I've made this pitch a few times, here and elsewhere. I've yet to discourage a single person from blowing hundreds and hundreds of pounds on top spec waterproof gear they just don't need (Arcteryx Alpha SV for a couple of weeks resort skiing in the alps in the middle of winter? Really?) so I've basically given up
Totally agree - though over the years hate to think how many jackets I've had.
And Scarpa agree about softshell cycling jackets, few years ago I was using an Enduro for both x-country and touring, and that's basically what the Quito is - see that youtube link in a previous post, or now here
Though like I said, my jackets / trousers get more or a battering back in the UK when I walk the dogs along the beach in a good old SW'ly gale
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:
I've made this pitch a few times, here and elsewhere. I've yet to discourage a single person from blowing hundreds and hundreds of pounds on top spec waterproof gear they just don't need (Arcteryx Alpha SV for a couple of weeks resort skiing in the alps in the middle of winter? Really?)
I think your point is pretty valid, but... my last jacket was apparently a full bore alpine climbing hardshell (well, it was obviously a hardshell ). Bought at the time 'cos I liked the colour, fit and pockets (what other reasons might there be?) I also wanted Gore-Tex as SHs didn't exist and I didn't know there were credible alternatives and I frequently skied in the PdS sometimes in the rain
As mentioned many times, it lasted 11 years and ~650 ski days plus "other" use before beginning to fail physically. It's still functional if limited.
The other half has watched 3 jackets expire (North Face, Eider and can't recall) in the same period before moving to Arc'teryx with G-T albeit not SV which is still looking brand new after 3 seasons / about 160 ski days).
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
The first time skiing I just used a thicker windproof fleece (not waterproof but with good breathability), a light midlayer fleece, a base layer and a light sprayway water proof. It was the stuff I used for hill walking. I'd swap and change these layers to match the conditions and my activity level. The waterproof was kept in the backpack most of the time and only came out when it was really windy or rainning.
Since then I've had numerous jackets of various brands (inc. an Arcteryx costing circa 400 GBP) and membranes (Goretex, Goretex XCR, Event etc) while always looking for the holy grail of one single jacket to rule them all.
It's just occured to that after all that time and expense - I've gone full circle.
DB, the first time I went skiing I was in a dodgy anorak, waterproof trousers, probably from C&A with cotton underwear and woollen insulation and gloves. Welly boots substituted for ski boots and the bindings were metal springs with formed steel grips for the toes. (Yes, my feet bled and the welly boots had holes afterwards).
Mind you, I was only 5...
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
under a new name wrote:
Quote:
I've made this pitch a few times, here and elsewhere. I've yet to discourage a single person from blowing hundreds and hundreds of pounds on top spec waterproof gear they just don't need (Arcteryx Alpha SV for a couple of weeks resort skiing in the alps in the middle of winter? Really?)
I think your point is pretty valid, but... my last jacket was apparently a full bore alpine climbing hardshell (well, it was obviously a hardshell ). Bought at the time 'cos I liked the colour, fit and pockets (what other reasons might there be?) I also wanted Gore-Tex as SHs didn't exist and I didn't know there were credible alternatives and I frequently skied in the PdS sometimes in the rain
As mentioned many times, it lasted 11 years and ~650 ski days plus "other" use before beginning to fail physically. It's still functional if limited.
The other half has watched 3 jackets expire (North Face, Eider and can't recall) in the same period before moving to Arc'teryx with G-T albeit not SV which is still looking brand new after 3 seasons / about 160 ski days).
+1
Quality nearly always wins. My Arcteryx shell is about 200 ski days "new". Still looks great and I have not noticed any deterioration in performance from new.
When it comes down to it, people are different so they pick different things.
For cycling I have a very light Italian thing, but it would be about as appropriate in BC coastal or inland conditions as my AK jacket would be on my bike. For touring (on bike or skis), I can see things will be different, I'd be amazed if people who hike for their turns use the same stuff I do. The bike jacket is also really cool on my really cool bike with the shades and all that... but it'd look stupid on a snowboard and it appears not to have a powder skirt.
Me, I need a jacket which is specifically designed for snowboarding. I've tried various climbing/ skiing things now and then, but in the end I settled on those top spec waterproof things designed for the sport. As it happens these days I get them for free, but I made my choice when that wasn't the case. Many brands sell equivalent stuff.
Quote:
...I've yet to discourage a single person from blowing hundreds and hundreds of pounds on top spec waterproof gear they just don't need ..
The whole consumer thing doesn't really work that way does it? Check out just about any expensive mechanical watch. It will cost you a fortune, looks ugly and will keep significantly worse time than your mobile phone. But you're not buying it so you can tell the time... Now I'm reminded of the guys who have a different $100,000 watch for every day of the week. They have to buy machines to keep them all wound up....
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
under a new name wrote:
DB, the first time I went skiing I was in a dodgy anorak, waterproof trousers, probably from C&A with cotton underwear and woollen insulation and gloves. Welly boots substituted for ski boots and the bindings were metal springs with formed steel grips for the toes. (Yes, my feet bled and the welly boots had holes afterwards).
Mind you, I was only 5...
Lucky bügger, my parents couldn't afford to take us skiing.
After all it is free
After all it is free
philwig, aaaahhhh but different cycling jackets for different cycling disciplines.
Road biking in the very uncertain conditions we've had in the mountains since June I pack a light jacket that is V light and fits in a back pocket in my cycling jersey. If it's already dank I have another one that is slightly heavier. Both jackets I would not ski or tour with!
For cold temps depth of winter riding then I have an Assos jacket that I use with layers, plus an old Endura Stealth, though I try not to ride in the wet in the winter.
If I was still commuting by bike then the Quito would be my choice as it's waterproof as well.
I snowboarded for around twenty years and always used a longer jacket (not specifically designed for snowboarding), but still shell and layers etc though did have a wonderful Chiemse windstopper pullover pod extra baggy, still have it as loathed to part with it but have not worn it for years
Tis always amusing when you see people out in Spring wearing great big jackets /co TK Max and the like etc and ending up so hot.
Though still amazes me when I see ski tourers all in black / dark colours etc
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Weathercam wrote:
Though still amazes me when I see ski tourers all in black / dark colours etc
What colour is best? Too light and it quickly looks dirty / shabby. Too dark and the salty sweat rings show up on base layers.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
DB, know what you mean, but once the jacket is off what's the point in climbing in a black base layer when a white / light grey will suffice.
Must admit although I wear black pants (because they go with anything and are the much more easily available than the 80's revival colours) I am trying to build up a selection of coloured base layers. One of my favoutite bits of touring kit is a gillet with a mesh back that I bought for Mountainbiking (similar to this http://www.wigglesport.de/altura-etape-weste/ ) looking to get another in a brighter colour.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 29-07-14 14:32; edited 1 time in total
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
DB wrote:
What colour is best? Too light and it quickly looks dirty / shabby. Too dark and the salty sweat rings show up on base layers.
For downhill, well as a photographer you want to be in yellow or red. Black is useless for photos, unless you're a photog, in which case black is practically the uniform. Personally I ride in what they give me. If I was paying then I'd avoid light colours as hydraulic fluid and other bad things don't work well with them.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I've got a stack of jackets and most of them get used at some point during the year depending on the trip / weather. Funnily enough my aging but expensive hardshell (arcteryx sidewinder) is getting less use than most of late.
cold weather lift-served skiing - ME primaloft insulated XCR jacket - wear it over a base layer, will deal with any kind of foul weather, pull one zip to dump heat and moisture which doesn't get caught up between multiple layers
late season lift-served - Mountain Hardware conduit softshell (membrane) jacket. This has taped seams and is water proof. Clearly not breathable enough for uphill work but is quiet to wear, trim fitting. Again wear it over a base layer. Doesn't have a hood which is silly but fine for lift-served skiing when I'm wearing a helmet. I wouldn't buy one now (too narrow a range of use) but its good in the role.
hiking, climbing - Arcteryx gamma softshell - classic non-membrane, highly breathable softshell that will deal with most things apart from solid rain. If I'm going far then I will have my Marmot ultra light coated breathable waterproof in my pack
ski touring - might have the gamma but probably not because I'd be too warm on the uphills and it is a bit bulky for the pack. Normally just have a midlayer or a gilet plus the Marmot shell
So these days, what would I use the sidewinder for? Sleety, rainy skiing I suppose. Also probably winter climbing (not that I've done any recently). The great thin about it is that I COULD use it for all of the above if I hadn't bought lots of other stuff that is a BIT better for the various niches. Rich world problem!
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
BTW - I looked at Paramo jackets and I do get the idea but I thought I'd find them too warm for aerobic stuff. I do run very hot though.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
jedster wrote:
BTW - I looked at Paramo jackets and I do get the idea but I thought I'd find them too warm for aerobic stuff. I do run very hot though.
You could use the Paramo stuff where you'd use the Gamma (though you don't need to, cos you've got a Gamma. Obviously) and probably have similar opinions about warmth and bulk.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Crikey 3 pages on what to wear in the rain
Most of us live in the UK. In the west and north of the UK it rains a lot, more than any where else in the rest of Europe. And it ussually very windy. Surey the answer is to wear what you would in the UK hills. Good well made breatheable jackets with really decent hoods and waterproof trousers. Conditions in central Europe and the Alps are never going to be more extreme than here
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Another reason why I love my Changabang so much. It has a brilliant stiffened hood that was designed to work with ski and climbing helmets and moves with your head instead of restricting vision. But it folds down into the collar so remains out of the way until you need it. It can make a big difference when fighting your way down in a blizzard.
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
