 Poster: A snowHead
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A question for my other half who is a ski instructor for four months every year here in Slovakia, she needs a new jacket, she feels the cold like most women do, has used Otovox Guardian shell and Oneil Jones 3l but they do not put up with being on the slope with learners, so we are interested to know if any of you are instructors and what experience you have had with makes of jackets, we are even looking at mountaineering gear for the rugged approach, don't mind spending the cash but want it to last more than two seasons, any info very welcome.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'm not an instructor but when skiing with slower skiers I tend to add a down jacket under my shell. Or these guys do heated gilets etc:
https://www.blazewear.com
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Ok thanks but the keeping warm is not the main issue, it is really about the ruggedness and not wearing out so soon.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Slovakbrit, I have found Beyond-X stuff to be very hard wearing, lots of ski schools and lift companies use it as their uniform.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Norrona Tamok or Trollvegen
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Tue 5-09-17 16:13; edited 1 time in total
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I have found my Patagonia shell to be wearing pretty well and not as £££ as e.g. Norrona nor Arc'teryx.
Pretty sure it's a mountaineering model.
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For really hard wearing you need to be looking at Ventile fabric or similar. As a minimum a coarse weave fabric with a membrane.
But you probably have pretty unrealistric expectations - if she's an instructor she's probably wearing it continuously for 120 days - most jackets will be pretty shagged after that.
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@Dave of the Marmottes, admittedly some of my days are quite short, and I don't usually go out in the rain but my Patagucci was acquired in 2012 so will have done some 250-300 days...
My old Mountain Hardwear one did 12 seasons (so ~? 450-550 days)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Burton AK will easily do a season like that, although you'd not normally be paying retail for it.
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@Slovakbrit, what's the problem with the learners anyway 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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My Beyond-X jacket probably has 1200 days, the shoulder that I carry skis on is fraying slightly. I replaced the pants because the pockets had developed some holes that I had repaired with tape.
You can pick which fabric is used, I picked Cordura as it was the hardest wearing option.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@rjs, impressive.
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The ski school that Mrs t_m works for issued Salomon uniforms last season. They were pretty bulletproof even teaching kids on an exposed nursery slope at altitude.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
For really hard wearing you need to be looking at Ventile fabric or similar. As a minimum a coarse weave fabric with a membrane.
But you probably have pretty unrealistric expectations - if she's an instructor she's probably wearing it continuously for 120 days - most jackets will be pretty shagged after that.
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So the Ortovox jacket which lasted two seasons did well, but at what price
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@Slovakbrit, what's the problem with the learners anyway
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Absolutely nothing, and my wife was reading over my shoulder telling me "it doesn't matter who you are teaching it needs to do the job, keep me warm dry and not fall to bits"
Thanks to all so far, my wife is a self employed instructor so has to buy everything, don't mind spending the money but it has to be worth it.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Most premium jackets are intended to last 100 or so full mountain days nowadays. No more. The Arcteryx Alpha SV I had (up there with the most bomb proof models, it was the original made in Canada model) wore out its DWR coating and outer fabric after 1 season, no amount of reproofing and tumble drying helped
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Poster: A snowHead
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@gra, didn't you try returning it? The Arc guarantee is pretty robust...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It may not be of interest...but LL Bean do a lifetime, no quibble guarantee on all their products...which I have tested successfully, when my ski edge cut through the inner protector on their ski pants.
I am not an instructor, so haven't given that kind of abuse...but the stuff I (and Lady F) have, is good quality....and the 3 layer Goretex shell can have both a Fleece and a Down Jacket (both bought separately) zipped into it.
If their stuff doesn't give full satisfaction, they will take it back (provided you still have the receipt)....they must be one of the only companies left who still do this.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Old Fartbag wrote: |
It may not be of interest...but LL Bean do a lifetime, no quibble guarantee on all their products...which I have tested successfully, when my ski edge cut through the inner protector on their ski pants.
I am not an instructor, so haven't given that kind of abuse...but the stuff I (and Lady F) have, is good quality....and the 3 layer Goretex shell can have both a Fleece and a Down Jacket (both bought separately) zipped into it.
If their stuff doesn't give full satisfaction, they will take it back (provided you still have the receipt)....they must be one of the only companies left who still do this. |
Same for Arc' & Patagonia.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
Same for Arc' & Patagonia. |
That's good to know...and they'd have a wider range to choose from as well.
Edit. Patagonia say that, "Damage due to wear and tear will be repaired at a reasonable charge."...and Arc' say something similar.
LL Bean exchanged my ski pants, even though I'd fallen over and ripped the inner ski edge protector, with the ski edge. When I said that I was disappointed that the edge protector hadn't lived up to my expectation, they were replaced without argument. Would the companies you list go that far?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Old Fartbag, I've had the same experience with Arc' and have a mate who's had similar with Patagonia.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I'm not somebody who feels the cold much, and in the cold part of the season I just wear my Buffalo for everything
They are on the, er, 'quite warm' end of the spectrum but the benefit of a Buffalo is it doesn't work on the layers principle, it works on the vents principle. So you can just put one layer on and control your body temperature by changing vents.
They don't actually make a ski jacket but that doesn't seem to deter the locals!
I don't want to 'encourage' it as the right jacket per se, I only wore mine for a few days skiing this year. but it's something that might interest you if you feel the cold easily. The attraction for an instructor is that they're very warm when you're stood still and all you need to do before doing something physical is undo the side zips.
The other perk (for us UK types but not so much the OP) is they're still made in the people's republic of up north, so if you break it it's not so much a 'no quibble' guarantee as just send a packet of custard creams along with the broken garment and there'll certainly be no quibbles...
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| @Old Fartbag, I've had the same experience with Arc' and have a mate who's had similar with Patagonia. |
Customer service of that standard is rare IME....mostly, I find companies try and avoid replacing/fixing anything under warranty, that isn't a manufacturing defect.
IIRC REI stopped giving Life Warranty, due to customers taking advantage.
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TOH just got a nice new Arc jacket for a mere €180 having returned the previous one. It looks like poor design to me but it was bought end 2011. they'd have repaired but don't use that particular GT facric anymore.
We though that was pretty fair.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I've got my eyes on the new Norrøna Lofoten Pro Jacket, but they also do an ACE version made with Vectran fibers (similar to Kevlar) which they are saying is their most durable outer fabric ever. For €1099 I would hope so. Only male version at the moment.
I've used the warranty service of Arc'teryx and Norrøna here in Norway. Two jackets repaired without question and only had to pay one way shipping to Arc'teryx (£16). Norrøna have a store 20mins away from me so that was just to pop into the store and the jacket was sent back to me.
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| Old Fartbag wrote: |
LL Bean exchanged my ski pants, even though I'd fallen over and ripped the inner ski edge protector, with the ski edge. When I said that I was disappointed that the edge protector hadn't lived up to my expectation, they were replaced without argument. Would the companies you list go that far? |
Think I heard on a Freakonomics or similar podcast that you literally cannot find LL Bean stuff in charity shops or donation bins anywhere near Maine as it is snapped up by opportunists who take it back for credit or refund no matter how old or battered. Bean know about this but think it is more damaging to their brand to scrap their unconditional policy than it is to provide free stuff for some less than ethical "customers". Their customer service staff are essentially saints for the amount of BS they accept without question.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
Think I heard on a Freakonomics or similar podcast that you literally cannot find LL Bean stuff in charity shops or donation bins anywhere near Maine as it is snapped up by opportunists who take it back for credit or refund no matter how old or battered. Bean know about this but think it is more damaging to their brand to scrap their unconditional policy than it is to provide free stuff for some less than ethical "customers". Their customer service staff are essentially saints for the amount of BS they accept without question. |
Their Warranty info now clearly states that the goods have to be accompanied by the original receipt, or they won't honor it....maybe they're now finally tired of being pi$$ed on.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ok, Thank you everyone who replied, we are working on several options and if we ever find something that does the job you will be the first to know...Good ski-ing
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Thought I would let you know that my wife has purchased a Mountain Equipment Manaslu jacket, because it is harder wearing we are hoping that it will be good for her as an Instructor, we will give you an update once the season has begun and at the end.
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FAQ
