 Poster: A snowHead
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Having skied most of North America, my wife and I began skiing in Europe last March. Our first two trips have been to Lech and Zermatt (since everyone in Texas goes to Colorado/Utah to ski, I have had to fully rely on the internet for planning these trips).
I did not think it would be possible to beat Arlberg, but Zermatt won over my wife, who now insists it is the greatest place on earth (Finderlerhof and Chez Vrony made a big impression).
My question is: where do we go from here in March 2015?
My short list is based on March snow record, village charm, food, good 4-5 star lodging with suitable bar (some apres), and an abundance of good red or black runs (we are advanced skiers in our late 20s but don't push ourselves on vacation!).
-Val d'isere, highly recommended by many in Zermatt. My concern is that I cannot find any charming lodging near the center of town. Hotel Christiania is the best I've found and the wife isn't impressed.
-St Moritz, not recommended by anyone, but the name could lure my wife from Zermatt. It sounds like the snow is typically good in March and has a lot of skiing options. Hotel Kronenhof seems like good (relative) value. Wife loves 'dressing up'.
-Klosters, not recommended by anyone, but snow sure and charming (all based on the WTSAS book). Hotel Walserhof looks great.
-Verbier, recommended in Zermatt, but I feel like we might have better options.
-Ischgl, I would love to ski here but the party reputation hurts. Might be more of a guys trip type place.
-Other?? Kitzbuhel, Three Valleys, Cortina, Laax, or others I have erroneously nixed?
Do we go back to Lech/Zermatt, or is something better for us?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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My personal hit list, matched with your requirements would be:
Dolomites - not renowned for steeps, but great skiing and huge area. Scenery is mind blowing, mountain restaurants are great.
Chamonix - if you want epic skiing and off piste. If you really only want groomed runs then avoid.
Davos/Klosters - I can't afford the Swiss exchange rate, if I could I'd ski here a lot more. Superb off piste, mountain restaurants OK.
Monterosa (Champoluc/Gressoney/Alagna). Big-ish area, superb off piste pretty good on piste, quiet except on sunny weekends.
Personally I'm not so keen on Verbier or Val d'Isere, can't fault the skiing but I don't like the towns, too much testosterone and cash flowing around in both places. That's just personal preference, the skiing in both places is superb.
3 Valleys is a bit meh, huge area but despite that the skiing doesn't compete with the other areas above. Vast numbers will disagree with me, but I've skied many weeks here, staying in all 3 valleys at one time or another; if I was heading that way I'd go to Val d'Isere.
Ischgl I would not bother with, it's OK but pretty tame skiing and the town has little charm.
PS. Love the username.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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MalteseFlamingo, Welcome to Snowheads! 
I would second sah's recommendation of the Dolomites, as he says huge ski area, stunning scenery, fantastic mountain restaurants (food includes both Austrian and Italian cuisine because much of the area is in the Sud Tirol and was part of Austria up till the end of WW1) and finally significantly cheaper than Lech or Zermatt. 
There is a famous ski circuit called the Sella Ronda which links the various resorts and can be done in either direction (clockwise or anti-clockwise, just follow the colour coded signs) by any intermediate skier easily in a day, including time for generous coffee/lunch stops. However, each resort on the Sella Ronda circuit has its own local ski area which is well worth exploring. Probably the best known areas are Val Gardena (resorts of Selva/Wolkenstein, St Christina and Ortisei/St Ulrich which includes the Sass Long World Cup Downhill course), Alta Badia (resorts of Corvara, Colfosco, La Villa, San Cassiano and Armentarola) and Fodom (resort of Arabba with the nearby Marmolada Glacier), and the Val di Fassa area (with resorts of Canazei and Campitello).
Access wise, if you are going to the Val Gardena resorts than Innsbruck airport is closest and you can get coach transfers/taxis from there, but for the Alta Badia and Fodom areas Venice airport is probably handier and there are also coach transfers/taxis available (plus of course you can have a day or two stay in Venice at the start or end of your trip!) 
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 23-03-14 9:31; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Alastair Pink wrote: |
as she says
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News to me 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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sah, Oops!  I've edited my post.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Alastair Pink, no worries 
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How reliable is the snow in Val Gardena in March?
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| MalteseFlamingo wrote: |
| How reliable is the snow in Val Gardena in March? |
Well, this year it's looking pretty good
Generally it doesn't get as much snow as the Arlberg or Zermatt, but when I asked the same question a few weeks ago most folks agreed it was OK until the end of March, but not a good bet for April.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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MalteseFlamingo, it seems you guys want to hit the plushest places and you've probably got most of same on your shortlist.
You say you are advanced but you ski on piste only? Did you do on or off-piste in Arlberg? As Americans in Europe I would strongly recommend the backcountry off-piste experience you won't getvat home. In this regard Arlberg is hard to beat. Every timevi have done P2P in St Anton there has been at least one American and invariably the experience blew their minds. I would say standard of piste skiing in Arlberg however quite disappointing, for advanced skier anyway.
I would like to recommend Tignes/ Val d'Isere or Les Arcs as probably best overall package on offer for advanced skier in terms of combination of genuinely challenging on-piste, quality, quantity, and variety, with such ease of movement around the huge resorts thanks to extensive and fast lift system, and easy access from either to a vast off-piste, ranging from gentle and easy to gnarly and scary and everything in between. But not sure your wife would like Tignes or Les Arcs. They are very different to Lech
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sah, is sah not short for Sarah?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I'm sure it is, it could mean many things. In my case the letter s, a, and h are my initials.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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MalteseFlamingo, Most of the replies here tend to be mentioning the skiing, but from reading your post is the standard of accommodation more important than the ski area?
I don't often do posh hotels in ski resorts, but Chamonix maybe worth a mention?
Downside is the skiing is a bus/taxi ride from the hotel each morning, but this is a cracking hotel http://www.hameaualbert.fr/en
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| peanuthead wrote: |
MalteseFlamingo, it seems you guys want to hit the plushest places and you've probably got most of same on your shortlist.
You say you are advanced but you ski on piste only? Did you do on or off-piste in Arlberg? As Americans in Europe I would strongly recommend the backcountry off-piste experience you won't getvat home. In this regard Arlberg is hard to beat. Every timevi have done P2P in St Anton there has been at least one American and invariably the experience blew their minds. I would say standard of piste skiing in Arlberg however quite disappointing, for advanced skier anyway.
I would like to recommend Tignes/ Val d'Isere or Les Arcs as probably best overall package on offer for advanced skier in terms of combination of genuinely challenging on-piste, quality, quantity, and variety, with such ease of movement around the huge resorts thanks to extensive and fast lift system, and easy access from either to a vast off-piste, ranging from gentle and easy to gnarly and scary and everything in between. But not sure your wife would like Tignes or Les Arcs. They are very different to Lech |
Quite frankly, we haven't had time to do much off-piste. We had 5 ski days in Lech/Zurs/St Anton and hired a guide for two of them. We requested he show us around the different ski areas instead of skiing off-piste because we wanted to get a taste of the area. At the time, we didn't know what a red piste was, or even what off-piste meant. We also had 5 days in Zermatt, which allowed us to ski 95% of the pistes on the Zermatt side as well as most of the good stuff we could find in Italy. Unfortunately, my wife is a teacher and cannot take more than 5 business days in March for vacation, so 5 (possibly 6) ski days is the maximum.
Thanks for the Val D recommendation. Our March 2015 ski trip in the Alps will likely be our last for some time for various reasons (back to spring break in Colorado). My main concern is not missing out on another resort like Zermatt, which was unbelievable.
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You know it makes sense.
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| kitenski wrote: |
MalteseFlamingo, Most of the replies here tend to be mentioning the skiing, but from reading your post is the standard of accommodation more important than the ski area?
I don't often do posh hotels in ski resorts, but Chamonix maybe worth a mention?
Downside is the skiing is a bus/taxi ride from the hotel each morning, but this is a cracking hotel http://www.hameaualbert.fr/en |
For me, the extent of the slopes and quality of the snow is 100% of my decision. My wife is 50/50 between quality of our accommodations and food. So I guess you could say the skiing and the lodging are equally important. Having said that, she resides on our 'investment committee' and I doubt I could sell her on any hotel that isn't 4 stars.
I have been to Chamonix in the summer and loved the town. If we went, I would feel a lot of pressure to do the Vallee Blanche as it looks amazing. The 'hike' from the cable car to the ski-able terrain looks hairy and gives me an adrenaline rush just sitting at my desk! The entire run looks amazing. Thanks for the rec!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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MalteseFlamingo, be careful in France, 4 stars can still mean a crap hotel!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Just back from 10 days in the Dolomites and would second the praise given here. Amazing scenery, vast lift system, great food, reasonable prices vs. Switzerland & France. Fantastic snow this year, but that is always a bit of a gamble. Only downside for me were crowded slopes particularly on the Sella Ronda route which often cannot be avoided. Alta Badia would be a good base. Corvara or San Cassiano in particular. Lively enough with high quality hotels and good access to lifts.
I'm not a fan of the town of St. Moritz, but you can't do better than the skiing in that valley. I've been there many years in March and the snow has been reliable, the ski terrain has a ton of variety and exposures, and the slopes are not too crowded. The on-mountain restaurants are in the Zermatt category. The lifts are a bit spread out so you will log some bus time no matter where you stay, but the bus, train and lift system work with typical Swiss precision. Instead of staying in St. Moritz, check out Pontresina. No skiing at your doorstep, but a pretty town with many high end hotels and easy bus access to the areas in the valley.
Or you can always go back to Zermatt.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I wanted to follow-up with everyone and give a quick trip report since y'all helped me out.
We chose St Moritz and stayed at the Kronenhof in Pontresina. Incredible hotel. Anyway, some of my St Moritz skiing notes:
- I thought this was the best skiing of my european trips... Zermatt and Lech/Zurs.
- My wife and I were practically alone on well-groomed, moderately steep red pistes all day. We almost didn't do the same run twice for 5 days. While the blacks were pretty easy, many of the reds were fairly steep/ varied and easily kept our attention.
- Snow was in great condition and we didn't see any new pow the entire trip. When we arrived it hadn't snowed in 3-4 days. This was 2 weeks ago starting March 8. Conditions were just fine until late afternoon it would get a little thin.
- We skied the Morteratsch glacier around the back of Diavolezza and really enjoyed it. While the conditions of it were pretty rough (ice) it was beautiful. Now wondering if I can handle the initial walk to do the Valle Blanche.
- Engadin is cheaper than Zermatt. Granted, we didn't stay in St Moritz proper but Zermatt was really expensive. I would like to see the short list of places MORE expensive than Zermatt.
- The scenery in the Engadin valley is right there with Zermatt.
- I was hoping for more in the apres ski category. I didn't look too hard, but it certainly didn't have a Mooserwirt or Hennu Stall. The Audi bar in Corviglia was pretty dead.
- Food was good but it wasn't Zermatt.
- I didn't like the vibe of St Moritz proper nearly as much as Pontresina, which was relaxing.
- The Corvatsch glacier had some great runs. It is beautiful up there. I wish it were closer to Pontresina. It was a 39 minute bus ride and a taxi would have cost $90. Only got 1 day.
- I want to reiterate how quiet it was. I think I had to make 1 turn all week because someone skied in front of me and was going slow. The snow was good and the sun was out. Insane. I don't think I rode on a lift with anyone except my wife.
- We didn't meet anyone for a week who speaks english as their first language (only slightly exaggerating). We enjoyed that.
- (not skiing related) Had to skip the Nietzsche museum because it didn't have an english tour or something. Total bummer.
Our friends in Texas and the people in StM thought we were nuts for traveling (with skis!) all that way for only 6 days of skiing and 7 total days. It was the same price for us as a trip to Vail/Telluride/ Deer Valley (with significantly better accommodations in Europe) and 10x the fun. I would highly recommend StM to anyone who doesn't have beginners. Seemed best for couples or families with good skiers. Or people who like sun-bathing. Our hotel dropped/picked up at the base of Corviglia and/or Diavolezza so the 'morning commute' was nothing.
I am throwing around trying Val D, Selva (based on your recommendation for this year), Wengen, Cham or Ischgl next year (same week in March) but it will be difficult to not go back.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Personally I think Ischgl has great skiing and it's certainly not all tame - and if pisted stuff matters to you I think there pistes there are better and more varied than the Arlberg.
I wouldn't worry about the party town stuff - yes there's a lot of apres, but it's not that intrusive, and outside of peak weeks can actually be quite quiet. Later at night it's also generally an older and slightly more sophisticated (or Russian) crowd than the label might suggest too.
I would agree it's not the most charming town in the Alps, but it's not ugly either. There are also some really good hotels and restaurants.
If you like pistes the Dolomites are hard to beat however, though the lift system is pretty frustrating at times depending on where you stay.
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| Quote: |
I don't often do posh hotels in ski resorts, but Chamonix maybe worth a mention?
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@kitenski,
The one you stay in Stuben at Easter ain't too shabby is it?! 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
If you like pistes the Dolomites are hard to beat however, though the lift system is pretty frustrating at times depending on where you stay.
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Yep, the area is incredible, and based on the report above I'd say it should be next on your list
@MalteseFlamingo. The lift system around Selva is good, very easy to do the Sella Ronda and easy to get to some quiet slopes above St Cristina. It is also easy to get to Seisseralm which is well worth a look, but they are the tamest pistes I've ever seen - the skiing on the Alm is frankly dull but the scenery makes it worth a day there.
If you go on one of the free ski school safaris from Selva they show you how to get to some more out-of-the-way areas with buses and short taxi rides. Well worth doing.
As a town Selva doesn't really do it for me, it's nice, there are a couple of lively bars, a few quiet ones, lots of very nice B&Bs but somehow it's not as "gemudlich" as other places. I can't really put my finger on it. There's nothing wrong with it and it's easy to get to, but next time I go to the area (this summer ) I'll be staying in Corvara so I'll report back if it's any different.
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@MalteseFlamingo, Based on your list, I'd comment as follows:-
Val D'Isere -Stayed there at least 10x in the 90's, we prefer skiing in Tignes so ended up there more often than not. Also stayed 7-8x in Tignes but its a very different experience than Lech or Zermatt. Val accommodation (and France in general) is very sparse compared to Austria. Take a look at Campanules in Tgnes, very nice, après very limited.
St Moritz - I don't earn enough to go there!
Klosters - one of the most beautiful places I've ever seen, stayed in Davos on a lads week 12 years ago, loved the skiing but I'd not go there now because of the exchange rate.
Verbier - skiing awesome, town awful, attracts city banker types which IME ski sometimes when the sun shines and party hard - Again I've not been for 5 years, exchange rate is again key factor.
Ischgl - loads of red motorways, o/p very good. Stayed in town 12 years ago, après crazy. In no great rush to return but would recommend it, stay out of town centre though, very noisy.
Kitzbuhel - been 5x, love the place but skiing not very challenging, 3V - Stayed in all areas in 90's 15x again lots of motorways, not in a rush to go back, Cortina - never been, not into fur coats and small handbag dogs but skiing supposed to be good, Laax - great youngsters place but again its in CH-land so very expensive, skiing easy was there a few years back.
I'd recommend you look at:-
Arlberg (all areas), Obergurgl, Verbier (plenty of big money places if you like that sort of thing), Chamonix (stay central or at Argentiere), Engelberg (Titlis), Tignes (if you don't mind quiet après) and maybe go back to Zermatt again if you really like it (I've only been 2x but found the lift system disjointed and town dark and too touristy)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@kitenski, wish I was going there at Easter - i'm in summer bike mode now, would rather be doing the Weisse Rausch soon though!
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@MalteseFlamingo, Sounds like you had a great time. One of the reasons St Moritz was so quiet I suspect is that the strong Swiss Franc has put off a lot of visitors. I have never been to StM but others have reported Davos as being very quiet this year and I have been there a lot and know it certainly isn't always so.
Difficult to know what to recommend when you have enjoyed one resort so much. @Markymark29, summarises a lot of the points wel.
Personally I love both Davos and Ischgl as ski destinations and have skied a fair bit in both. Ischgl has never been quiet when I have been there always high season but against that there have always been quiet bits to ski in and it is certainly not as crowded as some of the big French resorts. Davos is a superb place to ski and the valley is attractive, the town is not but there are plenty of decent hotels. Val d'Isere is a bit of a 'marmite' resort some love it and some hate it. The resort itself is certainly not very attractive and it is generally expensive and crowded, there are though a good variety of pistes and some excellent off piste which however gets very heavily skied.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
The resort itself is certainly not very attractive
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+1 It always astonishes me when people describe it as "quaint" or "charming". Perhaps they are comparing it to Tignes.
Within France Megeve might be worth looking at - some seriously good hotels and restaurants though the skiing might not be sufficiently challenging for the OP. The traffic free centre of Megeve is attractive though the outskirts are just outskirts like any others.
Within Italy, how about Madonna di Campiglio? Somewhere Italian might be a nice change.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I was thinking that when sat in la daille looking over at Val d'sere and looking at the high rise buildings I could see. Compared to say La Plagne it has some nice chalet buildings but I wouldnt view it as quaint or charming. Love the skiing and actually didnt find prices too bad last week though the move in exchange rate has obviously helped.
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Val d'isere quaint? 
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