 Poster: A snowHead
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its all about supply and demand.
If there is a surplus of cars then the price drops.
@philwig, I just took back a Chevi Tahoe to Avis
It cost me £650 for 13 days and I think it was a bargain. Hired via "Canadian Affair", I'd recommend them for car hire.
There was 4 of us and the ski kit, and we loved riding in it.
You need 5.3 lites under the hood in Canada. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well I've been costing out flight and rental car, versus taking my own car on an expensive ferry crossing, for a trip to Ireland in May. Taking my own car wins out, especially as there are two of us going, and my friend tells me that renting cars in Ireland, when you're old, entails extra expense and hassle. So, as neither of us is bothered by driving, we can take one of our own cars, plus the kitchen sink, instead of a wee wheely case.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
| olderscot wrote: |
| Roguevfr wrote: |
Even if what you propose IS correct, that still leaves the obvious question : why would I rent my car out for £20 when a realistic price SHOULD be £50-100 ? |
The answer to that one is easy. It’s supply and demand in a competitive marketplace. When there are more cars available than people who want them then it’s better to get the £20 than nothing. (And at the same time have the possibility of selling some extras such as insurance, filling charges, etc.) |
In a market where there is NEVER more cars than people who want them (ie an airport) there's no reason to do this.
You still haven't answered any of the previous points I made. |
Roguevfr, the only point you appear to be making is that it we shouldn't expect to be able to able to rent a car for under £20 a day and while I agree that would be good value we live in a competitive market where the rental companies charge as much as they can when demand is high and do their best not have cars doing nothing when demand is low.
For a mid sized car I would typically end up paying around £250 for a 7 day hire at Geneva at half term. This year at Geneva it's looking like double that or even more. Luckily I don't have to go at such a busy time any more so last week I had a very nice mid-sized estate from Venice at £140 for the week.
It's all due to supply and demand. The suggestion that there's NEVER more cars than people who want to rent them is nonsense. Although I'll give you that the car hire companies often have to drop their prices ridiculously low in order to ensure there is enough demand so they don't have cars sitting there doing nothing.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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To all intents and purposes an aiport branch runs as close to "never" as makes no odds . If they're not showing 95%+ utilisation there's something seriously wrong. Under normal circumstances it's very difficult to get a car there that isn't pre-booked.
There's nothing to be gained by renting a car for less than it costs to pay a staff member's wage for am hour and a half.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
To all intents and purposes an aiport branch runs as close to "never" as makes no odds . If they're not showing 95%+ utilisation there's something seriously wrong. Under normal circumstances it's very difficult to get a car there that isn't pre-booked.
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Yes, they do their very best to have as many cars pre-booked as possible as very few people try to hire a car without pre booking. That's why they have to drop their prices when demand is low to try and boost demand up to the level where they can rent out the cars.
| Roguevfr wrote: |
There's nothing to be gained by renting a car for less than it costs to pay a staff member's wage for am hour and a half. |
And yet that's what they're doing. It's what they have to do when demand is low and and they need to rent out the cars. Clearly you think they're wrong but I'm surprised you think they don't know what they're doing.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
It's all due to supply and demand. The suggestion that there's NEVER more cars than people who want to rent them is nonsense. Although I'll give you that the car hire companies often have to drop their prices ridiculously low in order to ensure there is enough demand so they don't have cars sitting there doing nothing. |
Yes clearly it's nonsense or we'd see uniformly high prices year round. I used to think when'd see rental prices of £6 per day in Spain or somesuch that intuitively it seemed too low but then also suspected there would be lots of upsells and overpriced extras e.g. insurance to make the full cost somewhat more "average". But agencies generally want enough vehicles that they can just sell out at periods of high demand and pricing, which leaves them with overstock at quieter times.
Current pricing is an output of sell off of redundant stocks when covid first hit plus supply chain issues with new vehicles. Who knows how long it will last?
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@olderscot , the other points that you've failed to spot are that there's no "business model" that works by simply buying a car and retaining it for a year, then selling it back to the manufacturer for a small return . How does this generate profit for either the manufacturer or the rental company? Why bother taking on extremely expensive airport locations when the rental company could simply buy a big shed somewhere to store the cars till they sell them back " for profit" ...?
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Quote: |
It's all due to supply and demand. The suggestion that there's NEVER more cars than people who want to rent them is nonsense. Although I'll give you that the car hire companies often have to drop their prices ridiculously low in order to ensure there is enough demand so they don't have cars sitting there doing nothing. |
Yes clearly it's nonsense or we'd see uniformly high prices year round. I used to think when'd see rental prices of £6 per day in Spain or somesuch that intuitively it seemed too low but then also suspected there would be lots of upsells and overpriced extras e.g. insurance to make the full cost somewhat more "average". But agencies generally want enough vehicles that they can just sell out at periods of high demand and pricing, which leaves them with overstock at quieter times.
Current pricing is an output of sell off of redundant stocks when covid first hit plus supply chain issues with new vehicles. Who knows how long it will last? |
What a fundamentally stupid way to look at things.
Agencies only want to sell out when it's busy? Why not want to sell out all the time?
I stand by my statement regarding demand at airports. Covid aside, there are no "quiet times" at airport branches.
The only reasonable comparison is with airline pricing, where you KNOW that the flight is going anyway, so the airline will do their very best to fill a flight. You know fine well that an airline ticket shiuldnt cost £20, and youll HAVE to pay for ski carriage, luggage allowance, to pick your seats, etc etc.
There's no such compulsion to rent out a car .
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Roguevfr, I think you are wilfully not getting it because you relate everything back to your experience in the rental car industry back in the day and your perceived ideal fo what a rental should cost. Let's spell it out - in normal times rental car businesses have 2 ways of making money - rental charges and ancilliaries (which can include uncompetively priced captive "insurance" and exhorbitant "repair" costs) and selling vehicles for capital returns. Car manufacturers are aware of the game - again in ordinary times the dirty secret of the auto industry is that those big factories and supply chains turn out more vehicles than there is direct consumer demand for. The rental fleet provides an ideal home for this vehicles as no manufacturer wants to be having to discount its overproduction direct to consumers. Plus a 1 year old 30k mile vehicle is not a substitute for its new stock. In such circumstances its perfectly possible for a new vehicle to come at a discount of say 1/3 from RRP and be flipped on by the rental company at say 75% RRP
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Guys, we'll be going to either Bergamo or Verona and then driving to Madonna di Campiglio, it's around 2hr30 drive. These bloody winter tires cost an absolute fortune, and they seem very hard to find. Hertz are at £450 for a Fiat Panda for the week with winter tires. Otherwise, rentalcars.com are at <£100 (no mention of snow chains) or just over £100 for snow chained cars. Also, isn't it a legal requirement to have at least snow chains in Italy?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Right, so the manufacturer sells a car to the rental fleet, which sells it back to the manufacturer as a used car for more than they bought it for .
And this is both a profitable enterprise for the manufacturer, AND the rental fleet operator?
Lalalalala
And my current experience includes very close contact to people with almost 40 years in the business, not only my own.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| viciousvulture wrote: |
| Guys, we'll be going to either Bergamo or Verona and then driving to Madonna di Campiglio, it's around 2hr30 drive. These bloody winter tires cost an absolute fortune, and they seem very hard to find. Hertz are at £450 for a Fiat Panda for the week with winter tires. Otherwise, rentalcars.com are at <£100 (no mention of snow chains) or just over £100 for snow chained cars. Also, isn't it a legal requirement to have at least snow chains in Italy? |
It's only in some regions of Italy that you have to provide winter tyres or snow chains in the winter months. Clearly it wouldn't make sense in the sunny south of the country.
I've found the most common thing is for snow chains to be included as it's the cheapest way of doing it. I usually find that you can see which cars come with chains on Holiday Autos but it's not always that easy to see and some agencies websites make it easier to see than others.
I wouldn't be too focused on the winter tyres side of things. I had a hire car a couple of years ago with winter tyres and I don't know if they were old or had something else wrong with them but they had no grip at all. They were sliding all over the place going round corners with just lightest bit of wind blown snow on the road. They should have been better than regular summer tyres but I'm not convinced they were.
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| olderscot wrote: |
| viciousvulture wrote: |
| Guys, we'll be going to either Bergamo or Verona and then driving to Madonna di Campiglio, it's around 2hr30 drive. These bloody winter tires cost an absolute fortune, and they seem very hard to find. Hertz are at £450 for a Fiat Panda for the week with winter tires. Otherwise, rentalcars.com are at <£100 (no mention of snow chains) or just over £100 for snow chained cars. Also, isn't it a legal requirement to have at least snow chains in Italy? |
It's only in some regions of Italy that you have to provide winter tyres or snow chains in the winter months. Clearly it wouldn't make sense in the sunny south of the country.
I've found the most common thing is for snow chains to be included as it's the cheapest way of doing it. I usually find that you can see which cars come with chains on Holiday Autos but it's not always that easy to see and some agencies websites make it easier to see than others.
I wouldn't be too focused on the winter tyres side of things. I had a hire car a couple of years ago with winter tyres and I don't know if they were old or had something else wrong with them but they had no grip at all. They were sliding all over the place going round corners with just lightest bit of wind blown snow on the road. They should have been better than regular summer tyres but I'm not convinced they were. |
Thanks. I'm no Colin McRae but I'm a confident driver so I think the snow chain option is best. Hopefully it can't be too bad in late March...
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You know it makes sense.
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Quote: |
It's all due to supply and demand. The suggestion that there's NEVER more cars than people who want to rent them is nonsense. Although I'll give you that the car hire companies often have to drop their prices ridiculously low in order to ensure there is enough demand so they don't have cars sitting there doing nothing. |
Yes clearly it's nonsense or we'd see uniformly high prices year round. I used to think when'd see rental prices of £6 per day in Spain or somesuch that intuitively it seemed too low but then also suspected there would be lots of upsells and overpriced extras e.g. insurance to make the full cost somewhat more "average". But agencies generally want enough vehicles that they can just sell out at periods of high demand and pricing, which leaves them with overstock at quieter times.
Current pricing is an output of sell off of redundant stocks when covid first hit plus supply chain issues with new vehicles. Who knows how long it will last? |
What a fundamentally stupid way to look at things.
Agencies only want to sell out when it's busy? Why not want to sell out all the time?
I stand by my statement regarding demand at airports. Covid aside, there are no "quiet times" at airport branches.
The only reasonable comparison is with airline pricing, where you KNOW that the flight is going anyway, so the airline will do their very best to fill a flight. You know fine well that an airline ticket shiuldnt cost £20, and youll HAVE to pay for ski carriage, luggage allowance, to pick your seats, etc etc.
There's no such compulsion to rent out a car . |
Regardless of experience you have a very skewed grasp of economic reality - Agencies stock so as to maximise profit across the whole cycle - which generally means having enough to sell out at high prices when there is high demand and cover overheads when there is low demand. Of course there are quieter periods at airport branches - after school holiday demand is gone do you think there will be same demand for big estates/SUVs and MPVs at ski serving airports? An agency that optimises for lowest periods of demand doesn't fill many of its bays at the parking lot.
Of course agencies don't have to rent out a car at a low price but usually they choose to do so rather than hoping for a last minute customer who'll pay a high price because they want contribution towards overheads including staff. A savvy consumer plays the game with holding a booking early then checking for price drops or promos periodically.
And rentals don't sell their cars back to the manufacturer (I assume when Ford owned Hertz etc the model was different) but I assume dealerships have a call option in some circumstances when they want to bolster their stock of nearly new approved etc.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Firstly, airport branches are always busy.
Always.
Secondly, who's only discussing ski-serving airports ?
Do you think Innsbruck or Salzburg are silent deserts in spring and summer?
Thirdly, skewed is what you call someone who thinks it's a revenue stream generator to "make money" on damage to a vehicle you're apparently selling back to a manufacturer "at a profit".
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
And rentals don't sell their cars back to the manufacturer (I assume when Ford owned Hertz etc the model was different) but I assume dealerships have a call option in some circumstances when they want to bolster their stock of nearly new approved etc. |
Oh, they very much do Dave, very much.
Why would they want a rental company to acquire vehicles from them at "a substantial discount" , only to sell them on " at a profit" after only 6-9 months to a random outside dealer who can now undercut the manufacturers own dealers on second hand stock?
Dear me.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Roguevfr, OK they do sell back (was trying to identify why it's still possible to make a profit and manufacturers aren't interested in funding and sitting on huge lots of new cars that they won't sell for a year)- and they make a hell of a loss when doing so if it pleases you AND always charge top dollar for rentals because there is ALWAYS a queue around the block at rental desks in the hours they are open. 
You've argued things here that mere observation tells us are not true.
All that suffices for normal consumers is to understand prices are dynamic, probably determined by algorithms and therefore not necessarily logical as RRP of the vehicle is but a single variable hence arbitrages are possible. Equally getting reemed up the ass by high spot prices also possible.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Simple observation tells me that there are always queues at rental desks in airports. I know this to be true.
Experience tells me that I know more about the business than casual observation allows.
I also know that a rental car should NOT cost the same as a pizza.
Furthermore if customers didn't expect point 2 above, then they wouldn't FEEL they are getting"reamed up the ass" by paying for extras which any normal sane customer would see as part of a reasonable daily cost.
Neither you , nor anyone else has explained why this situation doesn't exist in any other rental situation, be it skis, houses, wedding apparel or anything else.
Nor does it exist in any other retail situation. I've never been to a cinema where I've been told
"ah, what the hell, there's 100 seats free in this showing, you can get in for a quid".
Or, sure, we have one table left , half price dinner for you..
The flow of manufacturer supply has led to the rise of the PCP model of car " ownership" and that's how manufacturers have dealt with "overproduction " , not by dumping off stock to rental companies.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
Simple observation tells me that there are always queues at rental desks in airports. I know this to be true.
Experience tells me that I know more about the business than casual observation allows.
I also know that a rental car should NOT cost the same as a pizza.
Furthermore if customers didn't expect point 2 above, then they wouldn't FEEL they are getting"reamed up the ass" by paying for extras which any normal sane customer would see as part of a reasonable daily cost.
Neither you , nor anyone else has explained why this situation doesn't exist in any other rental situation, be it skis, houses, wedding apparel or anything else.
Nor does it exist in any other retail situation. I've never been to a cinema where I've been told
"ah, what the hell, there's 100 seats free in this showing, you can get in for a quid".
Or, sure, we have one table left , half price dinner for you..
The flow of manufacturer supply has led to the rise of the PCP model of car " ownership" and that's how manufacturers have dealt with "overproduction " , not by dumping off stock to rental companies. |
How naive - you think price discrimination doesn't exist in other retail situations - what are Meerkat Movies, O2 Privilege, twofer Tuesdays etc, online discount codes etc? Of course it exists - why are ski rental businesses keen to offer 20% online discount to book online in advance rather than risk you walking into a competitor's shop when you are in resort?
You might be right in the longer term that rental car outfits and indeed car manufacturer supply may restrict the size of rental fleets such that everyday "high" prices become the norm. However as people on this thread have identified that is not yet proven, even in a time of high market stress, as some rentals are still had at "low" prices.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Roguevfr wrote: |
Simple observation tells me that there are always queues at rental desks in airports. I know this to be true.
Experience tells me that I know more about the business than casual observation allows.
I also know that a rental car should NOT cost the same as a pizza.
Furthermore if customers didn't expect point 2 above, then they wouldn't FEEL they are getting"reamed up the ass" by paying for extras which any normal sane customer would see as part of a reasonable daily cost.
Neither you , nor anyone else has explained why this situation doesn't exist in any other rental situation, be it skis, houses, wedding apparel or anything else.
Nor does it exist in any other retail situation. I've never been to a cinema where I've been told
"ah, what the hell, there's 100 seats free in this showing, you can get in for a quid".
Or, sure, we have one table left , half price dinner for you..
The flow of manufacturer supply has led to the rise of the PCP model of car " ownership" and that's how manufacturers have dealt with "overproduction " , not by dumping off stock to rental companies. |
How naive - you think price discrimination doesn't exist in other retail situations - what are Meerkat Movies, O2 Privilege, twofer Tuesdays etc, online discount codes etc? Of course it exists - why are ski rental businesses keen to offer 20% online discount to book online in advance rather than risk you walking into a competitor's shop when you are in resort?
You might be right in the longer term that rental car outfits and indeed car manufacturer supply may restrict the size of rental fleets such that everyday "high" prices become the norm. However as people on this thread have identified that is not yet proven, even in a time of high market stress, as some rentals are still had at "low" prices. |
You're conflating different things.
The discount schemes you mention are pre- booking to ensure a certain utilisation.
Not offering a massive discount to "get something for" the last few remaining units which was my example.
They're still not offering their current prices at 1980's costs except when they're busy , as is what you seem to think should be the car hire.
Furthermore, i never stated in any way that restriction of fleet size is something that either the manufacturer or the rental fleet would propose. Why would they ?
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Mon 14-02-22 14:28; edited 1 time in total
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I think you are the one who is all over the place - I've never argued that last minute rentals at the desk should be expected to be cheap, generally I would expect them to be jacked as high as possible because when you really need a car (e.g. flights cancelled. transfers missed, family emergencies etc) you really need one. But in certain circumstances - branch manager needing to hit weekly/monthly numbers etc - I would imagine it is possible that sometimes you can luck into a cheap deal on "surplus" stock.
I don't think the hire price should be anything specific - I recognise it is a volatile market and try to best exploit features of it to best advantage and protect myself. I might appreciate it if pricing were more consistent and less volatile but I don't think it's in the culture of the industry and certainly might be against consumer interests if cartels were allowed to set "standard" prices. If consumers have come to expect certain "too low" prices ultimately that's a problem the industry itself has created not the consumers themselves.
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For what it's worth, which I realise isn't much, because you're flagrantly uninterested in accuracy, "manager's targets" are measured in "income per vehicle" (I.e average rental return) rather than 99 on fleet and 98 on rent .
So getting that " extra" car out for tuppence ha'penny only reduces the average income , not what the company is looking for.
As for Cartels setting prices, the problem the industry has created is not set by the " majors" , but by people setting up " car hire" where what they mean is they have some old bangers which they can't sell, or are otherwise valueless , but can turn them out to people in Benidorm for €10 a day to customers who then believe that they should be able to get a brand new £25000 car for the same price everywhere.
Some back street grubber renting out trade-ins isn't the same thing.
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OK so you've confirmed that last minute deals aren't really a thing and I didn't expect it.
& the "back street grubbers" are the majors' problem not mine - again it was the majors' decisions to chase the price down rather than focusing on the income per vehicle metric (I'm pretty confident that a branch manager hitting £300 per vehicle per day would still be getting the sack if he he only rented 5% of the fleet).
Plus what you are really buying with a car rental is a transportation service - it might make no difference to me if I have a brand spanking new BMW or a 10 year old Fiat if I only want to drive 20 miles to my holiday villa and pop into town a couple of times for shopping. In which case the "grubber" product would be perfect for my needs.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
OK so you've confirmed that last minute deals aren't really a thing and I didn't expect it.
& the "back street grubbers" are the majors' problem not mine - again it was the majors' decisions to chase the price down rather than focusing on the income per vehicle metric (I'm pretty confident that a branch manager hitting £300 per vehicle per day would still be getting the sack if he he only rented 5% of the fleet).
Plus what you are really buying with a car rental is a transportation service - it might make no difference to me if I have a brand spanking new BMW or a 10 year old Fiat if I only want to drive 20 miles to my holiday villa and pop into town a couple of times for shopping. In which case the "grubber" product would be perfect for my needs. |
The manager would be getting encouraged to motivate his staff to increase sales, no doubt, or moved to a less challenging environment. This is called successfully running a business.
That manager would equally be getting the sack if he was hiring out his entire fleet for 1/10th of the expected return.
Any fool's dog can sell something at a ridiculous price.
Would you still be happy with the grubber when you get it and it's 10 years old, bald tyres and barely driveable, let alone road worthy ?
Enjoy your roadside botulism burger, I'm off inside the nice restaurant to enjoy a professionally cooked and sourced steak, in the full knowledge that I'm unlikely to receive it at the same price as available at the burger van.
addendum while it may be simply a "mode of transport" to you, there are many others who enjoy getting a hire car as part of their holiday. They may never have driven a new car, or indeed "the car of their dreams" be it a BMW or Audi or other marque they'll never own.
They may never even have owned a car themselves.
They might be trying out a car for a week while they decide whether to buy a similar model.
Probably in today's multi-car family it's less of a thing, but getting a "nice car" still holds value to many people , if not the jaded world jet setter who skis.
I'm intrigued as to whether you rent skis or not, and whether you'd happily pay intersport for the latest "premium" (insert expensive ski choice here) or simply take the 20 year old pair of Rossi Bandits lying in the back shop of Luigis rent-a-ski.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Mon 14-02-22 16:08; edited 1 time in total
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You're making the mistake of equating price with value and quality. And fortunately in rental cars we don't have to because the majors chase down the market price because they don't generally like having stock around not making cashflow. And pretty much the market experience is that you can have good or bad experiences with any individual branch depending on sales staff aggression, competence, extra charges after the event, alleged or actual damage etc.
And you are a poor spokesman for the industry if you think you are convincing anyone they should willingly look to pay higher prices because it is somehow "fairer" or they'll get something far superior. I rented a car in the US at Xmas for what was a low rate (but still high historically) compared to where the market ultimately ended up. The car was brand new with less than 100 miles on the clock ( so much so that my main concern was that initial delivery problems might not have shaken out yet).
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Mon 14-02-22 16:23; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| You're making the mistake of equating price with value and quality. And fortunately in rental cars we don't have to because the majors chase down the market price because they don't generally like having stock around not making cashflow. And pretty much the market experience is that you can have good or bad experiences with any individual branch depending on sales staff aggression, competence, extra charges after the event, alleged or actual damage etc. |
You've missed out customers being an back bottom, hiding damage they've done, being outwith the terms of the agreement, returning late etc etc etc.
Just for balance, you know?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Silly question from me:
Many people rent cars not only for the convenience and possible cost savings of getting to resort and back to the airport, but it also allows the flexibility to travel to other resorts in case of closures, bad snow - or simply you want to try new places.
How do you get the skis/poles/boots into the car? Do they come with roof racks/roof boxes - or is that an additional extra you request in advance and pay for? Same with Winter tyres and/or snow chains.
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
I'm intrigued as to whether you rent skis or not, and whether you'd happily pay intersport for the latest "premium" (insert expensive ski choice here) or simply take the 20 year old pair of Rossi Bandits lying in the back shop of Luigis rent-a-ski. |
Well generally if I was renting skis it would be because an airline was paying and I'd thus look for something appropriate to my needs. If I was paying myself I'd again consider my needs/convenience etc. I might take Luigi's kind offer if I was only intending a bit of undemanding crusing around rather than pay for the Five star platinum plus generic piste ski at Intersport. But I don't generally rent skis because usually I can take what I am happy with with me. Getting my car into a hold bag is somewhat more challenging.
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You know it makes sense.
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@ado, i always book a car big enough to take them. If we get an MPV where centre seat can go down, our children are much happier but never found a way of specifying this feature with booking.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| NickyJ wrote: |
| @ado, i always book a car big enough to take them. If we get an MPV where centre seat can go down, our children are much happier but never found a way of specifying this feature with booking. |
If you have 4 or so people then getting an MPV or an estate car is usually the best way to go. If you only have a 2-3 passengers then you might get away with a smaller car and get the ski bag into that car. Or you could get a portable roof rack (magnetic or one of these inflatables https://www.handiworld.com/handirack/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIoYG9nsT_9QIVnYBQBh15twaHEAAYASAAEgLvBvD_BwE) and put on the roof of a sedan/smaller car.
I think you can ask for a roof rack/box but these optional extras can be a bit pricy and sometimes not guaranteed to be available on arrival, so if you did arrive with a ski bag and they didnt have any left, you would be stuck.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Trouble is, you can't rely on getting the car you booked. We booked a specific model, in Geneva, one summer to accommodate my mother's wheelchair, but were given a supposedly "better" car, which just wouldn't fit it. Sorting it out badly delayed us.
It always worries me when I get a shiny brand new hire car. I don't want an unroadworthy banger with bald tyres, but a car a few years old, with 20K on the clock - no problem. I also hate the smell of new cars. As for paying a premium for a car in order to impress people.  I obviously know the wrong people; I'd be ashamed for anybody I know to think that I'd done this. And why would I want to impress people I don't know?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| ado wrote: |
Silly question from me:
Many people rent cars not only for the convenience and possible cost savings of getting to resort and back to the airport, but it also allows the flexibility to travel to other resorts in case of closures, bad snow - or simply you want to try new places.
How do you get the skis/poles/boots into the car? Do they come with roof racks/roof boxes - or is that an additional extra you request in advance and pay for? Same with Winter tyres and/or snow chains. |
For skis, we have a cheap, soft ski bag which we take with us on the plane. Rolls up inside our hold luggage. Carries two pairs of skis + poles and will fit down the middle of the second smallest class of hire car. Fits more easily if one of the rear seats can fold down, otherwise it's a bit tighter. The first time we did this, we booked the smallest (mini) hire car category and it was very tight indeed - so it's better to go one size up. Not usually much price difference between the two.
Boots go in the rear footwells.
For winter tyres / chains it varies by country. For Swiss airports near the Alps, hire cars generally (always?) come with winter tyres, and often with chains too. I believe that's also the case for Austria / Germany, but haven't hired from there before. France and Italy you usually get chains but winter tyres would have to be specially requested (somewhat unreliable) and would incur a hefty surcharge (but from a lower base price).
Other advantages to hiring cars instead of using a transfer service, beyond what you've already mentioned - it makes it much easier to ski on arrival / departure day, as you've got somewhere to store your luggage. Enables a stop at a big valley supermarket, saving money on in-resort prices. Allows local sightseeing (nearby towns / museums / beauty spots etc.) after the lifts have closed, especially in spring when daylight hours are longer. Allows you to do a multi-ski-area trip rather than staying in one resort.
If you are going to a big ski area for the entire week (e.g. Three Valleys, Paradiski etc.), or to somewhere without free parking, there is less of an advantage to hiring a car, and not always a cost saving, depending on the number of people going.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Mon 14-02-22 17:56; edited 2 times in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Roguevfr wrote: |
| while it may be simply a "mode of transport" to you, there are many others who enjoy getting a hire car as part of their holiday. |
What?! Well, I've never met one. If the conversation is ever about hire cars it seems that everyone thinks the whole thing is usually on a scale of a bit of a hassle to a total pain in the butt. Do these strange people you mention get a kick out of being patted down in the security queue too? .
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@denfinella, it may be better than the alternative, ie a transfer, but enjoy it?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@maggi, yes, we enjoy it. I love navigating, trying different routes, sightseeing...
My partner loves driving and cars in general. It's a useful combination.
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I'm with denfinella on benefits, and probably on enjoyment. In terms of getting between an airport and accommodation in resort, for me, I'd rank the main options on enjoyment as:
1. Train direct from airport with no more than 2 changes, and short walk (<400m, say, given we'd be carrying luggage) to accommodation from destination station. This has worked a few times in Switzerland (Andermatt, Engelberg, Le Chable), but is rare:
2. Hire car with parking at destination accommodation
3. Train with more changes, and/or need a taxi to get to accommodation
4. Hire car with parking elsewhere
5. Private transfer (far down the list as they once failed to turn up for the return trip, and by the time I'd got hold of them and they'd found a driver, I got to the airport 30 minutes after my flight was due to leave, though happily the flight was so delayed I still made it)
99. Bus as part of a package deal
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@denfinella, OK, I'm pleased for you but I do think you are in the minority, though. Everyone I know has a story of queueing, thinking they'd ticked every box online and still didn't get the car/chains/child seat etc that they'd ordered. Or winter tyres (OK, maybe that's just snowHeads ). Also, the checking for damage in a dark, dank carpark when you pick it up, getting them to note it and wondering what they'll find after you drop it off in a rush to get your plane, usually because of the fill-it-up-to-the-brim at the nearest petrol station which, oddly enough, has a massive queue/rejects your CC then spits you out into a one-way system so it takes even longer to get back than you anticipated. Then the wait for the unexpected bill for something like a scraped wheel arch which you didn't do and is three times what it would cost, even if you did.
To be fair, transfers can be a bigger hassle. You pays your money, as they say ...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@DrLawn, TR needed
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Loving this thread. I’m glad we’re not the only ones being messed around by car hire companies. From my experience, cars hired in Germany near the alps always come with winter tires but if you want snow chains that’s extra in terms of cost AND hassle. We do always buy snow chains but it feels like a waste of money.
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FAQ
