 Poster: A snowHead
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What do people mean exactly when they are getting the edges done.
Does a ski shop actually replace the metal strips or is it filing the existing ones to be sharp etc
Peter
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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The latter.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The ski shop will put your skis through a machine that puts wax on the base and shaves metal off the edges, very often to a 2 degree angle. This is OK for most purposes, but I prefer my edges at 1 degree (as originally set by the manufacturer) so I do my waxing and edges by hand. Some people like 3 degrees, but I find that too grabby.
The people in the ski shop at Chatel, who kindly let me store my skis and boots there to save lugging them through the town were astonished at this nerdishness. They have good standard racers who happily put their skis through their machine!
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| Chris Bish wrote: |
The ski shop will put your skis through a machine that puts wax on the base and shaves metal off the edges, very often to a 2 degree angle. This is OK for most purposes, but I prefer my edges at 1 degree (as originally set by the manufacturer) so I do my waxing and edges by hand. Some people like 3 degrees, but I find that too grabby.
The people in the ski shop at Chatel, who kindly let me store my skis and boots there to save lugging them through the town were astonished at this nerdishness. They have good standard racers who happily put their skis through their machine!
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Sorry to derail the thread but I am curious. Do you think the specific angle helps to ski better, or do you think you could have learned to ski to the same standard at 1 or 3 degrees?
I am totally un-technical when it comes to this stuff, so struggle to understand how a degree here or there makes so much difference - although I suppose it wouldn't for someone at my standard (ungraceful red/black piste skier).
Cheers
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@huntleth, You are making assumptions about my standard of skiing! I am little better than a wheelie bin rolling downhill on a good day! I am, though, a bit nerdy about these things. Yes, ski prep does make a difference. A good brushed hot wax makes your skis run better. Edge angles do make a (slight) difference. It may be largely in the mind, but much of sport is. I think you would notice the difference between 3 and 1 degrees. Atomic tend to use 3, but they also tend to stiff and powerful skis. I do know that my first ski test astonished me at the difference there was in skis.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@huntleth, worry not. 99% of the skiers here wouldn't be able to tell the difference. At least 68% of skiers here will disagree, but skiing is like driving, 83 % of british drivers think they are in the best 10%. To tell the difference in your edge angle cut you need to be very very good. It will not matter to almost all of us.
But if you are very nerdy about stuff......................
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| thecramps wrote: |
@huntleth, worry not. 99% of the skiers here wouldn't be able to tell the difference. At least 68% of skiers here will disagree, but skiing is like driving, 83 % of british drivers think they are in the best 10%. To tell the difference in your edge angle cut you need to be very very good. It will not matter to almost all of us.
But if you are very nerdy about stuff...................... |
Are you telepathic ?
You post one minute before my nerdy reply 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Thanks for the info guys.
This feb will only be my 5th ski trip but since I finished uni two years ago I have vowed to make it an annual thing - and I think next year will be the year I buy ski's, so want to understand this stuff a bit better. I would really like to trial a few ski's and see if I can tell the difference - although I expect my first purchase will just be some ex-rental jobs from ebay!
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ignore all that tosh, the only thing that matters for most skiers is "your skis feel a bit weird when they have been serviced". A techo will say "detune" your skis. What that means is you take stone (or something like) and blunt the sharpness of the edges at the front and back outside edges.
Some like to shroud this stuff in mystery, but its not so bad really. You might want to get more involved if you ski every day or professionally compete, but otherwise, it's all rule 1.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| huntleth wrote: |
Thanks for the info guys.
This feb will only be my 5th ski trip but since I finished uni two years ago I have vowed to make it an annual thing - and I think next year will be the year I buy ski's, so want to understand this stuff a bit better. I would really like to trial a few ski's and see if I can tell the difference - although I expect my first purchase will just be some ex-rental jobs from ebay! |
If you are going to ski once a year not really worth bothering about. But if you are still determind then contact Spyderjon about one of his courses.
If renting last thing you want to be doing is messing around with the hire shops skis.
thecramps Is right unless racing or skiing at least a few times per week all year round not really soemthing you need to get that bothered about. ( I used to ski min of about 4-5 days a week all year hence why I bothered ).
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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So heres a thing, I was under the impression that different skis may need different edge angles as "standard". Not being too into this (I prefer to ski the things, not play with them) I took this as read, but it could be a load of tosh.
Answers on a postcard?
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@speed098 - not worth bothering buying ski's or with the edge angles? Although I'm not likely to bother experimenting with different edge angles or whatever other fancy setups you can have, if I do buy ski's I figure it would be good to have an understanding of this stuff for when I come to service ski's etc.
I've been paying more and more each year for ski rental, and given the price of some of the used ski's on ebay it seems a no brainer to buy, unless the extra costs outweigh the benefits.
edit - also the annual thing would be a minimum - i've had such a blast the last 2 trips I am desperate to spend more time on the slopes. Hoping to grab an end of season long weekend and 1 or 2 weeks in december if I can!
cheers
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You know it makes sense.
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@huntleth, No problem if you want end of season and can manage a week the EoSB is worth considering and probably not cost that much more than a long weekend.
If buying secondhand I think there is an American site that gives the edge/base angles but not sure how upto date it is or how accurate. I would say take the skis to a shop get them serviced and if you want to do your own after that buy a set angle tools at the same angle the skis have been serviced to. ( so ask the service guy to write the angles down for you ).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@huntleth, in the nicest possible way, if you are asking that stuff here, it really isn't an issue for you. It isn't for me. We aren't good enough for it to matter.
Hope you know what I mean. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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As all the highly experienced and savant experts chirp upon this board............................. Your skis are just fine as is. Never get them tuned. Leave them as is from the factory because skis are just fine right from the factory.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Chris Bish wrote: |
@huntleth, You are making assumptions about my standard of skiing! I am little better than a wheelie bin rolling downhill on a good day! I am, though, a bit nerdy about these things. Yes, ski prep does make a difference. A good brushed hot wax makes your skis run better. Edge angles do make a (slight) difference. It may be largely in the mind, but much of sport is. I think you would notice the difference between 3 and 1 degrees. Atomic tend to use 3, but they also tend to stiff and powerful skis. I do know that my first ski test astonished me at the difference there was in skis.
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The angle of the edge is important.
Beginners need an edge that will bite on the snow with little effort so their angle will be 90 degrees. The more advanced you become the more you need to carve in your turns - this involve putting the ski 'on it's side' if you like, think somewhere in the region of 45 degrees against the snow - obviously variable depending on what you're doing.
The harder you carve the more angle you need on your ski so it will be more stable and bite harder whilst you are turning - ski racers have an angle like 3 - 4 degrees because they need the ski to hold in high speed aggressive turns, or else the ski bites too early and will slip out from underneath you as you turn harder.
The angle of the ski is very important once you reach a certain standard.
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Modern shaped skis don't need detuning, although I don't know why not 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I always de tune my skis, otherwise I find they bite too early and wave around like out of control horses because they can't hold the turn initiation, but I do ski on a Q90 - they're relatively soft for an advanced ski, and sometimes they slip out before they've engaged.
But that's just me.
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Detuning the tips and tails is a bit of a hangover from the days of straighter ski styles and the associated methods of turning them. But as said, some people prefer a ski that does not grab immediately. The last lesson I had involved initiating and steering the turn from the ankle with both tips and for this you really need tip edges that bite into the piste, especially with stiff quick turning slalom skis.
I remember my old pair of Rossi B2s that were beginning to go noodle like and wash out of turns on hardback. i took them from a 1 degree edge angle to a 2, noticed a slight improvement and then went to 3 which gave much better grip on icy pistes. Since then I've stuck to 3 for all my skis, off piste it will make no difference, but get a pair of fat skis on a scraped steep piste and I am glad of any additional edge grip I can get.
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