Skiing 50cm of powder covering a piste is easier to ski than skiing 20cm of powder sitting on top of unconsolidated snow covering variable terrain IMHO.
Feck, yeah. Dust on crust.
But I didn't get the impression that was what the OP was talking about... ?
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
BobinCH wrote:
Look at videos of amazing skiers (Plake, Coombs, Schmidt) back in the day and compare them with modern freeriders. These guys were equally talented but fat rockered skis have totally changed freeriding for the better despite what some dinosaurs might have you believe! It is impossible to ride like the modern guys on “all mountain skis”. They are all on rockered skis between 110 -125mm at the waist. Amateurs want similar width but soft flex so easier to turn/kill speed. It is so much more fun skiing on the proper equipment than struggling on compromise gear. So while buying may not be practical, any aspiring off piste skier should at least try a proper fat ski when the conditions are right. There is no better feeling...
I think some clarification is required here on a few counts:
#1, nobody is suggesting people ski powder on old style skis, nor is anybody suggesting people ski powder on slalom skis or piste orientated skis.
#2, an all mountain ski to me is a compromise ski that is made to perform reasonably well on piste and reasonably well off piste. For skiing on piste there will be better skis and for skiing off piste there will be better skis. But I've read quite a few people that when on top performing all mountain ski will end up always taking out that ski because leading on to...
#3, my skiing day, and I expect for many, is likely to be a mixed bag - piste, powder on piste, crud, chopped powder, refrozen crust and if I am lucky some proper powder.
#4, you can't compare heli skiing or Jappow to an average day in the Alps. In those circs sure a super wide proper pow ski makes sense. Also if some unfit middle aged guy with plenty of cash goes Alaskan heli skiing then it makes sense to get a playful, wide as you like, punter ski. But the OP and I suspect the far majority of people start off dabbling of the side of the piste in Europe. Ideally they will still be in the relatively early stages of their progression in on piste or general skiing. It's never too early to start dabbling IMO.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Fri 20-04-18 13:31; edited 1 time in total
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Layne, good points, well made, other than,
Quote:
nobody is suggesting people ski powder on old style skis, nor is anybody suggesting people ski powder on slalom skis
I didn't? How remiss of me.
Nordica, Dobermann, SL-R, full bore FIS. The perfect powder ski.
Skiing 50cm of powder covering a piste is easier to ski than skiing 20cm of powder sitting on top of unconsolidated snow covering variable terrain IMHO.
Feck, yeah. Dust on crust.
But I didn't get the impression that was what the OP was talking about... ?
No, not dust on crust.
New unconsolidated snow on top of older unconsolidated snow covering variable terrain versus new unconsolidated snow sitting on top of a piste.
----------
To answer the OPs original question in a different way and expand on my original reply
In my experience too many skiers transitioning from pisted slopes to 'powder' slopes ski the slope and not the snow conditions.
They look at the pitch and width of the slope and then manufacture turn radii based on what they think they should be doing / what they've always done on that pitch when it's pisted / their favourite or 'go to' turn shape
What they should be doing is responding to the differing snow conditions and variations in terrain as the run unfolds and shaping their skis correspondingly. Sometimes that means straightlining, other times quick tempo, short radius pivotted turns. And everything in between.
you can't do the same turn every turn
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@Mike Pow, you raise (as always) an interesting point to my mind, which is entirely off thread. (despite your nitpicking about dust on crust).
I found myself this year, on my new last year Bonafides, when lazy, on well groomed pistes, settling in to their natural turn shape, sized more or less to velocity. Frankly, they're just too easy to ski.
Look at videos of amazing skiers (Plake, Coombs, Schmidt) back in the day and compare them with modern freeriders. These guys were equally talented but fat rockered skis have totally changed freeriding for the better despite what some dinosaurs might have you believe! It is impossible to ride like the modern guys on “all mountain skis”. They are all on rockered skis between 110 -125mm at the waist. Amateurs want similar width but soft flex so easier to turn/kill speed. It is so much more fun skiing on the proper equipment than struggling on compromise gear. So while buying may not be practical, any aspiring off piste skier should at least try a proper fat ski when the conditions are right. There is no better feeling...
I think some clarification is required here on a few counts:
#1, nobody is suggesting people ski powder on old style skis, nor is anybody suggesting people ski powder on slalom skis or piste orientated skis.
#2, an all mountain ski to me is a compromise ski that is made to perform reasonably well on piste and reasonably well off piste. For skiing on piste there will be better skis and for skiing off piste there will be better skis. But I've read quite a few people that when on top performing all mountain ski will end up always taking out that ski because leading on to...
#3, my skiing day, and I expect for many, is likely to be a mixed bag - piste, powder on piste, crud, chopped powder, refrozen crust and if I am lucky some proper powder.
#4, you can compare heli skiing or Jappow to an average day in the Alps. In those circs sure a super wide proper pow ski makes sense. Also if some unfit middle aged guy with plenty of cash goes Alaskan heli skiing then it makes sense to get a playful, wide as you like, punter ski. But the OP and I suspect the far majority of people start off dabbling of the side of the piste in Europe. Ideally they will still be in the relatively early stages of their progression in on piste or general skiing. It's never too early to start dabbling IMO.
I agree entirely with this. Decent modern AM skis with rockered tips/tails and 90+ mm underfoot make an easy enough intro to skiing powder and other off-piste conditions. Once you get into more powder specific super-wide skis, they can actually make the job harder if the conditions are not favourable. I can think of plenty of off-piste situations where I would much prefer to be on a 90 mm platform vs 110+ mm. Off-piste conditions are not all light, dry, waist deep powder! Skiing regularly in BC I find on most typical days a modern AM ski of around 100 mm waist seems to be the best compromise. The widest skis I own are 108 mm waist as I don't really see the point in owning anything much wider than that and they deal with any depth of powder with relative ease. Only 10 years ago I was skiing the very same powder on 72 mm and 82 mm wide fully cambered AM skis and not exactly struggling. The first punter ski I recall being relatively accessible in powder was the Salomon X Scream and they were pretty skinny by today's standards.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Quote:
Salomon X Scream
Ugh. Tried those when I was in Whistler. Hated them. Took them back to the hire shop and got myself a pair of Rossignol X9s. Much better!
After all it is free
After all it is free
Mike Pow wrote:
... If the snow is light enough and you 'hit bottom', then that 'bottom' is a smooth piste which is a consistent base on which to turn.
Skiing 50cm of powder covering a piste is easier to ski than skiing 20cm of powder sitting on top of unconsolidated snow covering variable terrain IMHO.
That's true, but my analysis of the mechanics is a little different. In BC back country at least, you're likely to be riding snow which feels more consistent than what's under resort powder. It should feel as smooth as cream, only lighter.
I think the key issue is that the skis or board are banked not edged. The action is similar, but the mechanics of the board/ snow interface are very different. In back country powder fore-aft and left-right stability requires subtle input: you can't just lever off the edge or tip/tail.
That means you have to a stance which gives you the balance you need. Examples:
- Wide rockered skis make it easier to balance if you don't have a good stance. They help novices ride powder.
- Modern powder snowboards are short and fat. They are easy to ride because they're easy to balance on, yet they ride low.
- Many people don't bother with buckles or rigid control inputs for powder: you don't need crisp and precise control of that little edge, you need to have your weight over the board(s) in the right place.
The mechanics of "banking" versus "edging" also means there's more lag in the control input.
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@uktrailmonster, assume you ski a lot on piste or in a traditional style. Fat rockered skis aren’t just for Japan/Alaska. They give even more benefit in Euro pow conditions, for example when the pow is windblown. How anyone skiing predominantly off piste can recommend a 90mm waisted ski is beyond me. I can only assume you just haven’t skied many modern fat skis, or ski side of the piste chopped up stuff rather than untracked snow. The OP wanted help in powder, not a “typical day”. Recommending him 90mm all mountain skis is frankly not going to help him. As before, get the right skis for powder conditions and it will make a massive difference to your ability and enjoyment.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Mike Pow wrote:
BobinCH wrote:
Look at videos of amazing skiers (Plake, Coombs, Schmidt) back in the day and compare them with modern freeriders. These guys were equally talented but fat rockered skis have totally changed freeriding for the better despite what some dinosaurs might have you believe! It is impossible to ride like the modern guys on “all mountain skis”.They are all on rockered skis between 110 -125mm at the waist.
It is impossible to ride like the modern guys on “all mountain skis”.
If you mean landing big jumps; skiing switch in powder; and flipping the skis sideways and then skiing through your own powder cloud like snowboarders do, then 100% yes.
Skiing powder at speed on steep, technical terrain? Then no.
I present exhibit A
Jeremy Nobis skiing Pyramid Peak, Alaska in 1997 on 188cm skis with dimensions somewhere between the production model Inspired (117-89-110) and Legend Pro (124-97-116)
Teton Gravity Research was filming the movie Harvest on Pyramid Peak in Alaska, a frightening 52-degree slope with 2,000 vertical feet of skiing. The TGR crew wasn't sure they wanted to film Nobis, but Adams persuaded TGR principal Todd Jones to bring him along. Veterans Dave Swanwick and Rick Armstrong were instructed to "take care of Nobi."
The year before, Doug Coombs, the "father of the freeride movement," had skied Pyramid cautiously, making 80 turns. Nobis skied it in 25 seconds, making about eight turns. The helicopter pilot thought Nobis had to be on drugs. His run changed everything: A new freeriding barrier was breached. "It wasn't really planned," recalls Nobis. "I dropped in, did a couple of turns, then started pointing it. The run was steeper than I thought, and I was scared, but I said, 'This is what I'm trained to do. I'm one of the few who can do it.' I just switched my brain off and reacted. Everybody was pretty buzzed."
Amateurs want similar width but soft flex so easier to turn/kill speed. It is so much more fun skiing on the proper equipment than struggling on compromise gear. So while buying may not be practical, any aspiring off piste skier should at least try a proper fat ski when the conditions are right. There is no better feeling...
For those short on time then definitely 100% good advice as I echoed in an earlier post.
For those who've got a handle on wider skis and who have the technique and fitness to try a different powder experience then skiing on a narrower platform is equally as fun, just different, 'when the conditions are right'
That is once in a generation skills right there! I had a pair of Legend Pros back in the day. Only way to stop them tip diving was Mach speed and boy was it spectacular when it went wrong! Now I know your inspiration for skiing the Japow on the skinnies 😉
But seriously on modern gear I could get my mum skiing a powder field. That’s what’s changed with modern skis.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Layne wrote:
BobinCH wrote:
Layne wrote:
Admittedly the 97 wide skis I have are the widest I've skied so I've no experience of extra fats. Plus I started skiing powder on skinnies.
I’d suggest to test some!
I can tell you, with lots of experience testing skis of different width, shape, construction and shape, that it makes a huge difference.
I have a pair of soft, fat, fully rockered skis on which I guarantee I could completely change the OP’s experience skiing powder in 10 minutes
I don't get to ski true powder often or long enough to justify it as I do family trips a year in late December and late March/early April in the French Alps. If I lived in the Alps and could ski just when there was powder or went heliskiing or did trips to Japan it may make sense. Maybe when the kids are a bit older but for now I need an everyday all mountain ski. This year was exceptional in the amount of powder skiing so maybe I missed a trick on not hiring some for a day just to see.
you'd have had fresh powder this year both of them times you went away. fingers x'd for next season
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I have some great all mountain Nordica Enforcers at 98mm underfoot. But these days I hardly ever used them, just keep them mainly for touring, as my 120mm Bents seem to handle every condition so much better. If I'm mainly on piste I'll just take piste skis and struggle on the odd off piste bit
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Scarpa, have heard great things about the Bent Chetlers. Would love to try Atomic skis but hard to find round here alas
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
BobinCH wrote:
That is once in a generation skills right there! I had a pair of Legend Pros back in the day. Only way to stop them tip diving was Mach speed and boy was it spectacular when it went wrong! Now I know your inspiration for skiing the Japow on the skinnies 😉
No doubting that. Nobis would be winning comps now if he was a young buck.
After a two week trip to BC on Dynastar Yetis (67mm waist) and a month long stint at the then Big Mountain, Montana on Olin Selkirks (119-75-106 IIRC), I returned to Big Mountain for my first N American season and thinking I was hot poo-poo upsized to what was then gargantuan, the Volkl G4 (118-88-111 @198cm)
Over time the skis got shorter and wider, but I always hankered for those full immersion days.
Being a better skier in 2013 than I was in 1999-2003 I gave a set of Coreupt The Casper twin tips (112-79-105 @173cm) a whirl and I haven't looked back since.
On the Movement Zoo now (115-84-106 @ 177cm) and very happy
The overwhelming reply to the OP is to get some wide skis. I consider myself to be in a similar stage to the OP, and having hired wide skis in the past (Rossi Soul 7s) I am unconvinced that wide skis make up for a lack of basic powder skills. However, having sought to correct this on a course earlier this year, I am intrigued whether any of the proponents of wide skis would advise at what width of ski “on piste” performance is significantly compromised?
As two week a year European resort skier an “all mountain” ski makes a lot of sense, and my experience suggests that a 90 width ski still is ok on piste, but a 106 ski is not great on piste.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
DavidYacht wrote:
The overwhelming reply to the OP is to get some wide skis. I consider myself to be in a similar stage to the OP, and having hired wide skis in the past (Rossi Soul 7s) I am unconvinced that wide skis make up for a lack of basic powder skills. However, having sought to correct this on a course earlier this year, I am intrigued whether any of the proponents of wide skis would advise at what width of ski “on piste” performance is significantly compromised?
As two week a year European resort skier an “all mountain” ski makes a lot of sense, and my experience suggests that a 90 width ski still is ok on piste, but a 106 ski is not great on piste.
Well personally my compromise point is north of 112mm. This will of course vary by individual.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
As a powder novice, I've found that wider skis with rocker really helped me. It's just so much easier, you can "surf" your way and the experience is much more forgiving. I've also seen the same effect with even less powder-experienced skiers than me.
Other than hair shirts, never did me any harm, I remember back in my day we learned to be real men and never complained, I could win a grand-prix in my 1964 E-type... is there any actual argument that sub-100mm skis are better on a proper powder day?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Ps it’s not just the skis but the shape and construction. They need to be soft and ideally full rocker for a novice. The faster you ski the stiffer you go and a bit of camber helps in chopped up snow and on piste
@Mike Pow, all good for you but the OP doesn’t have your skills (and is not skiing Japow). I’m a decent skier and didn’t enjoy skiing my old 85mm Movement Yaka Jam’s off piste, nor my bros Faction 9’s (90mm). The moment it gets heavier/wind blown/crusty they go deeper, the sidecut bites and they take a lot of effort to turn (particularly at slow speeds). Chalk and cheese compared to the DPS Wailers or similar which are simply miles easier to ski. And that for 99% of recreational skiers is what will make the most difference to their enjoyment.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@BobinCH, the OP doesn't have your skills either. Not sure where this is getting us and I think the OP has long since rode off into the sunset.
I don’t see the point in skiing powder on such wide skis that you are skimming over the top of it. You might as well be on piste.
I also don’t get the point of straight lining powder. I suppose it’s down to personal preference.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Layne, just trying to debunk the common misconception that fat skis are only for experts in Alaska/Japan. When in fact they would revolutionize the powder skiing experience for many recreational skiers were they to try them.
After all it is free
After all it is free
BobinCH wrote:
@Layne, just trying to debunk the common misconception that fat skis are only for experts in Alaska/Japan. When in fact they would revolutionize the powder skiing experience for many recreational skiers were they to try them.
As I say "we could be here all day"
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@BobinCH, Looking good there I got my Bents in a sale on the net, although I now live only a few km from the Atomic factory I demo'd the DPS Wailers and rated them highly, but I still preferred the Bents. They are a little limited in carving shape on piste, they get on edge fine but it's a bit same-ish every turn although I've done a few icy black runs that got the tips and tails flapping. I saw a review from NZ on them which gave the opinion that for a powder oriented ski they were very versatile. And being 30% rockered at each end they can change direction in powder at the drop of a hat, same for tree skiing.
@Gordyjh, My mate who is a much better skier than I can ever dream of being also prefers to be deep in the snow, although he recently got a pair of Black Crow Atris at 108mm and loves them, even though he seems to be able to ski pow just as well on bloody straight 1980's skis.
A fat ski doesn't just skim the surface though, it's more like flying through the snow...
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
DavidYacht wrote:
I am intrigued whether any of the proponents of wide skis would advise at what width of ski “on piste” performance is significantly compromised?
As two week a year European resort skier an “all mountain” ski makes a lot of sense, and my experience suggests that a 90 width ski still is ok on piste, but a 106 ski is not great on piste.
In one of the vids I posted earlier I was on a 118mm waisted ski @ 185cm length.
They were fine on edge on piste, and surprisingly manoeuvrable pivotting in steeper and/or narrower pisted terrain.
But it all depends on your core skills.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
BobinCH wrote:
@Mike Pow, all good for you but the OP doesn’t have your skills (and is not skiing Japow). I’m a decent skier and didn’t enjoy skiing my old 85mm Movement Yaka Jam’s off piste, nor my bros Faction 9’s (90mm). The moment it gets heavier/wind blown/crusty they go deeper, the sidecut bites and they take a lot of effort to turn (particularly at slow speeds). Chalk and cheese compared to the DPS Wailers or similar which are simply miles easier to ski. And that for 99% of recreational skiers is what will make the most difference to their enjoyment.
True and true to skills and Japan.
And yes the choice of ski depends on the type of snow and terrain you ski most of the time.
For me most of my ski time is spent skiing excellent powder. For my approx 7-10 days of Welsh skiing per season and 7-14 days of European skiing then my skill set and fitness allows me to manage on the difficult days. On the good days, there's no compromise.
I've always advocated increasing speed off-piste and feeling comfortable with that increased speed, which is learned on piste.
And In this thread I've supported your recommendation for the OP to try a wider platform.
I'll go one step further and advocate a centre mounted, wider waisted twin tip ski for the OP and others.
Turn initiation and release is so much easier when tip and tail are off the snow surface.
The traditional camber underfoot allows for a smoother ride on edge on piste.
And pivotting on and off piste feels more natural when centre mounted.
I'd recommend it to everyone.
It's transformed my enjoyment of turning. And my students who've done likewise.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Gordyjh wrote:
I also don’t get the point of straight lining powder. I suppose it’s down to personal preference.
I presume that's in response to the videos I posted.
Whilst it may appear that I'm straightlining for the majority of my time in the powder, the reality is I'm responding to the changes in terrain and the resistance of the snow and turning just enough to complete the turn.
Sometimes this involves a large deviation from the centre / fall line.
Other times it's just a subtle pivot and edging to the left or right to complete the turn and maintain a consistent and safe (for me) speed on snow.
It goes back to an earlier recommendation and answers one of BobinCH's shout outs to the jump turn.
If you do the same turn shape each turn regardless of what the terrain and snow is telling you,
some turns will feel wonderful and comfortable and in control;
others will feel fast and out of control (you didn't turn enough and complete the turn);
and others will feel slow, laboured and muscular because you've turned too much, lost your speed on snow, got the skis buried in the powder and the only way out is an artificial releasing of the skis by jump turning or reverting to a stem turn. Both of which feel like hard work.
What most people forget / have no idea is powder skiing is 3 dimensional.
There's the left to right and right to left movement of turning across the slope.
And the dropping into the snow and coming back out of the snow at the end of the turn that has been coined 'porpoising'.
A wider platform underfoot minimises the 'porpoising' but with less snow resistance there is normally greater speed on snow and a greater need to make a more pronounced turn shape to complete the turn and control acceleration and speed on snow.
A narrower platform underfoot encourages sinking in to the snowpack and the need for this 3 dimensional 'porpoising', but the added resistance of the snow around the skis, feet, legs, waist, chest if you're really lucky, minimises the need to make pronounced turn shapes to complete the turn and control acceleration and speed on snow.
If you do overturn on a narrower platform then declaration is abrupt and unforgiving with a feeling of being bogged down.
On any given slope the number of turns made in the powder on wider and narrower platforms is the same, it's the shape and extent of that turn shape which differs.
That can be seen in the 'Test Pattern' vid I posted hopefully. And also the sunnny San Martino vid.
I'm turning enough to maintain a safe, constant speed on snow without experiencing wild shifts in acceleration and declaration.
Hope that makes sense.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Mon 23-04-18 9:53; edited 3 times in total
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Mike Pow wrote:
I'll go one step further and advocate a centre mounted, wider waisted twin tip ski for the OP and others.
Turn initiation and release is so much easier when tip and tail are off the snow surface.
Agree with this. The Lotus 124 have a more centre mounted position and are just so easy to ski.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
BobinCH wrote:
@Layne, just trying to debunk the common misconception that fat skis are only for experts in Alaska/Japan. When in fact they would revolutionize the powder skiing experience for many recreational skiers were they to try them.
No argument there.
But the core skills have to be in place otherwise it can be 'Mr Toad's Wild Ride' 😉
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
For me as a visual learner what@Mike Pow, said made sense when I had a pleassure of skiing with him. Seeing is believing for me. And what I learned, it is very difficult to learn skiing powder at he keyboard
Best combo in skiing I had this year was Japan and @Mike Pow.
Accumulating holidays for the 2020 season, as two weeks were minimum even to scratch the surface, so thinking 18-20 days next time
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@Mike Pow, there’s still a weekend left. And snow forecast! Let’s do a test - although I fear you’ll look even better on my skis and, alas, I will have to work hard on yours 😜
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Mike Pow, Not particularly in response to your videos, just an observation of how some people do things. I enjoy the feeling of turning and this porpoising you mentioned describes it well. I sometimes get the feeling when reading Snowheads discussions that there is only 1 “right” way to enjoy powder, 1 best type of ski etc and I just thought I would point out that tastes are as varied as people.
I really don’t like any centre mounted skis I’ve tried and neither did I like the reverse cambered ones I tried for a couple of days at SOPiB18. I loved the Dynastar Cham 87s but they’ve been discontinued. The Nordica Enforcers I used for the rest of SOPiB18 were quite fun but not quite as lively as would be my ideal. Has anyone got any suggestions? A little off topic so sorry for that!
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Gordyjh, skiing tracked stuff or untracked? The goal skiing off piste is not to hit the base - to get the feeling of weightlessness vs edge on hard base on piste. A wider, rockered ski helps with this as you float better. Totally different sensation to on piste. Skiing straight down a couloir is a massive rush - speed = adrenaline. Snaking big wide turns on an open face is another great feeling but needs perfect balance on narrower/trad shape skis - see Nobis video!
Sounds like we like very different skis, probably because o am on the constant hunt for untracked snow and suspect you are typically skiing tracked stuff off piste but for what it’s worth I am a big DPS fan and also really liked the Blizzard Rustler 12’s I tested. Faction CT 4.0’s were also good but heavier and more damped. BC Atris is popular but lacked pop for me.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
mooney058 wrote:
For me as a visual learner what@Mike Pow, said made sense when I had a pleassure of skiing with him. Seeing is believing for me. And what I learned, it is very difficult to learn skiing powder at he keyboard
Best combo in skiing I had this year was Japan and @Mike Pow.
Accumulating holidays for the 2020 season, as two weeks were minimum even to scratch the surface, so thinking 18-20 days next time
@Mike Pow, there’s still a weekend left. And snow forecast! Let’s do a test - although I fear you’ll look even better on my skis and, alas, I will have to work hard on yours 😜
Would love to but mine and Nerys' schedule doesn't gel
Been trying to get out to Verbier since I got back from Japan but alas no. Got a mate Jon who has a place there.
But Nerys and I are seriously looking at Engelberg in May if the conditions are good
EDIT
Just read about the knee
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Mon 23-04-18 10:26; edited 1 time in total
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Gordyjh wrote:
@Mike Pow, Not particularly in response to your videos, just an observation of how some people do things. I enjoy the feeling of turning and this porpoising you mentioned describes it well. I sometimes get the feeling when reading Snowheads discussions that there is only 1 “right” way to enjoy powder, 1 best type of ski etc and I just thought I would point out that tastes are as varied as people.
100% and the story of my instructing career
After all it is free
After all it is free
BobinCH wrote:
@uktrailmonster, assume you ski a lot on piste or in a traditional style. Fat rockered skis aren’t just for Japan/Alaska. They give even more benefit in Euro pow conditions, for example when the pow is windblown. How anyone skiing predominantly off piste can recommend a 90mm waisted ski is beyond me. I can only assume you just haven’t skied many modern fat skis, or ski side of the piste chopped up stuff rather than untracked snow. The OP wanted help in powder, not a “typical day”. Recommending him 90mm all mountain skis is frankly not going to help him. As before, get the right skis for powder conditions and it will make a massive difference to your ability and enjoyment.
Your assumptions about me are all incorrect. It didn't sound to me like the OP was off heli-skiing anytime soon, more like dabbling at the side of the piste in his first forays into deeper snow. If he can't do that on a modern AM ski, then perhaps he should take a lesson or two. All I'm saying is that strapping on a pair of super fat powder skis isn't the real answer here. Sure once you are skiing much of the time in true off-piste they can be great fun and make life easier, but they are certainly not a requirement. Maybe I have developed some skills along the way, but I wouldn't think twice about skiing off-piste in deep BC snow with any half decent AM ski, even if not necessarily my first choice. One of the very best skiers I know (and he is seriously good having spent his whole career on snow) doesn't bother with anything over 90 mm waist in any condition on or off piste (he's a big guy too, not some lightweight). Not suggesting I would do the same for a moment, but skiing is not all about the skis and assumptions are often wide of the mark, LOL.
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@Mike Pow,
Quick clarification - when you say twin-tipped do you really mean full rockered? I don't really see why twin tips as such are important for intermediates learning to ski powder.
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uktrailmonster wrote:
One of the very best skiers I know (and he is seriously good having spent his whole career on snow) doesn't bother with anything over 90 mm waist in any condition on or off piste (he's a big guy too, not some lightweight). Not suggesting I would do the same for a moment, but skiing is not all about the skis and assumptions are often wide of the mark, LOL.
That's why these threads always turn to ratshit - the defensiveness around "really good skiers" skiing off piste on relatively skinny skis. If they do (having sampled the variety of stuff out there and having made a conscious decision) then good for them. It doesn't make it the best decision for everyone nor the best advice for someone getting into off piste. I know I'm not alone in taking a view that the best ski on a given day is the fattest you can get away with in the worst conditions be it rock hard early morning groomers etc etc as a wider ski buys versatility. But taking that view means you give up technical precision. Everything is a compromise and personal taste is relevant.
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