 Poster: A snowHead
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can they actually make people get off if they refuse?! where do you stand exactly on that??
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Gogs, I guess that the plane would be going nowhere at all until the weight was right. You'd probably find the two big guys in the seat behind would help you off after a while. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| cbowls30 wrote: |
| can they actually make people get off if they refuse?! where do you stand exactly on that?? |
'They' is an interesting term. The Aircraft Commander has the authority, see paragraph 141 of the Air Navigation Order.
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ItsSnowJoke, I worked for a summer at British Aerospace at Prestwick Airport. My office was pretty much right on the runway. I saw the IL76 take-off while carrying the British rescue submarine heading to Russia to try to help the submariners trapped on the Kursk. It was pretty much like your film!
Also saw the American equivalents (both Starlifter and the bigger one, Galaxy?) taking off regularly. They climb so slowly it doesn't seem possible.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I think Easyjet had only one flight from Birmingham to Geneva on the 27th. If this is the case, I was on this flight, it was delayed and the main reason seemed to be an BMI flight that arrived late and then left during the slot which the Easyjet flight would have uesd. The captain was then not allowed to leave and we had to wait for a slot, due to this delay, the Captain requested extra fuel due to the delay, just to add, no announcement was made to ask for passenger not to fly.
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I was on the Not so EasyJet flight from Birmingham, they told us they had put TEN tonnes of extra fuel in, then we were offered £100 to get off, even though their regulations state 250 euros. They eventually made the 36 passengers get off, the issue was that they would not guarantee that a flight would be available the next day, they threatened us by saying if the 36 did not hurry and get off none of us would fly as Geneva airport closes to incoming flights at 11.30pm, they did not give out any information unless you asked. This delayed the flight by 3 hours, we thought we were the lucky ones because we were still on the plane, they begrudgingly gave us a snack and a drink but again only if you asked. When we landed at Geneva we had missed our transfer to Val Thorens and it was midnight, OH nearly forgot the captain decided to help with the weight issue by not putting anyones hold luggage on the plane but we didn't find out until we were waiting at the carousel and no luggage appeared. We collected our luggage today at Geneva airport on the way home as they never got our luggage to us. Skiing in Val T was great but will never fly with Easyjet again
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Hmm. One first-time poster is contradicted by another first-time poster. Welcome to snowheads, both. I look forward to your credibility building up as you engage more with us.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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neveragaineasyjet, welcome to snowheads. What a miserable experience. I wonder what easyJet can come up with as their side of the story (I am an easyJet fan, but that sounds horrific).
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| achilles wrote: |
| Hmm. One first-time poster is contradicted by another first-time poster. Welcome to snowheads, both. I look forward to your credibility building up as you engage more with us. |
I don't think there's any contradiction - given the vastly different description of events they must be discussing different flights ie there must have been more than one flight from BHX to GVA that day. Perhaps neveragaineasyjet can clarify what nominal time departure flight he was on. 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| mcmitch wrote: |
| ...no announcement was made to ask for passenger not to fly. |
Passengers were defo asked to leave the plane, I saw a couple interviewed!
I am terrible for conspiracy theorys, always think there is more to things but this does seem like an almighty cock-up! Someone deserves a bollocking but I'm pretty sure EJ had no choice but to get these people off the plane for the flight to take place!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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The flight that the passengers were asked to leave was on Boxing Day, flight number EZY1496
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You know it makes sense.
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neveragaineasyjet, Ah, discrepancy with mcmitch's account resolved!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Alastair Pink, is it? Your opening post dated 28 December stated that the incident happened 'yesterday' - ie on 27 December. neveragaineasyjet says it happened on Boxing Day (ie 26 December). I am not saying this incident did not take place - but I am suspicious of first-time posters which come to snowheads to run down a company. I wish I could say I trusted the BBC news report - but I am not so sure - I don't recall easyjet comment being asked for, so I am not sure that the reporter did not pick up on some gossip.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Gogs,
The captain rules in an aircraft. If he tells you yo get off, you must or he is entitled to call in police/have you removed by force.
Many people forget that in civilian aircraft..
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Gogs wrote: |
Good to see that the police have so little to do that they have time to get involved in what is essentially a private matter between a company and its customers. Would love to know what law I would be breaking if I refuse to volunteer to fly out the next day or if I refuse to get off the plane because I declined to pay for speedy boarding and happened to be at the back of the queue at check-in.  |
Nope. The aircraft commander has all the authority he needs to ensure that the safety of the flight will not be jeopardized. I reckon you would have been looking at crime, not a 'private' matter, had those ordered to get off continued not to do so in the circumstances reported. That said, if the incident did take place, and I had been one of the customers affected, I would have been a most unhappy bunny.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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It happened! It was all over the local news, it's just to what extent. As I've commented it seems to me like a huge one off cock-up and won't stop me flying EJ, in fact I'd have been tempted by £100!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| achilles wrote: |
| Gogs wrote: |
| Good to see that the police have so little to do that they have time to get involved in what is essentially a private matter between a company and its customers. Would love to know what law I would be breaking if I refuse to volunteer to fly out the next day or if I refuse to get off the plane because I declined to pay for speedy boarding and happened to be at the back of the queue at check-in. |
Nope. The aircraft commander has all the authority he needs to ensure that the safety of the flight will not be jeopardized. I reckon you would have been looking at crime, not a 'private' matter, had those ordered to get off continued not to do so in the circumstances reported. That said, if the incident did take place, and I had been one of the customers affected, I would have been a most unhappy bunny. |
Who do you think you are, just because I am new? I am trying to track down anyone else that was on the flight so that we can sue Easyjet, I don't seem to be able to access the news item on Central News or Midlands Today, but I did speak to Michael Collie at Midlands Today to let them know that removing the 36 passengers was only half the story, and he told me that they had tried to contact EasyJet but they had not responded. I am not making this up, I am livid.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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neveragaineasyjet, its great to get info like this first hand. Don't let a couple of questions put you off, and good luck when you try and get some redress from Easy Jet. You will know when you are really at home here when they take a pop at your grammar/spelling. Please keep us up to date on how you get on.
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jbob, agreed
| achilles wrote: |
| Hmm. One first-time poster is contradicted by another first-time poster. Welcome to snowheads, both. I look forward to your credibility building up as you engage more with us. |
Are you f**cign serious? Perhaps you could help us all by telling us exactly how many posts people need in order to acquire so called credibility and earn your revered respect. Why don't you wait to see if there's simple explanation for the discrepancy before appointing yourself judge and jury and handing down a sentence of "no credibility".
Honestly, I've rarely seen anything so pompous and self important. It's an attitude that's been creeping more and more into Snowheads, and it's certainly contributed to my reading and posting less often. Shame, because there's so much useful information here, you just have to wade through the arrogance and pomposity to get to it.
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| Dr John wrote: |
| .....Are you f**cign serious? Perhaps you could help us all by telling us exactly how many posts people need in order to acquire so called credibility and earn your revered respect. |
Rather more than one when a totally unknown poster comes in slanging off a company - particularly one that many of us have use without much of a serious hitch.
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| Honestly, I've rarely seen anything so pompous and self important. |
You've lived a sheltered life.
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| It's an attitude that's been creeping more and more into Snowheads, and it's certainly contributed to my reading and posting less often. |
Most of us will cope with that, provided we have access to adequate counseling.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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achilles, many thanks for the arrogant and pompous confirmation of your arrogance and pomposity.
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Dr John, not at ll - my pleasure. 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| maggi wrote: |
OK children. Now play nicely  .
This is weird. Apparently this happened. It was on the BBC and people watched interviews with people on the plane. Now, not being as cynical as achilles, I believe neveragaineasyjet was on the plane. Why would he make this up? But the BBC no longer has the news item showing and, like the man said, the only thing that google comes up with is this thread Doesn't anyone else think that's odd? There must be a plane full of disgruntled passengers (plus friends, relatives etc) and nobody has had any media contact? |
Thanks, I would definately like to hear from anyone that was on the plane, I was in a party of 10 and we think if we had a big group we would stand a better chance of nailing Easyjet, at the moment the 36 who left the flight, appear to have ended up with a better deal, as they flew out the next day with their luggage and 250 euros compensation, we missed the first days skiing as we had no ski gear, ended up buying new ski wear and hiring ski's boots etc. and being in a very small village at the top of a mountain paid a fortune.
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| neveragaineasyjet wrote: |
| achilles wrote: |
| Gogs wrote: |
| Good to see that the police have so little to do that they have tim e to get involved in what is essentially a private matter between a company and its customers. Would love to know what law I would be breaking if I refuse to volunteer to fly out the next day or if I refuse to get off the plane because I declined to pay for speedy boarding and happened to be at the back of the queue at check-in. |
Nope. The aircraft commander has all the authority he needs to ensure that the safety of the flight will not be jeopardized. I reckon you would have been looking at crime, not a 'private' matter, had those ordered to get off continued not to do so in the circumstances reported. That said, if the incident did take place, and I had been one of the customers affected, I would have been a most unhappy bunny. |
Who do you think you are, just because I am new? ..... |
I fail to see how a post/reply addressed to another poster, i.e. Gogs, about the general prerogatives of a captain in his aircraft and nothing to do with your particular case, manages to get you so offended.
Especially when Achilles mentions that had he been in your case, he'd have been quite unhappy.
Maybe you should try and direct your anger at the right people, i.e. Ezy or the airport operator or the fuel guy or etc... there aren't enough details to know who is to blame for the cock-up at this stage. It might well be Ezy's fault, it might not be...
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| maggi wrote: |
| ........Now, not being as cynical as achilles, I believe neveragaineasyjet was on the plane. Why would he make this up?.............. |
Spreading disinformation for commercial reasons was an obvious thought. Only airlines would have a reason to do that though, and I am sure that never happens.
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Poster: A snowHead
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achilles, but the BBC started it! Although we know how they're always spreading disinformation  .
As the likeliest explanation is usually the true one, neveragaineasyjet was on the plane and was trying to find other passengers in order to facilitate his claim. He googled the event and found snowHeads. I've no axe to grind with Easyjet. I've used them a lot and found them perfectly adequate.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Kruisler wrote: |
| neveragaineasyjet wrote: |
| achilles wrote: |
| Gogs wrote: |
| Good to see that the police have so little to do that they have tim e to get involved in what is essentially a private matter between a company and its customers. Would love to know what law I would be breaking if I refuse to volunteer to fly out the next day or if I refuse to get off the plane because I declined to pay for speedy boarding and happened to be at the back of the queue at check-in. |
Nope. The aircraft commander has all the authority he needs to ensure that the safety of the flight will not be jeopardized. I reckon you would have been looking at crime, not a 'private' matter, had those ordered to get off continued not to do so in the circumstances reported. That said, if the incident did take place, and I had been one of the customers affected, I would have been a most unhappy bunny. |
Who do you think you are, just because I am new? ..... |
I fail to see how a post/reply addressed to another poster, i.e. Gogs, about the general prerogatives of a captain in his aircraft and nothing to do with your particular case, manages to get you so offended.
Especially when Achilles mentions that had he been in your case, he'd have been quite unhappy.
Maybe you should try and direct your anger at the right people, i.e. Ezy or the airport operator or the fuel guy or etc... there aren't enough details to know who is to blame for the cock-up at this stage. It might well be Ezy's fault, it might not be... |
OMG being new to snowheads I replied to one post, criticising me, on another post by the same author ie Achilles
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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maggi, if you believe everything that the BBC shows - particularly when prepared by regional hacks, you have a very sweet nature. I didn't see the passenger interviews, though, which could well have been convincing. Frankly, I thought it quite probable that neveragaineasyjet had been off-loaded, but OTOH his post was in conflict with that of another first-time poster, so I didn't know what the true story was. As Kruisler has said, we have no way of knowing who was responsible for the problem with the information presented here.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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neveragaineasyjet, I was on that flight. Lucky enough to have front row seating for the whole show down... I was sat in the seat right next to the door. Hearing quotes from the captain "you've put the wrong fuel in", and the best one... Me - "how are you going to sort out all the bags once 36 have left", EJ clipboard lady - "it is fine we have the code numbers for each bags. The bags will be fine"...
I should have gone with my gut feeling that something was completely up. Those who left the flight got an INFINATELY better deal. 250EUR, and a flight the next day WITH YOUR GEAR. The EasyJet fkup cost me about 500EUR and a days skiing.
I arrived at my chalet in Chamonix at 3am. 12 hours of travelling. It should have been 5. The next day was spent renting and buying equipment THAT I ALREADY HAD – not cheap. 3 days later I got my bag back. ONLY BECAUSE I WENT BACK FROM CHAMONIX TO GENEVA to get it… I hope others realized this was the only way.
I am beyond livid. I would be happy to go all the way and see if we can nail them. Embarrassment to the industry. They should be seriously dealt with. It was the manner that they dealt with the situation that frustrates me. Complete incompetence, combined with lies…
Lets discuss
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People often ask me why I use a TO for my trips, situations like this are the easy answer. Don't think I'll be DIYing it again in a hurry. Oooh, I could save £4 per person by booking my own flights, or I could go with a TO that has some responsibility for sorting things out...
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Another first poster, Achilles? Ha ha!
Ok, I know something seriously wrong happened on that flight and I do belive these people are just getting home after there nightmare journey and are looking into other travellers storys.
But to the newcomers here snowheads does have a history of people resigning up to creare an argument so although achilles does talk alot of sh*te he does occasionally help so give him the benefit of jumping the gun on this one, and good luck on your attempt to nobble the corporation!
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I haven't bothered to look up whether an A319 has a fuel dump capability. Smaller passenger jets do not. But it would not be relevant. Fuel dumping is an emergency procedure only.
Passenger aeroplanes cannot always take-off with a full payload and a full fuel load. There is often a trade-off to be calculated.
thirty06, is right about take-off performance considerations. But in the reported case the restriction was likely to be landing weight, not take-off weight.
The probable overload is reasonably estimated by Markymark29, at 3.6 tons.
Aviation fuel loads are always calculated by mass and not by volume (as recommended by achilles,) because the mass represents the energy content. For an aeroplane of that size to burn the excess fuel on a sector of that (short) length would not be possible except by extensive holding.
Fuelling errors do occur, either because of mechanical failure, or human error. An overfuelling error is more common than an underfuelling error.
Aeroplanes can be defueled on the ground. But it requires the use of a sterile bowser to avoid potential contamination of the bowser and/or airport fuel storage system. Organising it usually involves a significant delay.
The charges known as "landing fees" are indeed proportional to weight, but not to actual landing weight. They are charged on a scale related to maximum certificated take-off weight. To benefit from lower charges, an airline would have to obtain an amendment to the aeroplane's certificate. This is sometimes done on a seasonal basis, but never ad hoc. As you can imagine, the Authority charges for certificate amendments.
I do not know any of the background to this particular story. But since we all like to speculate, the error was probably either human or mechanical. The remedy chosen was almost certainly selected for commercial reasons, and most likely for reasons connected with the consequences of delay.
On the legal question of whether the police should have been involved in what looks like a dispute over contract, the airline may well have relied upon the Air Navigation Order provision that requires persons on an aeroplane to obey all lawful commands of the commander. The police are more likely to have seen it as a public safety matter.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Unless Hurjam you are infact achilles!
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Not achilles.. And i dont blog for fun. A little respect here please..
Monium, ive done enough travelling on enough airlines and to enough places that a TO isnt the most effective way. Not sure how they would have helped in this case.
Bottom line, is easyjet takes too many honest people for a ride, or not as the case maybe...
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FAQ
Welcome to Snowheads 
. Sorry your first post was about such a bad experience. 
BUT 4 days skiing better than none.
, but you'll also find this site a source of really useful information if you're interested in skiing/snowboarding. Plus meeting some of the people in reality (look at the 