Helmets

A snowHead

I expect this has been discussed to death before, but I never really bothered reading it. So here are some observations from me.

Last week, at St Anton, our group experienced 2 serious collisions. Both were due to being hit by idiots skiing (well, one on skis one on a board) at ridiculously high speed and out of control. One of these collisions was with such force that it ripped the binding from the ski and broke the ski (a 2 year old X Scream) at that point. Both times very serious injury could have been caused, but thankfully wasnt. Now heres the rub

Both of these collisions were caused and made by ladies' front bottoms wearing helmets. Both these imbeciles then got up and raced off without so much as an apology (and in the case of the collision with Doc, offering to pay for his broken kit, despite our best efforts to apprehend the yob)

It is my firm opinion, from these incidents and others seen, that the general people wearing helmets are reckless idiots who are wearing the helmet to protect themself, because thay know they are going to ski out of control and cause accidents.

And do the helmets actually protect in these situations ? I know that it has been proven that American Football (sic) players are caused more injuries from the wearing of all that "protective" stuff than they would get if they didnt have it, like in rugby. And equally, cycle helmets are only effective at speeds of less than 15mph (who goes that slow?)

Just wondering on other snowHeads thoughts, or conclusions from that other ex discussion forum. But are we breeding a new dangerous form of snowslope animal ?

A snowHead

The only conclusion I can draw is that you have made a hideous generalization.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

You have a point, I've been considering getting a helmet for a couple of years but have been dissuaded by the thoughts of a friend of mine: he bought himself a helmet and suddenly became invincible, going from an average 3-week snowboarder who couldn't take his eyes off his board to a maniac who thought nothing of dropping off conrnices and the like. However, I have other friends with helmets who have caused no problems and *touches wood* in fact haven;t had any major pronlems with any other snow users, helmetted or otherwise

It's definitely not the case on bikes though, I wear helmet and elbow guards when on my mountain bike and rarelyy come off: when I do it;s usually due to going to slow down technical bits and getting a wheel stuck

I've heard the suggestion that car safty would improve immensely if we removed driver's side airbags and replaced them with a dirty great spike pointing at the drivers face. Rather more of an incentive to drive safely, wouldn;t you say?

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Hmm, I can see you've considerred the matter in depth Gerry Wink

Just for the record, do U were a helmet?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I think the point you're making is that when wearing a helmet you feel less vunerable thus are willing to take more risks.
This does nothing to protect other skiers/boarder.
I once heard a guy doing research into car accidents say that if you fixed a six inch knife onto the steering wheel pointed at the driver he would drive a little more carefully, same principle.
Still thinking about wearing a helmet though.

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In last Sunday's Times or Telegraph, there was an argument For and Against helmets.

In January at Zermatt I had a bad fall on ice which resulted in my skis smacking me hard on the back of my head, which frightened me. 2 days later an errant skier collided with me (they admitted fault) and smacked me on the head again (same side). I am now thinking about a helmet as I've decided you can mend arms and legs, but you only have one head.

The argument in the paper against helmets was that it could make skiers reckless thinking they are invicible because of their helmet. Certainly in Zermatt, I have to say there were some pretty nutty skiers without a slightest consideration for anyone else around them (with and without helmets). I am only an intermmediate, nothing fast or fancy and don't expect a helmet will turn me into a mad, bad and dangerous skier. However, it would give me reassurance (if only to protect me from myself!).

I do think resorts should publish more (perhaps on piste maps) on piste etiquette. One instructor I had in the past drummed it into us and it's stayed with me ever since. A little more consideration for fellow skiers could save quite a few accidents.

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Yep, I wear one. Can you find me a helmet wearer who thinks their lid will prevent broken limbs, twisted knee joints, shattered spines, broken collar bones or shoulder dislocations?

You could, however, probably find a wearer who suffers from 'all the gear, no idea syndrome'. Maybe that's the problem?

After all it is free

Martin I presume you are fishing for angry responses?
Even so here is one (the edited polite version) from a helmet wearer....
Does your incredibly well thought through and highly intellectual theory also apply to cyclists, motorcyclists, climbers, builders, soldiers, etc, etc....?
If you've got anything worth protecting in your head you wouldn't think twice about wearing a helmet - moving quickly over hard ground with solid obstacles - where's the arguement? Of course if it's more important to be topping up your tan in your all-in-one with headband and sunnies (even in a blizzard!) then of course you wont be wearing a helmet (even if you do actually venture from the restaurant to the slopes)!
There are plenty of nutty inconsiderate skiers and boarders around and as the majority of people (in europe at least) don't wear helmets yet, then I think you'll find the wearing a helmet or not makes no difference.
I certainly don't think of myself as a human battering ram every time I strap my helmet on!!
Mad

I'm generally against compulsion to wear helmets, particularly for cycling.

A thought is what happened in Australia when cycle helmets were made compulsory. The number of head injuries to cyclists went down and the politicians claimed justification. Then some research was done and it showed that the number of people cycling had gone down even more. (Lets face it, having to wear a helmet is a pain in the back bottom and it's one more thing that can get stolen, else you have to carry it around with you while you're shopping.) Ergo, the rate of head injuries went up and those who stopped cycling are probably less fit and will on average die earlier.

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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

Surely it's what's on the inside of the head rather than on the outside that causes these "idiots" to act so carelessly on the mountain?

I bought a helmet when i was in Colorado in January mainly because i knew i was going to be skiing blacks and double blacks that had a lot of exposed rocks. I was surprised however at the amount of beginners and intermediates wearing lids...

It seems to me as if North America has a much better/up-to-date attitude to on-mountain saftey and as well as advocating the use of helmets, they also impose "go slow" zones and "no fly" zones. One of the weeks i was there was "on-mountain safety week" where resort staff were handing out pamphlets detailing skiing/snowboarding etiquette.

snow reports

I'd love to see more of the 'no fly' and 'go slow' zones in Europe. Saw a particularly nasty crash (boarder and skier - no helmets - but point applies anyway) - both at fault - going at fast speed at the bottom of the hill - where all the slopes converge to get to the chairlift. Both were far too fast - zooming in and out of the beginners and bumps. Result - bloodwagon for one of them - stupid - a completely avoidable accident

You know it makes sense.

i was at a dry ski slope on monday with one of my friends who is just learning to ski, there was a horrendous crash and neither skiers were wearing a helmet, one of them was still unconciuos when i left 15 minutes later.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I wear a helmet.
It is comfortable, and I have more control over my head temperature than with a hat. (Giro 9.9 has a variety of vents in it).
When skiing around trees, it is useful, as it stops me getting thumped on the head by branches. It's also helped protect me from flying skis and ski poles. I don't feel invincible in it. But then again, when I get in my car and wear a seatbelt, it doesn't make me a more dangerous driver.

A snowHead

I just came back from my first trip using a helmet.

It didn't make me feel invincible, in fact I forgot it was on most of the time.
The only time I noticed it was at the bottom of the runs where I got warm (it was 10-15 deg C last week).

I too have the Giro 9.9 - excellent piece of equipment.

A snowHead

Stephen,
When it gets that warm, try removing the ear pieces, and the bit at the back.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I removed the vents and the ear pieces - that helped.

It was unseasonably hot last week though.

I was grateful for vents on my jacket and pants.

My mates had Red Skycaps - they don't have the option of removable ear-pieces.

I thoroughly recommend the 9.9

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You don't necessarily need a helmet. Avoid trees. The majority of fatal head injuries in the US, at least, are caused by people skiing too close to trees with insufficient technical skills. I've posted a number of news stories about these deaths in the last few months. There were the famous cases of Sonny Bono and Michael Kennedy who both died this way. Another danger of trees is 'tree wells', where the snow forms a void near the base of the tree. The skier or boarder goes in the well, often head first, and it's curtains due to suffocation and shock. Easily done. I mean, how do you release your feet from the equipment in that situation?

Here's a story of a very lucky victim of a tree well, who was spotted by a couple of teenagers before he died. It's from today's edition of First Tracks Magazine

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

The story is called "Teens save life of Big Mountain skier"

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I note also, that:

"We regret that due to technical issues, our chat room at First Tracks!! Online has been suspended indefinitely. We invite you to instead interact with your fellow readers in the vibrant community that exists at our Liftlines BBS.

We've enjoyed providing chat services for several years running here at First Tracks!! Online, and we apologize for any inconvenience or disappointment that this situation may cause.

Copyright © 2004 First Tracks!! Online Ski Magazine"

Is there something in the air??? Shocked

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

Yeah, Michelle,
Two things: costs & lawsuits.
(at least in the US)
A certain well-known US mag has a chatroom. It started to get very popular, so they decided to recoup costs & increase profits by putting pop-ups on it.
Then they hired new staff who thought they knew best, and didn't listen to the users. They moderated everything to draconian levels - language, photos, everything was censored.
One day I log in, and discover that all my details are on view with my posts. And I keep getting pop-up ads for Hondas.
In that one day they lost about 2/3 of their members (several thousand people). Another web site welcomed us with open arms (and hidden IP addys)

After all it is free

Oooer....

On the subject of costs, I wonder whether we can apply for lottery funding to promote our interest in snow related sports through this site. We may not fit into the normal selection groups though- perhaps a bit too conventional Exclamation

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I choose not to wear a helmet, but I've never allowed my (now 9-year old) son to ski without one. So far, he hasn't questioned my double standards.
When I cycle, however, I ALWAYS wear a helmet. A two-ton car can do a lot more damage than an out-of-control skier.

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

A two-ton car can do a lot more damage, but an out of control skier can do enough for it to be fatal!

snow reports

Children 14 and under (correct me if age is wrong) are not allowed on piste in Italy without helmets this season.

It's an interesting one, that, because Italy's the one place I identify with bikers and scooterers keeping their hair in the wind.

Is the idea that you protect your bambino's head until he/she is old enough to ride a motorbike, or have I got it all wrong?

You know it makes sense.

I was going to make a joke about priests liking them young, but that would be bad taste.

The French law on motorbike helmets used to be (and may still be) that you must have a helmet on you. It does not say it must be warn on your head, so you'd see a lot of guys around Provence carrying their helmets on their arm.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

Having just got back from this years, all too brief, trip to the snow; one thing that struck me on this trip was the number of people now wearing helmets.

Ok the off piste conditions were fantastic, but previously I can only remember seeing them on people race training or sprogs.

I think they look pretty cool and might consider looking at them in the sales. Just as retail therapy you understand.

A snowHead

I always wear my helmet off piste on my mountain bike, but never on the road.
Thats probably bad right?

A snowHead

Well, you're more likely to be hit by an SUV on road than you are off road, particularly on the school run where the drivers may have hands free phones, but they are more distracted by screaming kids in the back. Twisted Evil

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

markP, I wear a helmet on 'n off road on the bikes. Tarmac hurts more than snow.

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Where I do my off rode biking your in mortal danger of quad bike interaction then anything else.
Not to mention tiny little scroats on huge trial bikes...

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

Local council estate? Very Happy

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

No marc. I'm refering to the local off road trials round here.
You can be bombing down a little piece of single track in the woods, only to find a dirty great big trials bike hammering up the hill towards you.
You can't hear them because of the trees. Mad

After all it is free

I was recently skiing in Lake Louise when two middle-aged gentlemen collided and knocked each other unconscious. Both were wearing helmets, one broke his leg and when I left they were still trying to keep the other one alive. I didn't know at the time, and still don't, whether this means that helmets are invaluable or whether they don't really make much odds either way. Confused

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I was considering getting a helmet to protect my head, my job and therefore my livlihood and that of my family. This thread has made me cast my mind back two or so years to when I rode a sports motorbike, I know its shallow but I would ride it maybe faster than I should because riding bikes is macho, it was a sexy thing and I kind of thought that other riders would expect to see me riding it such, using its potential etc. I fear that maybe if I wore a helmet I might ski like someone who wears a helmet should (some kind of olympic ski god or summat), because of some perceived non existant expectation.

I am probably being too honest here but the thought of a serious injury caused by skiing beyond myself or getting clattered by someone else frightens the life out of me.

So anyway hope the ramblings are clear enough, I dont think I'll get one, stay in my 70% zone, and keep an eye behind me.

Help!!

Helmets

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