Ski Club of GB makes loss of £841,589 in 2018-19

A snowHead

I'm very glad this is all being discussed over here. With anonymity it is easier to talk freely. Like plenty of others I am aghast at what's happening especially the financial black hole that seems to be opening up. Or maybe it isn't that bad in reality but the fact is the CEO and the new accountant don't appear to be able to say. Do they know but chose not to tell the AGM because it would have been more bad news on top of bad news? Or do they really not know? Both are unacceptable positions. The new accountant had two months to get to grips with the numbers but hasn't managed to. I'm certainly not an expert but the accountants in the room last week were incredulous.

People are rightly asking questions about the qualifications of the new CEO to have been Treasurer in the first place and then CEO. His submission to become Treasurer made him sound like a corporate superstar yet when you Google him you find nothing. In contrast if you Google the previous CEO's you find their previous positions and more. It is most mysterious. Why would he give up a presumably lucrative business in consultancy where he claims to have been advising global insurers and retail banks? Was it the lure of the alleged 200,000 package and skiing perks? His pitch for Treasurer is all there in the 2017 annual report. At one point he was engaged in the recruitment of a new CEO and interviewing prospects, then all of a sudden he was named as CEO. What happened? What process did he get put through and by who?

There are other questions like how Fall Line came to become the publisher of the club magazine, who built the website for such an outlandish sum and how transparent was the sale of the building. Like the Prince Andrew situation I think there is more to come out. I and others want to get the bottom of all this and all insight appreciated. Thank you.

Wow my first snowheads post. Never thought I would say that.

A snowHead

@thesnowmad, Welcome to snowHeads

Don't let that be your first and last...

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

From the chairman's report:

"Taking account of our experience without a chief executive from June 2017 on the passing of Frank McCusker, we resolved to have an interim Chief Executive and fortunately Ian Holt offered to step into the role and resigned as Treasurer. During the search Ian expressed his interest in a permanent position and so was then included in the rigorous selection process along with candidates that numbered more than 200. An excellent short list of candidates was interviewed by Council members and ultimately it was decided to appoint Ian".

Talk about 'job's for the boys'! Despite overseeing record losses as Treasurer he was seen as the outstanding candidate from 200 other applicants!

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Board appointments are only valid once the membship vote to approve it at the AGM. So a board appointment is temporary until the AGM. The Chairman usually has control of all the membership votes by members failing to vote. So if the Chairman decides to agree with the appointment, unless sufficient members vote it is a done deal.

It is fairly unusual though for shareholders, or members of a mutual, or otherwise, to disagree with appointments usually because the majority of the voters do not utilise their vote and by default give it to the chairman. (except in active clubs and mutuals, which are very few)

In the case of shareholders, many hold shares under nominee accounts, which passes the decisions on votes to the nominee. The nominee usually votes with the board, except if they are activist investors. These protest votes barely register, however they can show warning signs in some companies when there is a lack of support for the board.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

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@The Lev, I thought someone would correct me. Bear in mind that staff are often members, and 250 members of staff could control 50% of the voting power.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

@thesnowmad, welcome to snowHeads, where free speech isn't just encouraged, but is perceived as essential to the wellbeing of the community, like wine, beer and cake, all in moderation.
D'oh, not forgetting snow.

If I'd been to any AGM, even my bowls club, youth football club or allotment society, and there was inadequate financial information, I'd be calling for an EGM as soon as practicable.

If I was on the committee/board of such an organisation, I'd have been kicking up a fuss and helping to produce that information, to be seen to be open and transparent.

Such an EGM should be set at a point in time where that financial information can be presented and discussed. Also, by submission of questions in advance, the other key issues you raise should be addressed and discussed.

If this is really the situation with a £multi-million turnover 'not for profit' organisation, with over 20000 members, then that's a disgrace. Do their annual financial figures and one off major transactions get properly audited? Puzzled

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@PeakyB, Difficult to argue with your reasoning.
However, with 500* votes (of which approx 200 may be an unofficial union of reps voting "en block") out of 20,000+* members, then surely they deserve what they get, if not worse IMO. I'm surprised the money from the sale of HQ hasn't already been 'allocated' wink

The management can't be expected to read minds and take all the responsibility. It's a tough job.

Did you hear about the golf club that was sold off, just round the corner near Wimbledon Conmon?

(*"properly audited"?)

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@ecureuil, Yup.
I think Snowheads has a similar % ... of DAdmin's mood on any given day Toofy Grin

@AL9000, well yes, if true that only about 2% of the SCGB membership voted, then the 98% who didn’t have few grounds to complain.

Looked at another way, maybe a loss of not much more than £40 per member, over a year, isn’t worth a fuss. After all, it would only buy one decent lunch with wine on the mountain in Wengen.

Even so, it would be interesting to know the real story behind the cash write-off for website development. Also, does the CEO really get paid £200k pa, as claimed earlier in this thread?

You know it makes sense.

I think you might be onto something there @PeakyB.
Back in the early days of snowHeads, we were chatting to a fairly 'well healed' friend, telling her about what led to snowHeads starting.
"Oh yes, I'm a member of the Ski Club of Great Britain" she said. "I don't really know anything about them though. Had to join for some reason to go on a holiday with a friend. Every year I see the direct debit go out of my account and think, 'I must cancel that' and then forget."
As far as I know she is still a member Confused

To some folk, £50 is food + drink budget for a week

for example, some have boasted at achieving this on the EoSB

or make/break for a trip, to others, it's neither here nor there. While I accept the club's membership is more diverse than it once was, I suspect there's still quite a strong leaning toward the latter.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I don’t really ‘get’ their published accounts of income from membership versus the number of claimed members.

£965869 of revenue through membership, 24776 members, is an average membership fee of £38.98.

Looking on the scgb website, the cheapest membership package is £50?!?

..Nick

A snowHead

@admin, I have a friend who has, I kid you not, just celebrated his 91st birthday. He hasn't skied for at least 20 years and he's still a Member. He tells me he likes looking at the snow reports... Laughing

A snowHead

@big_ben, vat?

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@big_ben, could also depend on how they count families. Membership for say 2 adults + 3 children is £102. If they count this as 5, rather than 1, it only averages £20.40 each.

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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@PeakyB, yes, the accounts _are_ audited - and apparently the auditors refused to sign off the initial version, due to the lack of clarity when the size of the loss became apparent (I think in May). They were present at the AGM, although not really involved in the discussion. Whilst they now believe the current figures are _accurate_, it is not for them to say _why_ the loss occurred.
@PeakyB, I think the practical issue was that the AGM had been scheduled before the financial issues became clear - and I suspect delaying it to a time where the figures are known would not have been palatable. We didn't, however, get a clear answer from the FD as to when they _would_ have a clear view of the current running accounts - although there is an independent review to be carried out into root cause - I suspect some members will be chasing for the output of this to be published...

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@hamilton, thanks, yes, understand that. I said if I were a member, at the AGM, and no clear accounts were available, I'd be asking for an Extraordinary General Meeting to be scheduled for asap after the full accounts were ready and audited. A fundamental part of any AGM worth its salt is that the finances need to be clear and available, for scrutiny and to allow questions from members.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

@big_ben,

After all it is free

My subscription is due in a month. I will be cancelling if the Instructor led guiding in Tignes does not transpire. Details should have been out by now and am suspecting they cannot afford it.

I originally joined so that I could ski with people on the Leader service if I took my non-skiing wife to the Alps. However the choice of resorts was very limited with a preference to Switzerland where few of us normal mortals holiday.

Would you buy a used car from someone who had a moustache like Ian Holt? Toofy Grin

To whom it may concern:
I said so in 2017/18 and will say it again: after a rather unpleasant experience with the SCGB, I set up an account with Companies House - GOV.UK to find out more about the inner workings of the self-proclaimed NON-PROFIT organisation whose mission according to the MEMORANDUM OF ASSOCIATION OF SKI CLUB OF GREAT BRITAIN LIMITED found HERE (https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/04312167/filing-history?page=1.) is "to encourage skiing, snowboarding and other snow sports in all their forms"... sounds good, doesn't it?
Finish the remaining 7 paragraphs, describing in detail how the SCGB has initially planned to make that "dream come true" and you will ask yourself why you never read the memorandum of the sports organization that has been a major influence in your decision-making process and money-spending habits (skiing is an amazing sport/pastime/passion, but IT DOES NOT COME CHEAP!) even though you normally ALWAYS read the fine print.
Considering the fact that the SKI CLUB OF GREAT BRITAIN LIMITED is registered as a private company limited by guarantee without share capital, one should not be surprised that the great sport of skiing is not a priority in this convoluted network of companies and sub-companies.
In addition, a total of 23 small companies (SKI CLUB WINTER ARRANGEMENTS LIMITED, SKI CLUB SERVICES LIMITED, FRESHTRACKS LIMITED, MOUNTAIN SPIRIT LIMITED, SOURCE: COMPANIES HOUSE to name a few) who have ALL filed for tax exemption for 2018 are linked directly or indirectly through a) officers or b) directors to the Ski Club of Great Britain Ltd. All linked companies have been granted tax exemption due to a) dormancy or b) small business reasons.
All linked companies have one or more executives in common.

Check out the "Resolution of the Company Act" from 2011 here, https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/04312167/filing-history?page=1 and demand a clarification of the accounts from the Appointed Directors, preferably in writing, as is your right as a member.
You will find that due to the Resolution and the resulting changes to Member Policy, Honorary Members etc, those who profited most over the last 8 years were, in fact, the members of the "Inner Circle". The benefits range from tax exemption to major tax write-offs for the "Directors" and officers. And that is just the "legal" way of doing it.

All of this a coincidence? Really? Wake up, dear members of the formerly prestigious and exclusive elite organization that has the audacity to proclaim itself NON-PROFIT: the Ski Club of Great Britain Limited at its best!

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@GoneSkiing, You are David Goldenbits and I claim my £5. wink

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@GeorgeVII what can I say, I am a genius... Cool

No, actually, all of the very limited information above (nick the surface and the "nasty" starts pouring out) is the result of a graduate student research project at the LSOE in cooperation with the LLM at the University of Fribourg and will be made available to the public in its rather extensive and well-researched entirety on January 28th, 2020. It's been fun, kids...NOT!
And the moral of the story: even your long-time ski buddy is nothing but a crook who is looking for a money-laundering scheme that is not as dirty as, say, selling drugs. wink

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Are you all seriously "shocked" by the loss of 1 mil pounds amongst "friends"? C'mon, that's petty cash in the eyes of the BOD.

"Expense it!", they said.
"We got away with embezzling 40 x that amount over the course of the last 10 years.", they said.
"Who is going to notice?", they said.
"Our members are not holding us accountable as would be their right.", they said.
"Nothing will come of it, don't worry!", they said.
"We already picked our scapegoat, it is all taken care off.", they said.

I say: THEY won't be talking much longer.
January 28th, 2020. Save the date!

You know it makes sense.

"Miscellany of tittle-tattle?"
I am insulted by the implied accusation of having stood by when sh%t could have been prevented from hitting the fan by something as simple as reporting to the Insolvency Services...NOT! If I had only known!
Said project and the resulting report were initiated in late 2017/early 2018 after the Insolvency Service responded to an inquiry with the statement, and here I quote, "Following up on your inquiry regarding possible fraudulent business practices with the intent of concealing irregular cash-flow activities involving the Ski Club of Great Britain Limited and businesses seemingly linked through shared appointed officers, we would like to inform you that our research into the matter has not been able to solidify the claims you have raised." Now, that is ONE LONG sentence to come up with, just to say: "We couldn't care less and honestly don't want to know. Now kindly f%#@ off."

I know, however, that this is not MY circus and these are not MY monkeys - they definitely belong to the 20K+ members of the above mentioned well-established, non-profit organisation.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@GoneSkiing, don't belong to the Club, don't know who you are - but from what you say the Insolvency Service is not satisfied your claims are justified. Bad management doesn't mean that there has been fraud.

A snowHead

@achilles,

A snowHead

ALEXA!!

Order more popcorn

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

You need to Login to know who's really who.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

"I run a company that's basically not-for-profit." sounds a lot better than "I run a company that's unprofitable."

I'm always sceptical of businesses that say they're 'not for profit'. If it's not a registered charity, then the term is misleading. It may make a limited company sound warm and fluffy - but of course it's for profit. In many cases, 'not for profit' just means 'no money left over after running costs and taking out the director's salaries'. Nothing wrong with that, of course, but there's no particular virtue in running a commercial business that fails to generate profits after taking into account running costs, salaries, dividends and adding to an investment reserve.

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

I run a "not for profit" membership organisation. Clearly you either make money or lose money - there is no such thing as break even, but if we are having a good year the profits are ploughed back in to member benefits - holding the cost of membership fee or reducing the cost of events

It's also a good way to firewall off the risks associated with various ventures from failing and collapsing the club, leaving members liable. We used to do it for the large event that my motorclub ran.

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Help!!

Ski Club of GB makes loss of £841,589 in 2018-19

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