Mediocre ski racers

A snowHead

Watching Ski Sunday yesterday I fell to wondering whether the likes of Finlay Mickel and the British woman, whose name escapes me for the moment but who seems quite charming, make a decent living from their efforts. They presumably work bloody hard at it, and to the likes of me they appear to be absolutely brilliant skiers, but it seems unlikely that their efforts will ever be crowned with significant success (a relative term, I appreciate). Are they making a good living and storing up cash for a well earned and comfortable retirement or are they scraping by, relying on family and friends to keep them going?

BTW, who is more irritating; the woman who introduces Ski Sunday or the overexcited berk who does the C4 programme?

A snowHead

The former is Hazel Irvine. The latter is Nick Fellows.
Personally I think they both do a good job. Nick Fellows is a highly experienced commentator, and it's his job to inject a bit of excitement to keep everybody on the ball.
As to whether ski racers earn a living, that's up to them. If they're happy to perform for the audience, good for them!

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

http://www.chemmyalcott.com/

I'm pretty sure that if most of us here skied alongside Finlay or Chemmy we would look less than mediocre. It wasn't that long ago that the Austrians didn't see the Yanks as much of a threat.

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Leaving aside the completely inappropriate thread title rolling eyes

, yes they are both earning a reasonable living, and considerably better ones than skiers of a similar level in the alpine states who are less in the public eye, and have to compete with others in a high quality squad to get a start in World Cup races etc. The sponsorship jam is spread pretty thin as a result, while in the UK Chemmy and Finlay are the only alpine racers in the elite right now, with Alain Baxter struggling a little and others not quite making the breakthrough (Leuzinger, Noel Baxter)...

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David Goldsmith, yes, of course, good for them. I'm just curious whether the also rans, of whom no-one outside their home country has probably heard much, can earn a living. If they can, I'm very happy for them.

DB, my question doesn't imply otherwise; my skiing and their skiing has as much in common as my driving and Michael Schumacher's, probably less. As I say, I'm just curious.

Professional sport is full of people who never win or come close, who are essential for the well being of the sports, and I wonder whether a relatively mediocre performer in a sport which is probably not in the first, maybe not the second, rank of sports worldwide, can make a decent living at it, and how. Prize money? Sponsorship? The lower echelons of football rely on a share of TV money to keep going, as I understand it, some sponsorship, the odd wealthy patron for the lucky ones, flogging players up the ladder plus a bit of cash for the paying public and the very occasional cup run. F1 teams seem to be funded by sponsorship.

I assume that those who watch ski racing live do not pay at the door. Presumably there's some cash from TV rights; does that filter down to those who don't reach the podium? Sponsorship is presumably the big deal for the most successful racers, but what about the plucky Brits and others who don't, and probably won't, win? I see that Ms Alcott is sponsored, so they can obviously attract some sponsorship, but I'm interested to know whether, at their level, it is a good career in financial terms, or a labour of love (I'm not thinking of a late change of career, BTW). I guess that they rely a lot on the largesse and goodwill of friends and family, but I have no real idea.

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richmond,

I think describing the likes of Finlay and Chemmy as "Mediocre" is bit of a put-down. Would you describe Schumacher or any of the people he races against as mediocre? They are athletes from the UK who are competing against the elite from other countries in much the same way as the Jamacian bobsleigh team does (i.e. they don't have the local advantages of the Alps and US mountains as a training ground).
Go watch them ski live (not through the TV) and let me know if you still think "mediocre" is a fitting description.

After all it is free

richmond,

Without wishing to cast any slight on the Brits' skills, are they not 'mediocre' by definition?

They're certainly extremely good but in the company they keep they're clearly not the best (ie they're not among the 20 or so who might reasonably be expected to win any particular race) and they're certainly not the worst as plenty finish lower down the rankings each week - which means they're somewhere 'in the middle'.

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IMHO, the fact that they can get within a couple of seconds of the likes of Maier, Strobl et al makes them far from mediocre, but I suspect that a debate on mediocre was not the intention of this thread !

If we are to consider how well they are doing, financially, why not look at our other great british skiers....? - What are Graham Bell and the Conrad Bartelski up to these days...? Commentating on BBC and Channel 4 !

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BTW... there's nothing wrong with Hazel Irvine...'some' might say she's quite cute....

Its that Clare Balding that gets on my t*ts !

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And another thing, I think if I could earn enough to live on and pay into a pension for 5 or 6 years AND get to train and ski in the mountains all winter then I'd be pretty happy... at least then once I got a 'real' job ( Very Happy

) I'd be happy with how I spent the last few years - irrespective of whether I'd built up a financial security blanket !

You know it makes sense.

Can't resist this.

Villa are an excellent football side, in the context of all football sides. They are a mediocre premiership side, which is where they ply their trade and hence against whom are measured.

Chemmy Alcott is an excellent skier in the context of all skiers. She is a mediocre World Cup downhill skier, which is where she plies her trade and hence against whom she is measured.

both are true, and not meant to be derogatory. The difference between them is that all Villa's players grew up with excellent access to football.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

PG, thanks, now I know (BTW, your 1st post and my 2nd crossed - I was distracted mid post - bloody work). I'm pleased to hear that they can make a decent living.

FWIW, there's no need for anyone to read 'mediocre' in the context of the title as being belittling or insulting. I think that we can take it as read that the people I mentioned are brilliant skiers by anyone's standards, except those of top class professional ski racing. I think one might reasonably describe Aston Villa as a mediocre Premiership side (if one was being generous, obviously). If I knew how to, I'd change the thread title to 'Mediocre top class professional ski racers'.

A snowHead

C'mon guys, there's no such thing as a mediocre top-class athlete! Mediocre has the following meanings: 1 - average quality (the best you can get away with!) 2 - second-rate. Most people use it to imply the second sense, ie poor, indifferent, second-rate.

Neither definition should be applied to professional sportspeople who are in the top fraction of 1% of their sport, and challenging the very best for top ten positions.

But we've done this argument before... several times rolling eyes

- it's getting boring Confused

...

brian

PG, out of interest, are competitors per country limited in world cup races ? Or if the top 30 downhillers were all Austrian would that be the top 30 ?

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

It's complicated... First of all there are minimum competitor standards (max 120 FIS points, 20 points tougher than minimum Olympic standards that Kwame has not been able to reach).

Then at the end of each season a country quota is drawn up, based on the number of competitors per nation, classified within rank 1 to max. 60 of the WC rankings in each discipline. On top of that a national federation can enter a maximum of eight additional competitors, ie not necessarily ranked in the top 60.

Then there's some rule that gives organising countries an extra quota, but I don't know how that works.

So no - the Austrians don't dominate to the extent that many elite athletes are excluded but there's a limit to how many racers a federation can enter and wants to enter (cost etc).

Current men's FIS points rankings show that 'only' 4 of the top 20 GS racers are Austrian, ditto with slalom. 11 of the top 20 in super G and 8 from 20 in downhill show their dominance in the speed disciplines though. Serious competition for places when it comes to events like the Olympics. Don't think Maier would even have been considered for the downhill if it hadn't been for his win the other day.

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PG, Nevertheless 8/20 and 11/20 (and top 20 in the world in anything is pretty exceptional) will be reduced to 4 in each discipline for the Olympic games, and therefore our top class "mediocre" skiers have a definite chance!!! Shocked

I'm not suggesting that they'll medal - but a bronze wouldn't be totally out of the question.

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Watching the WC skiing, Finley Mickel appears lighter than the other guys, is he lighter or is it just my impression? And is being lighter a disadvantage as all the Austrians look huge. Puzzled

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Aren't these guys living the dream and who wouldn't swap?

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Peter Ross, Finlay is quite tall - about 6'2" i think? And thus may appear thinner and lighter while not necessarily being so.

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Mickel, 1m89, 91 kgs. The Hermanator is a mere 1m81 but 86 kgs, Strobl 1m87 & 95kgs, Grugger 1m80 & 92kgs, Schifferer 1m78 & 88kgs, so yes he's not as 'bulky' as some.

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The camera never lies? I'd have put money on the Hermanator being one of the biggest racers, and definitely heavier than Mickel. Is the Hermanator as cheerful in real life as he appears to be on the telly?

Another thing I was musing on while watching Ski Sunday is that ski racing seem to be one of the last bastions of decent behaviour among sportsmen and women. No histrionics, win or lose, and they manage to look convincingly cheerful as their winning time is beaten by the last man down. I suppose we don't get that much coverage here in UK so there may be all sorts of frightful behaviour going on about which we never hear, but they seem an admirable bunch compared to, say, footballers or tennis players. Am I the victim of ignorance and good PR, or are they really like that? Maybe it's because they're 'living the dream', as dan100 says.

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PG, going by you figures he is on the heavier side, maybe because he is tall he looks light? You might know is there an ideal body height, weight, shape to be a downhill skier or is it about technique? Why are some skiers better gliders than others? Puzzled

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Peter Ross, yes when you meet him he looks tall and 'rangy'.

Mass (?) is a factor in the speed events - there have been threads on this before - but only one of quite a number of factors obviously. Perfect technique, balance strength and stamina, the right line, an explosive start, a touch of luck, keeping low, staying in the tuck, as little aggressive edging as possible, the right wax and ski preparation etc, are all vital... so all things being equal, in the 'perfect' run, with identical weather and snow conditions as well, the bulkier racer should get to the finish first.

richmond, Ì don't think they all get along, Eberharter (not sure of spelling but retired now) and Maier weren't the best of buddies. I think the English speaking skiers stick together and share knowledge alright. For example if you saw Ch 4 lat week the Americans even have a guy who roars at the skiers as they leave the gate and Finley Mickel gets him too!

You know it makes sense.

They've lived through a pretty tough training regime in a tough environment from an early age, and from the outset taking yourself too seriously, pettiness, histrionics etc just aren't tolerated. They've seen enough injuries and mishaps among their mates to realise "there but for the grace of God..." In this and other minority sports they're not about to become superstars, there's no media circus following them around encouraging them to 'perform' for an audience.

They're obviously highly competitive, single-minded, strong characters (or they wouldn't make it to the top in the first place), but the fact they they might not go for a drink together after the race doesn't stop them from being civil and sportsmanlike to each other when taking part, in most cases. No different to many other minority sports, judo, yacht racing, you name it.

We just see too many tennis and football 'superstars' on the box and assume they're the norm, I reckon.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

If MAss were the sole factor one snowhead would be a world champ-no names

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Mediocre ski racers

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