Lots of skiing……without breaking the bank. How to do it?

A snowHead

After 2 disastrous skiing holidays in the 80s I spent over 20 years swearing I’d never ski again. In 2012 I found myself backed into a corner to try again…….and discovered I loved it after all. Embarassed

We skied twice in 2012 and twice in 2013, all in France, in an attempt to start making up for lost time before we’re too old (OH already over 60).

We’re looking at skiing at least 3 times this season, preferably more. Initial inclination is to pick a single area and buy a season pass and keep returning, but that may not make sense if we only do 3 trips.

Happy to self-cater, but it generally seems relatively expensive to get comfortable (ie not basic) self-catering for two people against a good deal staying in a chalet.

We don’t want any peak weeks, with the possible exception of Christmas, so we may be attractive repeat tenants for owners with families who rarely rent out as they need the peak weeks themselves. It would certainly be great to be able to leave gear behind for the season.

Our best flight options are to Geneva, Grenoble, Chambery and Salzburg, although we may drive at least once. And short transfers are obviously going to be cheaper from these.

Cruisy blues and some good private tuition are also important. Not interested in night life (or really, anything except good convenient skiing, now I realise what a fool I was for 20 years!).

Any and all thoughts gratefully received.

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Look at towns in/along the valleys rather than resorts for accommodation. For three weeks a season pass should save you money. Maybe a bit more expensive than a single resort season pass, but the Tirol Snow Card would allow you three weeks in any of several large resorts (Zillertal/Mayrhofen, Kitzbuehel, etc) if you wanted some variety. Also covers resorts around Innsbruck, which could allow cheap weekends if you can find flights into that airport.

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A season pass for the Espace Diamant costs €425 if bought before 3 November (mine costs less because I'm over 65). £90 a week if you do 4 weeks. £50 a night decent accommodation (for both of you, not per head) should be obtainable. You are not interested in apres ski, so eating and drinking need not cost much more than you spend at home (especially if you have an apartment where you can go home for lunch sometimes).

Private lessons, less than £30 an hour for two people.

How can you afford not to do it? wink

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I find self catering generally pretty cheap compared to B&Bs or hotels, we did get a really good deal on a catered chalet once though by booking 3 days before we went. Book flights and self catering accommodation early and catered chalets as late as possible, pick less well known resorts to stay in, ideally somewhere there isn't a massive UK tour operator. We generally spend around £100 +/- per day skiing when on holiday all in, not including any lessons. The other option is to move nearer the mountains, day trips make it much cheaper Smile

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Grand Massif pass for the season will be around €440 if booked before about 14th December. That gives you Samoens, morillon, Les Carroz and Flaine. So even if you do 3 weeks it is really good value, and then you have the freedom to go back for more if you want! We rented a place in Les Carroz for the whole season with a friend for a couple of seasons. Had an old Jeep that we drove out and left at Geneva airport. The long stay car park was about £8 per day, but as there was always someone coming and going, it wasn't too expensive.

I can thoroughly recommend a long let even if it's not the whole season. Last season we did it for 7 weeks in a satellite hamlet to St Martin de Belleville, again with a friend. I guess you could get an apartment between early Jan and half term quite cheaply. The big plus is that you can fly on any day and make the best of cheap flights. Leave your kit in th apartment, fly hand baggage on SleasyJet, pick up car. We usually did front door to ski slope in about 4 hrs 30 (but we do live 15 mins from Gatwick!). Lots of flights to GVA too, including the 9.30pm one home which was great as you can ski all day, have supper early and still easily get back to the airport-just an hour away.

This may not be quite what you had in mind, but it was worth it! Go to local estate agents for longer lets -even thoug they may be listed as weekly. Agents will be listed on resort websites. Here's a link to someone with apartments in Morillon too http://www.lushski.co.uk . Morillon Les Esserts is a marginally longer drive from Geneva, but is a lovely, if purpose built, spot for the skiing on the Morillon side- ski in ski out and located at the end of one of the prettiest blue runs in the area.
Les C is a really nice village too, a proper community and, totally unlike the stereotypical French resort, it's very friendly!

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After all it is free

Great suggestions, thanks.

Not that keen on staying in the valleys, as I like the convenience of something reasonably close to ski-in ski-out. And it's not likely that we'll have a vehicle on hand.

Really like the idea of a pass that at least gives the option of going somewhere else some of the time, so will need to factor that into the decisions.

Pam w - £30 an hour for private lessons sounds too good to be true! Who would that be with, and where?

Don't know Espace Diamant at all, so would need to do some research, but the Grand Massif had already featured in the ideas, as Samoens was where we first went in 2012.

Off to do some research and doubtless be back with more questions......

Yes, most season passes give you days elsewhere. Useful provided you have a car.

Once you are no longer working, and stuck with the expensive Saturday flights and week long holidays skiing becomes far more affordable.

For a long stay - a few weeks or more - I would definitely want my own place, not a catered chalet or hotel or, still less, a B & B. Quite apart from the cost I would want to be able to wander round in my underwear if I wished, fix myself a proper cup of tea or a gin and tonic at supermarket prices, have a bottle of white wine open in the fridge, have a comfortable place to sit and read, watch TV, surf the internet, not have to do it all in my bedroom or in a public area.

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sj1608, PM me if you are interested in our apartment in Serre Chevalier. A reasonable transfer from Grenoble airport, and we can offer equipment storage if necessary. 200m from chair lifts. My availability is becoming thin on the ground though, so may not be suitable, but we do have some time in December, January and late March. Ski pass is at a reduced rate until the beginning of December and includes 3 days at each of Les Deux-Alpes, Puy St Vincent, Montgenevre. www.ski-serrechevalier.com for more details.

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Pam w - Not a fan of ESF. Their teaching style was the cause of my 20 year skiing gap. Sad

We're not totally stuck with Saturdays, as OH is retired and I work flexibly. There are 7 day a week flights to Geneva from Southampton (where we are). How easy/cheap are transfers to Les Saisies from Geneva? I have a feeling we turned it down last year as not being very accessible other than by private transfer.

Generally we prefer self-catering (I'm sat in a foreign hotel now, on business, so a hotel is more associated with work for me), but since this is probably several separate blocks of time (don't think the fitness level would support more than about 10 days at a stretch!), I'm not as hung up about having my own space as I would be if we were going for a solid month.

You know it makes sense.

I've just spotted that ESI do lessons 9.00 - 10.30, which I'd love. The usual 'private lessons at lunchtime' rather restricts the day, and since I'm always up early I have no issue with being ready by 9am.

Pam w Any specific apartments that you may know of ..... ?

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

sj1608, this one is in my complex, but I don't know the owner. http://www.locapart-lessaisies.com/planning.htm €430 a week low-season but would probably do a deal for multiple weeks. Some nice photos on that website. The one "les chalets en bordure de la piste bleu" shows the location in relation to the piste. The photo of the "commerce" in the locality is out of of date - that restaurant is now a private house with a very swish gite to rent underneath. There's one (very good) restaurant up there, other stuff at the bottom of the slope including ski hire, small supermarket, a tea shop, another restaurant, but basically - it's extremely quiet! Websites will tell you it's a ten minute drive into Les Saisies but very often in winter it's a bit more - it's a very snowy area. There's a reliable but not frequent ski bus service to the village or you can ski over the mountain, of course.

I also have some friends in the complex who rent out apartments from time to time - I don't rent out mine so can't be accused of any pecuniary interest. wink

In Bisanne 1500 - very quiet, outside the main village. Ski in/out, nice apartments.

As I don't rent out my place I think I can be relied upon for accurate information if you want to know anything else. I have skied in the Espace Diamant a lot now, and am not bored yet. wink

Nice view from the terrace of the sunset over Mont Blanc. wink

A snowHead

Lots of skiing……without breaking the bank. How to do it?

You don't;
or
you go to Bansko...........

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A snowHead

Juddernaut, it can certainly be done, but only by people with enough leisure time to take advantage of cheap flight timings and the bargain season lift passes. It helps if they are willing to cook for themselves and are content with a glass or three of decent wine from the supermarket with their dinner rather than drinking in bars.

There have to be some advantages to being old. wink

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

sj1608, check out our website (link in my sig below.

We are running a multiple week discount at the moment, but if you wanted xmas week plus two others we can work something out for you, and plenty of space in the basement to leave all your gear if you want, which I think would be an issue with almost everyone else Puzzled

PM me if you are interested.

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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

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If you drive, try the ski in /out Balcons de les Vanoise in Termingnon; one of the cheapest lift passes in France for the area, and if you use Peak Retreats or Erna Low you get a flexi upgrade on the Eurotunnel ( v. useful) Eg. 25th Jan £ 420 inc eurotunnel, double bed + sofa bed, 6 day pass £143 Very Happy

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

If you want cheap long term skiing then look at buying an apartment and renting it out when you get too old to go.

After all it is free

Thanks again for the input. Thoughts so far against your individual suggestions:

Pam w - if we planned on driving each time, I think Les Saisies would be perfect, but I doubt that we'll drive more than once. It's another of those things that is cheap for four and expensive for two.

dennisp - your place looks great, but we only need one bedroom not three Sad

Hells Bells - perfect apartment, but we only get flights to Grenoble once a week from Southampton (just spotted that you're just up the road from us, so guess you may be aware of that)

dennisp - I think I should clarify on the 'not breaking the bank'. We're not trying to do it as cheaply as possible, but to avoid spending more than we need to, to achieve what we want. So choosing somewhere with a good value season pass, cheap frequent transfers from Geneva and a large enough area to make it easy to find smaller accom for 2 would look good to me. Choosing somewhere with expensive transfers, no Geneva option, and limited accom options would mean that I'd feel we were wasting money.

emwmarine - really don't want the hassle of owning, plus I don't feel we'd be set on any area yet even if we did.

Beginning to feel we should just plump for an accessible area and then play it by ear for accommodation...... which would probably put Grand Massif in pole position at the moment.

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sj1608, ready made answer for you. PSB in December, Birthday Bash in February, EoSB in April. Cheap holiday, lots of people in a similar position, join in as much or as little as you like socially, and very important they are dirt cheap. Almost too cheap.

PSB £444 includes lift pass, food, and there are loads of lessons available with some exceptionally good instructors for cheap. http://www.snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=102280 - you just book a flight from a convenient airport.

EoSB is a bit cheaper from memory, and quality of accommodation is very good. Also loads of private and group lessons on tap. Not sure that is open for booking yet, but is

I think your Feb option is now the Pre-Birthday Bash Warm Up Week, which will be in a similar vein to the above and similar ballpark price.

If you did these, you'd find by the third trip that it would be like joining a group of old friends on a ski trip, and then you've got a ready made bunch of ski buddies for next season and beyond too. Oh, and 60 isn't even starting to get old, there are many on the bashes significantly older than you and skiing all day.

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Lots of good suggestions. My word the season passes are cheap in some places. Tignes is €1000 even now.
I am afraid as I self cater all year I am disinclined to do so on skiing trips. So it's usually hotels but nothing too posh.
Hoping to do 60+ days this season and likely to be all or nearly all in the EK. So a season pass makes sense even at that price.
Retire in 5 years so selling my 3 bed detached in favour of a flat. Guess what I am using the difference for? A 5 year ski fund. This allows me to do a 4 day work week.
Once I largely retire I think I will be out most of the winter and catered will not be an option.

sj1608, A few thoughts;

One of the cheapest ways to go skiing is to book last minute with a tour operator low season. Every year there are bargains as the tour operators are unable to sell off their cheap weeks there is quite simply overcapacity. The biggest drawback with this is that you have to be prepared to go to the major charter airports. Flights from local airports are sometimes available but with nothing like the same availability. If you prefer self catering accommodation you are also far less likely to make a big saving particularly if there are only two of you. Tour operators two man accommodation that is cheap is not usually particularly enticing.

If you are self catering have you considered finding some like minded friends? Accommodation for four is generally far cheaper per head than for two and generally more spacious and if you DIY using car rental for transport can be very reasonable when shared between four. Sharing the cooking in my experience is actually quite pleasant and catering costs lower.

As far as cheap places to ski the Maurrienne valley is far cheaper than further north in France and very easily accessed from Chambery and reasonable from Grenoble & Geneva. Look at this website http://www.valfrejus.com/-Forfaits-Assurances-.html If bought before Dec14 a full season lift pass for Valfrejus is €223 and for four stations in the valley actually five now they have added Bonneval is €260
I have skied several of these resorts including Valfrejus and they are very pleasant indeed though Valfrejus is purpose built. Self catering accommodation is also usually cheap.

The only concern is that not all of the resorts have non ESF ski schools though Valcenis does, I am not sure about the others. One thing I would point out though is that a twenty year old experience of ESF lessons particularly if group lessons are probably not representative of what you can expect now. For privates the individual instructor is far more important than the ski school they come from and there are many good ESF instructors, my own poorer experiences have been with overlarge groups rather than particularly poor instructors though they doubtlessly exist.

You know it makes sense.

anyone wanting private lessons with ESF can very often get some personal recommendations here.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

T bar - yes, we've done well on the last minute tour op side previously, but it's a pain to get to Gatwick, not to mention the parking costs.

Not looking to share with anyone else. Partly because we don't have skiing friends, plus I'm not that good at being in close company for too long!

Will definitely look at Maurienne, can't believe that price.

I've found the bus timetable & fares this afternoon here http://www.alpski-bus.com/fr/reservation/page.aspx?cp=EN&rp=13 , which other people may also find useful. And page 2 is great for those of us whose geography of the Alps isn't too good.....

A snowHead

sj1608, from where I live I can easily travel by train, west to Southampton Airport or north-east to Gatwick - so presumably Southampton to Gatwick would be OK too. Gatwick does give you far more options and although I like travelling from Southampton I find that Flybe is often a lot more expensive than easyJet. For a trip of a few weeks airport parking would certainly strain the budget.

A snowHead

Have you spoken to alpine addict? His second appt should be done by then and iirc he has either a small garage or 2 caves and a good location..

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

We get the option of Easyjet from Bournemouth, too. Not that keen on training it to Gatwick, as the logical route from us is via London.

dennisp - no, not at the stage of targeting specific accom yet, although I've been following his renovations.

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sj1608, One area in the Maurienne that hasn't been mentioned is Les Sybelles.

Maybe also think about the Vercors or Chamrousse if you can get cheap flights to Grenoble.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I think that after much debate we've now settled on Grand Massif......although we nearly got derailed by the Vail Epic pass with the idea of skiing in The States, plus 5 days in each of Verbier, Arlberg and 3 valleys all for $709.

We've worked out that if we ski for 13 days at Christmas, which we hope to, the season pass will already have saved us money.

So now the search is on for accommodation. Current thought is to drive for the first trip and self-cater for a week from 14th Dec in Flaine (the rest of the area is not open) and then move to catered accom for the Christmas week, in either Les Carroz or Samoens. Can anyone recommend a mid-range catered chalet at all? We'd opt for La Vieille Ferme in Samoens, as we have visited it in the past, but it is full for Christmas. Sad

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sj1608, thank you for starting this thread - I do hope you have a fabulous season! And now I know that a season GM lift pass is so "low" (€465) I have all sorts of ideas brewing for my family trips for 2014/15, assuming similar offers run season to season....I think my husband is afraid.....

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avoriaz season pass is cheap, morzine accomodation is cheap and you can get cheap transfers and flights in/out of geneva.....That would be my choice if i were in your situation Smile

After all it is free

sj1608, Gatwick Turin with BA is the best option for Serre Chevalier (for future reference). wink

sj1608, Theres always Bassett and Christchurch wink

Although Christchurch tends to become expensive with such a good ski shop food and drinks avalable Very Happy

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sj1608, try http://www.360sunandski.com/en/ or http://www.lescarrozchalets.com or http://www.lescarrozski.com/ - all pretty reasonable and run by nice people... I think the Grand Massif is a top choice by the way. I've done 2 seasons there and absolutely loved the ski area. Still go back whenever I can. Smile

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Lots of skiing……without breaking the bank. How to do it?

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