 Poster: A snowHead
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I am glad that @Oleski, has sacrificed enough over the last two years to keep us two OAPs alive.
I think we have also done our bit too, spending many hours particularly last January and February in rain, wind and snow getting the general public shunted through the village hall to get their jabs. So I don’t feel at all guilty having managed to have ten glorious days skiing before Christmas, even if that trip was marred by our children and grandchildren not being able join us as some of them tested +ve . So we came back early, and I still paid the dog sitter for the 4 nights she didn’t have our dog in the end. Fair’s fair I said to her. We just have to try and be kind to everyone and treat them with respect.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Pamski, well said
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Pruman wrote: |
| Oleski wrote: |
| Me and my family have sacrificed enough over the last 2 years first to keep OAPs alive....... |
Summed up beautifully, poetic almost. A perfect illustration of how catastrophically entitled and moronic some people are. Lots of people are at greater risk of death, not just OAPs - certain ethnicities, disabled people, poorer people, diabetics, cancer sufferers, immune suppressed and many more - but let's go skiing and let them die. It's the 'must ski at all costs' attitude I just don't get or whenever the 'mental health card' gets played to trump any other arguments.
| oldsnowy wrote: |
@Pruman,
Having a bad day? |
On t'internet a good day is of course triggering people to say "having a bad day?" 
My overall point is really 'Why now? What's the mad rush?'. At this time of year you stand a bigger chance of lousy weather, travel disruption, poorer snow conditions, less snow depth, more unstable off piste etc. When you add in the chance of quarantine at either end (I'm still perplexed as to how many thousands aren't testing negative for their return trips and then suddenly coming down with covid when safely back in say London where 1:15 have covid), sudden rule changes, risk of huge extra expense, risk of missing work +++
Best skiing I have ever had has always been late season, like April - admittedly that's a survey of one person over 50 years, but talk to most other oldtimers and it's the same. I've had good ones in December and Jan too but fewer and further between. So, I'm saying save your spondz for when the covid landscape might (?) be clearer and travel more certain, less stressful. Happy New Year y'all. |
This second season of pandemic hit skiing, culminating in a second New Year's holiday in Arosa that was never was [as we'd caught Covid this time around], has led me to reappraise our Xmas/New Year plans for good.
Formerly bound by tight school holidays, now I don't know why I continued to put my family through the Xmas/New Year stampede of Europeans to the Alps.
The huge extra cost of selecting those weeks and lift queues. A lovely relaxed Xmas at home curtailed by; trips to cattery, (latterly) external Covid tests, a (formerly) packed Gatwick, perhaps a very early start on the 26/12 or 27/12. If driving, stuck in painfully slow jams in the Alps both ways, possibly leaving early to try to beat the hordes.
So, In future I'm looking at the second week of January, plus if money permits something later too but not Feb HT.
The snow and temperatures are often better then too, this January being a case in point.
I am lucky that I work for myself, so holiday entitlement is kind of unlimited.
That's a personal view, one silver lining from pandemic hit ski holidays.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
In future I'm looking at the second week of January, plus if money permits something later too but not Feb HT
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Good idea - and if going to France, the first week after the end of the French holidays (second week of March) is probably the optimum week in the whole season, with much better light, longer lift opening hours, good snow, sunshine and accommodation at low season rates, though not as low as the second week of January.
@Pamski, you've certainly done more than your share of helping to look after the OAPS - VMT. But I don't think anybody is suggesting you should feel "guilty" about a ski holiday, any more than I feel guilty about the stupidly expensive plants I bought in lockdown, or all that rather good wine I drank. Alone..... which is supposed to be the slippery slope to perdition. 
I had to can an awful lot of theatre tickets - I split the difference with the Festival Theatre, leaving them with half the dosh as a donation, and taking half as a refund. To spend on that wine......and even the best that Waitrose has to offer isn't as expensive as that bar at CFT.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@pam w, your tipple at CFT is usually G&T isn’t it?
I think I must be on a mission to de-clutter our glass collection as two nights running I have sent a wine glass across the room to end up in small pieces. If I get through the rather large balloons, at this rate I can go back to drinking out of the thick, seemingly unbreakable Ikea glasses in a few weeks.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| pam w wrote: |
| Quote: |
In future I'm looking at the second week of January, plus if money permits something later too but not Feb HT
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Good idea - and if going to France, the first week after the end of the French holidays (second week of March) is probably the optimum week in the whole season, with much better light, longer lift opening hours, good snow, sunshine and accommodation at low season rates, though not as low as the second week of January.
@Pamski, you've certainly done more than your share of helping to look after the OAPS - VMT. But I don't think anybody is suggesting you should feel "guilty" about a ski holiday, any more than I feel guilty about the stupidly expensive plants I bought in lockdown, or all that rather good wine I drank. Alone..... which is supposed to be the slippery slope to perdition.
I had to can an awful lot of theatre tickets - I split the difference with the Festival Theatre, leaving them with half the dosh as a donation, and taking half as a refund. To spend on that wine......and even the best that Waitrose has to offer isn't as expensive as that bar at CFT. |
We used to take our then young kids to Puy St Vincent (with Snowbizz) on that week, that was when I first discovered online the French school holidays system. PSV gets packed with either Parisians or folk from Provence in those weeks, we used to arrive the day the last batch were driving away.
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This is a winter sports forum. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to bemoan their inability to go skiing on a website literally designed for discussing skiing. However the sanctimonious idea that you can’t complain about missing out on anything because of Covid is everywhere so I suppose it’s inevitable that it’s here too. Yes, things could be worse. But you know what, they could be better too. A lot better. Telling people that they’re no allowed to be distressed at losing several thousand pounds is frankly bonkers, and I would have expected better from some of the posters on this thread.
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I agree @LittleRos - we should be able to discuss all matters skiing and being annoyed when we aren’t permitted to go, on here, of all places.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Just got back from the Monte Rosa area last Sunday with five of our friends. We've all had negative PCR result's this week and off again next Sunday to Obergurgl. We've all been triple jabbed and are making the most of it whilst we can. We are determined to ski as many weeks as we can this season to make up for the last two disapointing season's. One of the positive things about retirement. We are all glass half full types in our early 60's. As Nike says, "just do it".
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Just got back from the Monte Rosa area last Sunday with five of our friends. We've all had negative PCR result's this week and off again next Sunday to Obergurgl. We've all been triple jabbed and are making the most of it whilst we can. We are determined to ski as many weeks as we can this season to make up for the last two disapointing season's. One of the positive things about retirement is that you can be flexible time wise. We are all glass half full types in our early 60's. As Nike says, "just do it".
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Sat 1-01-22 19:37; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Snowbandit56 wrote: |
| Just got back from the Monte Rosa area last Sunday with five of our friends. We've all had negative PCR result's this week and off again next Sunday to Obergurgl. We've all been triple jabbed and are making the most of it whilst we can. We are determined to ski as many weeks as we can this season to make up for the last two disapointing season's. One of the positive things about retirement. We are all glass half full types in our early 60's. As Nike says, "just do it". |
Good for you. I’d hope to do the same if I ever get to retirement 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Oleski wrote: |
| Bones wrote: |
| Boris wrote: |
| @pam w, not sure on that, I can afford to spend a few grand skiing, I can’t afford to spend a few grand and get nothing for it |
Totally understand your feelings and would feel the same - but in reality Pam is right, you can afford the trip, and so can afford to lose the money. Technically when you paid for the trip the money has already gone, what you actually have missed out on is the experience of the trip.
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People go on ski holidays to get a much needed break and improve their mental well-being. Money spent on a holiday that didn't go ahead and cannot be recovered is the money that can't be spent on alternative holidays. Result is the miserable and depressing winter in the UK.
On top of that not all of us have a luxury to be able to get out on a short notice when/if rules relax, some of us have school age kids, you know.
So, no you and Pam are wrong - we can't afford to lose that money. |
But you still could lost your holiday even if you got your money back. Whatever other holiday plan you re-arranged could equally fall foul of unexpected change of rule again!
Whatever you've done to insure your money is safe will be the same. Just no guarantee you'll have a holiday. So is whatever "skirting" of principle of rules, you do whatever necessary to have the holiday to happen, money or materials. If that's moving the crossing 2 hrs, so be it. On the other hand, people who complain about other people's legal action need to look into the mirror.
I have no children so I just scrap all my Christmas/NY travel plans. I rearranged everything till late January, and make sure they're all refundable. But that's got more to do with my own safety than public safety. I think others should choose base on their own circumstance.
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@JamesHJ, You will, work hard play hard.
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You know it makes sense.
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@abc,
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I think others should choose base on their own circumstance
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So do I. I would be doing the same as Snowbandit56 if I could. Sadly an underlying, uninsurable medical condition makes it too risky for me to be stuck in quarantine abroad and potentially when I'd got home as well.  Still holding out for March/April, though; hope springs eternal.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Quote: |
I have been quite poor at stages in my life and therefore have skied (and made my children ski) in very tight circumstances, teeny apartments, teeny ski stations, taking picnics everywhere etc
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Weird understanding of what quite poor is
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Poster: A snowHead
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| TheGeneralist wrote: |
| Quote: |
I have been quite poor at stages in my life and therefore have skied (and made my children ski) in very tight circumstances, teeny apartments, teeny ski stations, taking picnics everywhere etc
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Weird understanding of what quite poor is |
Plainly they weren't implying they were living on the streets. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Yes, obviously!!! I am talking in the context of ski-ing…. and finding the money to go skiing. Anyone who is truly poor would struggle to take any type of holiday. I do get fed up with forums who immediately jump on people who have absolutely no idea of others’ circumstances. As LittleRos pointed out, this is supposed to be a skiing forum, not primarily a commentary on the general political landscape or the injustices piled on many people in this country particularly those who suffered terribly as a result of COVID-19.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Kimski44, couldn't agree more.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Being an acclaimed grumpy git, I find a bit of a whine cathartic. Are you people telling me that the hobby I've honed over 50 years* is now unacceptable in skiing circles? I'm doomed!
*And the only thing I'm really good at too!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Charliegolf,
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Pruman, To be perfectly candid any sport activity is hazardous at the moment because if you are injured whether minor or serious it is highly unlikely you will not be treated quickly of effectively due to the shortages of Nurses and Doctors in A&E departments. The NHS staffing is down by 60% in A&E units, I suspect EU hospitals are having similar staffing level issues. I know one UK A&E unit had 118 patients in the last 12 hours and only 8 staff out 25!
A cancelled ski holiday is not a problem. It is going to hospital expecting to be treated for an acute illness or injury.
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@David B, if you go down that path, then you should stop driving. If you ride a bike, you should stop that too. There is always a risk of injuries. Same holds for just about any physical activity. Where will you draw the line?
Bottom line: if you are not comfortable with going skiing because of the risk, then don’t go. Conversely, there are quite a few who understand that life is not infinite, tomorrow is not promised, and live life as full as they can. Merely existing is not living. Not for me anyway.
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@ulmerhutte,
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if you go down that path, then you should stop driving. If you ride a bike, you should stop that too. There is always a risk of injuries
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True, but at the moment there is the additional risk of not being able to access treatment. It's not the normal risk.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| ulmerhutte wrote: |
@David B, if you go down that path, then you should stop driving. If you ride a bike, you should stop that too. There is always a risk of injuries. Same holds for just about any physical activity. Where will you draw the line?
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I would drive more carefully and yes, drive less if possible. I would draw the line on whether it's necessary.
Do you go out to get your mail when there's ice on the driveway? Especially knowing the ice would likely melt in a few hours?
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Bottom line: if you are not comfortable with going skiing because of the risk, then don’t go. Conversely, there are quite a few who understand that life is not infinite, tomorrow is not promised, and live life as full as they can. Merely existing is not living. Not for me anyway. |
Tomorrow (rather, next month) will likely be less risky.
Do you go skiing off piste on a day with avi level of 5 instead of waiting for the snowpack to stabilize in a couple days?
If that's your idea of living life fully, you take on the extra risk others do without. They get to live to ski another day while you wait patiently under tons of snow till your partner to dig you out...
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Great stuff! We have nearly reached helmet discussions, at which point Snowheads will collapse into a singularity, ending forum life as we know it
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@abc, mailbox and avi risk 5 are absurd comparisons IMHO, but everybody has a personal risk appetite, so perhaps they are not absurd to you. By all means, sit out next year, or however long you feel you need to stay within your risk appetite.
Worth remembering: everybody who died today, or were diagnosed with cancer (etc) today, had plans and hopes for the days ahead that now come to nothing. One life - live it... and no, I would not go off-piste on an avi risk 5 day. That is outside my risk appetite.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| ulmerhutte wrote: |
@abc, mailbox and avi risk 5 are absurd comparisons IMHO, but everybody has a personal risk appetite, so perhaps they are not absurd to you. By all means, sit out next year, or however long you feel you need to stay within your risk appetite.
Worth remembering: everybody who died today, or were diagnosed with cancer (etc) today, had plans and hopes for the days ahead that now come to nothing. One life - live it... and no, I would not go off-piste on an avi risk 5 day. That is outside my risk appetite. |
"there are quite a few who understand that life is not infinite, tomorrow is not promised, and live life as full as they can"
Not as full as you claim to be, I dare say?
For me, I wait till the ice melts before I go to the mail box. Oddly enough, that's "living life as full as they can be" for my appetite.
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You know it makes sense.
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@JamesHJ, this thread started as an "observation" on "moanaholics". What do you expect? Polite reason? 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| JamesHJ wrote: |
| Great stuff! We have nearly reached helmet discussions.......... |
Funny you should mention it as there are many parallels with the psychology of helmet wearing. I will deliver my thesis another day. I've triggered enough lately.
| Hurtle wrote: |
| True, but at the moment there is the additional risk of not being able to access treatment. It's not the normal risk. |
That's right, A&E staff in, say, Northern Italy where Covid hit tragically hard, will not be best pleased to see you pitching up with your torn ACLs. They are probably understaffed too.
| abc wrote: |
| @JamesHJ, this thread started as an "observation" on "moanaholics". |
Correct, it was mainly about that and not about the diminishing risk of the virus itself - it's spoilt numpties trampling over common sense just to get away now now now saying "what about my kid's mental health" and "you only live once" while donning body armour and a helmet on a blue run. They post about beating up already beaten up tour operators for not picking up the phone swiftly, moaning about how hard it is to get PCR tests, moaning about airlines having to cancel flights (because, obviously, they know how to run an airline better), moaning about "We went to Les Gets and it rained", moan, moan, moan - so my question was simply 'Why? What's the urgency?" The mountains will still be there in April, honest.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| LittleRos wrote: |
| This is a winter sports forum. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to bemoan their inability to go skiing on a website literally designed for discussing skiing. However the sanctimonious idea that you can’t complain about missing out on anything because of Covid is everywhere so I suppose it’s inevitable that it’s here too. Yes, things could be worse. But you know what, they could be better too. A lot better. Telling people that they’re no allowed to be distressed at losing several thousand pounds is frankly bonkers, and I would have expected better from some of the posters on this thread. |
Well said.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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No, they'd not lost several thousand pounds. They have spent money they could afford to spend and because they booked non-refundable stuff, they haven't got their money back after being unable to travel. It's not like they've been scammed out of the money. As Prof. Sir Chris Whitty said, it's important to separate different issues. One issue is how well governments are handling the Pandemic (this has it's own thread). The second is the disappointment of being unable to travel and the third is not being able to get the cost back.
I'm with @Pruman in finding hyperbole over the latter two tedious. Yes, it's a ski forum. Yes, lots of people aren't able to go skiing. Yes, many of us have had trips cancelled. I appreciate the disappointment in part because I'm disappointed myself. But I don't see a ski holiday as some sort of fundamental human right. And if I organised a holiday in the middle of a Pandemic with no facility for refund then that'd be my fault, not someone else's.
But perhaps it's time to move on to a less contentions topic such as snow chains and winter tyres .......
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FAQ
