 Poster: A snowHead
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Just doing a bit of research for objectives for next year. Looking to do the Le vrai Mont Blanc and descend via the nrth face and Grands Mulets route in April/May as seen in this post on piste hors:
http://pistehors.com/news/forums/viewthread/585/#2002
Can't seem to login to the site anymore and my registration also seems to have lapsed?? Therefore can't PM the OP. Is KenR a snowhead as well??
Looking at a similar route and time but without the stay in GM hut on decent. 2200hrs from the church, summit 1100hrs and hope to be passed the objective hazards as early as poss - Cham centre 1500hrs.
I've also seen the youtube vid of Greg Hill doing it in 2009 (I'm not prepared to skin the GM route as he did, due to the serac hazard). A somewhat understated video for the achievement but I suppose thats what you get form a guy who cracked 2 million feet the following year!! 
I will be in Chamonix all winter and will recce the overnight approach in daylight a few times before April. I will also have a few months of touring in my legs and also a spells at +4000m from the Cosmiques hut etc. I'm looking for a guide that would be happy to do it classic in a day. I have one possible but he's still TBC.
I've read a few TRs on here and they have been really helpful but was hoping for some more specifics re. this itinerary.
Has anybody done a similar ascent, or any snowhead with any experience that they would like to share, I'd be very grateful.
Thanks in advance.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 18-09-13 7:07; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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pm Idris for lowdown on that sort of stuff.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Get this book.
http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/cord-mont-blanc-5-routes-p108334
Doing Mt Blanc in a day from Chamonix town centre would be a big ask.
Seeing as you as asking for a guide then I suspect you have no idea just how hard it would / could be.
Any reason you don't want to stay in the Grand Mulets hut before the second day ?
IMHO do it the "easy" way first - then maybe think about making it harder next time around.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Haggis_Trap, No, I have every idea how hard it would be and I have an understanding how hard it 'could be'. Thanks for the book recommendation. I'll be doing with a mate, the guide is a good friend of his and we plan to do quite a lot together over the winter. I totally understand it's a very long day in the mountains and I have the whole winter to acclimatise. How you react to altitude can be predisposed or just as easily be affected by certain set circumstances. A person can have a good day at altitude and then it can go to rat shi8t next. There is still a lot to be done to discover why certain people excel in a low partial pressure of oxygen environment, and why some become very ill in that same environment.
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Any reason you don't want to stay in the Grand Mulets hut before the second day ?
IMHO do it the "easy" way first - then maybe think about making it harder next time around.
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The challenge.
I may well do the route over a few days before but the objective would be to do as per the route that KenR took in the Piste Hors post.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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eddiethebus, Thanks for that. I'll have a look if my mate pulls out.
I'm by no means a kilian. Looking at 16/17 hours not just under 5. 
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Buddy1664, Sounds, er, fun! 
In terms of guides, probably worth looking up Rick Marchant. He's a good guy, based in Chamonix and seems to have developed a love for rando-racing and similar nonsense recently, so something like this might be up his street. I'd imagine any guide would want to do a few days with you beforehand to get a feel for your fitness/abilities before launching into a trip like this.
Good luck, take lots of photos and post em when you have done it!
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Arno, No worries will do. Thanks for the recommendation.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Haggis_Trap, not really "struggling" to find one. Mate's friend is first choice.
I will more than likely attempt a multi-day using that route during April. This will form my last recce before the 'oner' in May.
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Just so you can say you walked the first section on a path, rather than get a cable car to the Aiguille du Midi middle station?
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It must just me then that thinks that a climb without using mechanical uplift is special. It has nothing to do with "just so I can say..". The objective is to challenge one's self whilst still achieving the aim. People have done this before and they weren't all super pro rando racers. Therefore I don't think it's an impossible task. I guess this is all fuel for the fire! 
I've been waiting for this chance to do MB for many years and also waited many years to be able to fully commit to a season. I've been in some sh*tty places and situations in the last decade and this is the reward to myself.
Ill be sure to send a TR whatever happens.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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^ In which case go for it 
Mt Blanc is a great ski tour.
The simple point I am making is that you will need to be super fit & moving fast if starting from town centre and doing whole Grand Mulets route in a day.
(and being honest most people operating at that level wouldn't be requiring a guide).
It is good to have a dream and challenge yourself
Look forward to the TR!
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 17-09-13 11:23; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Buddy1664, have you thought about doing it by a different route? If you aren't tied to the lift maybe coming up the Italian side via the Gonella Hut may be a possibility? That said, you don't hear about too many people going that way - not sure if it because the route hasn't been in condition or because everyone take the easy option and rides the lift
Anyway, I reckon getting up to the summit from Chamonix without using the lifts is a worthy achievement if you can do it safely.
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Arno, I think safely is they key. Plenty of ways to die but also plenty of time to do it. I'm not scared to withdraw, reorganise and have another go.
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The simple point I am making is that you will need to be super fit & moving fast if starting from town centre and doing whole Grand Mulets route in a day.
(and being honest most people operating at that level wouldn't be requiring a guide).
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OK, i'll be happy to back myself and say that I'll be fit and moving fast but it would be nice to have someone on the team that has multiple summits, doesn't have to be a guide.
It's still very early days. People are saying do it for charity, combat stress etc. I have my own views about that though.
As I'm sure you know there are a fair few Brits out there just cracking things, really really long hard extreme days in the mountains with very little hype. They just keep themselves to themselves and do these things under the radar. There is a certain attraction in doing that way. I know this post contradicts that somewhat! 
Thanks to all for the advice and I look forward to updating you around May time.
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You know it makes sense.
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^Staying in a hut makes the timing for each section of the route much easier & also safer.
Though you could get to Grand Mulets hut without using the lifts.
FWIW : KenR seems to have stayed in the Grands Mulets on the way down ?
From original TR...
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| Down lower, I felt I was too tired (and still nauseous) to cross La Jonction and ski bad snow back down to Gare Para—also avy danger in afternoon off Aiguille du Midi. So I stayed the night in the Refuge des Grands Mulets—not crowded, friendly guardian (reached by short very exposed climb on rocks with chains and metal bars). |
Enjoy.
It took me 2 attempts to summit Mt Blanc (2008 &2009)
First year was too windy, though it helped knowing what to expect for the 2nd attempt.
http://www.haggistrap.co.uk/photostrs/montblanc.shtml
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Sure, but I think I can get past the junction a little earlier. I've been in correspondence with Ken on this and he was not really that well acclimatised during that trip. He did had not spent the winter out there. Hey if thats the way it plays out I will get myself into the hut for the night. No shame in that but just not the initial plan.
There are escape routes/contingencies in this plan.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Pedant alert!
Cosmiques hut is only at 3600 and a smidgen rather than 4000+
end pedant alert.
I would second the suggestion of Rick Marchant if your original guide choice doesn't work out.
Fit as a fit thing, and very much a winter 'lycra and carbon' man these days (in a nice way...).
And a super-nice guy as well...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Cheers mate, what I meant to say was days at +4000 from the C hut.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Buddy1664,
PS - can also recommend Jonny Morgan or Jon Bracey if you are looking for IFMGA guides who like a bit of suffering...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Some interesting comments here. I am a Mountain Guide based in Chamonix, and I would not be interested in this particular job. This is extreme performance stuff. I consider myself pretty fit, and I regularly put in big days in the hills. However, 3800m of ascent from Chamonix, before a ski descent, is no slouch of a day out. If I'm on the hill, I always need a bit in reserve to be able to look after my client properly. Specialised guiding demands specialised guides - ie for this job, ones who actually do a lot of ski rando racing. If someone approached me I would push them towards Jon Bracey or Jonny Morgan. They would want to do several training trips with you first to get a handle on your strengths and weaknesses, and to check out your kit. If you're not skiing on carbon skis and carbon boots you might as well forget it.
Anyway, good luck with your trip - I hope it goes well for you.
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Skinning from the tunnel entrance past the old lift station Thought I'd post an update and a short TR on phase 1. Should have posted this a few weeks ago but I've been out touring quite a lot so never really found the time.
Phase 1. Recce - Two day Mont Blanc from the MB tunnel entrance. Phil Ashby and I choose nice stable two week high pressure in March. Winds were a little high for a few days on top but they soon died down and a two day window of opportunity presented itself for the 12th/13th Mar.
Parked up at the tunnel wednesday morning around half 8. Conservative skin up to grand mulets hut. In the hut by half one. Stayed in the winter room that night. Lots of fluids, food and banter.
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Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Fri 18-04-14 9:54; edited 1 time in total
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Few ski tracks down the GM route Really nice having the hut/mountain to ourselves. Early night and then up ready to go for 4am. We choose the Grand Mulets direct route rather than the Dome du Gouter route. We agreed to move as fast as possible whilst in the danger area and we thought we could be at the Abri Vallot emergency refuge in 3-4 hours.
It's an amazing but extremely threatening place to be. I was all too conscious of the objective dangers that towered above us but we were efficient and dealt with a few equipment issues very quickly. We were moving well.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Amazing ice formations on the way up to the Hut Not many pics taken in the dark going from the Hut to Vallot Bivi so here's one from the previous day.
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Summit photo We got to the Vallot Bivi and after a fairly windy/cold transition to crampons we started the ridge boot to the summit along the Bosses Ridge. I had felt very strong up until 4600m and then the dull headache started. I felt a bit punch drunk but not too bad. There is no point stopping for any length of time to catch your breath because you won't . Just keeping ticking on, breath with control and look forward to the ski down.
We summited just under 6 hours from the Hut. Time to move off the summit, out of the wind a little and put on skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Phil getting his skis ready for the descent We put our skis on and started our descent down the north face. Not seen strugi (spelling??) like it, 2 feet high in places. Lots of rippled ice on the main face, a bit chattery but not too bad to ski. Further down this turned into very heavy wind crust. After a few caught edges because of tired legs we resorted to combat skiing. We pin balled down the next 1000 metres to the hut.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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negotiating the Grand Mulets descent Further you descend the more energy that you feel you have. We found a few stashes of powder that had not been trashed by the wind and they were a lot of fun to ski.
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A pretty threatening place to be! The sun started to soften the snow past the junction and on the Para face down to the old lift station. I think I bonked about then but soon got back on it after a few gels and enjoyed the ski. After the recent mild weather the descent path to the tunnel was unskiable, so we opted to walk the last few hundred vert back to the car. Beer in Elevation by half two admiring the view!!!
All in all a great few days in the mountains and a very good build up to the oner in May. Lots of training still to do but after two weeks of fairly continuous touring I'm feeling strong.
Avalanche Academy, Unfortunately i can't afford any carbon skis/boots so I'll have to do it on my wood/plastic set up!
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You know it makes sense.
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Magic! Good work
Your "training runs" are an achievement in their own right
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Buddy1664 wrote: |
| All in all a great few days in the mountains and a very good build up to the oner in May. |
Respect. 
Total elevation for "the oner" will be around 3800m won't it? What time do you plan to set off to do it in a day? and how long do you expect it will take (10-11 hours)?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Haggis_Trap, Cheers. You were absolutely right of course, it would have been really silly to try and crack it in one go on the first attempt. Its an amazing place to be. I'm not the most proficient technical climber and my skiing isn't really up to doing some of the more extreme descents around here. So i have to pick/engineer things like this. I suppose it not really the mountain thats the objective but more the chance to push myself in this environment.
Its an amazing town to spend time in. Im always humbled when I meet the various men and women that are really pushing the envelope. Best all its good to see that most don't take themselves too seriously. After all they're not brain surgeons or pioneering a cure for cancer. It was a good choice for a season.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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DB, Cheers - more like 12-14 hours! leaving Chamonix 2200-2359 the night before. I don't want to summit too late due to the danger of rock fall under the Midi come the afternoon. It will be trainers (should be able to move quite quickly) until the old lift station and then skis thereafter.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Buddy1664,
Thanks - I was wondering how you would fit everything in without being on the mountain too late in the day. Are you planning to change your sleeping cycle the days before so you get used to waking up at circa 10pm? What sort of backpack weight will you have? How much food & water are you planning to take?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
Are you planning to change your sleeping cycle the days before so you get used to waking up at circa 10pm?
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DB, Well I could go on the wee wee until 3am the few nights before. No not really, just get on with it I reckon. 2-4am will feel pretty miserable whatever.
Skimo backpack with the essentials plus food and water. I'm 95kg, I don't really worry about kilo here and there on my back. Looking at carrying 3lts of water and gels/bars. Should get to the hut at first light and then it'll be 2lts of march tea for the next leg to the summit. I'll be super hydrated before I start.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Well done mate.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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CH2O, Cheers, thanks for sorting out my bindings the day before!!! Enjoy the fishing mate.
I can highly recommend Sole Boot Lab in Chamonix. They'll square you away with great boots without the bull that other fitters seem to attach to the experience.
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Buddy1664, way to go dude! Can't wait for the 'final' TR where no doubt you will give a big V to some who have posted here. Ps second the sole boot lab, these boys rock.
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Buddy1664, PP, Thankyou guys, very proud of the boys this winter, they've done a fantastic job, thanks for your support; 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Buddy1664, Big ups to you too mate, first season, major feat! Dare say some of your experience helped!
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Buddy1664, Good work!!
What skis/boots are you using?
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FAQ
