 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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AndAnotherThing.., that all sounds really good - I will be very pleased if I'm at that stage in 2 weeks' time. I didn't do any proprioception stuff pre-op so not expecting to be in as good shape as you on that front though 
4 days in, and things are still fine here - not painful but then I have just taken pills every 4 hours so not given it a chance to be! (will probably pay the price for this later when I crash into a sudden codeine withdrawal depression though!). Slept well last night too. First physio session yesterday - again fine. Extension is good and can press down with the back of my knee quite firmly. Surgeon's instructions are to use crutches but am just using one having had the physio check my technique. She gave me some circulation exercises to do but can't really do much more than that as I have a bandage that I'm not allowed to remove and which the surgeon himself will change on Monday for one more week. This means I have no idea what the swelling is like either but the Ice Band thing is very convenient as it means you can move your leg about whist it's being iced, so I just keep changing the ice pack regularly and then getting on with things.
Only thing is I'm getting a little tired of the daily injection already - the nurses are both absolutely lovely and I'm not scared of needles at all but I do feel a bit like a pin cushion and will NOT be having them in my stomach anymore... ouch! Thigh injections are ok though - same pain probably but psychologically more bearable - and it is all over pretty quickly.
I think I have probably been fortunate to be in a ground floor, one-level apartment with a walk in shower (with a couple of plastic garden chairs, one to sit on and one to rest the bad leg on, wrapped in a bathroom bin plastic bag with gaffer tape!) so I feel quite independent as I can get around easily and wash myself and make pots of tea and get books and so on without asking for help. I have also raised the foot end of my mattress by stuffing firm sofa cushions underneath it in order to keep my legs elevated and have found sleeping like that much more comfortable than having my bad leg propped up on pillows.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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miranda, It sounds like a big difference in the aftercare between France and the UK. No injections or any thing for me. Not even aspirin !
Good tip with the mattress. I struggled to get comfortable with resting the leg on pillows as well.
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AndAnotherThing.., I bet you didn't have to wear the stockings for 10 days either. This is me sitting on the front step earlier today....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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miranda, At least you polished your shoes 
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AndAnotherThing.., yes, in La Belle France the hospital even sends round your own personal shoeshiner and hairdresser to do your curlers for you until you're fit enough to be able to do it all yourself again!
I did ask the nurse whether this was normal to have all these injections and regular blood tests (was wondering if I'd given them cause for concern or something) and she said it is an automatic prescription issued to anyone who has had surgery below the waist.
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thank you genepi - yes, had had lots of warnings about suppositories but thankfully I think those days are behind us
Got to see my knee for the first time (day 6). The incisions hadn't closed as much as they had expected (no staples or stitches), although this is apparently absolutely nothing to worry about and happens every now and then, so I'm going back in a week (well 10 days due to bank holidays). But it wasn't bruised at all and nowhere near as swollen as I was expecting. Surgeon said I could, and should, come off the codeine now as I wasn't in pain and that paracetamol should be enough but he wants me to keep taking paracetamol for quite a long time because he doesn't want pain to block me from bending my knee as much as possible (extension is already fine... flexion will be a different matter as I will still have the bandage on for a while).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Here is a photo for those who are soon to have the op - even though the incisions didn't close as normal, not that scary, right? I have put it in black and white just because the operated knee is covered in iodine and is yellow so it looks like a lot of old bruising but it isn't at all - there's a tiny bit of mild grey bruising on the top of my shin that doesn't hurt at all and that's it (dark patches around the incisions are just fresh iodine stuff and crinkliness is just from the bandage).
So, as yet, am still able to report... it's really not that bad... I know things might change, and I'm sure there are frustrating times ahead at some point, but the actual operation bit is definitely not a dreadful process - so much so that on day 6 I keep happily wandering into the apartment next door to get things and generally walking about and then suddenly remembering I should maybe be using a crutch. I'm not rushing things at all (indeed I possibly should be doing more exercises than I am) but am sort of just going with the flow at the moment and physio and surgeon seem happy.
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miranda, Good to hear it's going OK. Your scars are located exactly the same as mine, except for the one on at the top which looks a bit bigger than the one I had. I think I had disolvable stitches which they removed at the follow-up.
Sounds like you are doing a bit better on the bruising too - I looked as if I'd been slapped around with a cricket bat although mostly gone now. It's the bruising on the lower shin that's hanging on.
I managed to walk a couple of miles today and attempted a day in the office. The office was harder than I expected as I'm finding I need to keep the joint moving or elevated or it stiffens up.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| AndAnotherThing.. wrote: |
I managed to walk a couple of miles today |
that sounds impressive I have to say...
hope it wasn't too much hard work back at the office - whilst post op might not be a barrel of laughs, it is a good excuse to lounge around doing stuff you're normally too busy to do!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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miranda, Well, I did notice the swelling had increased. Not sure if it was the walking or the office Just in case I'm going to spend a bit more time on the sofa today !
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You know it makes sense.
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| AndAnotherThing.. wrote: |
miranda, Good to hear it's going OK. Your scars are located exactly the same as mine, except for the one on at the top which looks a bit bigger than the one I had. I think I had disolvable stitches which they removed at the follow-up.
Sounds like you are doing a bit better on the bruising too - I looked as if I'd been slapped around with a cricket bat although mostly gone now. It's the bruising on the lower shin that's hanging on.
I managed to walk a couple of miles today and attempted a day in the office. The office was harder than I expected as I'm finding I need to keep the joint moving or elevated or it stiffens up. |
Do your best to keep your leg elevated while working i used and upside down bin with a box on top amd make surw you take regular breaks to do your physio exercises
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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NickyJ, Yep, leg up today and back to some occasional ice.
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Poster: A snowHead
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AndAnotherThing.., I have a length of theraband attached in a loop to my office chair and use that to carry out exercises to help develop my Vastus Medialis (the inside bit o f the quads that is the first to disappear and last to return). In the initial phases of my return to work I also used the upturned waste paper bin trick coupled with icing and flexing exercises. I also used my office chair as a roller aid to engage my hamstrings - ask your physio about that as it is very good isolated hamstring exercise.
I found it helpful to program in a break every hour by setting an alarm using the computer's clock so I could get up and move around. I still use that sometimes when I have big translations to do, otherwise I would sit working straight through until I finished. Then I would be unable to move due to stiffness in the knees!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Samerberg Sue, Cheers, good tips ! Physio tomorrow so I'll check with her what she advises. Will be interesting to see how the swelling is later.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Did anyone else find that they had a really big appetite post op? After the initial injury and I was barely doing any exercise, I totally lost my appetite and actually had to force myself to eat after a while as I was worried about accelerated muscle loss. I assumed it would be the same after the op, and worse because of all the meds... but I'm eating absolutely loads - to the point where I think I'm going to have to watch it if I carry on like this whilst only doing the odd leg raise or quad clench to burn it off! Is this extra energy demanded for healing, or am I just being a pig?
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miranda, I was pretty hungry immediately post op, but less so now. I've lost a couple of pounds in the 2 weeks so far. Perhaps the weight I was putting on before WAS muscle !!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi folks, just catching up, it's good to see you post-ops are doing well! Three weeks til mine is booked. Working on pre-hab and can't wait to be working on rehab 
Loving the tips about things to do in the office as I spend my days very still at my desk and need to put together a plan so so that I don't end up with proper stiffness problems.
Was wondering about the Kneehab mentioned in Weathercam's post - its available to rent or hire, but I was wondering how long I might end up hiring one for as it might be cheaper to buy and then re-sell on eBay - anyone?
Not liking all this talk about pain, last year I had an op which involved a 14" incision on my torso, I had morphine on tap for about 6 hours after the op, but then just paracetomol and neurofen for 4 days then nothing, yeh it was painful especially when moving around, but it sounds like the pain from the screws in the bone is going to be tough, its sounding much more painful than my last op, eek!
Deb
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Hello debbiem, I specifically had you in mind when I posted a photo of my knee not looking as scary as I was expecting.... nothing like a 14 inch incision in your torso!!!
I would just say that I honestly have not been in pain. Don't take notice of me being pumped full of morphine for ages - I did mean it when I said the French are quite famously a nation of hypochondriacs. I was pleased to be in a drugged out haze for ages as it was the first time I'd ever been to a hospital and was quite nervous but I'm sure much of it was unnecessary.
I did take codeine when I was at home and I have been taking the max allowance of any pills I've been given, so started off every 4 hours and am now taking stuff every 6 hours. The pharmacy had given me soluble prescription strength codeine/paracetamol and after a few days I couldn't stomach another glass of it, so whilst I waited for the pill version to arrive I took some OTC Solpadeine Plus and actually it did the trick just fine so I knew the prescription strength codeine wasn't really necessary at that point. I have been on plain old paracetamol for nearly 48 hours now and I've still not had pain. Everyone's experience is different and I did freak out a bit in the week before the operation when I read some of the posts on here about bone drilling pain and the torture of trying to go to the loo! I don't think for one second these people are making it up so it is of course possible that it is going to be painful... but I can say to you that it's not necessarily going to be very painful. It hasn't been for me, but then I've not been shy about taking painkillers either.
From the sounds of it there are limits in the UK on how much you can buy of what... maybe start stocking up on the max strength stuff now each time you go past a different pharmacy?
ps I have both the cryo cuff that weathercam talks about and the Ice Band that I linked to above. weathercam is right in saying the cuff offers a bit of compression that the Ice Band doesn't, but as I have been wearing compression tights and a bandage, I have found the Ice Band a lot more convenient than the cuff, which is a bit of hassle when you're not that mobile and ideally you need someone to change the ice and stuff for you. With the Band, you just always have spare ice packs in the freezer so it takes less than a minute to get up in the middle of the night and change them yourself and then go back to bed. It's made of fabric and so not something you'd share with someone else or hire or anything but it is cheap and should last you the duration of your rehab. I know weathercam says he still uses his cuff some 7 months later, though, so if you go for that then it's worth buying (second hand maybe) rather than hiring I'd have thought.
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miranda, just out of interest can you buy OTC Solpadeine Plus in France? I bring some soluble with me on trips usually.
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marmotte16, I'm guessing not - it was given to me by my MIL who'd bought a pack in Boots at the airpot - I have a drawer full of soluble stuff here for when you come over next if you need it though! 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Me again... sorry, I promise not to dominate this thread... but just wanted to say AndAnotherThing.., that you are obviously doing really well. I tried to bend my knee for the first time today. I'll be honest about being a wimp and say I had been scared to do so before - not because of the pain but because of fear of breaking something. If someone tells me "this will hurt but that's normal" I'm fine with that, but I was worried about doing it unsupervised and not knowing when enough is enough. My physio didn't get the protractor out but it was probably about 80-85 degrees and she said this was really good and that many of her clients can't manage that much initially. She is a physio in a ski resort so ACL rehab is her basic bread and butter, so you managing 95 degrees after a week is brilliant. My physio was very good and explained what pain to listen to and what pain not to listen to, so I will be adding flex exercises into my day from tomorrow.
After yesterday's snow to 1300m (and rain below) it's been a nice day here and having also ditched the codeine, am now at last having a lovely glass of wine 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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miranda, Do you have the link for the ice band please? My knee gave way on me yesterday & is not looking good. I'm currently using a large bag of frozen peas.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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genepi, I'm really sorry to hear that. I didn't buy mine so can't recommend the ordering process but this: http://www.vivomed.co.uk/CH1000_9245/Ice_Band_Knee_Brace.html is what the French hospital sent me home with. Each brace takes two ice packs, one for the front and one for the back (assuming the ice packs come with the band and you don't have to order them separately) and they gave me two spare as well so they're on a fairly constant rotation cycle. When I did my injury I was just using frozen peas and I really do find this thing more convenient because a) it goes all round the knee and b) once it's strapped on you can move about, lie down, make yourself some tea, etc. whereas with peas you're pinned down for as long as you need them on.
Please update about how your knee goes and got everything crossed for you x
ps to anyone thinking of ordering the Ice Band, I would reiterate the need to phone the company rather than ordering online and finding out how many ice packs you will get with the band (which seems to cost twenty quid) and how much spares are. Ideally you want 1 band and 4 ice packs (2 ice packs will do though but 4 is best).
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You know it makes sense.
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Frosty the Snowman
I'm going to take that as a genuine comment and not an attempt to get an even better quote because when you have to wear Nora Batty stockings day in day out you'll take any compliments you can get, even if they are about an isolated shot of a kneecap.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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genepi, sorry to hear  In the mean time keep it elevated with the pea's, I'm sure the elevation did as much good as the ice for me. Did you say you are booked for an op too ?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hi everyone,
I have just read this full thread and it is quite comforting to see such good progress from the injured and interesting to note that the NHS queues over private care. I am also having this dilema financially.
I have a complete tear of my ACL and a "horn tear" of the lateral meniscus. I done this on 30th March and two months later, I feel things should be moving quicker. My time table has been
30/03/2012 - injury, leg brace rest, ice etc for 10 days (no physio prescribed so the muscle waste was dreadful and movement minimal)
10/04/2012 - flew back home, straight to A+E
11/04/2012 - first physio session (NHS) for weekly sessions
24/04/2012 - mri scan
16/05/2012 - mri results. Very unsympathetic consultant, did not want to operate and may not need it (??) could only do the repairs via TWO ops and that was his training - did not make me confident !! Asked who could do both and referred to a consultant who can do both at once, appointment not until 10th JULY ! Been on to the hospital every time he is in to try and get a cancellation but to no avail. apparently i will need an Arthroscopic reconstruction?
I have been doing a lot of excersise over the last few weeks, daily cycles of 20-30miles and was getting a lot of movement back. However, I went to NHS prehab gym yesterday to show me lots of other exercises, balance plates and pulling along on a pillow. my leg is REALLY hurting today, more than it has done for the last few weeks, maybe its just the new exercises, hopefully it will settle down a bit tomorrow.
Looks like that after consultation, it will be another 6 week wait (minimum) for an op!! very frustrating.
From reading the threads, it does not look like i will be able to ski this coming season.... very depressing ! Have called the private hospital and I can see the same surgeon next week, but the op waiting will still be another 3-4 weeks. so I could have it done around the same time as my NHS appointment. Cost is "aprox £3021" (sounds pretty exact to me)... not sure whether the cost is worth probably about 6-8 weeks time saving - what do you think/
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Libertine, I think the price of the private actually sounds good - I had a ring around about private costs in the UK (because I didn't have time to go through the NHS process, get fixed and get back to France in time) and it was looking more like £5k.
On the timescale of having a consultation - not even the op - on July 10th, I think it would be pushing it for you to be back on skis next season. Unless you are a pro and getting pro rehab treatment, I think anything under 6 months isn't realistic. My surgeon and his ex patients are all convinced I will be fine to ski in 6 months' time but I know that's the absolute minimum for your average person.
Saving two months of time v £3k... it really depends on your personal financial position. I ended up spending the cash as we had it put aside for a holiday that we wouldn't be able to take anyway because of my knee. Funnily enough, I could only get a consultation at the French state hospital on July 10th (could have got one earlier but not with the top notch recommended surgeon) and so I decided to go ahead and pay because I wanted to be able to ski next season. But of course I live in the alps and want to ski a lot, you could be fine for a late season week... and actually thinking about it weathercam also didn't have an op until the beginning of September and did ski 6 months later.
I'm sure the pain today is just the new exercises. Very wise Nurse marmotte16 advised me to take some analgesics before my first physio sessions when I did my injury thankfully, so maybe keep that in mind next time and keep icing it.
Good luck and let us know what you decide!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Libertine,
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| Very unsympathetic consultant, did not want to operate and may not need it (??) could only do the repairs via TWO ops and that was his training - did not make me confident !! Asked who could do both and referred to a consultant who can do both at once, appointment not until 10th JULY ! Been on to the hospital every time he is in to try and get a cancellation but to no avail. apparently i will need an Arthroscopic reconstruction? |
It is actually more common than you think to have the meniscus and ACL repaired separately. The Steadman-Hawkins Clinic in Vail Colorado did a 2 stage operation on Michael Owen after his injury in 2006. If the tear is in the horn of the lateral meniscus it could be that it is in the so-called red zone which means it can be repaired because it has a reasonable blood supply. If they repair a meniscus the rehab is completely different to the type of rehab that you need for an ACL, so it makes sense to do 2 operations. Repair the meniscus first, then reconstruct the ACL. While carrying out the ACL reconstruction they will check the repair to see how successful it was and make any adjustments necessary.
BTW just about all knee surgery is carried out arthroscopically these days. And they try to conserve the meniscus as much as possible to make sure that the mechanical forces through the knee remain as natural as possible and so inhibit the chances of arthritis developing for as long as possible.
I'm not a doctor but I have had both knees operated on for ruptured ACLs and meniscus tears among other things. My surgeon in the UK was reluctant to operate because of "age" - I was 39 at the time and a full time PE teacher. By learning as much as I could about the procedures available and also how my injuries would impact on my quality of life, I was able to make informed judgements and persuaded my surgeon to operate. Since he did I have had no problems with my ACL, although I have had numerous meniscus tears subsequently. Had I known about the better chances of success from a 2 stage procedure, I would of probably gone down that route as it would have conserved more of both the lateral and medial meniscii.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Samerberg Sue wrote: |
| My surgeon in the UK was reluctant to operate because of "age" - I was 39 at the time |
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miranda, Yep, quite a shock at the time! But we are talking about a time over 20years ago when all the major knee surgery was carried out using open knee surgery. His downfall was that he told me he never operated on anyone over 35! I didn't have my injury until I was 38 and he operated then no problem, so he kind of dug his own grave there.
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Samerberg Sue, well good for you on informing yourself and going back and convincing him. The surgeon just gave me a weblink http://www.tls-medical.com/uk/patients/theoretical-basis.php , told me he was going to be using this method, and my only question was: how much does it cost?! Sounds like you have some good advice on the 2 stage procedure. I suppose modern methods must make the whole recovery process much quicker. I googled my surgeon and found there was a recording of him doing a live broadcast of an ACL reconstruction to a conference. I made myself watch it beforehand and was glad I did because he was so relaxed and confident that it put me at ease and they gave him a big round of applause at the end. There was then another video of him doing a TKR and I thought, no, not the best idea to look at that just now!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The incisions on your knee are already fairly pale and small and you can see the kneecap! Really hope that's where I am in a couple of weeks (I think you are 11 days ahead of me). Were you a bit disconcerted when they had to draw an arrow on your shin to point the surgeon in the direction of your knee?
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miranda, I did have a joke with the surgeon about it as he drew it on
Hope your incisions are healing OK ?
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FAQ
When it comes to the injections, just be very happy they aren't suppositories - you are in France, after all 
ACL clinic 
I was pretty keen to try and regain as much as I could although it's being able to extend fully that seems to be really important. I had my 2nd Physio appointment today and I'm up to 125 or 135 (can't remember) and again she seemed pretty happy, moving me onto the "week 3/4" page 
