 Poster: A snowHead
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Going to Mayrhofen for the week over New Year....
This will be my wife's first skiing holiday..... and depending on how it goes, may be the first of many or the last! Bearing this in mind I do not want to break the bank on purchasing helmet and goggles if only for this holiday.... but I also know the importance of quality / fit etc
So first... Helmets.
Would people recommend buying your own instead of renting in resort? If so, anything in particular we are looking for? We have looked in Snow & Rock and also popped into Decatholon today after reading somewhere about their equipment. Decatholon helmets more in the price range of what I was thinking. Are they good quality?
Next... Goggles.
What should we be looking for in goggles? I would be hoping that we would only be wearing goggles during bad light / weather and sunglasses if / when it is clear blue skies.
Any help greatly appreciated.
Thank you
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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This is a bit like saying, "I'd like a car, what car should I buy?"
General rules do apply however:
All helmets sold within the EU should meet necessary safety standards for snowsports. You take your chances on auction sites and at the market but a big shop should be fine. You pay more for a name, comfort and design.
Same for the UV etc aspect of Goggles, all should meet EU standards. The lenses are rated from 0 to 4, a level 4 letting the least light through and 0 being completely clear. Seems you want to buy a category 1 or 2, which will normally have a yellow/orange or pink tint.
It is worth trying both items on before buying as comfort and sizing varies wildly, as with any clothing item.
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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theone, I wouldn't rent a helmet or goggles. They are the kind of thing that someone else might have sweated all over for a whole week, and they don't get washed or significantly cleaned. The kind of manky nastiness in other people's sweat is probably reason enough for me to (at the very least) buy a Sportsdirect special helmet and goggles for £20 each. You can probably try them on in larger stores, and all helmets and goggles should meet the set standards in the EU.
I wouldn't, if this is her first trip, spend a load of money in Snow and Rock. You might find she just doesn't get on with it, and you'd have just lost a huge amount of money on premium brand stuff that might never get used again.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Thank you. Why is this if you don't mind me asking?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Mistress Panda wrote: |
theone, I wouldn't rent a helmet or goggles. They are the kind of thing that someone else might have sweated all over for a whole week, and they don't get washed or significantly cleaned. The kind of manky nastiness in other people's sweat is probably reason enough for me to (at the very least) buy a Sportsdirect special helmet and goggles for £20 each. You can probably try them on in larger stores, and all helmets and goggles should meet the set standards in the EU.
I wouldn't, if this is her first trip, spend a load of money in Snow and Rock. You might find she just doesn't get on with it, and you'd have just lost a huge amount of money on premium brand stuff that might never get used again. |
Thank you. Are the sports direct helmet / goggles ok?
As you say, they should meet all the standards... main thing is just fit / comfort?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I got my helmet from Decathlon and it has been fine, has taken a couple of fairly hefty knocks including a ski edge during a rather specacular crash! looks ugly but has served well!
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Seems you want to buy a category 1 or 2, which will normally have a yellow/orange or pink tint.
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+1
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| theone wrote: |
| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Thank you. Why is this if you don't mind me asking? |
It looks awful, but on a more practical front 1) unless wearing a hat or headband under the helmet, it leaves a gap of the forehead exposed to windchill, 2) the arms of the sunglasses are squashed into the helmet and may cause discomfort.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| theone wrote: |
| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Thank you. Why is this if you don't mind me asking? |
It looks awful, but on a more practical front 1) unless wearing a hat or headband under the helmet, it leaves a gap of the forehead exposed to windchill, 2) the arms of the sunglasses are squashed into the helmet and may cause discomfort. |
in addition, the reason a helmet offers safety in the event of a crash is that it spreads what would be a point load across a larger area. By putting anything under the helmet, you've just introduced a couple of nice hard point load areas to get squashed into your head.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| theone wrote: |
| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Thank you. Why is this if you don't mind me asking? |
It looks awful, but on a more practical front 1) unless wearing a hat or headband under the helmet, it leaves a gap of the forehead exposed to windchill, 2) the arms of the sunglasses are squashed into the helmet and may cause discomfort. |
Such people are called Gapers (gay-purs). We're a rapidly growing minority and we're very angry. One day we will rule the piste.
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Thank you all.....
Been to Decatholon and made some purchases.... Happy with the helmets and goggles there... Will just make sure we don't wear our sunglasses with helmet
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skitech, do whatever makes you happy, but if a newcomer asks for advice we should give him good advice, right?
You've bought and wear a helmet to increase your safety in the event of an impact. Sunglasses offer absolutely no safety in an impact, and may in fact cause harm as they shatter or fly around your face. With sunglasses you also have a massive gap exposing your forehead to impact because the helmet is *designed* to be worn with goggles. Goggles protect your face, nose, forehead and of course eyes. Despite what brands try to sell us, they are not for fashion, they are for protection. Freeride skiers, ski racers, snowpark skiers, bobsled racers, whoever you choose, they wear goggles with their helmets.
In my work, which I guess is the same as yours given your username, I'm quite used to seeing clients with black eyes as their sunglasses have done nothing for them in a fall or collision.
If you need glasses you could consider contact lenses, prescription inserts for goggles, and goggles designed to go over the top of your prescription glasses.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| because the helmet is *designed* to be worn with goggles. |
[citation needed]
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You know it makes sense.
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The bigger problem is pulling it off as a look. I bet you could count on one hand the serious injuries over the last decade caused by wearing sunglasses with a helmet. Seems overly cautious but each to their own.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Serriadh, how many do you want?
SMITH
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| Smith helmets are designed to match the curvature of the ski goggle frame, eliminating gaps and allowing precise alignment between the goggle venting system and the helmet’s AirEvac system. Warm air is exhausted out of the top of the goggles and flows through the AirEvac system, which drives the warm air away from the goggles through external vents and internal channels in the EPS liner and out the back of the helmet. |
MARKER
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| Helmet and goggles must fuse together perfectly to work as one optimally functioning unit. To achieve this, MARKER products are 100% harmonized with one another. All helmets and goggles are designed to precisely tune into the shape of the other item and harmonize with its lines. |
RUROC
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| Ruroc believe that the future of snowboard helmets is fully integrated goggles. |
POC
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| POCombo - Helmets and goggles are designed and engineered for optimal synchronization, as one unit. |
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Poster: A snowHead
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| Serriadh, how many do you want? |
Right, so you've listed a bunch of 'for your comfort and convenience' quotes, mixed with a little bit of 'we'd also like you to buy our goggles' marketing.
Not one of those expresses a safety reason. If you can point at a bit of documentation (bonus points if this is a safety standard) then I'll agree with you. Saying "you must wear goggles with a helmet because it is more comfy and less chilly than using glasses" is okay, but then going on to claim that is is a safety requirement is disingenuous. Claiming that sunglasses are a safety risk when worn under a helmet sounds like a claim with pretty sparse evidence too (edit: oops, that wasn't you. but my point still stands  )
That said, goggles do a splendid job of protecting your nose when you face plant, so they do have safety benefits. They're just not required for your helmet to function as a helmet.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Tue 19-11-13 9:27; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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As mentioned above sunglasses can be very painful, nice pic of my lad a few years ago,
he was wearing sunglasses when he fell, since then he has always used goggles!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Well personally I wore a helmet for the first time in April. Never used one previously. It was a Nevica one from sports direct when they had them on an incredibly cheap deal, and I found it very comfortable. I also wore sun glasses most the time - it was April, wind chill was NOT a problem sun glare most definitely was. I then discovered on the one day which it was snowing all day and pretty much a white out, that my googles (blocs that I bought a VERY long time ago), didn't fit over the helmet, they couldn't go long enough on the straps. I need new googles as they have a crack in them so going to try and find googles which will fit over a helmet (suspect most do now, Helmets were very rare when I bought those googles).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Serriadh, yes it's marketing but you questioned one line I wrote and I gave you the relevant response (that you didn't want).
No, it's not part of a safety standard or requirement, but if I had said it was, I'm sure you would have quoted me on that.
If someone is buying a helmet to protect their head - it is therefore illogical that they refuse to wear goggles which also protect their head. It's like buy a pair of wrist guards but only wearing one because you keep a watch on the other arm.
I don't see how or why anyone would want to dispute what is sensible safety advice. The fact you don't look a massive tit is a bonus.
Edited as post to which I'm replying was edited before I hit submit, and some stuff didn't make sense.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Tue 19-11-13 9:56; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I will be completely honest the main reason I wore the helmet was because my children have to wear them in their lessons, and I felt it was a bad example to set if they saw me skiing without one. It wasn't due to any particular concern over a head injury (I was far more concerned over my knee which was still recovering from an injury - not as well as I first hoped it later turned out).
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Well we will probably go with goggles and helmet together. We tried both on in store before purchase, and they both fit quite well with no space between top of goggles and bottom of helmet. They also clip into the helmet.
We got cat 2 goggles. I believe these are good for variable conditions?? Will these be ok for both bad / sunny conditions?
Think we ended up spending approx. GB£ 90 for 2 sets of goggles and helmets. This is more like what we wanted as opposed to spending GB£ 80 on one helmet in snow and rock.
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albinomountainbadger, what complete twaddle. It would be sensible safety advice if there was a significant difference in risk when wearing googles versus sunglasses and so far no ones bothered to establish if that is actually true.
The marketing copy you quote is merely trying to sell the companies googles with their helmets. Plenty of helmet/google combinations leave all sorts of gaps hence the gaper term mentioned above. The main reason people don't want a gap is aesthetic.
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Tue 19-11-13 11:05; edited 1 time in total
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| theone wrote: |
| They also clip into the helmet. |
I like goggles with siliconised straps. Bit late to recommend em now, of course They're doubly useful for me as I bought a nice helmet which turned out to have the worst goddamn goggle clip in the entire world. Thanks, POC.
| theone wrote: |
| We got cat 2 goggles. I believe these are good for variable conditions?? Will these be ok for both bad / sunny conditions? |
When visibility is crap, even specialist crap visibility goggles won't help you a whole lot. At cat 2, you'll probably be fine if it gets super sunny... maybe you'll squint a bit. Pick some shady routes to compensate.
Anyway, good luck with the goggles. I've had a couple of pairs of cheap goggles in the past... one misted up something awful, and the other was much better. I don't know how much commercial anti-fog stuff is, but if it is cheap you might want to grab a little bit just in case it all goes a bit cloudy.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Sandbox helmets. Definitely the most Steezy helmets you can buy.
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| meh wrote: |
The marketing copy you quote is merely trying to sell the companies googles with their helmets. Plenty of helmet/google combinations leave all sorts of gaps hence the gaper term mentioned above. The main reason people don't want a gap is aesthetic. |
Whilst I agree there is a degree of marketing to this, a counter argument to this would be an example of a bloke who was on a course with me last year, who had (I think) a decent Giro helmet and Oakley goggles. His goggles were steaming up so badly he couldn't see and so switched to his sunnies. My Smith helmet and goggles combo had no such trouble.
Now, admittedly no-one else in my group had similar issues that I recall, and he was struggling a bit on the course at times and was a 'big lad' which the combination of the two made him a bit sweatier than most..... 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Whitters, yeah, we need a bit more than some bad correlation based on anecdote.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| theone wrote: |
| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Thank you. Why is this if you don't mind me asking? |
Take no notice. If you want to wear sunnies with the helmet then do so.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
Serriadh, how many do you want?
SMITH
| Quote: |
| Smith helmets are designed to match the curvature of the ski goggle frame, eliminating gaps and allowing precise alignment between the goggle venting system and the helmet’s AirEvac system. Warm air is exhausted out of the top of the goggles and flows through the AirEvac system, which drives the warm air away from the goggles through external vents and internal channels in the EPS liner and out the back of the helmet. |
MARKER
| Quote: |
| Helmet and goggles must fuse together perfectly to work as one optimally functioning unit. To achieve this, MARKER products are 100% harmonized with one another. All helmets and goggles are designed to precisely tune into the shape of the other item and harmonize with its lines. |
RUROC
| Quote: |
| Ruroc believe that the future of snowboard helmets is fully integrated goggles. |
POC
| Quote: |
| POCombo - Helmets and goggles are designed and engineered for optimal synchronization, as one unit. |
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If they all fuse together blah blah blah so well how come Oakley sell so many goggles cos they don't make helmets ??
BTW , the Giro seam can title forward to "meet" the top of a pair of Oakley Jawbone/Racing Jackets sunnies so there is no gap so therefore no "Gaper" - and you can swap out to yellows when you need!!
Yo! Make your own rules Gapers!
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You know it makes sense.
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| mishmash wrote: |
If they all fuse together blah blah blah so well how come Oakley sell so many goggles cos they don't make helmets ??
BTW , the Giro seam can title forward to "meet" the top of a pair of Oakley Jawbone/Racing Jackets sunnies so there is no gap so therefore no "Gaper" - and you can swap out to yellows when you need!!
Yo! Make your own rules Gapers! |
What's this? Is it an Oakley helmet I have in my hand????
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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meh, no difference at all in risk of being in an accident wearing Goggles or sunglasses. Considerable difference in potential injury though.
mishmash, you've got the wrong end of the stick. People generally buy goggles for visibility or fashion, not to protect themselves. By the way yes, Oakley do still make (or at least rebrand) helmets, I sell them.
In all honesty my first post about wearing sunglasses with googles was trolling a bit based on the 'dancing dad at a wedding' image it creates; I expected outcry from the Good Ski Guide subscribers here for criticising their look but never the argument that sunglasses are as safe as goggles.
Here's a test though. It's easy to find marketing material about goggles integrating with helmets, but can anyone find anything from those that make all three ie helmets, goggles and sunglasses saying either, 'our helmets are perfect for sunglasses' or 'sunglasses designed for helmets'? If not, why not, because it's surely in their interest to sell all their products?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| You should never under any circumstances wear a ski helmet with sunglasses. |
Unless it's a fancy dress day, otherwise this is true. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
meh, no difference at all in risk of being in an accident wearing Goggles or sunglasses. Considerable difference in potential injury though.
mishmash, you've got the wrong end of the stick. People generally buy goggles for visibility or fashion, not to protect themselves. By the way yes, Oakley do still make (or at least rebrand) helmets, I sell them.
In all honesty my first post about wearing sunglasses with googles was trolling a bit based on the 'dancing dad at a wedding' image it creates; I expected outcry from the Good Ski Guide subscribers here for criticising their look but never the argument that sunglasses are as safe as goggles.
Here's a test though. It's easy to find marketing material about goggles integrating with helmets, but can anyone find anything from those that make all three ie helmets, goggles and sunglasses saying either, 'our helmets are perfect for sunglasses' or 'sunglasses designed for helmets'? If not, why not, because it's surely in their interest to sell all their products? |
[img]http://uk.oakley.com/a/0f/f2/BAh7CGkKIgwyMDd4MjA3aQtsKwe-fpJQaQhpA8cGAw.jpg?class=fancy[/img]
Boom.
Two Jong Gapers on the Oakley Ski Team :
http://uk.oakley.com/sports/ski/athletes/34
http://uk.oakley.com/sports/ski/athletes/284 - this one is a real dancing dad - I mean Callum Pettit must be waaaay too old to rock that look, right?
Sure I get your point - they aren't wearing sunnies when there inverted in the middle of triple cork whatever but they are more than happy to roll with sunnies and lid when they are at civilian speeds.
You are allowed to make your own rules after all it seems - if these guys can wear Sunnies and helmets, why can't I ?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Let's look at those photos.
Neither are skiing, their helmets aren't done up and they have goggles on the helmet. This says to me the photos were taken during a break from skiing. I often wear sunglasses when I'm not skiing and if I'm off piste or in deep snow I'll often leave my helmet on my head to save it sitting in the snow.
I think you just like an argument
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| feef wrote: |
Let's look at those photos.
Neither are skiing, their helmets aren't done up and they have goggles on the helmet. This says to me the photos were taken during a break from skiing. I often wear sunglasses when I'm not skiing and if I'm off piste or in deep snow I'll often leave my helmet on my head to save it sitting in the snow.
I think you just like an argument |
You are right, I do love an argument!!
But just to be clear - its ok to wear sunnies and a helmet if you have goggles on the top then? but only if you are not actually skiing?
Ok, I being argumentative to make the point - and the point is : if its sunny and you are working hard and your goggles are steaming up and its spring and you are wearing a helmet and the ambient temp is 18c and you want to put your sunnies on as you have another go at carving that red, then help yourself ! To say otherwise is absurd.
I mean the extension to this is you shouldn't ski with Sunglasses full stop and the extension to that is always with body armour etc etc.
There comes a point in recreational sport where the safety kit trade off starts to get detrimental to the enjoyment of what you had set out to do in the first place, and the "Never ever wear Sunglasses and a Helmet when you are skiing" is just plain wrong for most recreational piste skiers.
Plus how are we all going to know who the people who know what they are doing are in the lift line are if everyone is out there looking the part ???
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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theone, Sports Direct No Fear helmets and goggles will be fine - the kids and I have skied in Sports Direct No Fear Helmets for the last 5-6 years. They last well, fit well (thanks to the adjuster on the back), don't fall apart and the ear protectors don't fall off. There were also the only helmet that I could find to be a good fit and I was prepared to spend around £150+ on a helmet if I needed to. You could also try Lidls and Aldis for both helmets and goggles over the next few weeks - their gear will also be quite OK for your needs.
FWIW they are just winding you up re: sunglasses/helmet combo. The so called 'gaper look', but I've skied in this combo on many occasions (it depends on whether you are that concerned about the 'look' of things) and there are days when it is fine - days with precipitation/snow in the air or fog, you will probably find googles are best. FWIW I find you can wear goggs all the time (although sunnies are nice on blue sky days), but you can't really survive with sunnies in all conditions so goggs are your more versatile option.
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Wed 20-11-13 14:15; edited 2 times in total
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Megamum, Thank you. I have purchased both goggles and helmet from Decatholon now. All a good fit so very happy. We will also look in Aldi / Lidl for thermals and accessories.
We will have the sunglasses in the rucksack.... more so for when we have stopped for a drink and relax.
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| albinomountainbadger wrote: |
| meh, no difference at all in risk of being in an accident wearing Goggles or sunglasses. Considerable difference in potential injury though. |
What's the risk of sustaining the potential injury though? Where is your evidence that this risk is significant?
My point is that it's easy to identify lots of 'potential' hazards but without quantifying the actual risk of them happening it makes it impossible to know if you should actually worry about them or not. There doesn't appear to be an epidemic of injuries caused by people wearing sunglasses with helmets so I think your opinions on the matter come across as overwrought and rather scaremongering.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Yeah - y'all just need to get in touch with your inner Gaper like Megamum and release it once in a while. Gaper retention can cause blindness y'know.
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..editing
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FAQ
