Ski Club of Great Britain, SCGB. Are you still a member? Why / Why not?

A snowHead

[Re-posting what I originally posted on Sunday, minus the final 2 paragraphs - since there's little point in tempting the censors again. That said, I'd assert that the last 2 paragraphs complied with sH terms and conditions]

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Leaving membership for this year to see how it goes: skiing Obergurgl (Jan) and Ischgl (Mar) - I know both resorts extremely well/very well respectively, so don't need a guide but am going by myself so it'd be good to ski with some people some of the time.

I suspect Obergurgl will be much the busier SCGB -wise, but the members I have skied with there are of a much lower ability level than Ischgl and in the past ski-leading has proven frustratingly slow at times there.

So, as I said - I will give it a try this year and then see...

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Currently a member – need to decide in the next few weeks whether to renew or not.

I joined 3 years ago as I was heading off to Whistler, and wanted to take advantage of the leading service. It was excellent, and made the holiday very enjoyable.

I’ve since stayed a member to take advantage of the instructor led sessions in Chamonix – it’s basically cheap occasional sessions with an instructor, on terrain I ski on a lot (so good for learning the area too).

If it was with ESF, I’d have cancelled my membership. But I like the Evo2 team in Chamonix. If Evo2 offered something similar directly, I’d just do that and not have SCGB membership.

However I believe prices are going up this season, and there are other ski schools in Chamonix offering great sessions and prices for seasonnaires – so I’m not sure it’s worth renewing.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@fixx sorry to go off topic but would you be able to PM me the schools in Cham offering local deals? I've never heard of any

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@Meltus, will do - though most I know of are women-focussed Smile

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Thanks! Yet another winter of being jealous of the women's mountain club... It's a great resource I keep telling my GF to go touring with them

After all it is free

I've been a member for 20+ years, rep/leader for 10 and standing again for Council this year (I have mixed feelings about this, long story)... however I do think SCGB is losing its way, and Snowheads seems rather more relevant - not least in its demographic. Organisation of a club is always tricky - SCGB has gone for a very overhead heavy model, may be fine when it is working - but this year they lost £1.1M - a large chunk of which was a disastrous website project. The salary for the CEO is huge and it does seem to be more concerned with the holiday company than the on snow experience of its members ... in my opinion. Perhaps there's a middle ground on overhead and membership fees. However SCGB like Snowheads is at its heart a club for members to get together and ski - and as someone has mentioned it is great to have these.

@pisteoff, thanks, a very interesting summary of your views from inside SCGB.

Don’t mean to be unduly critical but it sounds like a classic case of ‘let’s over complicate, over organise this and spoil it for our members’.

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I'm in but beginning to wonder why; have enjoyed discounts for kit, clothing and flights with Swiss, but that's about it. The magazine contains little of interest, I'm afraid (yet another feature on the City Ski Championships in Courmayeur - yawn!). I would like to ski with a leader/rep or whatever but they are operating in the same old resorts that they have for 20 years or more. I would like them to have a much more varied list (Saalbach is huge omission, for example). I'm on direct debit so must remember to cancel if I decide to leave!

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@pisteoff, thanks for coming in and asking questions – it’s good to hear from someone at SCGB reflecting on the current issues, and thinking seriously about the future.

I think sometimes people at SCGB can look a little too closely at Snowheads, and focus on trying to replicate some of it – but it takes a bit of luck, and some special alchemy, to create a big community driven resource. It’s not something that can be created by throwing money and a web development team at it.

Instead SCGB needs to look more closely at who UK skiers actually are, and trying to find the right ways of serving them.

To me it feels at the moment that the focus is just on reducing costs (and avoiding legal action) by cutting back on what the club has always been known for, rather than planning ahead and making the club well known for something genuinely relevant going forwards (not that I know what that might be!).

Good luck snowHead

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@pisteoff, thanks for declaring your interest. It was somewhat apparent from your low post count and nature of the question but you seem to be a more pragmatic persons than the most vociferous SCGB "rep" here who does nothing other than confirm to those of us that have never been members/left that it was teh right decision.

To me The SCGB is a Tour Operator that demands a membership fee and has been ill equipped to handle the 21st century with an aging membership and a succession of poor decisions which have got digital and social media completely wrong. If you look at what sHs is, all this could have been under the SCGB umbrella with a bit of forward thinking and less money grubbing with more willingness to self disrupt.....too late now.... Of course sHs "benign anarchy" would be somewhat of a challenge to certain traditionalist SCGB members I suspect, I mean how can you possibly ski with someone if you don't know whether they are purple grade or whatever. wink

@LOTA, +1, great point.

Resorts are constantly investing and changing - it could be really nice to have an oganisation helping people across the UK explore the new/improved areas, and see more of the variety of skiing on offer, rather than always repeating known names.

You know it makes sense.

I ditched membership for the family a few weeks ago. I just wish Snowheads admin would do a deal to sell insurance, I'm sure it would be popular and lots more would ditch the SCGB.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

[quote="fixx"]@pisteoff, thanks for coming in and asking questions – it’s good to hear from someone at SCGB reflecting on the current issues, and thinking seriously about the future.

Thats kind - but just to be clear I'm not 'at SCGB' - I'm a member and it has been great for me - but I share what most here share - a desire to ski with others and enjoy the mountains - I think clubs and having experienced people to help less experienced are very valuable. So my post here is an exploration with all those interested in what a club can do for us, and whether SCGB can be / is still relevant. I'm not sure myself.
I guess my declared interest is that I would like to think so because it honestly has been brilliant for me, completely opened my eyes as to what skiing can be about, and how to enjoy all mountain skiing safely. However I am very close to leaving membership myself - the way the loss of 'Leaders' has been forced through without engaging members or leaders is difficult to accept in a members club - I think the Club needs to change. Thanks for all the great comments here, btw

A snowHead

Interesting they still have a Tignes Leaders course advertised for 3-13 Dec 19
https://www.skiclub.co.uk/events/2019/12/leaders-course

https://www.skiclub.co.uk/ski-club-reps
The explanation seems that Reps will have the same qual

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Yes, and the club now seems to be saying it is compulsory for new style Reps. Note however that it is 2 days shorter and does not include the on snow leading parts, it is a mountain safety and ski skills course. In my experience it is very good, focused on avalanche safety

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@pisteoff, wow, lost £1.1m this year, a large chunk of which was on a disastrous website project?

Who was providing the website development, do you know?
Perhaps more relevant, who specified and commissioned it?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@pisteoff, I don't think you can blame them for the loss of "Leaders" that's something that's been forced on them legally/by insurers. Consulting the members to me would have just been a sham. But it is really a problem/symptomatic of some degree of arrogance that they think having a similar person as a "social secretary" in resort, living it up on member paid expenses is an adequate replacement.

For starters surely the social side comes together as a result of people skiing together not that a social secretary begats skiing groups. It's certainly a weird thing to articulate to an outsider you might be trying to recruit - you see you pay this membership fee and this gives you access to some sort of Bar Yoda who'll introduce you to other people standing near him/her then you might or might not decide to go skiing the next day with some of those people but not the Yoda as he/she isn't allowed.....

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I'm still signed up as a member of SCGB, but it's only ever been for the discounts. I see it as a financial investment, as the discounts genuinely save me more money than the membership costs. I've not got any interests in the trips, the guiding, the magazine etc.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

£3K is an expensive threshold to be a resort rep. Is bed and board provided? has this become a glorified gap year vehicles for wrinklies?

After all it is free

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@achilles, I wouldn't call TGR the "snowhead equivalent". It's a ski site devoted to a different segment of the skiing demographic.

Quite like the sound of Yoda I am

You know it makes sense.

Only belong for the family insurance, although after trying to extend cover this year I won't be renewing next year.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

Joined to go on their ski holidays many years ago especially a learn to ski offpiste in Flaine. I found that the other people on the holidays were perfectly normal and had a good time . Over the years found others to holidays with so the need dropped away. I did ski with reps in some resorts and enjoyed a beer with them. Never found any snobbery that is sometimes aluded to (or maybe it went over my head).

A snowHead

The Club needs some positive support here.
I joined 30 years ago, skied with some top brass , got to know the history and love The Club. Did several off-piste instruction courses when there were few others around. Got to know lots of lovely people and still ski with them.
Have made most of my ski progression in recent years in non-Club training camps and think The Club should have had a way of using these.
Still take the odd Fresh Tracks holiday, because they are ability related, and this has taken me to resorts I would never have known about otherwise.Ready made group of mates.....ok some oddballs but perhaps I am one myself.
There is no other ability-related holiday catalogue which offers anything like the scope of The Club/ Freshtracks.
However, running holidays is a risky business and we have had a sharp reminder of that this last season. Cannot be allowed to continue.
Club is heavy on overheads and that needs addressing.
It is not a criticism to say that it serves mainly an older agegroup...Birds of a feather, etc......as long as there is still some young input to enjoy the ethos and become our future Reps.
We couldn't cope with the whole of Snowheads in our membership......too many sharp knives and diversity of opinions, but I believe there enough folk of a certain type ( expect sneering response to this ) to form an adequate pool to keep the Club going and indeed flourishing, if soundly financially managed.
What is...a certain type..... ? well, it's outgoing, aspirational, adaptable, has a sense of loyalty and not in it just for the discounts, and yes, reasonably well off......but aren't most skiers so placed to even contemplate the sport ?) This "type" might well be a loner, or now without friends who still ski at a comparable level, or who needs the comfort of a leader and a structured group. He/she might be quite aged but likes the mountains and has enough for a 4 star hotel and they will find such a holiday with The Club.
One group we need to cater for is the impecunious 20-40 year old (where I was when I first joined and then left before re-joining when I had more disposable). Our holidays can be costly (and rule some people out ) but not dear....when you consider what benefits they offer.
I am sure I would enjoy a S/H bash, like Achilles whom I remember as a voice to be revered on the Club Chatsite of of bygone days, but my few precious ski days are taken up with established friends and it is to the Ski Club that I owe great gratitude for that.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@Farley Goode, the 'sharp knives and diversity' is largely the online element, don't confuse the two. The bashes are diverse but there's none of the backbiting and arguing that you get here, at least not that I've witnessed.

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@Farley Goode, good post. Every forum has its share of keyboard warriors these days. Their posts may be unrepresentative of the wider SnowHeads community.

I hope SCGB can overcome its current challenges and thrive. The need for sound financial management, whilst perhaps boring, seems a top priority.

If the SnowHeads community ‘lost’ £1m+ in one year, cake and neck buff supplies could be jeopardised.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I wonder what the comparative age profiles are between SCGB members and SnowHeads?

I suspect broadly similar, with relatively high medians and means. Be interesting to see I think.

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

I don't think sHs and SCGB demographics are that different. sHs potentially wins a bit at the younger end by being a bit less "structured" and a bit more diverse.

One thing however is that I suspect a number of sHs would not fit in a more formal "club" structure. And if the club has managed to lose more than £1m in a year, from a base of having such wealth and resources then the mind boggles as to what mgt has been doing.

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Ski Club of Great Britain, SCGB. Are you still a member? Why / Why not?

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