 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm considering buying some heavily discounted boots online and was wondering whether anyone has any experience of doing a diy heat mould on the liners? Also, is it absolutely necessary to heat mould or can you ski without?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Apart from the can of worms you just opened.........
I was going to try this 10 or so years ago..... first thought was a hair dryer but then almost used a paint heat gun with a extended nozzle. Didnt get into making or trying anything as I ended up having a spare few hours to get to a shop before the holiday.
If you are lucky to have bought the right size and they more or less fit you don't need to mould them..... but if you want just take them round a resort and ask if you can "borrow" a boot heater
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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michaelf, I did it myself with a hair dryer, was advised by a boot fitter though that the heat has to be constant for about 10 mins, which is a long time. Getting the heat to circulate can be a problem, you need something like a boot dryer that blows the hot air out through multiple holes so it gets to all parts of the liner. Fortunately I have Full Tilt boots and the boot opens right up to the toe, so I could get the hot air everywhere. It worked fine as they were 2nd hand boots that weren't heat shaped to my foot. They got nice and warm inside, then fastened them up tight, waited 10 mins to cool whilst walking around, and they now fit great. Just be careful you don't overheat anywhere and melt the liner or heat the shell up. Of course none of this will be much use if the shell isn't right!
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I have done this several times. Fortunately, I have a large thermostatically controlled convector oven at work. Anyway, here's my recipe:
* remove liners from boots an socks from feet
* spray inside of boots with silicone lubricant
* used double-sided tape to stick footbeds to bare feet
* fit neoprene caps over toes (ex wet suit bootees ?)
* apply sticky foam pads to any pressure points
* fit very thin sock (ladies pop-socks) to hold the lot in place
* cook liners - 10 mins at 135C
with first foot
* wrap liner over foot making sure the seam is central and the heel is well banged down
* cover the liner in another thin sock
* slip everything into the shell
* bang heel down hard again
* clip boot up with moderate tension
repeat with other foot then
* stand for 15 mins with piece of timber under toes
Some more info:
http://www.telemark-pyrenees.com/shop/article_info.php?articles_id=3
http://www.telemarktips.com/DrTelemark.html
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi there. I have been working as a custom ski boot fitter for twenty year and I would say that your best option if you decide to by over the web is to take the boot into a ski shop and pay someone to form the liner it shouldnt cost you much.
However having said that my friend if I were you I would have my boots fitted by a pro...that way you have someone to go back to when they are not comfortable.
What type of liner is it? If it is an EVA liner you will need to have the proper padding/dressing applied to the foot to make sure that the liner fits comfortably. Using a hair dryer is not advisable! It almost impossible to get the heat into the toe box. there is also a very strong possiblity that you will fry the liner and it could set you back £200 to get a new custom liner.
Altis is spot on about the processs for custom moulding both EVA and Foam liners...It might also be worth noting that when we form EVA or foam liner we never allow the client to walk around. This will alter the internal shape of the boot and as skiing is a mid-stance sport that the way we cast all ski boots. Also if you have a orthotic that is heat moulded take it out prior to heating the liner or it could turn to mush.....good luck
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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ski4life, welcome to snowHeads. There are a few other bootfitters on heree too.
Hope you enjoy it.
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One other alternative to is to warm them gently overnight when skiing. Once kept warm they will eventually mould to your feet with use. Though this is a much more long winded process.
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I'm not entirely sure about that frank4short. When I tried skiing my first pair of mouldable boots, without moulding them, I could barely do up my boots and my feet were completely numb after about an hour. That was without any pre-heating mind.
Lately, some manufacturers have taken to pre-moulding the liners for a standard foot. If you are lucky and your feet nearly match then you may find them comfortable enough as-is. I think Scarpa are doing this but I'm not sure.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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altis, My boots (Head 8.8's) came with heat conformable liners (these might be different to what you are talking about on this thread) and they didn't go to all that trouble when they did mine. A nice long time on the heater (liners inside the boots), then boots on feet and stand still in a 'mid' fore/aft position until they cooled and Robert was my mother's brother. Perhaps we should know what sort of boots and liners are being discussed by the OP, as I would think I could accomplish a similar process on a pair of my boots with a standard warm boot dryer  . Proviso - I really know nothing about boot fitting though - I'm just applying common sense based on what was done with my own, which are really comfy.
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I bought a second hand pair of X Wave 9's and looked into getting them remoulded in several local shops. The first one wouldn't do remoulds, the others charged £20-£25 which I thought was quite reasonable (that was a couple of years ago now) and I'm sure the price would apply for a first time moulding too.
In the end they were a brilliant fit so I didn't bother, I obviously bought them from my foot twin or I have standard Salomon feet.
By the way, I wouldn't advocate buying second hand boots normally. These were nearly new boots bought from a work colleague at a silly price, just to avoid the avalanche of criticism that was about to unleashed.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Nice to be here Mosha Marc.....looking forward to it 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Dorset Andy, I wouldn't normally, but mine were a demo pair, almost brand new - and fitted far better than the new ones I got last season (with a 3 hour 'fitting' and 3 return visits to the shop!). But my hubby and our 2 ski buddies found their hire boots so comfortable 2 seasons ago, that they bought them, only cost slightly more than the weeks hire cost and they are still happy with them! I guess it all depends on your feet, the last, and what level you ski at.ski4life, by walking I mean not sitting or standing still, this was how the boot fitter did my new ones, so perhaps it was wrong. The liners were great though...shells weren't!
I didn't have a problem heating the whole inside when I did it, didn't have the drier on full heat so nothing was damaged. There weren't any pressure points to begin with, I just wanted them to hug my foot shape as much a possible, and so far all's well. 
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ski4life, making a guess that you are james????
welcome to the madhouse
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You know it makes sense.
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The boots are full tilt. I know it is strongly advised not to buy online without proper fitting, etc. but I've used Head/Salomon/Atomic rentals and never had any pain or discomfort as, as far as I'm aware my feet are normal i.e neutral running pattern and no weird bony bits.
My only query (don't shoot, it may be a laughable assumption) is that if a 26MP and 26.5MP have the same shell size but different sized liners and the liner expands when it's heated and then shrinks back down to the foot is it safer to buy the smaller size?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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I moulded a pair of intuition liners in a domestic convection oven following these instructions http://www.telemark-pyrenees.com/shop/article_info.php?articles_id=3. Didn't have any toe caps (can you buy those or do you have to get them from somebody in the trade?) but used a couple of saw-off toes from a pair of thick socks. The intial result was good for recreation skiing but while ski-touring last weekend I started to have problems on the top of the toes. Not sure what is causing this, it might be a seam on the sock or because I didn't have toe caps. Is there a solution to this problem?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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DB...this happens quite often in EVA liners and tends to be because the material in the top of the toe box didnt get compressed enough. There are a couple of remedies for this problem. If you have orthotics then you can have a tech grind a few mm (carefully) of the bottom of the insole and this will usually give adequate room. You can also spot stretch the top of the toe box. Remove the liner and heat just the top carefully until warm and pliable. Then take a rubbing bar or even the end of a screwdriver and press the material thereby thinning it and giving additional room...hope that helps!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks for the advice ski4life (and everyone else). I think it sounds sensible if I do get them to visit my local store and pay a bit more to have them moulded properly (unless they would be fine to ski without moulding the liners, or is this not possible with intuition liners?). If they look at them and say they are unsuitable I will just have to return and stick with rentals and wait until I can afford the CEM treatment.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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ski4life,
Thanks, I'm assuming you mean a spot stretch using a hairdryer as the heat source.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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michaelf...you are very welcome! I would imagine that you will find the Intuition liners very uncomfortable if you dont form the before skiing...good luck!
DB Thats correct keep the heat moving and when the eva is squidgy then it is ready...be careful not to melt it .......good luck!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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So ski4life, you're saying if I'm umming between a 26 and a 26.5 I should go for the 26's if they have the same size shell?
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Michaelf....unless I am missing something Full Tilt originally the Raichle Flex on boots are built on the same mould. Therefore 26.5 and 26.0 should be the same. If it were me I would buy the 26.5. the difference should only be in the liner and ussually the manufactuers (especially intuition) do not produce 1/2 lasted liners. Some companies will short stich a liner which means they make the liner shorter that the boot. This is done to elliminate crumpling of the liner and can be a real pain in the ass. Do you have narrow feet??
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oh and buy the way when I order boots for the shop I only by the .5 boots so 26.5...27.5 and so on....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Well it was out with the hairdryer and screwdriver handles last night. Before starting work on the ski boots I tried them on and my toes were cramped. It was hard to move the toes let alone wiggle them. After 30 mins or so I could get in the boots and wiggle the toes on boot feet. Looking forward to seeing how they perform on the hill during next weekend's ski tour.
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I moulded the Intuition liners of my Dalbello Krypton's using the home oven set at 140 C for 15 mins, they came out so soft that they would not even stand up, I made up my own neoprene toe caps and also some ankle bone protectors. They are now the most comfortable boots that I have ever had. BTW I have worn out 2 pair of Raichle Flexon Comps which are the same as your Full Tilt's. I got my instructions from TRG forum a couple of years ago
altis, instructions are very similar. GO For it.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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michaelf, not sure about sticking boots in ovens at regulo 6 etc. A safe way for minor easing of pressure points is to do this... take inners out of boot. Put boot in large bucket of very hot water (not boiling hot, more like cup of tea with milk and two sugars hot). Leave it in there for a good few minutes. Put on some gloves (cos the clips will be hot) and put the liner back in. Stick your foot in (with or without sock up to you) and clip the boot up nice and tight. Flex it, walk around etc. Your foot will get hot! After 5-10 mins you can take your foot out and leave the boot to cool. The plastic will have a certain amount of memory and the effect might not be sufficient at first go. This works, I have done it on myself once or twice and on others in hotel ski rooms.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I got my boot free out of a colleague's attic... they didn't fit him well and he didn't realise he could get them moulded until he'd already bought a second pair. Anyway, they fit me perfectly when I first got them, but now are not so comfy. Lots of ideas here about how to get them comfier again. I was thinking of leaving them on the radiator for a while...
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You know it makes sense.
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+1 for the Intuition rice fitting
I bought my Scarpa Maestrales from flea-bay and the fit using rice is great - some of the most comfortable fitting boots right from day one!!!
I made some toe caps out of old wetsuit neoprene, and a couple of neoprene pads for my bony feet.
You get to eat the rice afterwards too 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I moulded the liners on my scarpa denali tt boots using our domestic oven following the telemark Pyrenees instructions.
It worked pretty well although I did end up getting them redone in a ski shop to improve the fit after a hut to hut tour.
I found that they came out pretty soft and it was a little tricky getting the hot inners back in to the boots without mangling them
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