 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi all...
My boots are Atomic Hawx Ultra 110's so not a lot of flex at all. I got them new this year and were custom fitted. I then had my ski bindings moved to fit new boots. What i am finding when I ski (i am a strong skiier - like to do off piste as well as all levels of pistes) my right boot is being pulled outwards, the only way i can describe it is if i did not fight to keep the boot straight my ankle, boot and ski would roll outwards and I would fall.
The other thing that is happening is I am getting pre release of my bindings - currently nursing a nasty shoulder fracture due to this happening on a black run 4 weeks ago. I can't figure out if the pre release and the boot pull is all related or an unlucky coincidence!
My gut is to replace the bindings as they were cheap and have them re set and take my boots back to shop to try and get some flex added.
Any body come across this before?
Thank you!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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four thoughts
1. was the ski re drilled to fit the binding? I doubt it was but if so does the binding look straight on the ski?
2. have you checked the din settings are correct?
3. have you had the skis services - what happens if you swap the right ski to the left?
4. has one of the skis warped?
don't worry about the flex, 110 is not that stiff!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Hi
Hi! Thanks for replying....in answer to your thoughts
1. Yes they were and they look fine, but will re check
2. DIN i think are too low - 4.5
3. Yes I had them serviced and did swap skis over and this made no difference so I assume it to be the boots more than the bindings?
4. Good point will look
Ah I thought they felt quite stiff as I was struggled to get forwards on them! I have skied since 2000 and this is the first time this has happened.
Also nasty GT fracture is making me blue too and future trips this season cancelled 
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Apart from 110 not being particularly stiff, it sounds as though the binding is, or is mounted, skewed.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Apart from 110 not being particularly stiff, it sounds as though the binding is, or is mounted, skewed.
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Yep when my OH gets home I will get skis out and look again, hard to do with one arm at mo.
These are my boots, it is odd as i know in theory 110 is not that stiff but they feel iron stiff on my feet!
https://shop.atomic.com/en-gb/products/hawx-ultra-110-w-AE0000912.html
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@cheltsski, Someone with more experience will be along shortly I'm sure, but 4.5 sounds v.low for a strong skier, let alone off piste...
(I may well be a lot heavier than you, and with much bigger feet, but even then sounds pretty twitchy).
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@Pynch I agree with you to be fair, i think they should of least been a 6. I have size 5.5 feet and not sure I want to give away my weight on a public forum! 
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Ok of you've switched skis it's the boots or the skier. I'm not sure I can imagine how it could be the boots...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I had a pair of Atomic Hawx fitted with custom made footbeds and had a similar experience/feeling. My left ski always felt like it was pulling inwards, if i lifted my leg and pointed my toes in a direction the ski would be pointing a few degrees to the right of where I thought my toes were pointing. I had them for one week and luckily they actually got stolen on the final evening of the weeks holiday.
When I had my pair (about 4/5) years ago Atomic were marketing them as having an offset last that allowed for a natural stance i.e. our feet point slightly away from each other but skis want your feet to be parallel so the Atomic boot allowed you to stand on the ski with your feet splayed (natural) and the skis would still be parallel. I think this is what contributed to my problem as I felt like I was forever trying to shift my foot round in the boot to get the boot on straight.
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Ok of you've switched skis it's the boots or the skier. I'm not sure I can imagine how it could be the boots...
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Thanks for the vote of confidence in my skiing ability 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
I had a pair of Atomic Hawx fitted with custom made footbeds and had a similar experience/feeling. My left ski always felt like it was pulling inwards, if i lifted my leg and pointed my toes in a direction the ski would be pointing a few degrees to the right of where I thought my toes were pointing. I had them for one week and luckily they actually got stolen on the final evening of the weeks holiday.
When I had my pair (about 4/5) years ago Atomic were marketing them as having an offset last that allowed for a natural stance i.e. our feet point slightly away from each other but skis want your feet to be parallel so the Atomic boot allowed you to stand on the ski with your feet splayed (natural) and the skis would still be parallel. I think this is what contributed to my problem as I felt like I was forever trying to shift my foot round in the boot to get the boot on straight.
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Interesting thanks! I did laugh at the luckily they got stolen comment! I feel exactly like that, i am moving the position of my foot to keep the ski/boot in the right position. It made the week incredibly hard work. Still managed off piste and did some guiding so not all bad but lack of confidence in equipment can really suck. Will go back to shop where they were fitted, to see if anything is obviously wrong or can be done. Alternatively I go back to my old boots that are too big but at least never gave me this trouble!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@cheltsski, I'm only commenting based on info supplied.
I can't easily see how a boot can become angled so that you are effectively toe in compared to the ski.
The Fischer stance thing was also on the Nordica race boots for a while. I quite liked it but didn't miss its absence when I switched to Salomons with a normal straight stance. If anything it would make your skis tend to more easily run straight.
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| Quote: |
The Fischer stance thing was also on the Nordica race boots for a while. I quite liked it but didn't miss its absence when I switched to Salomons with a normal straight stance. If anything it would make your skis tend to more easily run straight.
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I have skied on Salomons forever and never had any probs like this, (except they were too wide which is why I changed) which was why i have been so annoyed and perplexed at this oddness now I have switched to Atomics. Hey Ho.
I have found an interesting article on canting which does explain spot on what I am experiencing, so wondering if that could actually be the issue...as I am affectively adjusting my stance to stay upright on my right ski.
http://www.skibootalignment.com/page8.html
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You know it makes sense.
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@cheltsski, I have always been told that the cuff alignment is relatively trivial. Canting on the other hand, if required, is required.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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TBH I have always just skiied and never thought about it all too much!
I will return to the shop I got them from and have a chat..they were brilliant and super knowledgable and other than me not being able to ski in a straight line they fit like a glove 
Thanks for all the replies everyone.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| under a new name wrote: |
| @cheltsski, I have always been told that the cuff alignment is relatively trivial. Canting on the other hand, if required, is required. |
@cheltsski I think what @under a new name is talking about but doesn't fully explain is that the article talks about canting and does mention shims under bindings / grinding boots but then discusses changing ski boot cuff alignment and seems to term this canting. It's my belief that strictly only the former is actually canting and indeed is a very powerful tool to correct alignment issues, however if the boot shells have screws to change cuff alignment or you have suitable packing material it might be worth trying as its reversible and cheap.
I don't really if I'm honest fully understand what your problem is from your first description, is it that your right ski is rolled onto its outer edge or that the tip of the right ski is not running parallel to the left but naturally going in a "reverse snowplough" position?
The skibootalignment weblink you used makes a number of assumptions such as "People stand naturally with their knees vertically above their feet and their feet at hip width apart" etc, unfortunatley there is anatomical variation in people and biomechcanics is influenced by thinks like femoral anteversion, degree of tibial torsion and foot progression angle all of which is a 3d process and cant always be fixed by changing just one parameter necessarily. Having said all that as you didn't have a problem before and now do it does sound like a kit issue.
You commented on the flex of 110, shoe size and DIN but don't say your weight, height, age or sex all which could influence this. You also say you got new boots but not if you had new footbeds, used your old ones or are running with stock ones from the boot.
I'd be curious to see pictures/videos and what your boot fitter comes up with.
If it didn't help there are people who look at biomechanics, I have no experience recommending but I believe CEM works with Andy ?Mccan who specialises in this field.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@betterinblack, basically I when I wrote my original post i thought the ski pre release, odd position of the ski and the boot might all be connected. However since then I can see that it is red herring and highly unlikely to be the case at all.
Pre release aside, the article i found had a section in it about adapting stance to ski effectively which resinated with me as that is what I had to do..when skiing in a straight line my right ski would feel like it wanted to pull/roll outwards and I found I was lifting my ski off the snow and trying to reposition it to keep my balance..really hard work at speed!
Boots were custom fit new footbeds etc. I am going to make an appointment to go back to the shop before I go off on any more tangents They are experts in the field so I have every confidence...I will let you know the outcome!
For reference on the DIN side of things I am 5ft 4inches, 46 years old, size 5 feet, approx 152lbs and female.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| cheltsski wrote: |
| @betterinblack, basically I when I wrote my original post i thought the ski pre release, odd position of the ski and the boot might all be connected. However since then I can see that it is red herring and highly unlikely to be the case at all. |
I'm still not so sure they're not linked
| cheltsski wrote: |
| Pre release aside, the article i found had a section in it about adapting stance to ski effectively which resinated with me as that is what I had to do..when skiing in a straight line my right ski would feel like it wanted to pull/roll outwards and I found I was lifting my ski off the snow and trying to reposition it to keep my balance..really hard work at speed! |
Given what you're experiencing did the ski actually pre release or did hit an edge twisted and released appropriately?
I confess to being a bit thick here and still can't tell if you mean the foot is supinating ie weight going on outer edge of foot/ski or if it is rotating externally ie if looking down on youself from above is the big toe moving from a 12 o'clockish position to a 3ish position rotating the ski.
| cheltsski wrote: |
| Boots were custom fit new footbeds etc. I am going to make an appointment to go back to the shop before I go off on any more tangents They are experts in the field so I have every confidence...I will let you know the outcome! |
| cheltsski wrote: |
| For reference on the DIN side of things I am 5ft 4inches, 46 years old, size 5 feet, approx 152lbs and female. |
Does sound like it was a bit low.
Good luck with the shoulder and hope you're back skiing soon to tell us about how you solve the problem.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@cheltsski, when did you lasy have the ski edges sharpened?
It actually sounds maybe more as though the left edges have been damaged - a hanging burr that was not removed for example, which creates a physical "hook" and which would feel as though the skis were trying to roll downhill - and could easily only be apparent when your right leg is dominant, e.g. Turning left, weight mostly on right ski?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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- I have experienced this a couple of times, skis almost unskiable and most unpleasant.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@under a new name,
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@cheltsski, when did you lasy have the ski edges sharpened?
It actually sounds maybe more as though the left edges have been damaged - a hanging burr that was not removed for example, which creates a physical "hook" and which would feel as though the skis were trying to roll downhill - and could easily only be apparent when your right leg is dominant, e.g. Turning left, weight mostly on right ski?
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Hi, it was the week before went on my first trip at the beginning of Jan, I had service and wax and edge..they are Scott Lunas. I have had a good look at skis and they seem ok, bindings look straight etc.
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@cheltsski, hmmm, when our skis were damaged it was completely not visible to the naked eye.
I am leaning towards an edge issue if the problem basically appeared post-service.
Supported by it being only your right foot on both skis. (I am still skeptical you can do anything to the boots to cause such a problem)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@under a new name,
That is interesting...how did you find out that was the issue if you couldn't see it?
I can see I am going to have to get all my equipment reviewed - well I have time as I am done for the season!
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@cheltsski, they had been sharpened the night before. Wife's were the same. And we'd done around 360 days skiing on them each so were pretty familiar with what they were supposed to be like.
I didn't know the exact problem but around 12 years ago a chum complained near the top of a hill that her that night serviced skis were weird. I tried them, had a similar dislike and shop confirmed they hadn't finished the service completely.
Oh, and 25 years ago I spent a fortnight on a pair of skis with bases holed about 50cms underfoot along the edges and nails holding the edges in. A similar feeling, in certain snow. So I was pretty sure it was a concavity issue.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@under a new name,
Hmmm ok thanks, I will get skis looked at too. It was a most disconcerting sensation and one I would not want to repeat next season so thanks for the top tips!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@cheltsski, good luck!
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@under a new name, thank you!
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