 Poster: A snowHead
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| T Bar wrote: |
| Considering they are meant to serve their members and not the resorts |
If the ski club was wholly member funded that would be fair enough but they are a bit of an amorphus blob being part TO (as is snowheads these days) and being a channel for the ski industry including the resorts from which they receive goods and chattels.
Once you accept money or largesse from someone it is difficult to remain totally independent or unbiased.
The term "broker" used above is probably quite a good description. They appear to be a broker between a certain type of skier and the ski business, which is probably why the open forum format didn't fit with their model.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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davidof,
Mmm In their governance statement they state:
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Align as nearly as possible the interests of individual members, the Club as a whole and the snowsports community
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I have no objection to their acting as a conduit for the collating of information of snow conditions by the resorts.
However the reps reports are frequently less honest that the resort reports, unless the snow conditions are good throughout they virtually never give an overview of the snow and concentrate entirely on whatever'good' snow there is or fail to mention anything at all about the snow.
I am not particualrly expressing symapthy with the original poster as once one has skied for a while you learn to ignore much of what is said. However there are many inexperienced skiers who do treat these reports seriously and as such they are flawed and a dishonest 'snow report'.
They could serve a genuinely useful function in describing the conditions at different altitudes and aspects within the resort, this would be useful to both skiers planning their holidays and ultimately to the industry as a whole instead there is a persistant Polyannaish ine of everything is permanently wonderful ( except for the odd bit of bad weather) which ultimately helps no one.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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T Bar,
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| They could serve a genuinely useful function in describing the conditions at different altitudes and aspects within the resort, this would be useful to both skiers planning their holidays and ultimately to the industry as a whole instead there is a persistant Polyannaish ine of everything is permanently wonderful ( except for the odd bit of bad weather) which ultimately helps no one. |
In case you haven't noticed, conditions are in a constant state of flux.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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In case you haven't noticed, conditions are in a constant state of flux.
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It does not mean that an accurate knowledge of current conditions particularly when they are bad is not useful when planning where to go in the near future particularly during relatively stable weather patterns that frequently exist in the alps.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| T Bar wrote: |
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In case you haven't noticed, conditions are in a constant state of flux.
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It does not mean that an accurate knowledge of current conditions particularly when they are bad is not useful when planning where to go in the near future particularly during relatively stable weather patterns that frequently exist in the alps. |
Go on then, you compile a report based on your last day skiing, to illustrate what you mean.
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T Bar, I agree that would be really useful...
...but for all except a couple of repped resorts there is just one rep, who also has to lead groups, do social hours etc etc and there is no way he or she is going to be able to take representative independent snow measurements at several sites in the resort, every single day.
In addition, in many resorts with reps - they are not there in early December and April... which is just when the reports would need to me more accurate, and there are only reps in 30 or so resorts out of the hundreds or so around the place...
So I think the SCGB reports will need to continue - realistically - to be what they are. Based largely on Info from the resorts themselves. Just too expensive to do more perhaps?
In the end there are so many additional ways of getting snow data - eg webcams, phoning the SCGB rep/leader (mobiles seem to have made dealing with reps so much easier these days) or even looking for info on a forum like this...
Bottom line - the OP - who was not even a SCGB member - wants to blame them/see them lose members, and blame anyone else but himself, for his decisions. 
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stoat of the dead,
Bottom line it seems is that OP was a little naive perhaps and the thread title didn't help the cause, but not offensive, then he got jumped.
So I haven't been out to measure the snowpack at Whistler or even bothered to look at the reports, but I've been skiing here for the last few days and can tell by what is covered and filled in roughly what the snow base is and that even with a really deep alpine snowpack spring temperatures mean the ski out wont last. I can tell because it was hot and sunny yesterday that things may be a little crispy first thing this morning, especially on the sunny aspects (hence why I'm typing this and not running out the door), I can tell you that the chance of running out of places to ski in the next week will be very slim...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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stoat of the dead,
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...but for all except a couple of repped resorts there is just one rep, who also has to lead groups, do social hours etc etc and there is no way he or she is going to be able to take representative independent snow measurements at several sites in the resort, every single day.
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The thing is they do provide a reps report each day which is listed under snow reports and singularly fail to report anything other than good conditions. They should either leave the reports as resort provided reports (and preferably make it a bit clearer that this is what they are) and attempt nothing else or report what they do see somewhat more realistically.
PJSki,
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Go on then, you compile a report based on your last day skiing, to illustrate what you mean.
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OK an attempt.
4 Valleys 16/04/2011
General conditions:
higher north facing pistes remained firm throughout the day with good skiing. All West facing pistes skied were subject to freeze thaw conditions providing a hard but well pisted seurface first thing progressivly softening as the day progressed and beoming slushy between mid morning and midafternoon depending on altitude. The snow line was approx 1900m north facing rising to 2500m south facing. Below these altitudes piste skiing was reliant entirely on snow making.
At altitude beneath Mont Fort the piste was heavily mogulled with a hard but decent surface care was needed with a few exposed rocks. Excellent sking was had between Col des Gentianes and Le Chaux though though care was needed on parts where the run was exposed to the sun.The area above La Chaux had good skiing early though conditions reapidly softened in pistes heavily exposed to the sun some were incomplete.Agood sking was available throughout the day in the area above Lac des Vaux.
The Itinaires above Tortin were closed . The run fromTortin to Siviez was open with artificial snow giving good skiing in the morning but becoming very slushy as the day progressed and thin in places. Links to other sectors are closed due to inadequate snow though skiing is available within these sectors.
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| T Bar wrote: |
stoat of the dead
PJSki,
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Go on then, you compile a report based on your last day skiing, to illustrate what you mean.
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OK an attempt.
4 Valleys 16/04/2011
General conditions:
higher north facing pistes remained firm throughout the day with good skiing. All West facing pistes skied were subject to freeze thaw conditions providing a hard but well pisted seurface first thing progressivly softening as the day progressed and beoming slushy between mid morning and midafternoon depending on altitude. The snow line was approx 1900m north facing rising to 2500m south facing. Below these altitudes piste skiing was reliant entirely on snow making.
At altitude beneath Mont Fort the piste was heavily mogulled with a hard but decent surface care was needed with a few exposed rocks. Excellent sking was had between Col des Gentianes and Le Chaux though though care was needed on parts where the run was exposed to the sun.The area above La Chaux had good skiing early though conditions reapidly softened in pistes heavily exposed to the sun some were incomplete.Agood sking was available throughout the day in the area above Lac des Vaux.
The Itinaires above Tortin were closed . The run fromTortin to Siviez was open with artificial snow giving good skiing in the morning but becoming very slushy as the day progressed and thin in places. Links to other sectors are closed due to inadequate snow though skiing is available within these sectors. |
Spring conditions in other words. Don't see how your wordy description is of much use to someone thinking of booking. Conditions, don't forget, and this is a key point, change.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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PJSki,
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Spring conditions in other words. Don't see how your wordy description is of much use to someone thinking of booking. Conditions, don't forget, and this is a key point, change.
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It makes it clear that many links are closed and that the snow line is higher than usual. If you were comparing with another resort with open links and a lower snow line you may choose that . You would not read the report in isolation but in conjunction with other reports that would be filed during the week and preceding week or two.
Conditions do change and not always for the better but information on current snow conditions makes a successful choice more likely than one based on no information or misleading information.
A report from the equivalent week last year that still had spring conidtions would have read very differently
The reps report from Tignes yesterday described where they skied and that they had lunch it said that they had a good time but this was not clear whether it was because of or inspite of the snow conditions. An inexperienced member might assume that when filed under snow reports it was because of the conditions a cynic would assume that unless stated otherwise it was inspite of them. Not a very honest state of affairs.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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"Spring conditions" is an annoying (and lazy) description. I've skied every spring since 2003 and conditions in spring vary as much as conditions in winter.
It's no use expecting the SCGB to provide honest descriptions when they rely on the goodwill of the resort. But all resorts (as far as I know) publish daily reports of which pistes and lifts are open. They say it all, really. If 60% of the lifts and runs are closed early, then you can be reasonably sure that they've only been closed when they got really grotty, and that a proportion of those still open will be marginal.
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T Bar, your level of detail is of little use when booking.
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You know it makes sense.
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With the lack of snow across the French Alps early in the season the end of the season was always going to be variable at best. Places like Les Carroz closed early, La Tania looked pretty bear, so it must have been the same in Les Arcs. I know some resorts try and go on about micro climates but it was 25 degrees in France and the snow simply melted. Not exactly sure why anyone would book late this season, save money for next season surely?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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pam w,
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It's no use expecting the SCGB to provide honest descriptions
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Possibly true but their practice of being more dishonest than the resorts is not one too encourage new members who are unaware of this and take their reports in good faith.
PJSki,
Feel free to use the reps report of lunch and a jolly good time was had by all if you find it more useful.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| chrisb wrote: |
| With the lack of snow across the French Alps early in the season the end of the season was always going to be variable at best. Places like Les Carroz closed early, La Tania looked pretty bear, so it must have been the same in Les Arcs. I know some resorts try and go on about micro climates but it was 25 degrees in France and the snow simply melted. Not exactly sure why anyone would book late this season, save money for next season surely? |
I booked on Thursday, 3 days in Tignes, what's the worst that can happen? Still a ski holiday, and if the weather forecast is half right, I will be happy. It a long time till December!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| T Bar wrote: |
PJSki,
Feel free to use the reps report of lunch and a jolly good time was had by all if you find it more useful. |
A typically snide, complete with some social stereotyping, attack on a group of individuals who give up their time to help enhance other people's skiing experiences. It's not like they get much in return apart from a free lift pass, some very average accommodation and online attacks from a completely irrelevant punch of punters.
What you should do is make your accusation of dishonesty directly and put your real name to it. There's, what, 200+ Reps and you are calling them all dishonest? Man up and confront the Ski Club about it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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lightningdan, not your only trip of the season though? 3 days in Tignes with a glacier sounds very sensible, but you woul dnot have booked lower down would you?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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PJSki,
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A typically snide, complete with some social stereotyping,
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 I was commenting on the utility of yesterdays snow report not social stereotyping, and quoting it virtually verbatim.
FWIW I have nothing against any SCGB reps, those that I have met have generally been decent folk and some have expressed concern about their lack of ability to accurately report snow conditions.
I really don't think it is worth complaining to the SCGB about their snow reports they have long been a standing joke, you seem to be the only person on the thread who regards them as honest.
I just popped across to the SCGB web site to look at the posts, something I have not done for a long time due to the lack of traffic and if you care to look there is a thread there also with all posts bar one stating their opinion that the reports are essentially inaccurate.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Sun 24-04-11 13:58; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| T Bar wrote: |
PJSki,
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A typically snide, complete with some social stereotyping,
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I was commenting on the utility of yesterdays snow report not social stereotyping, and quoting it virtually verbatim.
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Not you didn't, you stuck the word 'jolly' at the front to give the reports the old 'jolly hockey sticks' feel to it as a means to add a negative social stereotype to rep and his group. Snidely dishonest of you.
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| FWIW I have nothing against any SCGB reps, those that I have met have generally been decent folk and some have expressed concern about their lack of ability to accurately report snow conditions. |
I don't believe you.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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PJSki,
Oh dear, the emphasis was that it was not to do with the snow, I have precisely zero interest in social stereotyping.
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T Bar, you would say that, wouldn't you.
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PJSki,
I am not quite sure if you think I have something against reps or that I am interested in social stereotyping them.
As long time contributor to this board I have seen threads on both subjects. If it was a particular concern of mine my name should come up repeatedly in them , if you are interested run a search and I think you will find that it does not.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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PJSki, having met a bunch of SCGB reps at one of their pre-season shindigs (which I shamelessly gatcrashed) I can confirm that they were all very jolly hockey sticks indeed.
Nice canapes though. 
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Lizzard, I think that may be a more accurate description of the female reps than the blokes. After all, one of the more interesting and fun characters to be found in snowHeads' boarding community recently became a rep 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| PJSki wrote: |
| T Bar wrote: |
PJSki,
Feel free to use the reps report of lunch and a jolly good time was had by all if you find it more useful. |
A typically snide, complete with some social stereotyping, attack on a group of individuals who give up their time to help enhance other people's skiing experiences. It's not like they get much in return apart from a free lift pass, some very average accommodation and online attacks from a completely irrelevant punch of punters.
What you should do is make your accusation of dishonesty directly and put your real name to it. There's, what, 200+ Reps and you are calling them all dishonest? Man up and confront the Ski Club about it. |
That is an approach that David Goldsmith would take. How ironic.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Spent 5 days at Geneva Airport with these reps, amazed and humbled by how hard they worked to try and help the stranded clients, for sure, all a bit 'looking forward to the Royal wedding types' but wow, they sorted it, would love them to be looking after my holidays, although a couple of months cutting weed in California isn't in the brochure.
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FAQ
