 Poster: A snowHead
|
Tragic news. RIP and condolences to the family...
Must have been a freak accident to happen on a beginner slope but sounds similar to something that happened to an aunt of mine who tripped and fell whilst walking her dog. Two days later she was in a coma, and eventually her life support machine was switched off...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Very sad news  .
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7949195.stm
| Quote: |
Leading neurosurgeon Chris Chandler said a seemingly minor blow on the head can cause life-threatening injuries.
Mr Chandler, from King's College Hospital in south London, said the effects of a blow to the head may not become apparent until several hours afterwards and, if untreated, a patient can fall into a coma.
"A blow to the head can cause a bruise or rupture a blood vessel that slowly swells, causing pressure to build up inside the skull," he said.
"In the skull there is nowhere for the brain to move to so pressure continues to grow and that swelling can cause the brain to malfunction because it can limit circulation.
"If that pressure is not relieved it can kill." |
Really makes me think how lucky we were after the OH's fall onto a hard piste last week, banged his head hard and was unconscious for about 5 mins. He was wearing a helmet, thankfully otherwise I'm sure it could have been a lot more serious. Piste patrol took him up to the top of the mountain where we could get a gondola all the way down to Fiss but he seemed OK, we didn't hurry, stopped to have drink and for him to 'recover' in the restaurant at the top for about an hour. He was complaining of a bad headache but I never thought of how serious the injury could have been. Luckily he's OK now. I shall definitely take it much more seriously if either of us has a knock to the head in the future...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
A real shame
| Quote: |
Those closest to late actress Natasha Richardson have revealed there was "no hope" for the late 45-year-old star after she was removed from life support on Wednesday.
On Tuesday the Brit was flown to New York's Lenox Hill Hospital from Montreal, Canada, where she suffered an accident while learning to ski.
Concern for her health grew when doctors at a local hospital described her condition as critical.
Her actor husband Liam Neeson stalled film work on his new movie Chloe to be by his wife's bedside, and he flew with her to New York, where he was joined by Richardson's mother Vanessa Redgrave and other family members and close friends.
She was removed from life support on Wednesday morning and died hours later.
Just before the tragic news was confirmed by Richardson's publicist Alan Nierob, close pal Ted Casablanca reported the family members spent Wednesday afternoon saying their goodbyes to the actress on his Eonline.com blog.
He wrote, "The two-day vigil is over. Close relations to Natasha Richardson tell me there is no hope for the 45-year-old actress."
And in a tribute to his friend, the blogger and US TV personality adds, "I've known Natasha Richardson so long, I was at her first wedding to producer Robert Fox. Her bridal selection was a creamy, lovely ivory, a pantsuit actually (very classy), with a decolletage down to her navel. Was pretty fun stuff. I'd already become very fond of her, interviewing her extensively for my old gig, Premiere, but that damn nervy wedding look made me love her even more!
"It was vintage Natasha: classy yet seductive. Just like she was in The Parent Trap when she lured wayward Dennis Quaid back into her clipped, British seductress ways. Go, Tash! That's precisely how she was in life.
"And true to the sexy lady's ways, after marrying Fox, she decided Liam Neeson was the man for her, divorced Robert and started up with the Oscar-nominated stud for a life of interesting domestic love in upstate New York."
He reveals "levity" was his friend's hallmark, adding, "Her equal senses of humour and grace were paramount to her... I can still hear Tash's self-deprecating, throaty laugh telling me she didn't even think she was that gorgeous.
"How wrong she was. Bless you, Tash, wherever you are." |
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/1/20090319/ten-pal-reveals-there-was-no-hope-for-ri-c60bd6d.html
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
Very sad news indeed. Condolences to the family.
RIP Natasha
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
R I P
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
Condolences to her family and friends.
RIP
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Very sad news.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dreadful news.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
So sad news.
A friend witnessed something similar happen on a school skiing trip. One of the other teachers fell and bumped her head then died a few days later. Turns out she had a brain tumor (IIRC) and the bump merely hastened the inevitable. Obviously, I cannot know at this stage but I wouldn't be surprised if there is another contributory factor in this case too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Before I get anywhere near a piste again I will be buying a helmet. Horse riders wear them (they fall from a height), cyclists wear them (they would impact on concrete) - what - do skiers think they are invincible or something?
Stupidity I call it. You are on a surface that is intentionally "piste bashed" to smooth it all down. Of course there will be hard patches, especially in north facing slopes. Even when you are stationary, waiting for your intructor - if you are a novice - skis are quite hard to control. There are trees around, there are stupid skiers and boarders who have a total disregard for their fellow skiers/boarders and career out of control and usually fuelled by some lunchtime wine/
don't kid yourself into thinking this is a freak accident. you are deluding yourselves. She went head first down the slope. Which I have done many times (on blues as well as greens - not so much reds for some reason - fear more than likely).
My life is worth more than £45 for a helmet. First thing i'm buying...and I bet if you do a demographic, a higher percentage of men are against helmets than women. Says it all really.
Wake up and smell the coffee. Although skiing isn't dangerous per say - if other sportsmen wear helmets - they must do for a reason!! - Look forward to skiing at 70 and being a cantekrous old git! Don't let your life be snuffed out my a moment of stupidity.
Sorry -but shocked by this story and genuinely gobsmaked that people think wearing helmets isn't the done thing.
Sarah
xx
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
Very sad. And very bad luck.
The chances of a minor closed head injury (no penetration of the skull) causing severe brain injury is small.
(Closed Head Trauma)
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
why take the risk though? that's like saying the chances of being in a car accident and being unlucky enough not to be wearing your seatbelt are small - which they are. but 90% of people now wear seatbelts. it's all about education.
My friend hit a cow in the middle of the road with her car for christs sake - THAT'S a freak accident. Falling on a piste is not a freak accident - it happens all the time - developing a brain injury is the small chance but i'm sure "could" have been avoided with helmetage. Even for beginners or people in lessons as a starting point!. Would like to hear a doctors opinion on that though...
such a shame - I really had my fingers crossed for her pulling through. I don't think she ever woke up after getting to hospital though did she? Heartfelt condolences to the family.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Jonpim, is spot on - I am very pro-helmet, but this case is very unusual. As lawyers say "Hard Cases make Bad Law".
There are plenty of good reasons for wearing a lid. This tragedy is not one of them unless you plan to wear a helmet every time you leave your house on a rainy or icy day.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
Poor woman, what a tragic, terrible accident.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
stoatsbrother, so you don't think it's a good reason to wear a helmet if you are learning to ski and quite likely to fall over regularly and have MORE of a chance of hitting your head than anyone else? 
"There are plenty of good reasons for wearing a lid. This tragedy is not one of them"
you are kidding?!! If I ran a ski school I would INSIST every beginner regardless of age wore a helmet. Perhaps it's been a long time since you were a beginner - but we fall over. A LOT. Hence we have more chance of sustaining a head injury! Good lord....
I think that is a bloody good reason for wearing a helmet!!! And I will do my part by recommending them to anyone I speak to who wants to take up skiing or boarding for this VERY reason and citing Natasha's accident. I hope some good will come from this terrible tragedy and avoid further pointless loss of life.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
queen_sheba, seatbelts are a poor analogy IMHO - a huge number of people have RTAs where seatbelts are life-saving (and the evidence is way clearer than for helmets). I would say most drivers sooner or later are involved in an RTA where a seatbelt at least mitigates injuries. If you fully adopt a precatuionary principle - you will never leave your house, eat any food, drink any water, bretahe any air/
It is possible the helmet might have saved her - but I have a friend who had the same problem occur (thankfully recovered) hitting his head on a door frame.
As I say - plenty of good reasons for wearing lids - but this accident should not be one of them - any more than an air crash on a tuesday should make you fly wednesdays.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
queen_sheba, you misread the post.
| Quote: |
| so you don't think it's a good reason to wear a helmet if you are learning to ski and quite likely to fall over regularly and have MORE of a chance of hitting your head than anyone else? |
On the contrary - I believe all adult skiers should wear helmets as beginners and be encouraged to continue to do so - and that all children skiers should be legally required to wear helmets all the time when skiing (as in Italy).
I think however a hysterical press and industry over-reaction to this single incident is not called for. We have seen the same problem with Jade Goody and smear policy discussions.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
I completely disagree (this is in response to your previous post). I think you are over simplifying things and precautionary measures are in place with many other high impact sports; horse riding, cycling for example. I wouldn't get on a horse without a helmet - how is this any different?
There are plenty of good reasons for wearing helmets and this IS one of them. She was a beginner. More likely to fall over - hence thereforth it would make sense for her to minimise her risk by wearing a helmet.
I can't see how you can disagree with this? So you advocate beginners heading out onto the slopes, never been on a pair of skis, unsteady on their feet and blithey sliding about without any head protection??? - Again -
like I said, we beginners fall a lot. I'm sure it's less of a worry for those people who glide about gracefully all day, never coming off their skis, with one still halfway up the slope and you heading down the slope without it - but it is a fact of life - beginner skiers fall over. therefore should wear helmets.
thanks
**sorry you reposted while I was in the middle of typing this - I think what you are saying is that we sholdn't use this incident as a reason to encourage people to wear helmets - again - I have to disagree - I think it's an excellent case in point**
I also think this is worth a read
http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/the_way_we_live/article5934246.ece
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Thu 19-03-09 11:27; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
queen_sheba, nope - low impact acute subdural/extradural bleeds in young people - which is what this sounds like - could be set off by almost anything that happens in your every day life. The reported trauma was minimal.
It is a really really poor case. Plenty of better reasons.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
She could have slipped in the shower at home with the same tragic consequences.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Before we rush into print re-igniting the helmet debate, doesn't anyone think it wold be a good idea to get the results of the post-mortem?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Helen Beaumont, precisely
Gordyjh, given that she had scans showing cause of death prior to death - I would be suprised if there is a post mortem - however scan details are beginning to leak out.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Quote: |
| My friend hit a cow in the middle of the road with her car for christs sake |
In which case, it is clear that all cows should be banned from the UK, and all people required to be vegetarian.
Nonsense. Yesterday's Telegraph reported that the injury was consistent with a NECK injury.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
okay - i'm still not 100% clear on your point stoatsbrother, . It is still a case, you personally think it's not a very good one - but you accept it is still "a" case none-the less.
It doesn't really matter anyway - i'm in charge of my own personal safety and this example has made me ensure I wear a helmet at all times - whether it's a strong case for wearing one or a "really really poor one" I've made my decision and I genuinely hope that it will at least have encouraged a few more people into helmets (at the end of the day they will appreciate all the right reasons)
what you have to remember is the power of the media and celebrity. It doesn't matter whether you like it or agree with it. Look at the case of Kylie - when people heard about her breast cancer, the people getting screened jumped 30%
Surely that has saved some lives? It's the same with Jade Goody. Love her or hate her - she has increased awareness. Sometimes that's just enough. I don't think it is as you say....
"a hysterical press and industry over-reaction to this single incident is not called for. We have seen the same problem with Jade Goody and smear policy discussions."
so what? If it encourages just ONE woman to get a smear test that didn't before and it saves just ONE life - surely that's worth it??!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
queen_sheba, The problem with the Jade Goody case is that cervical cancer in younger age groups does not seem to be prevented by cervical screening, whereas it does in older groups. So if you overload the system with young people who will not benefit from screening it harms the older people who would benefit.
As regards Kylie - Breast screening has not shown to be useful in the under 45's - and has a relatively small effect in the 45-74 year age group - but is saving some lives. I would be a lot more impressed if a celebrity in their 50s with Breast Cancer or Cervical Cancer was used as an example - but no - we like our sufferers young and pretty.
Similar thing with prostate screening in people with no symptoms - no evidence at all that it is worth doing and saves lives.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
I look at it this way -I wouldnt wear a bike without a helmet, so why would I ski without one?
I don't understand all this bravado over I'm not going to wear a helmet - You get one brain and call me old fashioned but i'm quite attached to it and do actually use it quite a bit!!!!! if I can protect it in anyway I will. Skiing is a dangerous sport ! - An accident is an accident usually unforseen and unexpected and it can happen to any of us ,be it a fall , collision with other skiers or hitting trees,rocks etc no one is immune - I just think its sensless not to wear one. Anyone who thinks wearing one makes you invulnerable and able to ski faster should grow up and maybe look at what they are trying to achieve particularly on crowded pistes. I had a couple of occasions last week whilst in Flaine of watching skiers taking air amongst other skiers, one actually brushed me at shoulder height,what would have happened if I'd turned on to his path? In my opinion we need The European Pistes patrolled the way the Americans do with immediate powwers to revoke lift passes!! What happens if you had an accident and were left impaired when a helmet could have saved you or mitigated its effects? Its not just you, but your family too that are affected and its bloody selfish not to think about them.
For me its simple - on or off piste you wear a helmet - the next thing will be that Insurance Companies will not give you Winter Sports Cover without you wearing one, if it just saves one extra life its worth it be it a girl down the street or an Internationally renowned actress.
My heartfelt condolences to the Richardson family
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
marksovereign, I agree with 95% of what you say... I have been wearing lids for 7 years now.
But what if everyone wearing helmets really did save just "one extra life" and it took 2 million UK recreational skiers wearing lids to do that at a cost of £50 each every 5 years. Then you would be costing saving one life at £20,000,000 per year. And there are dozens of interventions which that money could be spent on which would be more effective in death reduction. For every implementation of a widespread safety measure there is an "Opportunity Cost". You choose to spend the money on that - you cannot spend it on something else.
Anytime anyone says "If just one life is saved - it is worth it" they are usually wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hopefully out of this sad story, perhaps some good will come out of it? A high profile case like this will surely raise skiers/boarders awareness of wearing helmets. My kids have worn them from first day on slopes, BUT I do not. I have worn a cyclying helmet for 15 years now, so why not whilst skiing? I have been giving it a lot of thought recently and whilst this story will not make me rush out and buy one today it will probably be on my Xmas pressie list.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
| stoatsbrother wrote: |
marksovereign, I agree with 95% of what you say... I have been wearing lids for 7 years now.
But what if everyone wearing helmets really did save just "one extra life" and it took 2 million UK recreational skiers wearing lids to do that at a cost of £50 each every 5 years. Then you would be costing saving one life at £20,000,000 per year. And there are dozens of interventions which that money could be spent on which would be more effective in death reduction. For every implementation of a widespread safety measure there is an "Opportunity Cost". You choose to spend the money on that - you cannot spend it on something else.
Anytime anyone says "If just one life is saved - it is worth it" they are usually wrong. |
I think you are taking that a bit too literally - my point is that £50 - £100 for a helmet - not a bad trade off against keeping you head safe really is it? Dare I say a 'no - brainer' ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
marksovereign, agreed - as my personal decisions show.
Your response is rather more nuanced than some of the posters in this thread who seem to be saying: - "this injury - which is a bizarre and unlikely one which could have happened with any minor trauma at home - has made me change my mind and I will now where a helmet when all the evidence and opinion available before could not convince me". 
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Thu 19-03-09 13:25; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
I've always worn a helmet when skiing. My boyfriend insisted on it when I was learning. Said it was an important piece of safety equipment. I laughed at him for saying that, but wore my helmet anyway, feeling a bit daft to be honest at having to wear one. I'm afraid I thought I was far too cool to be wearing one. But after a couple of falls on the snow, and various friends doing the same and hitting their heads, including one being wacked by a chair lift when she fell off dismounting, I have to say I would never ever consider doing even a nursery slope without one now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
I was very saddened to hear of this accident and her subsequent death, my condolences go to her family and friends.
I wear a helmet having fallen on a path, not skiing but in a ski resort, and ended up with staples in my head to repair the hole. Obviously I have a very thick skull but having done that was given very little choice in the matter by my family  even though my resistance was still very strong. Now, having worn it for two seasons, I would feel very unsure not wearing one whenever I am skiing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
Wearing a helmet when skiing has got to be a good idea hasn't it 
Having said that despite my kids, husband and brother wearing helmets I haven't worn one, I've been thinking all season that I should as I'm skiing steeper and faster but just haven't got round to buying one.......until today. The sad news of Natasha Richardson's death has galvanized me into buying one this morning and quite honestly I can't for the life of me understand why it took so long.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
stoatsbrother, You should be in politics - you seem to have a need to argue about absolutely anything and the ability to spin totally out of context points.
That ridiculous £20,000,000 thing ... ahahaha .... anyone can pull fiction out of nowhere! What if all those people didn't spend that £50 each on helmets? They might just blow it on booze and fags, and overburden the the world's health resources with illnesses instead, but then think of the tax government collects from these things, but then remember they spend that on something else, but then but then but then ....
Sorry, but everything you say, makes you seem (to me) to be arguing for some personal gratification.
'Could have' arguments are nonsense - the woman had an accident whilst on the snow, and has sadly now died. Why is it so important to you that you tell everyone that this particular accident shouldn't count statistically towards any decision someone else makes about helmets?
Sorry, I'm not normally like this ... I haven't had any beer today ... and nothing here to letch at either .. makes me a bit grumpy.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| Quote: |
queen_sheba, The problem with the Jade Goody case is that cervical cancer in younger age groups does not seem to be prevented by cervical screening, whereas it does in older groups. So if you overload the system with young people who will not benefit from screening it harms the older people who would benefit.
|
More to the point why has Jade Goody's case not led to a higher demand for the HPV vaccine? There may be a touch of "I'm not like her", but it is not just people like her who are dying of cervical cancer. Sorry for the diversion on a ski forum, but
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
beequin, very good point. And we have seen a lot of interest recently - so hopefully the message is getting through.
beeryletcher, read the posts and take a deep breath  I am very pro-helmet - as those who have been around a while know. I am arguing that people should - as jonpim points out - be aware that this particular chain of events was both very unlucky and very rare and probably not the best on which to base personal or public policy.
I am arguing against the perennial knee-jerk cries of "something must be done" and "if one life is saved..." and yes - people actually taking decisions about any interventions do have to consider the Opportunity Cost. Taking your example -if the punters spend the money on booze and fags - the higher tax rate may pay for more safety measures in other areas.
arbee, Agreed on exposure - and guess where I wear the helmet. I think my point here is that this particular person has sustained an unusual injury with very low impact which might have happened to her in other low impact situations, and that it is better to look at more typical scenarios and injuries when forming policies.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Very saddened by the news.
RIP Natasha , a beautiful person.
My heart goes out to her family, and especially to her mother and siblings, as I too lost a daughter-- in a bicyle accident.
I was just packing to go skiing in a few days time, and was even thinking how bulky the helmet is to pack( I recently bought but have not yet had a chance to wear)--and was wondering if I'll wear it... and of course now am reminded it is an essential piece of equipment.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
I've hit my head pretty badly quite a few times whilst learning to snowboard on hardpack, hearing the high pitched whine, fuzziness, instant headache, etc. I guess I was lucky I didn't get concussion or worse. However, whilst I would agree in hindsight that all beginner snowboarders should have a helmet (nothing worse than catching a heel edge and having your skull thrown against what feels like a marble floor), I certainly wouldn't support a compulsory wearing of helmet for all boarders. I've never hit my head since my first two seasons, and feel my chances of accident would be increased by the encumbrance of a helmet. I'm the same way on cycling. Beginners sure, but a helmet does little if you ski off a cliff or get run over by a lorry.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
[
I'm still missing the point here somehow - Why are people intimating that helmets are only for beginners? When was the last time you saw a downhill ski racer compete withjout a helmet?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
