 Poster: A snowHead
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| billb wrote: |
| I think a lot of state schools have stopped doing ski trips because of the extensive risk assessments involved and actually getting teachers, even keen skiers, to volunteer. I don't blame them - such a high risk activity is too worrying especially if you are the party leader. I know that's a pity but that's how it is now. My (now adult) children's state school didn't do them (we took them ourselves). Being able to afford £2200 for just one child is another world for me! |
I don't really think that's the case and anyone using that as the reason is deflecting from some other agenda. Staff can, I'm sure, be reluctant, but at my place I almost get bribes from staff wanting on the visit.
I've run/continue to run ski trips for an FE college, for well over a over a decade.
Risk assessments are standard - it's just a simple process - really not onerous.
What I think is more likely is that someone higher up thinks it's overly risky or has an aversion to kids learning outside the classroom. You'd be amazed how many managers/leaders think kids should just stay in a classroom for 38 weeks a year!
Similarly, when I first asked to run a ski trip, my boss said "kids round here don't go skiing!" (small, Northern, working class city).
Getting the right deal has always been the priority to make the trip as inclusive and accessible as possible.
This year's cost - £1165 - is the most we have ever paid, and we've always gone by coach in the past AND we have ALL food included this time.
I guess I've tempted fate now and it will all go Tango Uniform!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@NickYoung, I think it's great you're still running trips - well done! I hope it goes well but a ski trip is, obviously, an elevated risk. I'm guessing it's younger staff who are more willing to go as you get more risk averse as you age.
I was in FE and accompanied one trip to Italy in 1986. No injuries, went well. But as others have said, as staff, you're on duty 24 hours really. I also took students dry slope skiing in those days and like to think I introduced a few of them to a great lifelong activity. Again, no injuries, I got away with it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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It was recently announced that ours still has a few places available. And it will have one more as my daughter is trying to pull out (bad ankle hasn’t healed).
It was a great experience for the older one to mix with children from the year above. Didn’t happen so much for the younger one last year, sadly.
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| billb wrote: |
@NickYoung, I think it's great you're still running trips - well done! I hope it goes well but a ski trip is, obviously, an elevated risk. I'm guessing it's younger staff who are more willing to go as you get more risk averse as you age.
I was in FE and accompanied one trip to Italy in 1986. No injuries, went well. But as others have said, as staff, you're on duty 24 hours really. I also took students dry slope skiing in those days and like to think I introduced a few of them to a great lifelong activity. Again, no injuries, I got away with it. |
Thank you!
Agree 100%.
There are of course times when I question my sanity, but I'm still feeling on the right side of the risk-reward balance.
The outcomes are genuinely joyous! One day it'll end!
The most annoying bit is colleagues who keep commenting about the "holiday"! 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@EarthWindandWater, that's a whole different thread discussing how much people spend on their own trips!
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| NickYoung wrote: |
| Similarly, when I first asked to run a ski trip, my boss said "kids round here don't go skiing!" (small, Northern, working class city). |
The first time I went skiing was with the school in a small northern town where people didn't ski. Roll on a considerable number of years and here I am working as a ski instructor for the last 10 years. It wouldn't have happened without that school trip and a mother that appreciated the cultural values that international travel could provide. Now I sometimes teach school groups and the differences in the kids is amazing. Some school's kids are really supportive of each other while still being competitive, some are horrible to each other with many looking for excuses not to ski. Some school's teachers have a holiday while still keeping a quiet eye on what is going on, other school's staff have a really stressful time dealing with the crap kids throw at them. There is also always a top group (however small) taught by an ex national level racer, so always kept amused.
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@EarthWindandWater, you have a family ski trip to Austria for £1000
Talk us through that - line by line - unless you're a family of 1
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| mishmash83 wrote: |
| Tristero wrote: |
| mishmash83 wrote: |
Can anyone share how much their children’s school ski trips cost?
Just curious… my child’s school has just advertised one for Easter holidays next year at ~£2200, which is a lot but it is in Canada!! |
Eco-friendly, humble choice. What kind of school is that? Is everyone supposed to be going? Genuinely curious. |
No, it’s only 40 places first come first served for everyone below GCSE age!
They have been before and it’s to Jasper, so really long flight plus a really long transfer (think maybe 5-6 hours) so it’s really far to go for a week in my opinion!! |
School ski trips are invariably outsourced to niche TOs. They are able to book modestly priced hotels that can cater for large parties (high number of twin, triple etc rooms and the ability to mass cater at meal times), arrange equipment hire, tuition etc. Hence, there are a select number of resorts where such trips take place. Les 2Alpes, Sauze and dare I say Jasper. Our 16Y old who is an excellent + very technical skier went to Jasper last year. He was knackered by the time he got there (flew into Calgary). The time difference doesn’t help. He found the skiing mundane and boring (granted, he’s a spoilt brat who is afforded the luxury of 3 ski trips in a normal season). His favourite bit was stopping off at Lake Louise and jumping through the ice, getting soaked to the bone in the process on the return journey. We paid £1,750 last April.
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| red 27 wrote: |
@EarthWindandWater, you have a family ski trip to Austria for £1000
Talk us through that - line by line - unless you're a family of 1 |
£4k.
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My sons school ski trip (also in Canada) cost me close to nothing! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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£1,150 for 7 days - only 5 of them skiing. Includes everything - flights, full board, evening swimming, bowling, lessons for 2 hours in am and same in pm in Passo Tonale, Italy. 9-16 Dec 23
Biggest surprise was my 12 year old left us at 159cm tall - measured the week before so his skis were the right size and came back 163cm tall. Apparently a week of skiing, mountain air ,breakfast and then 4 adult bowls of pasta a day sent him into a growth spurt!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
Biggest surprise was my 12 year old left us at 159cm tall - measured the week before so his skis were the right size and came back 163cm tall
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5cm a week. That is scary. Especially when it comes to buying new clothes.
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You know it makes sense.
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I’m guessing he slipped out under his chairlift’s bar and was hanging on underneath for half the ride up. He didn’t grow, he stretched.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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So how is it that some schools manage to get to Canada, yet many of us say Canada is becoming too expensive eg because of the lift tickets?
Bought from discounting resellers? Special block booking price? They are expensive but cheaper accommodation subsidises it?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Orange200 wrote: |
| I’m guessing he slipped out under his chairlift’s bar and was hanging on underneath for half the ride up. He didn’t grow, he stretched. |
We couldn’t believe it. He walked out of airport arrivals and I was like he looks taller. Must be because I haven’t seen him for a week. Got home about 10.30pm and my wife was like he looks much taller than when he went. So next morning we measured him to check and 4cm taller.
Yes - thankfully he wears shorts all the time so no need to buy a bunch of new trousers but the tracksuit bottoms we bought him to go on the trip are now above his ankles so they lasted all of 2 weeks!!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Fascinating! I just can't imagine what makes teachers inclined to go on an unpaid very stressful work-trip during their holidays? Are they so badly paid they can't afford skiing on their own dime or what is it?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Tristero wrote: |
| Are they so badly paid they can't afford skiing on their own dime or what is it? |
If you look at a) the fact they can only travel in school holidays, and b) teacher salaries, then you get a pretty rapid answer to your question.
Particularly if said teacher has recently graduated and is carrying £60k+ of debt.
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A mate just shelled out £1600 all in (UK state school) for a week long yr9 trip to VT for his son. . .felt expensive to me given the accom etc but he had a good experience and came back unscathed which is the main priority. My question was / is - does the perceived excess supplement the teachers holiday cost either partially or in totality? (tin hat on apols to any teachers on here as I'm sure its a stressful experience!)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| mishmash83 wrote: |
Can anyone share how much their children’s school ski trips cost?
Just curious… my child’s school has just advertised one for Easter holidays next year at ~£2200, which is a lot but it is in Canada!! |
I'm running 3 trips for our school
Finland - £2200 includes husky sledding, ice fishing etc AI
Italy - £1k ski trip AI
Canada £2400 AI
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My son's trip to Andorra cost 1200£ last year. Its a state school and he loved it. Can't compare a family holiday with him going out with his mates. Spending a lot of time in the fun park,things I am too old to do. So I would definitely recommend a school ski trip for kids.
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I ran my schools ski trips for 7 years but stopped in 2019. It was a small group 20ish with 3 staff, went to the same resort in Italy, great spot , easy progression from nursery through to blues, red etc. It was at half term , cost around 1200e all in incl flights. Over the last couple of years it got very difficult, very demanding kids but, far more demanding parents. I jacked it in when a parent declared that it was my job to ensure his child had a Disneylandesque experience from the time she left the school until we arrived back and that was only the tip of the iceberg. Why is it so cold ? Why didn't she win the ski school race ? Why can't she have your phone to play on ? I ran one for the staff last year , sheer bliss
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| T Bar wrote: |
| I think one of the big attractions for America and I suspect Canada as well is that it is much harder to buy alcohol underage than in Europe. |
Attending grammar school in the 1990s all of our ski trips were in Vermont for this very reason.
I think the all in cost was about £800 or £900 pp back then but forget as i wasn't paying, just harassing my parents each year to go!
Jasper certainly wouldn't be my first choice in USA/Canada although neither would Vermont given the east coast snow situation this year. My sister-in-law is a teacher and has taken the kids to Sestriere and Madonna di Campiglio the past few years, <£1k pp. Having spoken to her about it, it sounds like a very stressful holiday if you are a teacher even if you are getting it for free.
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Back in 1975 my first ski trip was exactly £100, which is why I can remember it. That was flight on Dan Dare to Turin, half board hotel, ski pass, equipment, lessons, clothing hire, insurance and transfers both ends. My Mum paid it off at £10 per month. £100 is equivalent to about £1000 now so prices schools are quoting now aren't a million miles off.
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I learned to ski as a teacher, when I was invited along to help supervise the children (making sure they were up and ready for lessons, eating regularly, keeping homesickness to a minimum, not trashing the hotels, etc), and organising evening activities. When we arrived in resort and I'd helped sort out skis/poles/boots etc, my colleague who had organised it all informed me that my lessons started the following day, and that I'd better sort out my own skis and boots, that had been booked in advance. Filled with trepidation, I did what I was told, and the following morning followed the children to the beginners slopes. Within three days I was hooked, and a few years later it was me organising the ski trips.
TO's offering school ski trips used to offer a free place for every 10 people/children, and subsidised places if more staff wanted to come along. The prices were very reasonable at the time, and several parents would come along as well. They were getting a cheap skiing holiday, seeing their children enjoy themselves and develop their skills, and at the same time getting the chance to go off and ski on their own, go to nice restaurants if they chose to, and have a cracking nightlife, all with free 24/7 childcare. As has been mentioned already, it was bloody hard work for staff members, but we generally got the chance to go skiing when the children were in their lessons. Several of the resorts we went to, I would go back to on my own penny, and enjoyed the apres that had been missing from the school trips!
We always flew with the school trips I went on/organised, the thought of a 36+ hr coach ride each way was too much of a nightmare for me. After talking to a friend of mine, a fellow teacher, who did use coach transport, I knew I used to make the right choice. Granted, it would have kept prices down, but... nah! Luckily for us, none of the other staff saw the school ski trip as a 'jolly', especially after seeing us back in work absolutely frazzled, on Monday after getting home late on Saturday night.
As for where we went, it was mainly Italy, France, and Austria, but one year we pushed the boat out and took a trip to Canada, Mont St Anne. It was certainly culturally different to anywhere we'd been before, and the evening/night activities which included bowling in a 'proper' bowling alley, going to a big ice hockey game, and lots more besides, really broadened a few horizons. One unexpected thing that would happen on these trips was that the children would see a different side to you, that you were actually a person not just a teacher, and vice versa. There was definitely a different, more positive rapport when we'd get back, and that their self-confidence and self-esteem would have grown in leaps and bounds. Who can put a price on that?
Do I still run them? No. I became disillusioned with the world of education, and left before I became too bitter. However, even though they were exhausting, I thoroughly enjoyed them. Is it worth the money to send your children on them? Well, that is in the eye of the beholder.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@MajorQ, What a lovely post, I enjoyed that. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| red 27 wrote: |
@EarthWindandWater, you have a family ski trip to Austria for £1000
Talk us through that - line by line - unless you're a family of 1 |
EW&W said that £2k is half the cost of the family trip....
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You know it makes sense.
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| pam w wrote: |
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Well you are contributing for the teachers
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Or to put it another way..... you are paying for 24/7 child care. |
That was my conclusion with our schools offer to fly to italy for a week. They weren't price gouging us at all but it seemed to me like 50% more expensive (pro rata) than a family holiday due to things that I didn't really want to buy: childcare, flying, ski school, and full board.
Last edited by You know it makes sense. on Mon 15-01-24 21:08; edited 1 time in total
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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That seems a lot of money for a school ski trip. Bus and ferry to a cheap ski resort in Europe is fun at High School with your mates when you dont care its going to involve 24 hrs on a bus and 6 or 8 per room. I dont think it really matters where the trip is - they would have just as good a time anywhere with their mates but Europe would be a lot cheaper than Canada. If you were a family of 4 would you be prepared to pay 4 x £2200 = £8800 ? Thats a lot of money for 6 days skiing.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@MajorQ, 100%
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hi @pam w,
Those were the days.
I think my School Trip was in 1963 as well. Mine was £50 I think, spending money was £5
We learnt a lot...
Learnt how to smoke .. The train stopped in Basel and the duty free cigarettes were there.
Learnt to Drink beer I think it was about 9d for a pint sized bottle at the bar in the Hotel.
(Post Hotel in Achensee)
I got a badge for my skiing .. we all did.
We did not have a lift ... so sidestep up the hill a bit.
Learnt to traverse and a tidy snowplough.
We all had a great time, well worth it.
@Gored, Congrats on your 4000'th post.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
My question was / is - does the perceived excess supplement the teachers holiday cost either partially or in totality? (tin hat on apols to any teachers on here as I'm sure its a stressful experience!)
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Not sure if you are being genuine or a bit obtuse? Of course the per child cost is paying for the teacher places. It is totally standard practice for group holidays to offer "1 in x" places free for the adult organisers. Not sure why you would expect teachers to give up their week of holiday to work long hours, looking after a bunch of teenagers, getting a couple hours skiing at best AND pay for the privilege?
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That seems a lot of money for a school ski trip. Bus and ferry to a cheap ski resort in Europe is fun at High School with your mates when you dont care its going to involve 24 hrs on a bus and 6 or 8 per room
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As others have said, its not the kids doing the organising but the adults who probably do actually really mind a 36 hour bus journey.
Big thanks to all the teachers like @NickYoung and @MajorQ, without people like you running the Friday-after-school trip to the dry ski slope and running the school ski trips I never would have discovered or been able to progress os much with this amazing sport.
It is all very well for people on snowheads with years of experience going to the alps to be sniffy about how much cheaper they can get a family holiday per person to the slopes, but for kids who's parents don't ski the school trips are a fantastic opportunity, and there is more to develop than just the ski side being away with a mixed group of kids from the school.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
for kids who's parents don't ski the school trips are a fantastic opportunity, and there is more to develop than just the ski side being away with a mixed group of kids from the school.
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that's very true but many of the benefits of being away without your mummy and daddy can be gained from much cheaper, nearer-to-home trips and poorer families can NOT afford to pay two grand for one child to go on a luxury holiday. And if they DO pay, then something else, possibly more important, will have to be sacrificed. My family could not have afforded the £40 for my ski trip - it was possible only because I opted to spend the entirety of the savings accumulated for me since birth by my grandmother on a "one off" trip - couldn't afford to go skiing again till I was 40 and earning a good salary! I don't know how so many of today's apparently horribly impoverished students can afford it!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| pam w wrote: |
| Quote: |
for kids who's parents don't ski the school trips are a fantastic opportunity, and there is more to develop than just the ski side being away with a mixed group of kids from the school.
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that's very true but many of the benefits of being away without your mummy and daddy can be gained from much cheaper, nearer-to-home trips and poorer families can NOT afford to pay two grand for one child to go on a luxury holiday. And if they DO pay, then something else, possibly more important, will have to be sacrificed. My family could not have afforded the £40 for my ski trip - it was possible only because I opted to spend the entirety of the savings accumulated for me since birth by my grandmother on a "one off" trip - couldn't afford to go skiing again till I was 40 and earning a good salary! I don't know how so many of today's apparently horribly impoverished students can afford it! |
An interminable diet of cheap lentil soup. Apparently.
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If you are lucky enough to be able to afford £2200 per child on ski trip to Canada and you think its good value and will develop them then go for it. I think any child could get the same experience for a lot less by going on a school trip to Europe to ski with the same mates but thats my opinion having done it as a teenager. As someone pointed out its not only the skiing they go for its the friendships, fun, experiences they will remember for life. I still remember the stuff we got up to in the evenings and on the mountain and it was hilarious. Regards the Teachers who organise and go on these trips they do a fantastic job in what must be quite a challenging and stressful week. I wouldnt expect them to pay as they are giving up their weeks leave and are having to work hard to herd the kids about and without them some kids would never get a chance to ski. I think a lot of schools are not running trips like they used to pre Covid
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@pam w, I'm struggling with understanding your point of view TBH. Your post seems to be both a race to the bottom (school ski trips bad, no school ski tips because they aren't affordable to everyone) whilst at the same time horribly elitist (keep skiing away from kids unless their parents already ski). Lucky for your children (and grandchildren) that you scraped together that £40 and subsequently bought an apartment in France eh?
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@kat.ryb, Genuine question I'm afraid! Wasn't sure whether teachers places were 'fully' covered or just in part. On face value trips do seem expensive on the whole and some could argue the excess (if fully covering several teachers for nish as assumed) is simply expensive childcare on a budget ski holiday.
However . . . .I'm not a teacher (my father was late in life) but do have 3x kids so do TOTALLY appreciate the responsibilities / likely dramas / stress involved lol and understand the arrangement (which works both ways) which presumably can be especially appealing to non skiing families who want to give their kids a unique life opportunity / experience.
Being vaguely obtuse though (!!) I've never let my kids near a school holiday primarily due to worries about injuries (which I have horrifically experienced with child No2 never to be repeated!) so have historically preferred to shell out the dosh on family trips instead to retain my sanity. . .
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
Your post seems to be both a race to the bottom
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Eh? I have stated that poor families are not likely to be able to afford to pay £2K for one child to go on holiday. Which, sadly, is a simple fact. Your inference that I therefore believe there should be no school trips is just that - you inference. I don't believe I said or implied that.
What i DID say is that although school trips can indeed be a valuable learning experience for kids, being away from mummy and daddy, cheaper trips can make those experiences accessible to kids who can't afford the ski trips.
My grand-daughters' (state) primary school arranged terrific residential trips - where the kids stayed in dorms in accommodation managed by the LEA, similar to a youth hostel. Not an en-suite bathroom in sight. It was still as a stretch for the poorer kids (and there were plenty in that school, loads of free school dinners etc) but the school and the PTA did a brilliant job making sure everybody could go. What was particularly valuable for my elder grand-daughter was that all her classmates went, absolutely not just "her mates" and for a very shy child with issues around socialising and friends, that was a valuable experience. The teachers who facilitated those trips were saints. They probably retained their sanity by NOT reading the parents Whatsapp group in which some mummies were determined to accompany the trip (there were far too many volunteers) because they felt the need to supervise their kids 24/7 and had never let them out of their sight.
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@Belch, I suspect on most of the trips when you cost it all up the 'value' is decent for the offering given the cost usually is 'fully comp' with all food, lessons, ski hire, lift pass, evening activities to keep the group occupied and out of trouble etc. However vs a family of 4 who organise their own trip driving to alps, part time or no lessons and staying in a SC apartment and cooking dinner in most nights - the cost per person looks high.
A bit like UCPA trips. The value is really good but the headline cost is much higher than a budget trip.
Sorry to hear about child no2 injury 
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FAQ
