 Poster: A snowHead
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From Trento Today:
The compulsory insurance for skiers will start from next January 1st (unless extended). The rule, contained in the legislative decree 40/2021, provides that "the skier who uses the alpine ski slopes must have a valid insurance that covers his / her civil liability for damages or injuries caused to third parties".
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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If you are coming from outside the EU (Uk, USA etc) you will have travel insureance so you are covered. Anyone living in an alpine country should have winter sports insurance so should be covered there. Myself I am a member of the French Alpine Club, so covered there.
This is a necessity as I have personaly come accross people having to be rescued in Italy who didn't have any insurance and there were many issues.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Idris wrote: |
| If you are coming from outside the EU (Uk, USA etc) you will have travel insureance so you are covered.. |
I haven't checked yet but I don't think my annual travel insurance covers third party liabilities.
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| Idris wrote: |
This is a necessity as I have personaly come accross people having to be rescued in Italy who didn't have any insurance and there were many issues. |
How does having cover for damage or injury to 3rd parties affect the situation you describe?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Red Leon wrote: |
| Idris wrote: |
This is a necessity as I have personaly come accross people having to be rescued in Italy who didn't have any insurance and there were many issues. |
How does having cover for damage or injury to 3rd parties affect the situation you describe? |
It would cover the costs of the rescue helicopter paid for by the region (prefecture/state) of Aosta. Or thats what I was told in an official comunication from the French Union of Mountain Leaders
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| Idris wrote: |
| Red Leon wrote: |
| Idris wrote: |
This is a necessity as I have personaly come accross people having to be rescued in Italy who didn't have any insurance and there were many issues. |
How does having cover for damage or injury to 3rd parties affect the situation you describe? |
It would cover the costs of the rescue helicopter paid for by the region (prefecture/state) of Aosta. Or thats what I was told in an official comunication from the French Union of Mountain Leaders |
Thanks. That’s generally covered by a Winter sports extension to a travel policy and isn’t really ‘injury or damage to 3rd parties’, though.
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Anyone who wants to look up the legislation and try to understand (or Google translate) it should go to:
https://www.normattiva.it/uri-res/N2Ls?urn:nir:stato:decreto.legislativo:2021;040
Article 30 of the legislation says:
Art. 30
Assicurazione obbligatoria
1. Lo sciatore che utilizza le piste da sci alpino deve possedere una assicurazione in corso di validita' che copra la propria responsabilita' civile per danni o infortuni causati a terzi. E' fatto obbligo in capo al gestore delle aree sciabili attrezzate, con esclusione di quelle riservate allo sci di fondo, di mettere a disposizione degli utenti, all'atto dell'acquisto del titolo di transito, una polizza assicurativa per la responsabilita' civile per danni provocati alle persone o alle cose.
Quite simply, every sale of a lift pass must be accompanied by the offer of 3rd party insurance and everyone will be insured (if found not to be insured, the lift pass will be confiscated).
Europ Assistance have an offer of €2.50 per day, I haven’t looked at Carte Neige
There are lots of paragraphs wjhich include:
Mandatory helmet (of an approved design) for U-18s
It is obligatory to stop and assist those “in difficulty”
It is forbidden to walk (or snowshoe) on pistes unless necessary
Recreational use (as against service or emergency use) of snowmobiles on ski runs is out
In the event of a collision between two or more skiers, all are presumed (initially) to hold equal responsibility.
All the Italian Police forces (Polizia, Carabinieri, Customs, local police) have competence to enforce all aspects of the law
Drink/drug skiing is an offence – probably to the same levels and checks as driving (including breathalysers!)
Paragraphs cover skiers with varying levels of disability and their helpers, including precedence at queues. They will be identified by orange tabards or similar.
Various requirements of the law will not apply to cross-country.
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Third-party liability only covers you against claims from others, when you have caused an accident / damage. So this is similar to the UK requirement for compulsory third-party motor insurance.
Nothing to do with personal medical/hospital treatment, rescue etc.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I’ve just checked my annual policy with Insure & Go. Looks like it’s covered under the Personal Liability bit for £2M. It’s a bog standard policy with winter sports cover so I’m guessing most would have similar. Time to get reading your policy documents.
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Just checked our current travel insurance, and it says it covers death or injury to any other person up to £2M. There are some exemptions (mostly due to illegal activity or relating to things that should have been separately insured) but it doesn't exclude winter sports. Last time I skiied in Italy we were insured with a different company, but I imagine it was similar.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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This is already offered at the resorts I've been to in the VDA. La Thuile normally has it for a couple of euros extra a day iirc so no real change other than them making it compulsory.
Who can complain anymore about anything in a covid world..I'd pay 20/200 a day more just to be able to ski!!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Sweedish wrote: |
| This is already offered at the resorts I've been to in the VDA. La Thuile normally has it for a couple of euros extra a day iirc so no real change other than them making it compulsory |
I think there’s a degree of confusion here.
According to the OP, "the skier who uses the alpine ski slopes must have a valid insurance that covers his / her civil liability for damages or injuries caused to third parties". That liability is usually covered by travel insurance which locals won’t generally have, hence the new requirement, I suspect.
But that’s not, AIUI, what carre neige & similar schemes (“a couple of euros extra a day”) is for - they cover evac & some medical costs, not 3rd party damage / injury.
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I've now read our annual policy with LV and it does cover third party risk, provided you have taken out the winter sports add-on. Without winter sports it wouldn't include cover for third party risk.
It will be interesting to see if there is any enforcement, either spot checks on the slopes or when purchasing a lift pass.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Red Leon, most "locals" I know, like me and toh have 3rd party insurance ...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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If you are a member of one of the alpine clubs such as CAF or AAC you will probably find that the membership provides both accident cover and 3rd party liability and legal cover.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| under a new name wrote: |
| @Red Leon, most "locals" I know, like me and toh have 3rd party insurance ... |
Assuming you meant to say, “(we) have 3rd party ins” and that’s normal for most people who ski in their own countries (ie. ‘Travel’ ins not deemed necessary), then I’m not sure who the new regulation will be aimed at.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Red Leon wrote: |
| Sweedish wrote: |
| This is already offered at the resorts I've been to in the VDA. La Thuile normally has it for a couple of euros extra a day iirc so no real change other than them making it compulsory |
I think there’s a degree of confusion here.
According to the OP, "the skier who uses the alpine ski slopes must have a valid insurance that covers his / her civil liability for damages or injuries caused to third parties". That liability is usually covered by travel insurance which locals won’t generally have, hence the new requirement, I suspect.
But that’s not, AIUI, what carre neige & similar schemes (“a couple of euros extra a day”) is for - they cover evac & some medical costs, not 3rd party damage / injury. |
The policy I mentioned does cover third party liability amongst other things...
https://www.lathuile.it/en/insurance.html
'Snowcare is the most known ski and snowboard insurance in Europe the only insurance policy for injury and third party liability (RC) for ski and snowboard '
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Red Leon wrote: |
| under a new name wrote: |
| @Red Leon, most "locals" I know, like me and toh have 3rd party insurance ... |
Assuming you meant to say, “(we) have 3rd party ins” and that’s normal for most people who ski in their own countries (ie. ‘Travel’ ins not deemed necessary), then I’m not sure who the new regulation will be aimed at. |
I guess there will be a minority of current snowsports holidaymakers who choose not to take out insurance, just as there are those who drive without insurance. That's a problem when they cause injury to others, so maybe this is what the law is aimed at
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@Red Leon, a reasonable question. I would suggest maybe the one week a year Milanese?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@under a new name,
That sounds reasonable.
If that’s the case, it’s not really an issue for the average SnowHead (not that any of us is average, of course  ) to worry about.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Insurance companies use different names, but it amounts to the same thing
this is from my LV policy : It does not mention Personal Liability or Public Liability !?
".What is covered
We’ll pay up to a maximum of £2 million (including claimant’s costs and expenses and any
other costs and expenses that we agree to in writing) in total for everyone insured on the policy,
for anything you cause during any trip that you are legally responsible for and which results in
one of the following:
n the accidental bodily injury or death of a person but not you, a travelling companion
or relative
n accidental loss of or damage to the accommodation, and the contents belonging to that
accommodation, you are using on your trip that does not belong to you, a travelling
companion or a relative. Damage to other property is also covered provided it is not
owned, hired, loaned or borrowed by you a travelling companion or a relative...."
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Fri 11-03-22 12:49; edited 1 time in total
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Yes, I've read the T&C's and they read very similarly to the above. Just a bit concerned if I were to get checked it's not so obvious, especially for a non-English official.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I doubt anyone will check (I haven't been..), unless you do have an accident...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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This is a storm in a tea cup. Any sensible person would have third part liability insurance in place for any activity where they might cause injury and significant cost. I have never some across a travel insurance product that does not include it as standard.
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| zikomo wrote: |
| This is a storm in a tea cup. Any sensible person would have third part liability insurance in place for any activity where they might cause injury and significant cost. I have never some across a travel insurance product that does not include it as standard. |
It is I agree a storm in a tea cup for UK skiers, as to ski most will travel abroad and so nearly all will then get insurance.
But compare it to say MTBiking. I'm sure lots of folk in the UK go for a bit of a MTB without any insurance. Not the hard core 'every weekend and most evenings' crowd, but the odd weekend with the lads/lasses brigade. This despite the fact it is easy to imagine that third party insurance would be a wise thing for them to have.
In alpine countries there will definitely be an equivalent group of occasional skiers.
So I think the mandate is sensible.
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You know it makes sense.
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House contents cover will cover third party liability also. Mine (Nationwide) covers:
We cover your family’s legal liability:
• as individuals, wherever you or your family are in the world
£5m cover. No excess (I assume as it's someone claiming against me, not me making a claim).
No exclusions I can see for stuff like winter sports. Main exclusion is obviously motor vehicles as they are a very high risk hence need their own insurance.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@tjmoore, That's an interesting point. Must have a look at my house insurance..
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Poster: A snowHead
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It's a common one to counter the "cyclists don't have insurance" argument as any cyclist in a family with house insurance usually does. MTB off road as well.
Possessions cover is another. Contents £5k possessions away from home worldwide with mine and can't see why it wouldn't cover skis and luggage. Bikes have separate cover though with limits or need specifying, but interestingly inside the house they come under contents cover with no limit on mine. Just outside (often including in a shed) they need separate cover.
Travel insurance has more tailored cover and needed for the accident, medical bits, cancellation and delays (though flight delay cover is often pathetic compared to what you used to be able to get back direct from the airline within the EU, though airlines tried to get out of it. That option may no longer exist post-Brexit though. Might still be okay on flight departing EU though.).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| zikomo wrote: |
| This is a storm in a tea cup. Any sensible person would have third part liability insurance in place for any activity where they might cause injury and significant cost. I have never some across a travel insurance product that does not include it as standard. |
Friends have arrived in Champoluc today and heard about this for the first time. It appears as though the Barclays family insurance they have didn't include third party liability insurance, so have been recommended Snowcare by their rep.
My Italian is non-existent and Google translate doesn't work on their website (presumably intentionally) though.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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My add-on Nationwide insurance has third-party liability, too. What some UK travel policies DON'T have, and French ones do, is liability for damage done to rented property. I think this cover is explicitly required in most French rental contracts. @Hells Bells will know more about this.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I have got to say I am in total agreement with compulsory 3rd party insurance. Also drink/drug testing. Maybe not to levels similar to driving, I haven't thought it through, but certainly something.
Mind you, I would happily pay an extra €20 or so if there were proper patrols "educating" irresponsible skiers and lifting passes from those who don't learn
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| pam w wrote: |
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My add-on Nationwide insurance has third-party liability, too. What some UK travel policies DON'T have, and French ones do, is liability for damage done to rented property. I think this cover is explicitly required in most French rental contracts. @Hells Bells will know more about this. |
I don't see why third party liability is not extended to property damage as well as injury or death ? I guess it is in the policy wording, and if you need it you should be asking your current insurers before taking out anything else. The Barclays policy linked above does, so does my Nationwide one, and it is also included in many house insurance policies. Every travel insurance policy I have had (as I've checked) has included it. Any damage caused to a property in France is not necessarily covered by the owner's insurance if the damage is caused by someone else. Your insurer would expect to be able to claim the costs back from the third party, hence the requirement for the insurance. I believe though, that the majority of French people will have this insurance, and I am sure I've even seen it advertised for children returning to school.
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| jebroni3_16 wrote: |
| zikomo wrote: |
| This is a storm in a tea cup. Any sensible person would have third part liability insurance in place for any activity where they might cause injury and significant cost. I have never some across a travel insurance product that does not include it as standard. |
Friends have arrived in Champoluc today and heard about this for the first time. It appears as though the Barclays family insurance they have didn't include third party liability insurance, so have been recommended Snowcare by their rep.
My Italian is non-existent and Google translate doesn't work on their website (presumably intentionally) though. |
I tried out the Snowcare website last week ; after the first page it went from Italian to English (possibly because the website recognised my location as UK?).
If your friends are in Italy it may not do that tho' ::
The Chrome browser is handy for translating.
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@zikomo, as suggested, not all skiers are sensible. Ever shared a resort with Varsity week? 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I've just spent a good few minutes trawling the policy wording of our Virgin Club M current account and to save others the same pain, we're covered up to £2m per claim for third party claims and there are no restrictions imposed for winter sports.
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FAQ
