 Poster: A snowHead
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Erm, where to start? Ok, I'm planning to book the gnarbug and sopib next season, I've always skied skinny skis or carvers, the widest skis I've owned are the current 170 iRallys at 76 underfoot. I've always been too tight/broke to carry more than one pair. I generally have no trouble skiing all terrain on the iRallys, from deepest powder to hard piste but thinking the powder may be more fun on purpose built planks.
Is there such a thing as a powder ski that carves like the iRallys?
Those snowheads that know me know that I'm not much of an equipment geek, generally replacing ggear as it falls apart rather than falls out of fashion.
I'm 90kg 185cm tall and learned to ski powder on 2m super gs in 1980something or other.
The plan for the gnarbug and sopib is that we are driving out in a Ducato van so if I can buy, beg, borrow or steal, I can carry quite a number of pairs to try.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@tangowaggon, powder itself isn't usually an issue but wider skis typically take less work. Where a "modern" wider ski really helps is in crappy snow, crud, crust, etc. Until you get really wide and long for Alaska like high speed lines.
Almost anything you can find ... personally my daily driver is 100mm and it's very fine in everything so far but there are those on here who'd go wider.
There are few bad skis made these days.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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As you are comfortable on narrow skis, then going to something with a waist of around 92 will feel pretty wide, much easier in powder and still feel carvey on Piste.
An All Mountain type ski won't be as good at carving on piste as a dedicated Carver...it just depends where you want to compromise.
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Blizzard Brahma would be a good ski for you
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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i would have a look at the Rossi sky 7 HD because they are all over and super good value right now 99/98 underfoot, often found with a binding in the pack - go 188 rather than 180 which will be too short for you . I think Brahmas would be fine but not "different" enough.
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Yeah, I'd aim 95-100mm. Take a few days of acclimiatistion.
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There is tons of choice in the 90-100mm waist range. From what you describe it sounds like you might prefer stiffer ski (ie metal in it) so Blizzard Brahma, Atmoic Vantage 90 etc. Rather than Sin 7, Cham 97 etc (personally I prefer a softer ski, but it's preference/what you're used to).
Another thought is the binding. If you are looking to ski more off piste, then that may lead you to doing a bit of ski touring. There has been a couple of recent posts (including one from me) about changing bindings to a frame or tech binding. If you don't have tech boots and don't intend on changing them, then a marker f10/f12 binding could be a thought.
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Do you tend to a longer ski for a powder ski? as I say, I'm 185 tall and 90kg currently on 170's, I tend to prefer a shorter ski that is easier when in the tricky bits. I used some Rossi experience 88's about 6 years ago at UCPA which seemed ok offpiste, not too bad carving but had the nimbleness of a supertanker in the bumps. A lightweight & nimble ski that can change direction quickly would be preferable
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An Exp88 shouldn't be tanker like in the bumps. Were you trying to carve it or pivoting/steering. You can comfortably go fatter than that in a rockered ski and pivot quite easily to eat up bumps.
Plus you should go longer if you go for a rockered ski because your effective edge is much sorter.
I stand by my view that the Cham 2.0 97 is all the off piste ski most people need.
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| Quote: |
nimbleness of a supertanker in the bumps
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It's not the skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| under a new name wrote: |
| Quote: |
nimbleness of a supertanker in the bumps
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It's not the skis. |
Compared to my old Head 1100s , they were like supertankers, even my current Head iRallys can't match the 1100s in the bumps,
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| under a new name wrote: |
| Quote: |
nimbleness of a supertanker in the bumps
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It's not the skis. |
To be fair it probably is. Rossi Experience are absolutely rotten things, they're either made of cardboard or feel like it.
They were bought by all the rental shops for a few seasons, I think it's a nice easy ski for your 1-week-a-year hobbyists.
I've skied with tangowaggon and you might say he 'doesn't hang about'... I'm quite aggressive on the skis too and can relate to the problem. They're far too flappy and the camber doesn't drive the tip in. In the bumps they end up just flailing about like a bamboo hut in a hurricane.
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@dp, In fairness, I haven't skied on anything like that since about 1989 when I had the joy of an all wooden rental pair of Rossis from around 1962.
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You know it makes sense.
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@tangowaggon, I started on skinnies (Sallomon Force 9 et al) 25 years ago and then went on to carvers (Rossignol Bandits/B2). I had a brief failed flirtation with some Movement Thunders that were just too stiff (for me). Then a couple of years ago due to a failed binding I hired some Dynstar Cham 87's. After the other binding went I decided to invest in some new Cham 97's. The 87 and 97 denoting the waste width - they was also a 107. The 87's were great but was encouraged by folks on here among other things to go wider. And I have to say the 97's rail pretty darn good. And of course they are much better in the crud and powder in comparison to me old carvers. The wife upgraded to some wider skis (White Doctor) last year and she says the only difference is their ability to crush the crud. So sure go for it.
The Cham 87/97/107 have been replaced by the Cham 2.0 last season, so if you scour the second hand market you can probably get some 97 or 107's for a decent price.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@under a new name, yeah... I know that often on the forum we say "it's not the skis, get a lesson". But there are exceptions.
I am not saying that Rossi Experience are dog egg, period. It sold well for the cheaper-end ski hire places like Intersport etc... it was just the go-to ski for several seasons during the soft snow part of the season (then once it firmed up everybody seemed to hire the Salamon X-Drive). Walking round resorts 2 years ago, every tourist seemed to have a pair of Experience 80s slung over his shoulder.
But IMO if you are a heavy and/or aggressive skier who pushes hard into turns, the ski is just too floppy and bouncy. It doesn't push into the snow at tip and tail, it just sits gently on the snow so as soon as it gets bumpy they just start flapping all over the shop. They reminded me of being a child and pinging a plastic ruler over the side of the desk. booooooooiiiiiiiing-g-g-g-g-g-g.
Obviously all skis have like an effective weight range. The bendy end of the scale, you have the problem that if you're heavy/strong, you give it 30% effort and the ski bends to 100% of it's range... then you have no control beyond that. At the firm end of the scale, you have the problem that if you're smaller/weaker, you give it 100% effort and the ski bends to 30% of it's range... and no matter how hard you push you just can't turn it. And that's basically fine... different skis are different firmness, for different size/weight/style/skill of skiers. The trouble is when you go into the hire shop and they just give you the same pair as everybody else, size you up by height alone and use your weight solely for the DIN. There's no question of - how good are you, how do you ski, what kind of terrain will you ski, etc etc. Hence the problem when you walk into Intersport or UCPA and some kid in his first season gives you the skis and his entire knowledge of skis is that they're long and pointy and you give everyone a Rossi Experience 80. Because you just do.
I don't think they're actually rubbish. They're just one of any number of skis which have gone down in history as 'not very good' because most people's experience of it has been twinned with being issued it as the wrong ski by a hire shop.
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Poster: A snowHead
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No, not X-Drives, horrible things. Actually, those were the last noodles I skied. Mind you, the not-FIS Head GSs I skied two winters ago weren't great.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@dp, I agree with all or most of what you say.
Except that, a noodle that you describe will not be like a supertanker in bumps. By definition.
In which case...
He he he...
It's not the skis. 
("It's not that you can't ski bumps, it's that you can't ski and bumps are Nature's way of telling you", as someone else once said)
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@under a new name, it's a good quote, fortunately I can ski and bumps are just nature's way of telling me to start thinking about heading home for the day
Like a supertanker in bumps? No perhaps you are right. Basically the complete opposite come to think of it. Still rubbish but too eager to move, rather than too hesitant.
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@dp, I am, in all fairness being too heavy on someone I have never skied with. Bumps are why you go out when it's not a powder or spring day however.
@tangowaggon, I'm sorry, I am too harsh. Really, I am.
Sounds actually as though not only were they a relatively rubbish ski, but possibly trashed out and purely tuned into the bargain.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@under a new name, sorry maybe we're thinking about different bumps then  im referring to bumps forming up more at the end of the day which tells me that the day is coming to an end because I otherwise hadn't noticed from having too much fun
I don't think the Experience is a rubbish ski. I just think that for some stupid reason, hire shops and indeed UCPA did seem to think that it was a ski which suited every single skier in the whole world no matter their size shape style or ability. Not only is there no such ski in the world, but if there was it would definitely not be the Experience!!!
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@tangowaggon, End of Season Bash, 3pm onwards every day... bumps heaven
the fat skis make it too easy though
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@tangowaggon, I know it sounds mental but seriously on my 190cm, 118mm Ragnaroks I can close enough straight-line the bumps. I think it's more to do with the fact that at EOSB it's slushy bumps, so smaller skis get bogged down in it but the big skis have a bigger footprint and stay up on top.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I purchased a pair of Rossignol Super 7s this year. 116mm under foot. Initially aimed at off-piste but I found myself using them for the piste days too (had the option of 97mm Blizzard Bonafides). Awesome and so easy to use for such a wide ski. These should be my all rounders now.
At 185cm buy the longest skis in any range. You will be too heavy for the short skis. if you are a decent skier it will not be a problem.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I've been looking ont' net and there's a few off season bargains to be had, up to 70% off Cham 97s and some Rossi sky 7 hd's for £309 inc bindings.
The smallest turn radius I can find in wide skis is 17m, I'm used to sub 14m radius skis because I do like carving at silly angles on piste, I tried a pair of 18m radius skis and nearly hit a pylon that I thought that I would be well clear of so I think it will be fat skis for off piste days only.
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I really don't understand the obsession with radius - FIS GS are out above 30m radius and no one would say those guys can't carve.
Personally I really liked my Icelantic Shamans as a wide utility ski because the 17m radius made them a doddle on piste when needed but plenty of people found them too "turny" for off piste. You can carve any wide ski bar reverse sidecuts but the better you are at developing edge angle the easier it will be.
Given what you've said I'd get the Chams particularly if they are the 2.0 15/16 season onwards. It's a great allround ski for the competent skier and not too much of anything - soft, firm, charey, playful with enough Dynastar proper ski heritage to not be too much of a leap from pistencarvers.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Dave of the Marmottes, +1
Given current men's FIS slalom is 13m... ... (and the focus on radius is (I suspect) really only because it's easily measured on the hill) - if you're finding r=18m a handful something else is going on (torsional rigidity, technique, who knows?) - my Bonafide's are 20m and quite short turny enough, thank you.
Radius is a bit of a red herring.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| under a new name wrote: |
Radius is a bit of a red herring. |
Big fat HUGE red herring - easiest ski to pivot tiny turns I've ever used had something like a 40m radius.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@clarky999, +1 also a good point is that rocker (which really isn't used much on race skis) totally distorts the effects of sidecut (which I think was what you were referring to anyway).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Cheap isn't always good - you gets what you pays for. I have always abided by advice I was given about 35 years ago - "never buy a ski who is old".
My favourite all-around ski of the last few years is the Dynastar Cham 87 but I firmly believe that the best ski is the one you like. It is a very subjective judgement and the best way to find out is to try before you buy. A friend of mine who is a good skier couldn't stand the Cham. I also had a lot of fun on the Volkl Kendo this year at the SOPiB having not liked the Black Crow I initially tried (I can't remember the model).
I find that skis with rocker feel shorter so I would usually go for a longer ski than normal.
Good luck with finding your ideal!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
I find that skis with rocker feel shorter
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I can't imagine a ski with rocker feeling longer...
I've said it on here before, early season we tested 5 different models with extremely similar geometries_on_paper and they were very noticeably different. But then, we are both quite ski sensitive and this was totally to be expected.
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@tangowaggon, I've skied those Cham 97's and they make life easy as, you'll find it a piece of urine in the deep stuff with them and I think you'd enjoy them, they won't suit you in the bumps though so your screwed now mate as your carrying two pairs of skis around from now on and the next step is carrying 27 pairs of skis like northerngeezer.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I found some ski + binding packages
Faction prodigys £323
Soul 7 HD £363
Faction 9 £373
Sky 7 HD £309 this is favourite on paper, 98 underfoot and a 17m radius, wider than my 76mm iRallys without being ridiculously wide and a reasonably tight turn radius so I can still carve some tight ish turns on piste.
I need to decide whether to buy now and just hope I like whatever I buy or wait till I'm in resort (1st trip St Anton 26/1/18 ) and take various skis out on test but unlikely to get such a choice of discounted skis 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Snowheads Oktober ski tests
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@spyderjon, rumour has it white dot may attend and that I guess there may be some old skis to clear again.
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| tangowaggon wrote: |
I found some ski + binding packages
Faction prodigys £323
Soul 7 HD £363
Faction 9 £373
Sky 7 HD £309 this is favourite on paper, 98 underfoot and a 17m radius, wider than my 76mm iRallys without being ridiculously wide and a reasonably tight turn radius so I can still carve some tight ish turns on piste.
I need to decide whether to buy now and just hope I like whatever I buy or wait till I'm in resort (1st trip St Anton 26/1/18 ) and take various skis out on test but unlikely to get such a choice of discounted skis |
They probably won't have your list in resort. I think if you are in resort a better approach is to state your requirements and test out what they have. Or as others have said at the October ski tests. The trouble with those it's a limited test environment.
Another downside of the doing the testing and deal in resort is it will eat in your ski holiday. Could well be worth it of course rather than taking a punt based on descriptions and reviews. That said the reviews and information found can be quite in depth and if you know what suits and can read the reviews with that in mind it can work.
Absolute worst case scenario you have to sell them on and take a hit if you really hate them.
My missus bought some new ski's blind last season and it worked out fine.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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It's a 5hr round trip to the nearest Oktober test and like you say, it's a limited test environment, especially for an off piste ski.
The write up on the sky 7 describes them as lightweight which is appealing for quick turns on really steep stuff ( 3600g but difficult to compare as most of the other skis didn't quote weight).
There's a touring binding option, is this likely to be of any use on the gnarbug or sopib?
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| tangowaggon wrote: |
I found some ski + binding packages
Faction prodigys £323
Soul 7 HD £363
Faction 9 £373
Sky 7 HD £309 this is favourite on paper, 98 underfoot and a 17m radius, wider than my 76mm iRallys without being ridiculously wide and a reasonably tight turn radius so I can still carve some tight ish turns on piste.
I need to decide whether to buy now and just hope I like whatever I buy or wait till I'm in resort (1st trip St Anton 26/1/18 ) and take various skis out on test but unlikely to get such a choice of discounted skis |
Do you mean Faction 9Five?
Anyway, I'd write the Factions off that list as they're very much all mountain rather than offpiste skis, and I doubt you'll notice that much of a performance bump over your current skis.
I demoed the Sky and Soul 7 HD's several times back to back at a ski test year before last. Both lots of fun, but the Soul would be my pick. Very very fun, and totally idiot proof. Very easy to ski on piste - so easy that there's no need to consider the narrower Sky IMO. Don't be scared of them or 100mm+ waists. They're the sort of ski anyone could have fun on regardless of ability, aims or conditions. The only reason I'd go Sky over Soul 7 would be if you were planning a lot of ski touring.
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FAQ
