 Poster: A snowHead
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| Shimmy Alcott wrote: |
| PJSki, make dried apricots your friends, it must be your age |
You might be right. This morning's one, Jesus, I didn't know whether to call Dyno Rod or a midwife!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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PJSki, what makes you think anyone wants to know about your bowel movements?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Crikey is this an example of an awesome SH thread drift? From 'helmet use attitudes and beliefs' to 'bowel movements' in 7 pages - mind you some might say they are one and the same 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| PJSki, what makes you think anyone wants to know about your bowel movements? |
As I was saying...thought I'd finished twice! In the end I just crimped it off. Currently hoping for the best. I'll PM you if I get the tortoise head before tomorrow.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Sat 31-07-10 14:09; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| PJSki, what makes you think anyone wants to know about your bowel movements? |
We don't of course but, as we have seen here before, he's anally fixated and it would be good if one of our resident amateur psychologists could post an opinion.
Shimmy a dried apricot is his best chance of friendship.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
I think concrete would actually hurt rather more than a tree
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sloop,
Now thats an intresting question which we did not pick up on!
While I agree that concrete is hard, that little tree just off the side of the piste at + 2,000 metres up could have been there for a 100 years and in that time they get pretty hard, plus when you hit one its a point impact which can do a lot of damage!!
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slider_tom, JWAZ - my response to Masque is in the spirit.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Nice to see that the helmet debate also rages in other areas.
After a bit yesterday about the new london bike scheme ads showing people not wearing lids, 2 letters in the Metro today stating that wearing a helmet makes cycling look too dangerous so people don't take it up, and my personal favourite, that wearing helmets means drivers feel that they can drive closer to cyclists as they're safer, Brian from Middlesex says there are STUDIES that back him up on this too...
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Richard_Sideways, suppose we're just waiting for the first Boris Bike Scheme death. It can't be far off. Will probably involve a bendy bus.
We need more helmet debates like a hole in the head.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Bode Swiller, agreed - but I rather hope the bike scheme works - and spreads to other cities.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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achilles, flat cities like Lincoln maybe? I hope it works too but we can all imagine the levels of media hysteria if/when some poor unfortunate cops it... Especially if it's an innocent pedestrian. I was in Amsterdam recently and it was like dodging bullets. Helmets for pedestrians, there's a good idea.
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Bode Swiller, the middle of Lincoln is anything but flat!
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You know it makes sense.
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Bode Swiller, mmm. Hadn't thought of the responsibility/liability issue. BTW there are what you might call 2 main areas of Lincoln - up-hill and down-hill. They are both very flat - but there is a very significant heave between the two - most non-sports cyclists dismount.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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laundryman, achilles, Hey, last time I was that far east I found myself in Moscow.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Bode Swiller,
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Helmet use attitudes survey results are in and the summary of the research is below
Use of Helmets in Snow Sports: Attitudes and Beliefs
When Dieter Althaus was involved in a skiing fatality at the beginning of 2009 sales of helmets for skiing soared and debates about the use of helmets in snow sports were reignited; these debates were refuelled with the death of actress, Nastaha Richardson. Fatalities in snow sports are quite rare despite the prominence given to these in the media. However, the primary cause of death is traumatic brain injury, which is also the primary cause for long-term disability. For this reason, there have been some calls for mandatory helmet use as there is evidence that using helmets may reduce the risk of serious head injuries by as much as 50%. Hence, bodies such as the Swiss Council for Accident Prevention (bfu), Monash University Accident Research Centre and the American Medical Association recommend helmet use. Yet, they support voluntary use as there is no evidence that mandatory use would reduce the number of fatalities. This latter reason has been used by opponents of helmet use to suggest that there is no compelling reason to wear helmets, with some arguing that doing so may actually increase the risks of incurring an injury owing to risk compensation.
Although helmet use in snow sports is increasing, it varies widely across ski regions with uptake as low as 12% in some areas. Much of the research into why people wear helmets assumes that helmet use is common sense and those who do not use them lack sufficient knowledge of the risks involved. While there is research to suggest that better knowledge may be associated with safer skiing behaviours, there is also evidence that those who take more risks are more knowledgeable. If knowledge does not fully explain why people use or do not use helmets for snow sports, then maybe we should look at people’s attitudes and beliefs. Prior research into this subject has elicited some of the beliefs and attitudes associated with helmet use, but did not indicate how strongly each of these influenced a person’s behaviour. Hence, research was undertaken to assess the variables influencing people’s intention to use helmet (and indirectly the likelihood that they would do so).
We invited people to complete an online questionnaire constructed using the well-tested method for the Theory of Planned Behaviour (Ajzen 1985) and drawing on beliefs and attitudes found from earlier research. Over 1200 adults completed this survey; they were predominantly skiers (c. 80%) of whom 9% also boarded; almost three-quarters were male. The majority were at advanced or expert levels and were positively disposed to helmet use.
We found that a person’s intention to use a helmet was strongly related to their age, attitude, beliefs about the amount of choice they had (perceived behavioural control), what was normal for their sport (subjective norms), past behaviour, self-efficacy and moral norms. Unsurprisingly, the strongest predictor of a person’s intention to use a helmet was past behaviour. This may explain why those most likely to have worn or intend to wear a helmet were significantly younger than those least likely to do so. Older experienced skiers may have begun learning when helmets were not available whereas younger skiers may have been introduced to skiing or other sports when young and helmets were more commonly used.
Attitude was the next most significant predictor for helmet use intentions, with beliefs about the protective aspects of helmets being the most important. This finding supports the idea that helmet users were more likely than non-users to believe that helmets would protect them from injury. Although those who were unlikely to use helmets were more inclined to believe that wearing helmets would lead to risk compensation, these beliefs were weak and may have very little influence on their ultimate behaviour.
The overall analysis does not support the idea that helmet use behaviours are influenced by subjective norms as suggested by some researchers. However, analysis of individual beliefs indicates that those with a strong intent to use a helmet were much more likely than those with little intent to report social pressure to wear helmets. A similar finding exists for moral norms.
It seems that there is a tendency for people to do what they have always done as custom and habit presents the path of least resistance. While it is possible that beliefs elicited so far may be convenient excuses that do not ultimately influence behavioural intentions, generally, the beliefs held by those with low and high intent to use helmets were mostly in the expected direction, but the differences were small and often not important.
Note This research study was undertaken by Mary Ondrusz as part of the requirement for the MSc in Health Psychology at the University of Surrey under the supervision of Dr Victoria Senior.
I am indebted to every person who participated in this study and who willingly donated their time to support my work. Any queries about this study may be directed to Mary Ondrusz (email: mo00044@surrey.ac.uk or m_ondrusz@hotmail.com) or to Dr Victoria Senior (email: V.Senior@surrey.ac.uk).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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slider_tom, thanks for reporting back. I have little to say on the findings without appearing intolerant
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
Over 1200 adults completed this survey; they were predominantly skiers (c. 80%) of whom 9% also boarded; almost three-quarters were male. The majority were at advanced or expert levels and were positively disposed to helmet use.
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Out of all of this....
" The majority were at advanced or expert levels"
That bit worries me... how many other sports would a majority of 1200 people think they were advanced or expert?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Thanks for reporting back which is a courtesy beyond most survey pimps. I can't say I'm any the wiser - is there a twitter version of the conclusions?
| slider_tom wrote: |
Attitude was the next most significant predictor for helmet use intentions, with beliefs about the protective aspects of helmets being the most important.
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No poo-poo Sherlock! Glad to see it wasn't because the Wasabi Green colour scheme available was simply divine. 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
is there a twitter version of the conclusions?
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Some people wear helmets, some do not.
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| Quote: |
Some people wear helmets, some do not.
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I can't believe after 7 pages on here, 1200 results and a detailed report back that you came up with that utter, utter nonsense Bode Swiller, ... that is just plainly innaccurate and makes a mockery of the whole thing.... grow up...
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'cos it should be:
" Some people LIKE to wear helmets, some do not."
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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slider_tom, thanks for reporting back. Sorry but I'm afraid I'm of the opinion that the results reflect conclusions that could have been arrived at in an apres-ski bar over a pint.
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slider_tom, unstated sampling method. No mention of method and response rate. And we saw how it worked.
Therefore total fail and waste of time and effort.  Call us when you have a representational survey with a known response rate.
Do people get any academic credit for this?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hmm University of Surrey. If only a snowHead was connected to that esteemed money making machine oops I mean University 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Thank you for the update. it is good manners. Almost innevitable the we also witness some scratchy egos posting. This is not a viva nor an academic publication or conference. It is polite to report back, the academic rigor (or otherwise) is not the point.
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| stoat of the dead wrote: |
slider_tom, unstated sampling method. No mention of method and response rate. And we saw how it worked.
Therefore total fail and waste of time and effort. Call us when you have a representational survey with a known response rate.
Do people get any academic credit for this? |
Hmm. Not sure where to start. The feedback that was given to the board was not (somewhat surprising I know) the entire publication. Even more astonishing it was not not even an abstract - it was more in the line of a press release or if you like a common courtesy. If you are interested in finding out about the study itself there was that little bit at the bottom which told you whom to contact.
On a separate issue how do YOU propose to get a response rate from an anonymous internet survey?
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You know it makes sense.
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slider_tom, well... You might start by not claiming that the survey is anything more than useful for looking at the attitudes of a small unrepresentative sample of Internet users, many of whom CBA to finish it because of the way it was written... Or may be you choose a different sampling methodology...
So much of the news we see and hear these days is actually derived from press releases or badly skewed surveys...
So are you saying that there is a press release and no online access to the paper?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Seriously? Who cares?
I wear a helmet when skiing because I don't see any logical reason not to...
1. Its comfortable to wear
2. It keeps my head nice and toasty
3. Wearing a "cool" bobble hat doesn't make me (or anyone for that matter) look any "cooler"
4. It protects my head
To those of you insistent on the validity of point 4, obviously you don't need to wear a helmet as there's no brain up there for a helmet to protect.
It doesn't take a genius to work out that smashing your head against a brick wall whilst wearing a helmet doesn't hurt, doing it without one f'ing hurts (and a visit to the hospital for a few stitches). The last time I checked, walls are about the same "hardness" as rocks on a mountain; correct?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| stoat of the dead wrote: |
| slider_tom, well... You might start by not claiming that the survey is anything more than useful for looking at the attitudes of a small unrepresentative sample of Internet users, many of whom CBA to finish it because of the way it was written... Or may be you choose a different sampling methodology... |
I have had another look at the PR and for the life of me could not see where it said anything about the survey being representative - but of course I could be mistaken - it has happened in the past and no doubt will happen in the future.
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So much of the news we see and hear these days is actually derived from press releases or badly skewed surveys...
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That may well be true, but with the press generally trying to be 'objective' and not having the necessary knowledge it is likely to be the case.
[/quote]
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So are you saying that there is a press release and no online access to the paper? |
Alas, whether there is access to the paper or not is not controlled by the either the researchers nor the supervisors - it is generally up to the University as a whole.
As a small aside, I am personally very much in favour of research being available to access for free/low cost however:
1. this is not my research and
2. it is not in my control.
3. who pays for the servers/ bandwidth to make it free?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| junglist_matty wrote: |
| It doesn't take a genius to work out that smashing your head against a brick wall whilst wearing a helmet doesn't hurt |
But a genius did work out that it does hurt. That lump of jelly between your ears keeps moving on impact with or without a helmet and that's where a lot of the damage is done. Anyone who thinks they are that much better protected in such circumstances is not a genius.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| stoat of the dead wrote: |
| So are you saying that there is a press release and no online access to the paper? |
If it got published properly you'd have to subscribe to the relevant journal to get any more than the abstract anyway.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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[quote="Bode Swiller"]
| junglist_matty wrote: |
| But a genius did work out that it does hurt. That lump of jelly between your ears keeps moving on impact with or without a helmet and that's where a lot of the damage is done. Anyone who thinks they are that much better protected in such circumstances is not a genius. |
No, that took an idiot. The genius hit his head lightly, then a bit harder and worked out the harder you hit, the more it hurts.
I'm not going to disagree with you regarding the internal damage of a head impact. However, what is pretty obvious is a head impact with a pyramid shaped rock... Hitting your head on something like that is likely to crack your skull as the impact is pin pointed to one area. The same impact, whilst wearing a helmet means the impact is more evenly distributed on your skull and so are less likely to crack your skull.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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ooohhhhh... here we go... (again)... where's the popcorn etc...etc...
I still can't believe you lot have skipped over the significant finding that a majority of people think they are advanced or expert in winter sports.
What other sport (especially one invloving high speeds) can you think of where a majority of people who take part claim to be this skilled?
I can drive, have done it for years; I must now be advanced or an expert in the 'sport' of driving.
This is surely the most intriguing bit of data this survey has gathered. The helmet thing is/was a no brainer (depending whether you were wearing one or not )
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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flangesax, yep, most people are fairly rank at sliding around. What I see from the comfort of my own chairlift survey is a mass of defensive-looking skiers moving relatively slowly and making no real use of the technology on their feet. Most simply do not possess the dynamic posture required to flex the boots they were sold when they happily descibed themselves as advanced/expert or whatever to the on-commission shop fella. They hit the merest patch of hard stuff (which they call "ice") and they are all over the place. Lots of 'em wearing helmets but I'm not sure what damage they'll do to themselves at 5mph. Rare, by comparison, that you look down and think "blimey, he/she is a good skier" and, when you do, chances are they are not wearing a lid. So, to answer the question that you weren't even asking, the answer is "I don't know". What I do know is that the survey was an attitude and beliefs survey and the major conclusion appears to be:
| Quote: |
that a person’s intention to use a helmet was strongly related to their age, attitude, beliefs...
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So, there you have it. No need for any more silly helmet talk.
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| Quote: |
Rare, by comparison, that you look down and think "blimey, he/she is a good skier" and, when you do, chances are they are not wearing a lid
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not round here mate.... non-lidded-sliders are a real minority in these parts.
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| Rare, by comparison, that you look down and think "blimey, he/she is a good skier" and, when you do, chances are they are not wearing a lid. |
This generalisation of course varies considerably by where you are. . What I'm still struggling to get my head around is the whole point of the exercise - confirmation in an attitudes and beliefs survey that helmet use is indeed indicated by attitudes and beliefs? It would be hard in the absence of legal requirements to predict anything else surely?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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flangesax, it's probably 8-9 years since I went to the dead centre of the ski universe but in Austria I typically ski Kitzbuhel and nearby and that's what I see. I hope you're not trying to say your survey is better than my survey.
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| fatbob wrote: |
| This generalisation of course varies considerably by where you are. |
Generally speaking, I'm in general agreement.
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FAQ
