Talk to me about skiing in North America please......

A snowHead

Hi guys,

Considering a trip across the pond for my snow fix this winter. Having only skied in Europe I don't really know where to start looking.

Canada vs USA? What resorts do people recommend for 2 solid intermediates (happy on European reds and the odd kinder black) and 2 advanced nutters.

At first glance it looks a good bit pricier than Europe (obvs it is more expensive due to longer flights etc)

Thoughts/advice/suggestions all gratefully received.

A snowHead

@slulu, If you've only ever skied in Europe then I'd definitely recommend trying North America for a different ski experience. Here's just a couple of my thoughts, I'm sure others will add to this.
1. Given the cost of the flights, and the fact that it may take you a day or so after arrival to get used to the jet lag, in my opinion you'll want to go for a minimum of 10 days, ideally 2 weeks.
2. Lift tickets can be a lot more expensive than Europe, particularly if you just turn up at the cash desk and buy your pass there and then. It's best to look out for online discounts by buying your ticket in advance. Sometimes the lift pass may be included in accommodation/lift pass packages which you can buy before you go.
3. Mountain restaurants tend to offer typical American fast food, but are relatively cheap in comparison to say many of the French resorts
4. Unfortunately at the moment (following recent political events) the £ is very low against the US$ (about $1.20 at the moment), but it's not so bad against the Canadian $ (about C$1.6 at the moment, if you look at this 10 year chart you'll see it's no worse than it was between 2010-2013). So you may well find Canada more affordable than the US.
5. If you should decide on Canada then the main popular ski areas are Whistler (best to fly into Vancouver) or Banff, Lake Louise etc (best to fly into Calgary).

Hope this helps

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Snow, lifts and customer service are way superior to the Alps in the US and Canada.

West is best.

Jackson Hole, Aspen, Snowbird, Alta, Whistler and Vail are the banner resorts.

Go to Telluride if you want "something different".

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As has been pointed out. Exchange rate favours Canada at the moment. Whistler is THE premier resort and the biggest in N. America. Can suffer from 'west coast cement'. Very wet snow. It is only an hour or so from the coast so gets a maritime type of climate a lot of the time. Having said that you would be unlucky not to enjoy all it has to offer. Banff is sold by UK TO's as a ski destination. IT ISN'T. It doe's have 1 very small hill. Mt Norquay 15 minutes from town. After that Sunshine which IS great is about a 40 minute drive from Banff. There are shuttle buses but for 4 of you I'd suggest hiring a car. Lake Louise is a good hours drive from Banff and is also good. If still considering the US. the resorts around South Lake Tahoe in California offer a real choice of different ski options from easy cruisey Alpine Meadows to the steeps of Squaw Valley and of course Heavenly, though my favorite was Sierra At Tahoe. Totally tree skiing from top to bottom. Do a lot more research yourself. there are other option's as others have said. I'm off to Steamboat Springs in Colorado for 5 months soon.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Having been caught out by dreadfully poor conditions in the Tahoe area in the 14/15 season, diabolical conditions in Vermont in this season just gone (visiting son who was working as an instructor) but also having skied in good and also atrocious conditions in Whistler, I'd say, contrary to Whitegold...lifts are nothing special, customer service (in that saccharine north American way) is excellent, and the food is averagely poor to sh*te, unless you love huge portions and burgers. It can feel a little soulless and corporate compared with the alps. Tree and glades skijng and the ability to ski "off piste" but in avi controlled areas in bounds are great.
We like Whistler, but wouldn't go back to California unless there were signs that it was a good season. It was a long way to go to ski mush and sit in 25deg heat at the bottom of the slopes in late January!
Would love to go and see what Colorado has to offer one day.
Try Japan...much more fun, great snow and a real cultural experience to boot.

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Perty and I display the problem with these things. They are ALL so subjective. Went to Japan last season for 10 days. Nice, different but absolutely nothing special snowise. Had 2 GREAT ski holidays in Tahoe, tons of snow both times. Whistler had it at it's best and worst. Would still give it another go. You don't have to have as Perty say's s--- food. there are GREAT restaurants all over N.America. It WILL be different from European skiing, but that's what you are going for, right?

YOU choose. After doing your homework of course.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

If price is important I would consider Canada.

I think a mini road trip would be in order, maybe a three resort trip? Taking in some resorts that the advanced nutters would also like whilst giving you solid intermediates a challenge? I would try and go somewhere that has some easy glades and some open bowl type skiing.

After all it is free

Take a serious look at Breckenridge, Colorado.
5 separate mountains. 2 solid intermediates ski down the frontside, the nutters drop off the bowls on the other side. If you want to ski together some of the blacks on Peak 10 are groomed. Some of the blues on Peak 7 are ungroomed and make use of undulating, wonky natural terrain (making them less straightforward in general than the runs on say Peak 9). I've not skied Peak 6 which I think is relatively new. There is a lot of choice, degrees of difficulty and terrain (including treed and treeless areas giving you options in bad weather).
And while the mountain restaurants are poor (as described above) the restaurants in town are very good and there's a lot of them.This contrasts with a lot of other US resorts.
Also an excellent micobrewery pub with some semblance of apres (often - but of course not always - poor in the North America) This contrasts with a lot of other US resorts. You also don't need a car if you are based in town. You can walk or skibus to everything.

As above all depends on your expectations and what you really want. Any ski area anywhere in the world can get skunked at any particular point in time. Even in Colorado you can find spring conditions at the end of January or freezing blizzards in April. I've been in Tahoe over New Year when mountains went from green to too white (i.e. the huge snowfall shut down the local power grid for a couple of days so no skiing there). If you choose somewhere and build it up as the trip of a lifetime chances are you'll be disappointed if it turns out to be average or poor conditions - hence the many people who make the trip to Whistler and come back saying "never again" having been rained on for a week. Package prices to N America range from not bad (Banff) to eye-watering (e.g. Vail) and there are combinations you can definitely do cheaper DIY particularly if you let go of the European notion that ski in/out is essential

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Never having skied in Canada, I can't really offer good advice on the Canada vs. US question (although Whistler is obviously famous and is supposed to be amazing). But here is what I can tell you about a few of the US ski resorts/areas:

Vermont- while I ski Vermont a lot due to relative proximity to NY, I would not go there if I was coming all the way from UK.

Colorado- I've been to Vail and Beaver Creek, and that area is a lot of fun and would keep all the skiers in your group happy. Vail's back bowls are legendary. It's also pretty lively when it comes to apres-ski (not Austria level lively). However, it's exceptionally pricey even by US standards, both in terms of lift tickets (should be purchased online ahead of time to get some discount), food on the mountains, parking, etc. If money is no object, Vail is great, plus you could sample other resorts in the area (Beaver Creek, Breckenridge, etc).

Utah- there are at least 5 or 6 resorts within an hour driving radius from Salt Lake City, the prices are MUCH lower than in Colorado in terms of both lift tickets (should be bought at substantial discount at various sports stores in the area), accommodation and food. No real apres to speak of. Supposedly the best snow in US. The resorts are smaller than, say, Vail, but there are so many of them so close together, that it's really fun to sample them all, provided you don't mind getting a rental car. In the 4 days that we spent in Utah, we skied Alta, Snowbasin, Park City and Deer Park. It was a lot of fun. Didn't have enough time for Canyons, Solitude, etc, so leaving that until the next time. If you end up going to Salt Lake City and have a few extra days, you could also drive to Jackson Hole (a 4.5 hour drive, if I am not mistaken). Your advanced skiers would probably really enjoy that one- it's pretty legendary.

Lake Tahoe area- best views in US (IMO), several resorts to sample. But California is in the middle of a drought that's been going on for a few years now. So I would not book a trip there unless I was sure that this winter was different and they get a lot of snow.

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Thoughts:

Direct flights are less hassle than connections.
Personally I've no issues with 7 days and jet lag, just get on with it.
Both Canada and the US have horrible "immigration" processes (ESTA and eTA) but are otherwise easy/ cheap to fly to.
As you're asking, go West, but avoid AK.
You can't really go wrong, just do your research.
If you want Michelin-starred dining then go to Courchevel or take your own cook. On-hill food is similar to Europe in my experience, service and breakfast being better (do remember to tip). Bear in mind that most locals have transport, so they're not limited to on-hill dining.
For a first trip, I'd either go somewhere big so you won't get bored, or rent a car so you can experience the real thing. Driving around is what people do there.
Whilst it's currently true that $CDN < £USD, that doesn't make Canada "cheaper". 52% of Brits don't get this.

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I am an old retired Brit who now lives in the Caribbean so I ski in the US and Canada.

Definitely plan for Colorado. There are direct flights to Denver. If you are going to make your own arrangements then as there are 4 of you hiring a car makes sense.

I skied the US a couple of times from the UK staying in chalets [ very upmarket chalets in Vail and Aspen] with Skiworld. It is worth checking them out.

I would avoid Breckenridge as it is really high and there is a significant risk of altitude sickness.

Vail Beaver Creek Aspen Snowmass Steamboat are premier resorts and offer great skiing. Telluride is missing from the list due to the extra transfer time.

If you are going for a week then it is not worth going for a season pass but if 2 weeks then you need to investigate the different pass options especially if thinking about Vail and Beaver Creek. The Epic pass boght in advance can be a CONSIDERABLE saving but you need to jump on it as it will not be available for much longer.

@slulu,

When we went to Colorado, for 3 weeks, in February Vail & Beaver Creek were charging an incredible $175 for day tickets! Shocked

Keystone and Breckenridge were charging between $120-$140 per day.

In contrast, our season passes were a bargain $600. No doubt you will appreciate the significance of doing your research about lift ticket prices.... wink

I agree with other comments that, despite the jet lag, a week's trip is ok and is well worth it. When we were stuck with Feb half term trips, in the past, we always went Transatlantic for a week and made the most of it.

You know it makes sense.

I also feel that a week is totally doable. Europe to US is a great direction for jet lag. You end up feeling tired by 7 pm and go to bed early. And then you wake up feeling totally awake and refreshed at 5 am and go skiiing. Not a great combination if your goal is apres-ski. But for actual skiing it's perfect.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I'd agree that a week is OK, but of course if you can do 10 to 14 days, do it. It means you can also have a rest day if you like; a fair few resorts do a "13 of 14 days" type lift ticket too.

In terms of location, west is definitely best. For USA, I've only done Utah but its superb and as alenchic has said, smaller resorts but with a car there are loads to go at. Your advanced skiers wouldn't get bored at Snowbird or Alta, or Brighton. Solitude a little less full on. Powder Mountain is really quiet in the week so if its snowed and you pretty much want the resort to yourself, you could do a lot worse than go there. Not much apres but some if you go and look for it, and a few nice bars and micro breweries in SLC town itself (we stopped in Sandy last time we were there).

In Canada, again, as others have said, Whistler is definitely worth experiencing especially if you are sorting as a package holiday, obvious destination, lots of mileage to go at and lots of apres options too. If you want a bit more of a locals experience head in to the interior a bit more though, places like Kicking Horse and Red Mountain are very good indeed but so different to anything you'd get in Europe in the most part, do some research as to what you want out of the trip beforehand, as if you want the European type mileage and big lift area, there aren't that many places that will give you that in Canada.

A snowHead

A snowHead

I have had accounts in all of those currencies for thirty years or so. Canada's very oil dependent.

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I've done Heavenly Lake Tahoe three times, Vail once and Winter Park and Squaw Valley (Tahoe) for a day. However, all have been on the back of business trips where I was already in the US. Personally, I'd not bother (and haven't) trekking all the way across the Atlantic (and much of N. America) to go there - I'm with those advising a protracted visit if you chose to go. I really liked Heavenly and Vail and we had good conditions. There's no employment-cartel-also-known-as-the-ESF and you can get all sorts of instruction levels without paying a fortune. Lift prices are relatively expensive but that pays for a high staff-to-visitor ratio. Queues are orderly and rarely long and it's never been 3-Valleys-type busy.

Problem with SFR is that you arrive late afternoon; have to get through immigration; get your hire car; and escape the Bay Area (think Heathrow M3/M25) and you're still 4h+ from Tahoe, the latter part being single-carriageway roads (unless you use the Reno freeway, which takes even longer). A bit like Troyes to Chamonix. Since we were already there, we started out around 9-10am not 5-6pm. so you might consider a 2-3 day city break to San Francisco first, then you'll be un-jetlagged and can drive to Tahoe in the daylight.

Denver is a bit better but you still won't be on the freeway 'till the late afternoon early evening. Although there are resorts nearer than Vail, it sits beside the Freeway, and I found it easier than driving off the freeway to Winter Park, for example. We hired a nice apartment rather than a hotel, and eat out. But like much of the US, skipass, equipment hire and accommodation is more than in the Alps. Our trip cost more per head than a hotel in Verbier in the New Year. But the skiing is extensive, snow was deep and the pistes uncrowded.

Having just come back from an anniversary non-skiing trip to Vancouver, Jasper, Lake Louise and Banff, I would recommend Canada as an alternative to the US. Canadians seem to have a genuine interest in UK visitors and often have links with the UK, even if it's just in terms of where their grandparents emigrated from. Snow fell down to 1500m while were in Lake Louise on 19th Sept although that's probably no guarantee of what the winter will be like. As for the skiing, from what we saw, they seem to have pretty extensive skiing around Lake Louise and as mentioned, Banff didn't seem that big an area. good point re Whistler - the west coast is a marine climate whereas the Rockies are continental. Looking at the cost of trips to Banff/Lake Louise I was quite surprised that some packages really weren't as expensive as I expected. As long as you can endure and recover from an 8+ hour BA Economy flight. Banff is absolutely a winter holiday town - not in a bad way: lots of accommodation choice and places to eat out without breaking the bank. Plenty of self-catering apartments let you eat in when you feel like it and provide somewhere to relax. It's about 2-1/2 hours west from Calgary airport so the journey isn't too difficult. Add another 90 minutes up to Lake Louise.

As with SFR, arriving in Vancouver is going to be a late afternoon/early evening affair, so you might similarly consider a couple of nights there first, to de-jetlag and also as an interesting city break. We stayed at the Pan Pacific and I'd joined the (free) Loyalty Scheme in advance, so we got upgraded to a nice suite.

However, I always remember talking to an American on the Heavenly chairlift: "Why are you here? Man, if I could afford it, I'd jump at the chance of doing the Alps ..."

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We had a go at Whistler. A pretty poor weather experience but with Blackcomb there was still enough to ski to make it worthwhile, and the fact that at least half escaped us makes me want to go back to try it rather than give up.

There isn't really 'mountain food' in the same way you get in the alps (waffles rather than fine dining at the top of a lift pretty much covers it), but in town you can usually find a good breakfast / brunch and okay coffee providing you don't go to Starbucks.

In general food and accommodation was good / cheap (check out Creekside if interested). We combined it with a few days in Vancouver first to sort out jet lag, but I reckon you could get away with not doing that.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@slulu,

More than anything keep abreast of snow conditions first. Things can in a good year start shaping up as early as November but are more reliable by late December to mid January. There is such a variance in condition throughout North America that it's not right to spout out a given region or resort, instead watch conditions so that if you do make the decision to go through all the time, effort and expense you will place yourself somewhere where the conditions are really good. Tons of places for "intermediate" and "nutter" folk.......... A distance of no more than 200 km can spell the difference between great and mediocre at best just like in Europe.
The West coast of NA gets its bulk of snow in a good year from late January forward on to March, even April in a blow out year, whereas the more interior regions can realize acceptable skiing by Christmas if all the stars are aligned but the bulk of snow has flown by early March. But again, it varies tremendously by region, even "micro" region in any given year. So hold your horses and wait till after the New Year and see how things have shaped up and go from there. You have such a tremendous selection of location - resort and correlating ski offering to choose from and there are no doubt some exceptional offers to be had. Study up as to what's what and what appeals to YOU and yours. Resorts run from less than basic to grande, give yourself some time..............

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@slulu,

According to your requirements I would recommend Snowbird in Utah.
On the one hand it offers something different from Europe: always more snow, different snow, plenty of off-piste just meters from lifts, different trail marking; while on the other hand it is still large enough to begin bored. Ski-pass prices are lower than most of famous Colorado resorts. 40 minutes drive from international airport Salt Lake City. Sometime roads are closed due to blizzards, do not forget to rent 4x4 or AWD car, otherwise there is a risk of missing 1-2 days of journey. These particular characteristics make Snowbird quite unique.
In addition, while looking for accommodation you can find deals that containing lodging and ski-passes included. In this situation you are likely to get pretty good saving.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

@slulu, I love visiting N. America. Been lucky to ski lots places mentioned above, plus several smaller areas.

My feeling is that if the trip is just for skiing, then overall, I much prefer Europe. Going all that way across the pond and spending lots more has only felt worth it for me when visiting great cities, sights, national parks, etc. Then fitting in some skiing in between.

What worked best for us was going for 2 weeks minimum. Skiing weekdays, when most mountains quieter. Then doing other travelling stuff Fri-Sun. Always rented a car. Liked San Francisco/N. California best. Vancouver/ Whistler too. New England travelling and cities excellent but found ski areas limited.

After all it is free

@Whitegold,

Markymark29:- The Arlberg is undoubtedly one of the premier areas in the Alps. Lech & Zurs especially. I do understand though what Whitegold means.

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@Old Man Of Lech, Must be good then.....never even crossed my mind to go there, maybe one day when I've more time....too much to go at in Europe and plenty folks from across the pond rave about it when they come over, they don't seem to mind the Alps. wink

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As I have always said when asked which is better? Neither, they are just different! Each has it's own pluses and minuses. Take them for what they are and enjoy both the US and Europe. People get so parochial about their favorite places they sometimes lose sight of the fact that there are options out there. I pointed out earlier re Perty's comment it is ALL so subjective.

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@Old Man Of Lech, Yep, agreed.....but for me its about quality time on the snow, personally I work hard all year for 30 days on snow and I want the best I can without having to be going long-haul, don't want to be sat in airport lounges and doing long transfers, I'd rather be nearer. Perhaps one day when I've got time on my hands.....Colorado would be my preferred destination, from the feedback I have had, but most folks I know who've been to US/ Canada did so a long time ago and don't go anymore.....

Markymark29, Guess I am in a somewhat privileged position NOW, however skiing around Tahoe in 95 was still a great experience as was 10 days in western Canada the year before, while I was still working full time. This coming season I am off to Steamboat for the whole season.

You know it makes sense.

@Old Man Of Lech, Nice!

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@Markymark29,

We (like you) like to maximise our time on snow but used to be stuck with school hols (when Mrs B was a teacher) for over 20 years. However, in that time, we managed a few Transatlantic trips where we skied for 6.5 days with only 5 days off work. Of course it all hinges on your return flight time but we managed that in Winter Park (twice), Breckenridge, Alta, Banff (skiing Nakiska on our last day) and Kelowna area (with our last day at Crystal Mountain).

In each case we flew out on a Saturday from Newcastle and flew back the following Saturday evening, getting back home on the Sunday. All involved 3 flights and 2 changes of plane in each direction but where there's a will there's a way! Very Happy

I'm surprised to hear that your contacts have tried the USA/Canada but have now jacked them in. While we love the Alps we have also visited about 30 US/Canada ski resorts and have been most impressed by the extreme variety of terrain in the majority of ski areas. Runs usually range from as gentle as you like to as steep/tough as you like, with everything in between - and all on marked, in-bounds terrain. Keystone last season was incredible - with steep, deserted bump runs in the glades, on packed powder with the place to ourselves, day after day. It was an almost indescribable experience and so different to anything we've experienced anywhere in Europe. Very Happy

Do you get up to Scotland much from where you are? From here we have managed to get in up to 15 days up there over the course of a season (on weekend trips, most of them overnighters for 1 ski day), with skiing into May the last few seasons.

A snowHead

@ Old Man: "As I have always said when asked which is better? Neither, they are just different! Each has it's own pluses and minuses. Take them for what they are and enjoy both the US and Europe."

as an American who has skied most places in the western US and also done 5 trips to the Alps, I reply in this fashion to my friends in the US all the time regarding Europe vs. North American skiing experiences. I like some aspects of skiing in Europe better and some aspects of skiing in the Alps (e.g., you people are generally so orderly and polite, so WTF can't you form a proper lift line?).

Vive la difference--that the whole reason to go different places.

OP: once you narrow things down a bit, or if you have specific areas you want to compare/contrast, post up, and I'll provide feedback if I can. I've done at least 1 trip to western North America for each of the past 30 years now.

A snowHead

@ mr .mike just booked 10 day trip to banff ,early march for my son and i, both experienced skiers but he,s now joined the dark side .This will be our first trip across the pond, any info /review would be appreciated . Smile

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Just read this thread and noticed that no one mentioned the NE states ..I spent the winter last year (2015) in Rhode Island and tried to ski all the "major" resorts ...some I enjoyed .Sunny River Stowe Killington and Cannon ,, others I found to be a bit limited a but mostly they are worth a couple of days as they are not very extensive ..my most firm memory was that they were COLD ..I thought I was going to get frostbite just walking across the car park in Stowe ...

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I haven't the time to read through all the responses. So perhaps it's already been mentioned.

Build into your budgets some lessons! Especially for the 2 intermediates.

North America is the place to learn to ski "lumpy" snows, aka off-piste that's within the resort boundary, avi controlled, without having to pay for guides.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Linked to the above; there is a very clear definition of inbound terrain in North America, the inbound runs are opened, closed and cleared by patrol as you'd get for pistes in Europe, except that includes some pretty serious ungroomed runs as what would otherwise be "off piste" in Europe.

Likewise, the concept the of out of bounds terrain is very clearly defined, both on the trail map but also on the ground. I've been to a good number of resorts in North America where going in to the backcountry requires you to pass through a "gate" where there is a board explaining your personal responsibilities. In Snowbird you even have to check in with patrol at their hut beforehand. I'm guessing this is all down to preventing litigation if it all goes wrong, but it's a system that works fine for me.

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Some typical N American inbounds "runs"

<p>

Mike Wilson 100' Double Backflip from UnofficialNetworks.com

Mike Wilson 100' Double Backflip from UnofficialNetworks.com on Vimeo.</p>

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

@ KimH: have a blast, but no help here. You picked one of the few areas I have not visited (in the winter at least). I can say from a summer trip, that it's some of the best mountain scenery in North America, though, which still leaves it a little shy of the Alps. Great time of the year to go too. They are almost certain to have good coverage by then, and you get slightly longer days and hopefully even some warm sunny ones.

After all it is free

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Getting to Utah is a whole lot easier this year. The vail ski company bought the canyons and took out a lease on park city resort last year ( gazumping the family company who had run it for decades) merged the two and now have the biggest resort in the USA. and have persuaded delta to run direct flights from Heathrow to salt lake three times a week.champagne powder wins over Sierra cement any day.

Help!!

Talk to me about skiing in North America please......

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