 Poster: A snowHead
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A fire broke out today in the Frejus tunnel which connects the Maurienne in France with Italy. This tunnel is the main route between Lyon and Turin and stands to play quite an important part in getting people to and from the Winter Olympics in 2006... Two people have been killed and Italian authorities fear that the tunnel structure may have been damaged bringing risk of colapse. The source of the blaze was a lorry loaded with tyres whose engine is thought to have caught fire.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Report from BBC with a short video if you want it.
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| The 13km (eight-mile) tunnel, which carried 2m vehicles every year, has now been closed indefinitely, amid fears that some sections could collapse. |
If it is closed for a long period, what is the alternative when going from Turin to the Southern French Alpes ? Will this impact on the Winter Olympics ?
Does anyone else feel that trucks should be allowed through long tunnels like this only in convoys with at least some fire service in attendance ?? Mixing heavy trucks, some with flamable cargoes, with all other traffic in a totally unregulated fashion seems a recipe for disaster. QED Mont Blanc. Fortunately the death toll this time seems to have been quite low. But .....
| Quote: |
| The death toll may rise as a two-kilometre stretch of the tunnel has not yet been searched. |
from another site.
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 5-06-05 9:57; edited 1 time in total
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Will this affect regular ski resort transfers? I've never used the Frejus Tunnel as I've not skied the Southern French Alpes, but is it used by tour operators on a regular basis?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The ITV news last night (1 min not even metioning which tunnel) said a lorry loaded with tyres started the fire 
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rob@rar.org.uk, yes - is the short answer for those using Turin Airport.
<< EDIT - this is balls - see below for corrections >>
Just checked with the AA online travel planner and Turin to Briancon comes up with a route with no mention of the tunnel but I'm not familiar enough with the routes it proposes to be sure it recognises the closure and that there are alternate routes. Sure there must be - but will they stay open in bad weather ?.
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Sun 5-06-05 13:29; edited 1 time in total
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| kuwait_ian wrote: |
rob@rar.org.uk, yes - is the short answer for those using Turin Airport.
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What resorts could potentially be affected?
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Serre Chevalier, Montgenevre, & Risoul are the obvious ones for Brit T.O.s using Turin. Crystal I think have switched to Chambery for the Southern Alpes even though it is a longer transfer. But I'd guess there are a lot of private cars transporting skiers in both directions.
<< EDIT - this is balls - see below for corrections >>
A thread I read on another site said leaking diesel on the truck with tyres started the blaze but it was fuelled by another truck loaded with glue and resins which produce toxins when burned. Nasty.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Sun 5-06-05 13:31; edited 1 time in total
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kuwait_ian,
If memory serves correctly a combination that would not be allowed in the Dartford tunnel!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| kuwait_ian wrote: |
| Serre Chevalier, Montgenevre, & Risoul are the obvious ones for Brit T.O.s using Turin. |
Could they be switched to Grenoble, or would Lyon be closer? I skied in Risoul a long time ago and think I think we flew to Lyon, but it was a long, long transfer.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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One report suggests the Winter Olympics will be affected any opinions on this?
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| boredsurfin wrote: |
kuwait_ian,
If memory serves correctly a combination that would not be allowed in the Dartford tunnel! |
But who checks ?? Since this is the second serious fire in the Alpine Tunnels, and will again cause major traffic disruption, I really think the powers that be need to look at regulating the permitted cargoes more strictly. It's all very well having good detection, fire fighting, CCTV, emergency lighting, ventilation controls and pressurised safety escape tunnels but if someone takes 40 tons of what is virtually high explosive into a confined space it will always be dangerous. Diesel and Fertiliser make a very good home-made explosive. A similar thing also happened in the Channel Tunnel. And let's not mention the possibility of a terrorist attack........
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You know it makes sense.
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| rob@rar.org.uk wrote: |
| Will this affect regular ski resort transfers? |
In short, no. It connects the Maurienne with Italy. It serves the Lyon -> Turin axis and is not use by TOs as the Maurienne is only lightly served by TOs who would land at French airports.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| kuwait_ian wrote: |
But who checks ?? Since this is the second serious fire in the Alpine Tunnels, |
Third serious fire at the very least. The Gotthard fire in Switzerland (2001?) killed 11.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Most of the Southern French alps you would go over col Montgenevre to get from Turin. Going through Frejus tunnel would be a very long way round. Iwould of thought it is only Maurienne valley resorts that would be much affected.
Davidof beat me to it: redundant post
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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rob@rar.org.uk,kuwait_ian, if you're using the Frejus tunnel to get to Serre Che, Montgenvre etc you're def going the wrong way, ask MArk Hunter who had a nice return trip through it last Winter. It may affect some independent minded travellers who take advantage of a cheap flight to Turin to head for the Tarentaise though.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Helen Beaumont & davidof, I stand corrected. I knew I'd seen the Frejus on coach transfers to Serre Che from Turin and I knew we'd gone through tunnels - but obviously it was not the Frejus we used. Sorry for any confusion. It was a few years ago........
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kuwait_ian, Helen Beaumont, davidof, I have been through the Frejus tunnel on a tour operators bus twice (some years ago though). The T.O was serving Bardonnechia, Montgenevre, Sauze D'Oulx.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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snowbunny, sounds a strange way to go, but maybe the Col du Lauteret was closed due to bas weather or avalnche or something, but if you were also calling at Bardonnechia I suppose thats not so bad. I forget they drop off at other resorts too,
Type23, if you use Michelin for route planning, it shows you which roads are closed due to snow, and which ones you need chains for. The route to Briancon from Turin will initially head for Frejus, but the road divides and for Serre Che you take the sign for Oulx, then climb up to Claviere, Montgenvre then descend into Briancon.
There are plans for a rail route for lorries , the sooner it opens the better (2010?)
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Helen Beaumont, yes that's the standard TO route from Turin to Serre Che. You see signs for the Frejus but you don't use it. Have you tried skiing from Montgenevre to Clavier - there's a bit of a trudge on the top where you cross the border. But it's worth doing for a pasta lunch in Claviere. Taxi or Bus back up to Montgenevre. Makes a change from all the pistes you know and love in Serre Che.
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| Helen Beaumont wrote: |
| snowbunny, sounds a strange way to go |
It is, the normal thing for TOs to do is land at Turin for the resorts on the Italian border. Given the cost base of package deals TOs are loathe to pay Tunnel fees.
| Helen Beaumont wrote: |
There are plans for a rail route for lorries , the sooner it opens the better (2010?) |
Ferroutage - the service using the Modalohr system between Bourgneuf in France and Orbassano in Italy has been open since 2003. Hopefully the Frejus fire - which has severely damaged the tunnel, will encourage its use. There is not much political will in France for moving freight by rail.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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We used the Frejus with Crystal last year....Chambery to Sauze d'Oulx....I don't think it's a regular route though. I've seen many a banner in the villages along the Maurienne Valley calling for all freight to be routed through a tunnel....this isn't going to help their cause much.
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kuwait_ian, we've skied there too and have made friends with a nice football-loving restaurateur in Claviere (despite Newcastle having knocked AC milan out of the UEFA cup the week before). Also tried Sestriere, but not Suzie-does-it.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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From transport news network ...
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The eight mile Alpine tunnel that links France and Italy will closed for at least a year following a fire at the weekend.
Two drivers were killed on Saturday as fire swept though the Frejus Tunnel, with temperatures high enough to melt some of the road's tarmac.
The Frejus tunnel is a major thoroughfare linking the French city of Lyon with Turin in Italy and carries four-fifths of commercial roadway traffic between the countries. Most of the truck traffic - about 3,800 a day on average will probably be rerouted through the Mont Blanc tunnel, requiring a 124-mile detour.
The fire appears to have started on a lorry carrying tyres which was about 3 miles inside the tunnel entrance and quickly spread to another carrying glue.
A total of six vehicles were burned, said Lieutenant Colonel Michel Decker of the Savoie region fire brigade, including two fire appliances.
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Nearly 4000 X 124 miles per day for at least a year is going to cause massive additional costs and pollution.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Pretty nasty combination Glue and Tyres, lots of heat plus thick toxic smoke 
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D G O, I'm relieved to see you weren't there and didn't do it
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| kuwait_ian wrote: |
From transport news network ...
Nearly 4000 X 124 miles per day for at least a year is going to cause massive additional costs and pollution. |
Pollution levels in the Chamonix valley already were exceeding European directive levels before the fire:
Chamonix Chokes on Air Pollution
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Helen Beaumont wrote: |
| rob@rar.org.uk,kuwait_ian, if you're using the Frejus tunnel to get to Serre Che, Montgenvre etc you're def going the wrong way, ask MArk Hunter who had a nice return trip through it last Winter. It may affect some independent minded travellers who take advantage of a cheap flight to Turin to head for the Tarentaise though. |
Thanks for the reminder Helen  As has been mentioned, you really do NOT want the Frejus Tunnel for the Southern French Alps! If you do make that mistake, be prepared to hand over plenty of the folding!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Mark Hunter, not that I want to rub salt into old wounds. Off to Briancon on Friday, I'll make sure we don't go the wrong way!!!!"At leats we won't be able to get through the tunnel!!!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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forensic work has finished and the clean-up has begun in the Frejus. Reopeing is very tentatively set for September, 2005. It will be a nice cool spot to work in August anyway.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Traffic across the Col du Lauteret and Montgenevre is quite heavy, made worse by road improvements for Turin Winter Olympics, and tarting up the place for the visit of the Tour de France to Briancon on the 14th and 15th of June. I have had the pleasure of visiting both Whistler and Turin this year, both hosting Winter Olympics, I'd say Whistler is more prepared for 2010 than Turin is for 2006!!! The road improvements and building still going on around Sestriere/Sauze d'OUlx is worrying.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Good news - the tunnel will probably reopen before end August
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A joint communiqué from the French and Italian Transports Ministries was released on Thursday, June 30th, confirming that the Tunnel security committee, following a day-long meeting in Bardonecchia (Italy), had approved the work programme required in order to reopen “before the end of August”.
However an intergovernmental Franco-Italian commission is to convene during July, date to be confirmed, with a view to establishing additional operational protocols "destined to guarantee extremely high security levels" with immediate effect from the Tunnel’s reopening.
Ministers Dominique Perben and Pietro Lunardi will then decide, "by the end of July", the exact reopening date of the Tunnel, which is the main road link in the Northern Alps between France and Italy.
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Can anybody confirm that this is now actually open? About to book flights to Turin to go to Val Cenis end of Jan next year. All I can find is a lot of reports indicating the tunnel was due to reopen / partially reopen in August etc.
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> All I can find is a lot of reports indicating the tunnel was due to reopen / partially reopen in August etc.
We are now November so....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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agavin,
Last time I looked at the web site it said it was open.
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Agavin,
I have also travelled your intended route to Val Cenis and was pretty OK but if you can get a cheap flight to Grenoble aka Ryan air etc etc then you should find it easier. If I read the Frejus website correctly then their tariffs are increasing in Jan 05. I went just before last December and the return ticket (get one alot cheaper than x2 singles if you do use tunnel) was just under 40 euros !
Rgds
Rich
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FAQ
) this is the Haute Mauriene Valley with Val Cenis,Valloire,Aussois, Saint-Jean d’Arves a few of the resorts
