 Poster: A snowHead
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Anybody who does anything in the mountains knows that half an hour can change conditions from glorious to ghastly and back again. It's the nature of the beast, and nobody needs to be told that. We all make the best of things - on a recent sailing trip to the West Country, in summer, we had two named storms and an unpleasant Force 7 squall which had not been forecast till after we left Dartmouth for Portland Bill. Spent 5 days at anchor up rivers hiding away. Read lots of books. On a 4 day autumn training course in Tignes we spent two days unable to get up to the snow because high winds closed the lifts. We made the best of it. Went for walks, got some ski-maintenance tuition! But to suggest that skiing on icy pistes is better than any alternative and that it isn't sensible to wait till the last minute to decide how to spend limited time and money is just not credible.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Origen wrote: |
| But to suggest that skiing on icy pistes is better than any alternative and that it isn't sensible to wait till the last minute to decide how to spend limited time and money is just not credible. |
Ultimately it’s an individual decision. I’m just expressing my viewpoint on it; I do very much enjoy icy pistes so for me it’s a no brainer. YMMV
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| boarder2020 wrote: |
It could have been 6m deep, that's not the problem. All it takes is one, increasingly common, hot day and then a refreeze overnight. Or just rain higher up, which also seems to be increasingly common. Snow completely ruined until the next storm.
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That is patent nonsense. It may make it difficult for some people the next day, but no reason at all to suppose that it will then remain unchanged until the next snowfall. There are so many other factors that affect the snow pack and surface after it's fallen even before you start including the effect of skiers and piste-bashers... |
Obviously never dug a snow pit in your life  weird how we can dig pits and identify the layers where it rained and buried sun crusts from when it was too hot. Having experienced rain high up the only solution was more snow or arrival of spring heating up the ice to make some corn.
Of course this is all moot if you just ride pistes. Considering the lack of recent snow and hot temperatures I was actually pretty impressed by the pistes. Sure they were a bit too hard packed and icy in places for my liking, but they were passable. (Although I hear firm pistes are more fun on skis than snowboard so maybe I'm being harsh).
I actually did overall enjoy my time in Val D, enjoy though I'd consider the conditions to be pretty poor. A lot of that was some great company though, if I'd been there on my own I think I'd have been more disappointed. But as others have said it's not cheap and most people have limited time. I certainly don't think I got good value for money, and would be hesitant to book Europe again. Not just based on my one off trip, but on the basis of the last few years having too many poor weeks. While I accept there's always a bit of luck involved the odds just don't add up for me - as others have said I'd get more enjoyment from spending my money elsewhere on other things. Also I'm lucky that I can just come to central Asia instead where we are still skiing boot deep powder from a storm nearly 2 weeks ago - the magic of no competition for lines and no very hot days and rain high up!
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| Kramer wrote: |
| Blackblade wrote: |
| run 87 degrees sidecut on my skis for these conditions |
Fair enough. I can imagine that it would be fun on the correct skis.
IME that’s probably as much about having the correct equipment as attitude though. |
Well duh. That's what rental shops are for.
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| boarder2020 wrote: |
| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| boarder2020 wrote: |
It could have been 6m deep, that's not the problem. All it takes is one, increasingly common, hot day and then a refreeze overnight. Or just rain higher up, which also seems to be increasingly common. Snow completely ruined until the next storm.
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That is patent nonsense. It may make it difficult for some people the next day, but no reason at all to suppose that it will then remain unchanged until the next snowfall. There are so many other factors that affect the snow pack and surface after it's fallen even before you start including the effect of skiers and piste-bashers... |
Obviously never dug a snow pit in your life weird how we can dig pits and identify the layers where it rained and buried sun crusts from when it was too hot. Having experienced rain high up the only solution was more snow or arrival of spring heating up the ice to make some corn. |
Oddly enough I've done really quite a lot of avalanche rescue and prevention training, so yeah, I'm more than familiar with analysing layers in this way.
You're still talking nonsense, you should know from your extensive experience of snow-layer analysis that you will often find layers of hoar frost, layers of blown snow, layers where underlying snow has changed as temperatures rise and water vapour rises through the snow-pack, layers where water on the surface has seeped down and softened underlying layers or caused fresh snow to better adhere to it...
Yet despite this knowledge you insist that a single freeze-thaw cycle will then leave the snow in a "ruined" state until more fresh snow has fallen.
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| o wrote: |
| If you can only enjoy one evening of the food at your local pub - which is of varied quality - it makes sense to choose a night when the best chef is working and your favourites are on the menu. |
I think that's not a good analogy, because in that case you know for sure that the best chef will turn up and also when. And you will go hungry between now and then. Snow isn't like that: you don't know if it will get better; you don't know when; and you mostly can't be flexible enough to take advantage of it anyway.
Locals often suffer from the pursuit of the best conditions, refraining from going out unless it everything's perfect. Eventually they switch from being skiers to simply being folk who live in ski resorts.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| phil_w wrote: |
Locals often suffer from the pursuit of the best conditions, refraining from going out unless it everything's perfect. Eventually they switch from being skiers to simply being folk who live in ski resorts. |
That’s very true but I think once you’ve lived in a ski resort for a period of time, skiing around on a busy piste in less than ideal conditions becomes pretty boring. There are plenty of other ways to stay amused on those non perfect days.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| zzz wrote: |
| once you’ve lived in a ski resort for a period of time, skiing around on a busy piste in less than ideal conditions becomes pretty boring. |
That what ski touring is for!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I just got back from Gressoney on Sunday. The snow cover was pretty sparse at the start of the week. All the pistes were open and they all skied better than expected, but there was pretty much no off-piste at all.
It did snow non-stop for the last 60hrs we were there (and was still snowing when we left on Sunday morning). Sometimes this fell as rain/sleet at village level, resulting in some periods of melt at this altitude. But up on the hill it was all good, the snow stuck even if it was a bit wet at times. It did mean that on the slower, uncovered chairs you looked a bit like a snowman by the time you reached the top. Also showed up the lazier lifties when having to hop on a uncleared seat (we split up on the 2man ones... cleared the other seat then sidled across for the ride).
I'd imagine anyone out there this week would be having a great time.
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| Quote: |
Yet despite this knowledge you insist that a single freeze-thaw cycle will then leave the snow in a "ruined" state until more fresh snow has fallen.
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Actually rain is far worse. In my experience nothing has made off piste rideable after a big rain event until it got covered with snow. Again I'm talking off piste. If you groom it it's usually fine although sometimes lots of death cookies.
I did a season at whistler where rain wasn't uncommon at the bottom. It destroys off piste, just becomes hard ice. How do you explain this ice turning into powder? Clue: it doesn't.
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If they sent you all the way to Central Asia to find boot deep powder I suggest you request a refund from skibumpedia.com or wherever you get your beta
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I basically ride powder everyday out here. Step off my board and sink in well above my knees. Tour straight from my door, zero competition for tracks, costs next to nothing. 30cm forecast for Friday night falling at around -10 so nice quality snow. Forecast for Verbier 2400m tomorrow +5 degrees
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You know it makes sense.
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"a single freeze-thaw cycle will then leave the snow in a "ruined" state until more fresh snow has fallen."
Nonsense. Demonstrably not true.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Kramer wrote: |
| @dharnett, what’s Zell like? |
Zell is struggling, has been very slushy/icy and recent weather wasn't cold enough to snow all the way down to bottom lifts, so very different conditions top to bottom of the resort. Short term forecast is awful, mountain temperatures as high as 10 degrees on Friday, dipping back to around zero after that (which is still not really cold enough as that's top of mountain).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| dharnett wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| @dharnett, what’s Zell like? |
Zell is struggling, has been very slushy/icy and recent weather wasn't cold enough to snow all the way down to bottom lifts, so very different conditions top to bottom of the resort. Short term forecast is awful, mountain temperatures as high as 10 degrees on Friday, dipping back to around zero after that (which is still not really cold enough as that's top of mountain). |
Thanks, that was one of the places I was looking at that would be a bit cheaper. Did a week in Kaprun in 2022 and enjoyed it but found ourselves trekking over the Saalbach most days and thought that would be easier from Zell.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| dharnett wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| @dharnett, what’s Zell like? |
Zell is struggling, has been very slushy/icy and recent weather wasn't cold enough to snow all the way down to bottom lifts, so very different conditions top to bottom of the resort. Short term forecast is awful, mountain temperatures as high as 10 degrees on Friday, dipping back to around zero after that (which is still not really cold enough as that's top of mountain). |
Thanks, that was one of the places I was looking at that would be a bit cheaper. Did a week in Kaprun in 2022 and enjoyed it but found ourselves trekking over the Saalbach most days and thought that would be easier from Zell. |
Actually Zell is conveniently between the two and just a bus ride to either. So not a bad center to choose, should the weather change for the better then all three areas are available (on the same lift pass) and if not you still have the glacier as your get out of jail card. Bit of a pain to have to bus it each day, but a good problem to have in a way!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| dharnett wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| dharnett wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| @dharnett, what’s Zell like? |
Zell is struggling, has been very slushy/icy and recent weather wasn't cold enough to snow all the way down to bottom lifts, so very different conditions top to bottom of the resort. Short term forecast is awful, mountain temperatures as high as 10 degrees on Friday, dipping back to around zero after that (which is still not really cold enough as that's top of mountain). |
Thanks, that was one of the places I was looking at that would be a bit cheaper. Did a week in Kaprun in 2022 and enjoyed it but found ourselves trekking over the Saalbach most days and thought that would be easier from Zell. |
Actually Zell is conveniently between the two and just a bus ride to either. So not a bad center to choose, should the weather change for the better then all three areas are available (on the same lift pass) and if not you still have the glacier as your get out of jail card. Bit of a pain to have to bus it each day, but a good problem to have in a way! |
Yeah, if conditions improve then it's still in the picture. However if not, then I'd be a bit fed up bussing to the Kitzeinhorn every day.
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| frejul wrote: |
Well it's a lot more enjoyable than being sat at home on the sofa! Give me an icy piste over a UK high street or muddy field any day. |
Riding muddy trails on a mountain bike would be preferable to shitting myself on steep sheet ice. Or just sit in the bar.
I can cope on icy but I don't enjoy it. Not after many years of North American trips enjoying relatively reliable powder, but been Euro trips in recent years for one reason or another.
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Looks fantastic
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| Kramer wrote: |
Is there anywhere in Europe with decent skiing conditions at the moment?
I've got the time and money to go skiing in the next few weeks, but to be honest if conditions are "meh", I'd rather save my money. |
I'm seeing photos from friends of great conditions in 3V and the last few rooms in snowretreat chalets in La Tania keep popping up on my Facebook feed at a very attractive price. (£650 per person catered for next week - travel and lift pass would be on top of that.)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| under a new name wrote: |
"a single freeze-thaw cycle will then leave the snow in a "ruined" state until more fresh snow has fallen."
Nonsense. Demonstrably not true. |
Freeze-thaw is all good, but also IME thaw-freeze usually needs either another thaw or more snow for good skiing (assuming really everything thawed, though obviously that's unusual). Otherwise it's just re-frozen ie ice.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| boarder2020 wrote: |
| Just right now conditions are better than the Alps, which I'm happy to stand by. |
No they aren’t based on what you posted and the video I posted above which was just above La Fouly village at 1600m altitude 
And we just drove 30mins up the valley. You had to fly to the middle of nowhere
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@BobinCH, I normally turn left at Sembrancher....looks like I might have to turn right and explore that valley a bit more
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Whitters wrote: |
| @BobinCH, I normally turn left at Sembrancher....looks like I might have to turn right and explore that valley a bit more |
Particularly good after a Southerly front as it’s right on the main Alpine ridge
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Yesterday I dropped off the back of here (Serre Chevalier) fully expecting to run out of snow as I headed down to the valley on the other side, and was totally surprised to be able to ski all the way down given the aspect, where usually I'd have a bit of a scramble to get over the little gulleys (left of picture), and then climbing back up, I'd usually see the top of a Summer walking sign at the Col I go over and that was totally hidden!
Vallon de Chambran 1,750m
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Anyway for those who are still following we've booked a week in Ischgl.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| Anyway for those who are still following we've booked a week in Ischgl. |
Have a great time. (I've never been there.) I had been about to say that, if the snow were to arrive as expected, you and your companions would all find something to enjoy in Baqueira-Beret and the gastronomy and general charm of Veilha.
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Mrs B and I are hoping to go the week before Easter, but holding off booking anywhere at the moment. Likely to be back to Vallandry/Les Arcs - snow seems to be ok higher up and some runs back to resort
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FAQ
I find it actively un-enjoyable after a couple of runs and not a good allocation of cash or holiday time. 
