 Poster: A snowHead
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Advice needed on where to do a ski season for 2023/2024 Dec-April
21 years old male doing a gap year post uni.
Looking for a healthy combination of great skiing (love the freeride/pow stuff; not overly smitten with groomers) and good social options--so ideally a big resort.
UK passport (so i think only France/Canada/Switzerland are the main options)
Currently thinking val d'isere/Les arcs/Alpe dhuez/meribel/courchevel/verbier/whistler/banff --but looking for other good options. preferably somewhere high so it's possible to ski for a long season and avoid the weeks of grassy slopes we had this year in the alps.
also: anyone have advice on which jobs to apply for? i'd probably be most keen for a chalet host job in france but otherwise am open to something which has plenty of time to ski and good social options.
have heard some of the french resorts are great fun especially, but id be worried about spending an entire season there with the same people from same sorts of places in england and potentially average skiing for a lot of the year.
please prove my assumptions wrong! a lot of cliche advice about ski seasons out there and need some objective input
thanks
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@halibut1, Welcome to Snowheads. Why do you think France is an option but not Austria or Italy for example - all EU countries, and with a UK passport you would need a working visa for all of them, otherwise you can't work and can only stay for 90 days in 180, so not a full season.
Your best bet might be Canada, but others who will have a better idea of how easy/difficult it is to get a visa for France will be along...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
Your best bet might be Canada
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Or Japan or possibly Andora?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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You can no longer work anywhere in Europe (including Switzerland) without a work permit which is now hard to get post Brexit. Even just ski bumming you have max 90 days.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| BobinCH wrote: |
| You can no longer work anywhere in Europe (including Switzerland) without a work permit which is now hard to get post Brexit. Even just ski bumming you have max 90 days. |
Same for Canada, you need a work permit. At your age you'd be eligible to apply for a working holiday visa. However, you need to apply in advance and be lucky enough to get one in the lottery draw. New Zealand used to offer working holiday visas on arrival, so may be worth consideration if that's still the case.
If you like off-piste Canada is fantastic because the resorts are set up with everything inside the boundary avalanche controlled. So you can access all kinds of terrain without the need for avy gear and partners.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@BobinCH, @holidayloverxx, my understanding is that French ski companies are still hiring UK passports and willing to sponsor them for the visa process, whereas less so (if at all from my research) in Austria or Italy. I know of one chalet company in Switzerland which sponsors UK passports but that's it.
hoping someone can prove me wrong because would love to do Austria/Italy/Switzerland, probably more than france...
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@johnE, not so keen on Andorra for a whole season. Japan would be fantastic, but with the language barrier i wonder if i would be able to have an immersive experience
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@halibut1,
Welcome to Snowheads.
I'm assuming from your post that you are looking to become a working rather than ski bum seasonnaire (I've done both - worker in Meribel; ski bum in Tignes).
First up, if applying to Tour Operators forget any idea of being able to choose which country/resort you'll go to - just be thankful of getting a job & go where the company sends you - people doing 2nd, 3rd etc seasons get some say on where they are going.
Second, be aware of the high drop out rate of first timers - you would be expect to work hard before thinking about partying or skiing. Too many people arrive in resort thinking they are on a paid 5 month holiday - they don't last past January.
You mentioned chalet host as a potential job - have you booked yourself on a chalet host course? It would help your job prospects & may open you eyes as to how tough the role is - even just the cooking is different at altitude!
Be aware that the ski season makes life tough for any first timers - two of the premium weeks are right at the start -Christmas & New Year. If you go down the chalet host route you could find that the guests who have paid a huge premium for the weeks are some of the first (or even the first) you host. Not too much chance to learn from your mistakes! And don't expect to get much snowtime 'til mid January.
On the plus side more & more employers are recruiting UK passport holders - their business model depends on cheap labour being willing to suffer hard work, poor living conditions & poor food to be able to ski five days a week (if you're lucky). The employers website will tell you if they are willing to help with visas.
Ski Beat have posted on Facebook that they are recruiting for next season (skibeatjobs.co.uk) - a lead for you there. Apply to everyone you can think of for any role you are qualified for, and don't worry about where you may end up - any season on the snow is better than none.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Kenzie,
From skibeat website:
"Since Brexit, candidates resident in Great Britain do not have an automatic entitlement to live and work in France. To work in France, you will require one of:
EU Passport
Established residency in France (Titre de Sejour)
Other means of legally working in France
For exceptional candidates from Great Britain with relevant chalet experience, Ski Beat can assist with French visa and residency applications. However, this process is time consuming and not guaranteed to succeed."
I'm sure it's possible to get sponsored for a visa. But not so easy. Realistically you are likely at the back of the queue, especially as a young person with no experience.
It's definitely worth considering if you can do a season without working. Imo a much better experience, but does require saving up enough money up front. Might be less than you think though.
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| halibut1 wrote: |
| @johnE, not so keen on Andorra for a whole season. Japan would be fantastic, but with the language barrier i wonder if i would be able to have an immersive experience |
https://www.niseko-wow.com/jobs/
Working Holiday Visa is easy to come by
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@halibut1, daughter has been teaching at Whistler ski school since November and loving it. Had BASI 1 with 5 years of teaching at local dry slope here in Glasgow. She has since attained the CSIA (?) Level 2 over there mostly funded by ski school. She has also got some adaptive qualifications out there too and loves doing that.
Pros - great support from ski school to better yourself, great terrain in Whistler
Cons - long way from home, getting accommodation is extremely difficult, cost of living expensive (eg she gets CAD 1500 a fortnight and paying CAD 1200 PM for a bunk bed, supermarkets very expensive.
Definitely worth considering though and visa was easy enough to get for the 2 years.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Kenzie, wow thanks so much for your input-- really helpful.
I have booked a chalet host course for May--from the stuff i've had from them so far they seem pretty confident that their students can still get jobs in french resorts with relative ease.
I take your point on the difficulty of the job. Definitely something i probably haven't fully absorbed yet, but i am generally a pretty rugged person and think I would enjoy making food/serving clients long hours as long as the people I'm working with are nice.
Having said that, not having much time on the snow sounds awful- could be a dealbreaker.
was thinking maybe a job as a driver-- have heard that gives more skiing time. I've had a full clean UK license for 4 years so i think could be a possibility.
take your point re getting any job i can get. sounds like i need to reel in my expectations somewhat!
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| halibut1 wrote: |
was thinking maybe a job as a driver-- have heard that gives more skiing time. I've had a full clean UK license for 4 years so i think could be a possibility. |
If you mean transfer driving, think that became a real issue in and out of Geneva, post Brexit.
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You know it makes sense.
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cost of living expensive (eg she gets CAD 1500 a fortnight and paying CAD 1200 PM for a bunk bed
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To be fair 1200cad for anything is whistler is cheap. Guessing it's staff housing? Shows how hard it is to make ends meet there.
Elsewhere in Canada you get a lot more for your money, but nowhere offers the same experience (for better or worse!).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@halibut1,
Don't sweat lack of snow time early season - it's a busy period & you'll be new to your chalet work. Most people seem to get more sniwtime as the season progresses and they get used to the work, find timesavers etc.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Lots of people - including one of my grandsons - also thinking about the same sort of thing, @halibut1. It's become hugely more difficult post-Brexit, and even pre-Brexit the warnings about working flat out for the first few weeks were relevant. My son did a couple of seasons, as a well paid chef, and over New Year with one French family worked 36 hours on the trot, producing food. He found it satisfying, though, because he loved cooking for a really discerning (and very rich) Parisian banker who appreciated his food. Not all clients were quite so rewarding. But not all weeks were quite so busy!!
Let us know how you get on, as you look further into the prospects - folk here will be interested to follow your story.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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There seem to be far fewer "catered chalets" than there used to be, so presumably those jobs are now harder to get.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@pam w, thanks so much. what your son did sounds good to me! Have led far too sheltered a life- I quite like the sound of hours on end as the dogsbody + dealing with unsympathetic clients.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@boarder2020, thanks for the help. I like your idea of not working for 90 days but do feel i would do better off with a base, such as work colleagues etc. Plus would nowhere near be able to afford it and would ideally want to be able to fund a decently fun lifestyle for a whole season.
any more info about finding housing in whistler? I'm in the working holiday visa pool so fingers crossed for success. I've heard working for Vail resorts is possible- any thoughts about that?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@halibut1, do you have experience of working in hospitality? Lots of students earn extra money that way, and it would be useful and relevant experience. Round our way, loads of places seem to be hiring staff.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| halibut1 wrote: |
@boarder2020, thanks for the help. I like your idea of not working for 90 days but do feel i would do better off with a base, such as work colleagues etc. Plus would nowhere near be able to afford it and would ideally want to be able to fund a decently fun lifestyle for a whole season.
any more info about finding housing in whistler? I'm in the working holiday visa pool so fingers crossed for success. I've heard working for Vail resorts is possible- any thoughts about that? |
Just stay in a hostel and you will meet a bunch of people that are all doing seasons, love skiing, and want to have a good time.
I'd be wary of working for the mountain. The positives are you get a free lift pass and some places have employee housing. The negatives are by definition a lot of your work will be during potential ski hours and the free ski pass can kind of trap you in a bad situation. I know one guy who rocked up in Canada got a job with the mountain, was all good for the first few weeks, then they drastically changed his position, his new boss treated him really badly, and he realised he could be getting paid way better and way more ski hours doing another job. Unfortunately by that point the early season lift pass sales was over so was going to cost a ridiculous amount he couldn't afford to buy a season pass, so he got trapped there as couldn't afford to lose the employee pass.
There are plenty of jobs in most ski resort towns it's not hard to find something. Working at a bar is the most social, and gives you all day to ski. Working as a server (waiter in UK) is less social but can be better paid as you get the same minimum wage (around $17 per hour) plus tips, which add up as it's normal to tip 15-20%.
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@pam w, none! would ideally like to get some before i start, possibly over summer. the chalet host course i'm booked onto seem to get a lot of success with people who don't have hospitality experience so I'm guessing it's a path well travelled.
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@boarder2020, excellent advice; where have you been all my life
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| halibut1 wrote: |
| @pam w, none! would ideally like to get some before i start, possibly over summer. the chalet host course i'm booked onto seem to get a lot of success with people who don't have hospitality experience so I'm guessing it's a path well travelled. |
Wetherspoon.
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From my experience in Tignes this year, there were quite a few UK pass port holders Woking having been sponsored by the companies.
Best thing to do is make yourself more attractive than the other candidates, the course is a great idea.
The phrase you can’t ski bum for more than 90 days is bollox, for France you can get a long stay tourist visa for up to 6 months. There are hoops to jump through but if you have adequate funding it’s not difficult, just time consuming.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@halibut1, if you do get the Canadian working holiday visa I'd be hesitant to go to whistler. It is the biggest resort, has awesome terrain, and best apres/liveliest. The limited housing and high costs just make it difficult. Lots of other good resorts that are much more affordable to consider.
| Quote: |
The phrase you can’t ski bum for more than 90 days is bollox, for France you can get a long stay tourist visa for up to 6 months. There are hoops to jump through but if you have adequate funding it’s not difficult, just time consuming.
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Quite a big "but". Especially when you can just go to Canada, get 6 months tourist visa on arrival with no hoops to jump through, and over longer trips Canada works out cheaper ime. I'd love to do a couple of months in cham, but even with the flight savings it's still way more expensive than same amount of time in Canada did to much cheaper lift pass and accommodation.
However, my personal (perhaps unpopular) opinion is if you are ski bumming with no job 90 days is more than enough anyway:
Enjoy Christmas and Nye with family and friends then head out start of January when conditions are coming into their prime. Then 3 months going out everyday. By end of march conditions are starting to turn and if you've done 75+ days on snow you will probably be ready to do something else.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@halibut1,
These two travel agents will probably cover most UK TOs:-
igluski.com/ski-operators
alpineanswers.co.uk/ski-chalet-tour-operators
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@halibut1, if you want to look beyond chalet work-I know that Tim Wall who owns the Pub Le Ski Lodge in la Tania is still prepared to recruit and get visas for British staff (we asked and the staff said they had had to get visas). The Latania.co.uk website - has links to a number of small scale chalet companies in the resort which may also be prepared to do so. On the Belleville Valley side of the 3V I think Whitemountainchalets do too. They are a fancier more upmarket outfit so employ professional chefs, but they also need drivers to shuttle clients around to and from the lifts. I'm cautious to assume that all the English staff were working with visas, as you never know whether they may themselves have dual nationality, a carte de sejour or irish grandparents who enable them to have Irish/EU passports even though they are from Surrey!
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You know it makes sense.
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@halibut1, KK junior has been in Canada for the last 2 winters on a WH visa. Banff in year 1 and Whistler this winter.
There is work available, but and it's a big but accommodation is expensive and hard to find particularly in Whistler.
He has worked in hotels, starting off as a pot washer, then moved to line chef. Changed jobs for better pay, again as a line chef. Left Banff and travelled around and then to Whistler last year. Job as chef and now pretty much managing a kitchen in a restaurant. The restaurants and hotels seem to offer subsidised accommodation to chefs/kitchen hands but not necessarily servers. Also they want servers with experience. To get a job as a server you need to take a test. Can't remember what its called.
In Banff there is the Banff Hospitality Collective which run most of the bars and restaurants there. The website gives an idea of what jobs are available https://www.banffcollective.com/
KK junior was lucky as he was able to get jobs that mainly wanted him to work late afternoons and evenings. He also worked elsewhere at weekends as he didn't want to bother with queues, especially in Whistler.
Also check out other resorts such as Sun Peaks, Big White, Panorama etc
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@knackered knees, thanks so much. KK junior absolute hero.
thanks for the leads. Inane questions, but did KKjnr enjoy himself /make friends easily / enjoy the work? Did he like Banff?? have heard it's beautiful but not sure what it's like as a 'youngster'?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Cons - long way from home, getting accommodation is extremely difficult, cost of living expensive (eg she gets CAD 1500 a fortnight and paying CAD 1200 PM for a bunk bed, supermarkets very expensive.
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@boabski, bleak stats. A seriously respectable hustle though. did she manage to make it work despite these ridiculous numbers? Margins like these make me want to play it safe with the alps and be able to have fun without worrying too much. Probs being wimp though.
Would hate to have been in the alps for the past season watching west coast N. America have the most unreal season ever
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| halibut1 wrote: |
| Quote: |
Cons - long way from home, getting accommodation is extremely difficult, cost of living expensive (eg she gets CAD 1500 a fortnight and paying CAD 1200 PM for a bunk bed, supermarkets very expensive.
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@boabski, bleak stats. A seriously respectable hustle though. did she manage to make it work despite these ridiculous numbers? Margins like these make me want to play it safe with the alps and be able to have fun without worrying too much. Probs being wimp though.
Would hate to have been in the alps for the past season watching west coast N. America have the most unreal season ever |
This is a key aspect which often gets overlooked
Choose a resort with a long, consistent season
You're not going to be able to get out every day, or every storm cycle
Also does the resort offer night skiing?
And proximity to other resorts
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| halibut1 wrote: |
@knackered knees, thanks so much. KK junior absolute hero.
thanks for the leads. Inane questions, but did KKjnr enjoy himself /make friends easily / enjoy the work? Did he like Banff?? have heard it's beautiful but not sure what it's like as a 'youngster'? |
He was 18 when he went to Canada and thoroughly enjoyed Banff and made great friends. He says its a more enjoyable place than Whistler as more of a "village" than a "city". He socialised with people from where he worked, but also other seasonaires and travelers. In fact, partied too much, so ended up staying to end of June to build up funds 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@halibut1, that's not staff accommodation. That's a house share in Creekside. She had been staying in Pemberton for 3 months prior to that for CAD 1100 pm. That involved restricted bus times to Whistler and c.45 mins on bus. So it was a bit of a pain for her as she could not really enjoy apres in Whistler. She is currently at home with us I Glasgow for a family wedding but heading back on Sunday to Whistler with as yet no room sorted.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@halibut1,
If you want to do a season in a specific resort check out its Facebook seassonaires group page for jobs.
Generally apply to everyone & if you are lucky enough to get more than one offer then worry about which resort.
If you can't make friends doing a season then the problem is you.
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