 Poster: A snowHead
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I've just been amusing myself watching ski porn of Whistler, Fernie, Revelstoke and Kicking Horse.
And all the skiing seems to be very steep and very deep "powda".
All the movie stars are extremely skilled and acrobatic and all ride on Fat Banana shaped skis.
I'll be going out that way again in January and I'll have to rent just one pair of skis for two weeks.
Do I really need 100mm wide skis or is this just fantasy?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It's fantasy. They may have statistically more powder days than over here, but they are much, much better at hype than the frogs.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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100mm is not wide.
I ski an all mountain ski that is 97 wide.
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And the question is are you going to only ski very steep very deep powder.
Movie stars will wait for and travel for and plan for the best of conditions. They are also the best of skiers. So will end up skiing very steep very deep powder.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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What do you normally ski on?
Where do you normally ski?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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If you're not already a fat ski convert get on something 97-105ish and have at it - adequate for most powder.
If you already ski something in the "true all mountain" bracket you can go fatter on big days.
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@DrLawn, if you get the snow you're hoping for, and which is common where you're going, yes.
That said, I feel light interior snow has a flaw: it doesn't "reset" the hill unless you get oh, 7" or more. It hides what's already there, and if that's icy bumps, you're gonna hit 'em. But the same amount of coastal snow fills things in, "resetting". Note that in both cases, fatties are the tool.
However if your timing is bad and cruising is the best thing on the menu, no. My fatties are positively dangerous on cord. As we used to say: SABENA: such a bad experience never again!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I'm sure if you watch the same kind of films for Europe they will all be riding similar skis. Also a lot of those films use areas actually outside the resort, so while there tends to be more snow than europe, don't believe everyday is bottomless powder!
I'd say the trend for that part of the world is a wider ski than Europe. The mindset is different though, very few are going out to ride groomed runs or interested in covering distance, in bounds avy control enables everyone to enjoy "off piste" skiing and many are searching out powder and fresh tracks, hence a wider ski has its benefits.
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@DrLawn,id say skis of around 100mm under foot would be the norm in most lift lines in BC , and lots of 120mm+ skis too , but if your renting you can just swap out as conditions allow 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hi @Scooter in Seattle, SABENA used to be the Belgian national airline 
I was going to pick up some skis in Banff on the way and drop them off on the way back to Calgary.
I was going to go for a pair of Magnum's or Hero's because in all the years I've been skiing I've hardly ever had a powder day.
And all the wider skis I've tried over the years have been a bit on the "dull side"
I'll have to have a look at what's available .. perhaps something like a Kastle 84 perhaps?
Thanks for the input guys!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business.
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| DrLawn wrote: |
OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business. |
They are fine but if you get a real powder day get something fatter, less stiff and more rockered and you’ll enjoy it much more.
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You know it makes sense.
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[quote="DrLawn"]OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business.[/quote
A real allmountain is over 100mm wide. A marketing all mountain is a glorified piste ski for those that occasionally dabble at the side of a piste.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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You need to be aware that in North America/Canada ‘new snow’ is usually called ‘fresh powder’  (well it certainly was when I was going to Whistler). Also, that seasonal snow fall totals are quoted rather than current snow depths. It’s completely irrelevant that 7.5m of snow has fallen at the mid station, if the piste/off piste is showing grass.
Another point is that coastal snow must be skied when it falls or is still falling, as the moisture content means it collapses/compresses quickly, and if there is a genuine powder day, pretty much every skiable line (and many un-skiable), will have been skied out by mid-day.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
pretty much every skiable line (and many un-skiable), will have been skied out by mid-day.
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Pretty uncommon ime, as if there's been enough snow to really make a powder day avalanche danger usually too high to open everything in the morning so things get opened gradually. Take kicking horse for example, after a big storm T1 and whitewall might not get opened till the afternoon, T2 and ozone the day after. Plus a lot of the hike too terrain stays fresh (not completely untracked but still plenty of fun) because people don't want to walk and it's kind of hard to do laps). Knowing where to look also helps, but unless you've spent some time there or have a local showing you around easier said than done. Get out of bounds and there's pretty much unlimited fresh tracks to be had, although comes with the issues of backcountry skiing.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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BC Canada:
Resort = 85-100 mm
Backcountry/cat skiing/heli = 100-116
My 2 cents
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| DrLawn wrote: |
I sort of feel that fat skis are cheating a bit ... but we could say that about lifts.  |
Like driving on winter tires in the snow, or wearing a ski jacket when it’s cold right?
Use the right tools for the conditions and you’ll enjoy it exponentially more.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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[quote="boarder2020"]
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Get out of bounds and there's pretty much unlimited fresh tracks to be had, although comes with the issues of backcountry skiing. |
Including killing your wife at KH.
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Bent chettler 100 is the way to go
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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[quote="Dave of the Marmottes"]
| DrLawn wrote: |
OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business.[/quote
A real allmountain is over 100mm wide. A marketing all mountain is a glorified piste ski for those that occasionally dabble at the side of a piste. |
disagree
Unless you are big or fat 90-100mm is the real swiss army knife.
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@BobinCH, you not think The Mantra is a skiers ski? Great on the right feet but will punish a not so skillful skier.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@DrLawn,
I ski a Volkl Mantra, and it's great for sub-optimal off piste conditions. As @BobinCH says, you'd benefit from something slightly wider in deeper powder.
I spent 2 weeks in Revelstoke in 2018 and we didn't get a single powder day 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@DrLawn, my first afternoon heliskiing was on 70mm cheater GSs. No, you don't need fat skis.
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@under a new name, not a question of need, just a question of what is better.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Layne, better would be 67mm FIS SLs 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| under a new name wrote: |
| @DrLawn, my first afternoon heliskiing was on 70mm cheater GSs. No, you don't need fat skis. |
Why aren’t you still skiing them then?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Mother hucker wrote: |
| @BobinCH, you not think The Mantra is a skiers ski? Great on the right feet but will punish a not so skillful skier. |
Of course Mantras are great skis and a good pilot will drive them effectively in all conditions but they are relatively stiff, long radius etc which means in deeper snow and at slower speeds they’ll be harder to turn and control. Take a nice, soft, rockered ski like a DPS Wailer 112 Hybrid (or similar) and pretty much any half decent skier will be whooping and hollering in the powder, rather than struggling through it, getting knackered after 1 run.
Those Blister reviews are usually spot on IME.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| BobinCH wrote: |
| Mother hucker wrote: |
| @BobinCH, you not think The Mantra is a skiers ski? Great on the right feet but will punish a not so skillful skier. |
Of course Mantras are great skis and a good pilot will drive them effectively in all conditions but they are relatively stiff, long radius etc which means in deeper snow and at slower speeds they’ll be harder to turn and control. Take a nice, soft, rockered ski like a DPS Wailer 112 Hybrid (or similar) and pretty much any half decent skier will be whooping and hollering in the powder, rather than struggling through it, getting knackered after 1 run.
Those Blister reviews are usually spot on IME. |
Oh come on!
Two of my mates have been on mantras for years. They are pretty good skiers (but not your standard) and they certainly don't get knackered after one run in powder! One of them is fit but the other really isn't.
I'm not for a moment saying that mantras would be better than "a nice, soft, rockered ski like a DPS Wailer 112 Hybrid" in powder. I just don't think you should massively oversell the difficulties of enjoying a day of powder skiing on mantras.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Gosh a bit of "chatter" this morning!
It has prompted me to go out in the garage and have a look at a pair of skis I bought in 1996.
Volkl "Snow Ranger"
Len: 190cm
under foot: 78mm
widest part of the pointy bit: 98mm
Emm!
These were supposed to be the "All Mountain Skis" of the day, just before the first parabolic's came out .. The shop insisted I tried these new squirrely skis they just got in called "Head X13"
They would just not stop turning.
I remember the guide from Mark Warner asking me:
"Surely you are not going to use those wide skis on the piste?"
But I did for a couple of years.
But 78mm underfoot for a ski that was supposed to be good in powder ... ????
Anyway lets pray for powder!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| jedster wrote: |
| BobinCH wrote: |
| Mother hucker wrote: |
| @BobinCH, you not think The Mantra is a skiers ski? Great on the right feet but will punish a not so skillful skier. |
Of course Mantras are great skis and a good pilot will drive them effectively in all conditions but they are relatively stiff, long radius etc which means in deeper snow and at slower speeds they’ll be harder to turn and control. Take a nice, soft, rockered ski like a DPS Wailer 112 Hybrid (or similar) and pretty much any half decent skier will be whooping and hollering in the powder, rather than struggling through it, getting knackered after 1 run.
Those Blister reviews are usually spot on IME. |
Oh come on!
Two of my mates have been on mantras for years. They are pretty good skiers (but not your standard) and they certainly don't get knackered after one run in powder! One of them is fit but the other really isn't.
I'm not for a moment saying that mantras would be better than "a nice, soft, rockered ski like a DPS Wailer 112 Hybrid" in powder. I just don't think you should massively oversell the difficulties of enjoying a day of powder skiing on mantras. |
Yes you are right that bit is probably an over-exaggeration for Mantras
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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[quote="jedster"]
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| DrLawn wrote: |
OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business.[/quote
A real allmountain is over 100mm wide. A marketing all mountain is a glorified piste ski for those that occasionally dabble at the side of a piste. |
disagree
Unless you are big or fat 90-100mm is the real swiss army knife. |
Ok I'm not quibbling about something 97-100 and yes size down if you're smaller and all that. I'm just identifying that what manufacturers often call an all mountain ski at say 84mm is just a fatter carver and will go only a limited way to actually helping in 3D snow. Essentially the marketing designation of "All Mountain" actually means only limited dabbling off piste whereas people who routinely ski all mountain e.g. in Western NA resorts or European offpiste in all conditions will often have something wider and maybe with other attributes like rocker etc.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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[quote="Dave of the Marmottes"]
| jedster wrote: |
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| DrLawn wrote: |
OK, you've convinced me .. I'll try some "All Mountains" I've a pair of XT800ti in the garage that I've not used for years but I loved them when I rode them.
But what to go for .. I've been looking at the advice videos .. and Volkl M6 Mantra look the business.[/quote
A real allmountain is over 100mm wide. A marketing all mountain is a glorified piste ski for those that occasionally dabble at the side of a piste. |
disagree
Unless you are big or fat 90-100mm is the real swiss army knife. |
Ok I'm not quibbling about something 97-100 and yes size down if you're smaller and all that. I'm just identifying that what manufacturers often call an all mountain ski at say 84mm is just a fatter carver and will go only a limited way to actually helping in 3D snow. Essentially the marketing designation of "All Mountain" actually means only limited dabbling off piste whereas people who routinely ski all mountain e.g. in Western NA resorts or European offpiste in all conditions will often have something wider and maybe with other attributes like rocker etc. |
Agreed. I only made the point because I have skis with waists of 66, 75, 88, 100, 108 and 125 and if I really needed ONE PAIR to do everything (surely what "All Mountain" should mean) it would be 100 max. I begin to miss the edge to edge manouvreability on hard snow once waists > boots (rule of thumb) and the extra float on powder days is not enough to compensate. But then I really do like to crank up the edge angles at times...
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In BC, although my experience is snowboards not skis, rentals seem different from Europe. In Whistler most of the places are resort owned and pretty good. It's common to ask for precisely what you want, and to change it as much as you want, and to have well prepared this-season gear. Working from memory I think they just bill by the day (google it...), so there's no particular reason why you'd want to rent something for 2 weeks. It'll need waxing in that time anyway. I'd rent from the local shops where you happen to be. Then you can rent precisely for the conditions you're expecting, and swap the boards if you're not delighted or if you fancy a change. I expect rentals will be cheaper in Europe if they don't offer that sort of service. You may as well make use of what you're paying for.
You could just rock up and take the shop's advice (it's a service culture, so that is actually not a bad idea), and then see how it goes.
Look at what everyone else is using and work out what works, then switch to that.
I would not spec your gear for heli unless you're using one - in which case ask them what works. Heli powder looks kind
of similar but doesn't have the benefit of "skier pisting" underneath it.
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When I switched from boarding to skiing about ten years ago, initially I used Mantras (5wks a year), then I switched to Scott Missions for a couple of seasons (again 5-6 weeks a year), on the whole, they fulfilled the job, but when I started doing whole seasons I bought some White Doctor TwinTip 104's and they just transformed my skiing and really brought the "kid" out in me, and made it seem so easy to ski all types of snow-pack away from the piste.
I then bought some Scott Cascades (110) and they skied well, except I lost one soon after being caught in a slide, it was either at the SIGB ski test that year or the year after in Kuhtai when I was testing touring skis that I skied the 108 Black Crow Atris and they then became my de facto do it all ski for quite a few seasons.
I've now migrated back down to 105's Scott Superguides pretty well replacing the Atris.
I did buy some ex-demo Scott Slight's 93 before last season but the closest I got to skiing on them was a couple of snow-kiting sessions
When we skied Colorado a few years back, Winterpark and SteamBoat where we scored some good powder we rented Rossi Soul 7's which are 106 underfoot so felt at home on those, and they were the widest we could find to rent there.
I suppose the obvious caveat/question to the OP is.
"Are you happy on skis over 105 in all types of snow-pack" or are you only used to sub 95mm etc?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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[quote="Dave of the Marmottes"]
| boarder2020 wrote: |
| Quote: |
Get out of bounds and there's pretty much unlimited fresh tracks to be had, although comes with the issues of backcountry skiing. |
Including killing your wife at KH. |
I've heard a few different accounts of the story and none of them make much sense unless you think he was actively trying to get rid of her and make it look like an accident. There's actually a hut down in canyon creek now with an emergency phone inside because people still end up down there. I just don't know how they do it, it's clearly out of bounds and there is no obvious looking way back to the resort other than hiking back up what you just skied. I guess the same could be said for cakehole at Whistler.
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Hi @philwig,
I assumed that it would be much less expensive to rent for two weeks rather than popping into the shop at each of the places we'll be visiting,
It has never dawned on me ever to just rent skis for each day.
But I usually swap the skis about 3 times during the week, just because I'm a "tart" and like to experience everything.
I'll see what the shops have in stock and grab some local advice as suggested.
I am not going Heli Skiing.. or least I don't think so.
And I can't imagine going proper off piste, more a case of nipping outside the poles for a bit and riding boiler plate.
And if we get really luck deep snow on the piste.
The Mantra sounds about right for me if its as "non noodily" as they say.
I'm a bit cream crackered this evening, I took my 9 year old granddaughter to the Hemmel Fridge this afternoon.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/aSv1PKTFykXZhBrT7
She loved it.
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