'est pas ouvert, sa fréquentation par quelque moyen que ce soit se fait donc au risque et péril des pratiquants.
Dans tous les cas, la situation encore très tendue dans les services hospitaliers doit amener chacun à faire preuve de civisme en évitant toute prise de risque inutile.
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@Claude B, unfortunately as we've alluded to, post-December 15th we might well see a blanket ban when the hordes are released.
Almost had a domestic last evening based on a "what if" scenario when I mentioned as above that Cucumelle was doable within three hours at pace, with OH saying that you don't have to go all the way, and my response was that's where the best descent is from, so if people want to come with me and then start moaning I'll just leave them to it and go on my way, or words to that effect
Anyway that's all irrelevant as I won't be in that situation from the looks of things, and probably just confined to ski du fond.
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@Weathercam, sorry if I missed it but are you back in France now??
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@kitenski, don't you start rubbing it in
Actually, see my post in the road bike thread from yesterday!
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@Weathercam, why drive to the Lauteret if you can ski closer to home in better conditions? The roads around Grenoble weren't very practicable on Saturday. The Autoroute from Lyon was also blocked for a time.
Lots of kitesurfers or whatever they are called up there now mind.
Look at the Belle Etoile trip on your list. The guy did 2700 meters in 80cm of snow depth and more than 20km from his home. He must have been out all day. I think by and large people are ignoring the 20km / 3 hour rule now.
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