 Poster: A snowHead
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davidof, Good on you, please do.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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martinm, if you want to argue then I'll leave it for another day or another thread
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I wasn't arguing. You were the one being aggressive...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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robboj, no, you're not a tell it like it is kinda guy, you think that the way to get your point across to another parent is to kick them so hard in the dangly bits that they can't have any more kids. Get help son.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Bode Swiller, Apologies, on reflection I should have put a smiley or some such after than comment to indicate that however much said parent might deserve such I would not actually contemplate nor advocate doing so.
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| robboj wrote: |
| Bode Swiller, Apologies, on reflection I should have put a smiley or some such after than comment to indicate that however much said parent might deserve such I would not actually contemplate nor advocate doing so without smiling. |
Fixed it for you.
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robboj, what I've seen plenty of parents do is abdicate their kids safety by way of sticking a lid on their head. They then take them down a crowded, icy home run and constantly leave them exposed to being skittled. You see them taking a breather right in the firing line just below an icy patch almost saying "please wipe us out". Helmets are essential for kids but, ironically, parents would probably think harder about their mountaincraft if the kid wasn't wearing one.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Comedy Goldsmith wrote: |
| rob@rar wrote: |
| Comedy Goldsmith, did you read the comments from Schumacher's doctors that his wearing a helmet meant they had a serious brain injury to deal with rather than a corpse? |
Yes I did, and it would also be interesting to have their views on the possibility - being aired more and more widely by epidemiologists - that 'risk compensation' may be playing a part in helmet-wearers possibly having the same number of head injuries as in the past. |
So you are saying that if Schumacher hadn't taken excessive risks that day, caused by false confidence derived from wearing a helmet, that his helmet would have been unnecessary?
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Bode Swiller, you've hit the nail on the head there (pardon the pun) in that good mountain craft is way more important than any kit including helmet. Just as abs and traction control are the helmet of driving, it is way better to read the road in an advanced fashion and avoid using them in the first place.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Bode Swiller, Undoubtedly true. My specific comment was aimed at those who chose to ignore the possible consequences of an injury for their dependants and worse still not even adopt that most basic of precautions for smaller, thinner skulls.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| Comedy Goldsmith wrote: |
| rob@rar wrote: |
| Comedy Goldsmith, did you read the comments from Schumacher's doctors that his wearing a helmet meant they had a serious brain injury to deal with rather than a corpse? |
Yes I did, and it would also be interesting to have their views on the possibility - being aired more and more widely by epidemiologists - that 'risk compensation' may be playing a part in helmet-wearers possibly having the same number of head injuries as in the past. |
So you are saying that if Schumacher hadn't taken excessive risks that day, caused by false confidence derived from wearing a helmet, that his helmet would have been unnecessary? |
No, I'm not trying (unlike certain newspapers) to analyse his specific accident. I'm just putting the accident into the context that serious head injuries are not decreasing and therefore most ski head injuries inside helmets have to be judged in that context. It is possible that Michael Schumacher's accident would not have occurred had he not been wearing a helmet. If one doesn't accept that point then one is throwing the whole validity of 'risk compensation' as a theory out of the window.
You're at liberty, of course, to do that.
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This topic is a disgrace. I wish all the keyboard warriors could take it elsewhere.
Get well soon Michael and happy birthday.
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You know it makes sense.
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As an aside, this thread is phenomenally busy. 28,000 views since it commenced on 29 December (5 days): average 5000 to 6000 views per day. An unusually busy thread on snowHeads is (as I understand it) 1000 views per day.
Presumably those who find the thread irrelevant, a disgrace, the pits etc. etc. are in a minority. There is nothing disrespectful, in my view, about a vigorous discussion of relevant issues. Better than some faux 'bedside ritual', which would hardly be in the spirit of an exceptional risk-taker.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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HoneyBunny, If it was on a tribute page, a personal page belonging to Michael etc then I would agree. But it's just a ski forum, it is obviously going to spark discussion on not just that accident but the likelihood of such accidents and possible prevention. I don't think that anyone here has made any disrespectful comments towards Michael Schumacher.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Comedy Goldsmith wrote: |
| I'm just putting the accident into the context that serious head injuries are not decreasing and therefore most ski head injuries inside helmets have to be judged in that context. |
If I have a serious head injury I really couldn't care less whether the overall number of head injuries is increasing or decreasing, so I take issue with your assertion that the use, or not, of helmets has to be judged in that context. That is an assertion that insurance actuaries might find useful, but at an individual level I don't think it adds much to the decision making process. The facts seem to be that in some circumstances wearing a helmet can add some protection against injury, but they will not protect you fully or even at all in other circumstances. Beyond that that it is up to the individual to decide whether helmet wearing is necessary or not.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think we probably all agree that, in this particular, specific accident, a helmet saved a life.
However, if Michael had not been wearing a helmet, this particular, specific accident would not have occurred. I'm not talking subjectives, like risk compensation, but about the physics. A helmet is a physical thing. It's not like wearing a different beanie. It has volume and it has weight, therefore, the body has to make adjustments for this. Michael's C of G, and therefore his balance, would be changed. Therefore his fall would too. And it's consequences, for better or worse.
This is neither a pro, nor anti, argument. I'm just fed up of statements on the lines of "He would be dead without the helmet" or "He wouldn't have risked it without the helmet". Nobody can possibly know.
All the best to Michael X
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Just seen this article on the BBC website. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-25582925
Is it just me, or is it all a bit weird? Just how much of a fan do you have to be to get on a bus and be driven miles just to stand outside a hospital when the chap you are wishing well to has no idea you are there? His wife thanked fans for their support, but if I was in her position then what I'd really mean is 'Thank you for your kind thoughts, but our lives would be a great deal easier if you all just went home and took those damned journalists with you'.
'But the spokesman insisted that the event was not about promoting the Ferrari brand or its clients'. It would be too cynical to suggest otherwise, but I just feel it's all so weird it's kind of creepy. They even had some chap named Cacciatore (do we know him?) bring along his 12 year old son and a birthday card for MS.
Now, my attitude has nothing to do with being unsympathetic I just can't imagine making this sort of pilgrimage for anyone.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| maggi wrote: |
I think we probably all agree that, in this particular, specific accident, a helmet saved a life.
However, if Michael had not been wearing a helmet, this particular, specific accident would not have occurred. I'm not talking subjectives, like risk compensation, but about the physics. A helmet is a physical thing. It's not like wearing a different beanie. It has volume and it has weight, therefore, the body has to make adjustments for this. Michael's C of G, and therefore his balance, would be changed. Therefore his fall would too. And it's consequences, for better or worse. |
You can't really mean that. Helmets weigh grams, not kilos. What total rubbish.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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foxtrotzulu, If I was very ill in a hospital, I would be quite annoyed if people had a minutes silence for me while I was alive. That's very odd.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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maggi, while you cannot turn physics off, I cannot see how a quarter kilo of distributed plastic and foam would throw a supremely fit racing car driver, who is used to supporting a much more substantial helmet under significant G loading for 2 hours off his game. sorry you're just wrong on this one.
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| HoneyBunny wrote: |
| This topic is a disgrace. I wish all the keyboard warriors could take it elsewhere.... |
Other forums are available. TGR, for example.
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thecramps, and the difference between a cut and a fractured skull is millimetres not metres. What were you saying about rubbish? 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Avalanche Poodle wrote: |
| HoneyBunny, If it was on a tribute page, a personal page belonging to Michael etc then I would agree. But it's just a ski forum, it is obviously going to spark discussion on not just that accident but the likelihood of such accidents and possible prevention. I don't think that anyone here has made any disrespectful comments towards Michael Schumacher. |
Discussion about helmets is (boringly) inevitable, I'm talking about the childish slanging matches that have marred a sensible thread. I find it quite distasteful and petty when someone is fighting for their life. Same goes to achilles. I'm not the only person who's said as much.
You'd think CG and PJSki could at least refrain from yelling at each other and have a mature discussion.
Anyway, as you were.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Fri 3-01-14 16:13; edited 2 times in total
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In a sad sort of way this thread is a bit like a tag team verbal boxing match - think i will put my feet up, grab the popcorn and watch from a safe distance..i will leave you all to guess if i have a helmet on
akirk, thanks for your contribution.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Richard_Sideways, it wouldn't put him "off his game" but, like the proverbial butterfly, it would change this specific accident.
My last word. I'm not getting into arguments, just stating a fact.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| maggi wrote: |
I think we probably all agree that, in this particular, specific accident, a helmet saved a life.
However, if Michael had not been wearing a helmet, this particular, specific accident would not have occurred. I'm not talking subjectives, like risk compensation, but about the physics. A helmet is a physical thing. It's not like wearing a different beanie. It has volume and it has weight, therefore, the body has to make adjustments for this. Michael's C of G, and therefore his balance, would be changed. Therefore his fall would too. And it's consequences, for better or worse.
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Load of rubbish. Back to the kitchen with you!
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maggi, I profoundly disagree, Richard_Sideways, got it right
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You know it makes sense.
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maggi, Are you the Oracle?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| maggi wrote: |
Richard_Sideways, it wouldn't put him "off his game" but, like the proverbial butterfly, it would change this specific accident.
My last word. I'm not getting into arguments, just stating a fact. |
Facts? To suggest, as a matter of fact, that the injured party's trajectory through the air would not have terminated with a head first collision into a rock had he not been wearing a helmet, is the most preposterous statement yet made in this thread.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Fri 3-01-14 16:28; edited 1 time in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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PJSki, I do agree with you but we can't argue with cold hard facts like those.
Oh no, wait, that's not right is it.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Should I be worried that my helmet is going to try and talk me into doing something really dangerous if I wear it? 
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Fri 3-01-14 16:29; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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If ever a thread warranted one of these, it's this one...
...i'm going to bed
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Neraida wrote: |
| Should I be worried that my helmet is going to try and talk me into doing something really dangerous if I wear it? |
You are putting a layer of tin foil between your head and the helmet, aren't you?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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NO! GAH!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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thecramps,
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foxtrotzulu, If I was very ill in a hospital, I would be quite annoyed if people had a minutes silence for me while I was alive. That's very odd.
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I agree. I'd be very hacked off.
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| davidof wrote: |
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| I just heard on the BBC News that a vigil is being held outside MS' hospital, to mark his birthday. I do hope he's on the mend. |
yes, people from all over Europe have come, I'm popping by in about an hour to pay my respects so I'll say a little prayer on behalf of snow heads. |
Thank you.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Neraida wrote: |
| maggi, Are you the Oracle? |
No, I am the Oracle.
ie I talk a lot of balls, but put it in such a way that people are unsure if it is balls or not.[/u]
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| Quote: |
Can't a firendly mod just put all their posts somewhere else?
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We need a new forum rule. Comedy Goldsmith and PJSki are an embarrassment to SCGB, an embarrassment to themselves and to SH with all this petty squabbling and derailing of threads.
Guys, take it to SCGB forum, or to PMs, or to the pub. Anywhere but here.
I think we need a new furum rule where any squabbling by those two over ancient SCGB history results in an instant ban!
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FAQ
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