madlondoner, FFS you would be in Switzerland not Bolivia.
What's the issue with Bolivia
Ukraine or Syria I'd probably be dodging right now
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Layne wrote:
Quote:
madlondoner, FFS you would be in Switzerland not Bolivia.
What's the issue with Bolivia
Ukraine or Syria I'd probably be dogging right now
FIFY
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
While I agree with most others there's no need for any "company" or even contract for an adult to be looked after, the following is a good point:
madlondoner wrote:
The owners may very well be nice people but they are not your friends and you are not doing this as a favour to them.
Just as your boss isn't your friend, nice person they maybe.
You have MUTUAL INTEREST, that's all. As long as the interest remains mutual, you're ok. But if your interest diverge for any reason, you need to have a way out.
Although in this case, the "non-worker" can simply pack up and leave. So I don't see too much problem.
I understand how it works and that some people will want to do it because they enjoy skiing. I just think that any job should be paid with a contract laid out. It's not as if it's a weekend position helping out on a farm. It is for months and is for an individual commercial operation and not a charity.
I am surprised this type of thing isn't cracked down more in the alps as it is against the interests of the ski resorts.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
madlondoner, it is not a commercial operation...it is his private, family chalets.
I'm not the sharpest knife in the draw but in the snowsports industry there is a hell of a lot of swapping for things. I see this as a getting accommodation for the season. Pay for it or work a couple of days over the weekends to pay for it. if you do it and it's not for you, leave. Don't think it goes against the interest of a resort as season passes are being purchased and whoever does it would no doubt spend in resort.
Great opportunity. If I were younger and without the kids I'd be on this like a fly on 5h1T.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
My concern about the whole thing is the immigration status and the Swiss authority view. Presumably the OP would prefer if a detailed description of the arrangement isn't freely given at immigration?
Probability of being caught may be low but I can't see the explanation that you're volunteering to cook/clean at the houses of some people you've never met before and they just happen to provide accommodation/food/transport for you (but only food while you're actively volunteering) fully satisfying anyone looking for disguised employment, immigration irregularities, minimum wage issues or tax/benefit in kind evasion.
Happy to hear if this isn't an issue and there is solid local legal advice and someone willing to stand behind volunteers if it goes wrong, but based on what I've read that's what would put me off an otherwise intriguing opportunity.
After all it is free
After all it is free
I've just realised that this isn't a job after all, it's an internship:
It's an opportunity to be part of something most people dream of, with great advantages including the legendary company socials and shiny toys, all in a desirable environment where competition for work is usually fierce.
There's no wage other than some paid expenses, no job security, no guarantee of career prospects, you have to do anything that is asked of you (to make a good impression) and the guy at the desk [chalet] next to you is getting paid very-well-indeed-thank-you to do exactly the same work.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
madlondoner wrote:
Can not imagine how much money you would burn through in expensive Swiss resorts on food and drink. I hate how across desirable positions that they are left to unpaid labour and I think it sets a terrible precedent where somehow it is deemed that a job must be boring/tiresome to be paid.
No contracts, no guarantees and a very broad job definition of what you have to do. The owners may very well be nice people but they are not your friends and you are not doing this as a favour to them. If I was in a foreign country where I didn't know anyone I would want a contract and the support of a company if things went wrong.
madlondoner in case you didn't follow the thread for the last 5 years, it isn't a job, we don't have contracts, you need to be able to look after yourself, the favours are mutual its not just one way, and without exception, we are very good friends with all our previous volunteers.
It seems that some are prepared to believe that the world is full of "nice" people with a "reasonable" proposals doing nice things for each other
Others think the world is full of bad people doing bad things to each other, and consequently believe in very little.
Those with faith in their fellow human beings have a much better time in general and benefit everyone from paying forward into a virtuous circle, - so I choose to be like this group.
Nix.
In short, I find your lack of faith disturbing.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
nixmap, +10
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
I am now confused as to why people are angry about this thread.
IF it is a genuine article, and I currently believe it is, why are people up in arms about it?????
(currently 1460 sleeps before I throw my hat into the ring !!!! )
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
lots of very jealous snowheads on here. If I wasn't at uni for the next two years I would be doing all I could to do this.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I think this could be great fun. My only issue would be keeping up with the OPs when out skiing.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
This is crazy.
If I didn't have 2 small kids, myself and the wife would be all over this. This is a great deal: stay in Swiss for "free", accomodation included, lift pass included, and in return some small tasks to keep the place running...
Yes, this is not a career move - its perfect for a couple (or 2 mates), to ski a season. If you are smart with your money, you can live quite cheaply in swiss....I did it in Norway for years (which is even more expensive that Swiss).
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Absolutely a fair arrangement in my view.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I just can't get my head round the whole thing. The need for the 'position' in the first place.
If the OP is just wanting a hand with household chores, as is intimated, then it implies that they don't cook/clean for themselves wherever it is they stay during the week. If they were used to doing their own chores then why need help at the weekend. If they weren't used to doing their own chores then they must already employ staff in their midweek home, why not take them with at the weekend?
Just makes no sense, to me at least
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:
If they were used to doing their own chores then why need help at the weekend.
simply to have a break from the chores?
and if
Quote:
they must already employ staff in their midweek home, why not take them with at the weekend?
then to give those staff a break
I follow this each year and although there are those that come down on the side of thinking it verges on the illegal side of organising things it has always struck me that it is a good opportunity for a couple to spend a few month in the mountains.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
If I put aside the legal issues that have been raised (I've no idea how valid the points are so will leave that to the piste side lawyers). On the face of it, the deal sounds good. I thinkthe the main reasons there are so many scepticism and doom mongers (again putting aside any legal issues) is that in all the years this has been running, and presumably the position filled. There has not been a single 1st person response or post saying how good/bad it turned out.
From this we must conclude that Nixmap ensures that there is a cast iron confidentiality clause somewhere in the arrangement, either that or all previous helpers are either
a. Still locked up in the basement
b. locked up in some Swiss gaol.
If not a or b then why would Nixmap at least not allow nay encourage some positive feedback which would make next years 'Nix factor' easier to fill.
If I were Young, free and single (in fact if I was free and single) I'd at least consider the offer and would be discussing more of the details direct.
Pamski, they are already getting a break from work at the weekend, do they really need a break from chores too??
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
dode, well everyone who stays at a hotel presumably does so in part to get a break from the chores? And if you have a sizeable "house party" then feeding everybody well and clearing up is a very substantial chore. As is the planning and shopping needed beforehand to ensure that you don't run out of something vital. I should know - I do it a great deal, as does pamski. My quarrel with this arrangement is with making out that keeping a big chalet clean and doing all that is really nothing at all. If that were true then yes, they wouldn't need anybody else (let alone two anybodyelses) to do it for them.
dode, My quarrel with this arrangement is with making out that keeping a big chalet clean and doing all that is really nothing at all. If that were true then yes, they wouldn't need anybody else (let alone two anybodyelses) to do it for them.
To misquote (slightly) F Scott Fitzgerald, "The rich are different to you and me".
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
pam w, it's not really a hotel though, it is a second home. Not denying a sizeable house party involves a lot of work, but according to the OP 'occasionally we may have house guests' other than that it's just a family of 4.
Agreed on the implication that little is expected of the 'helper/s'
Also, re-reading the OP, I realise now that each chalet has a segregated (their choice of words) apartment for the 'helper/s'. But they also say that the helpers can use the full facilities of either chalet when they are empty'. Maybe they just get segregated when the OP and his family turn up??
After all it is free
After all it is free
One of the "helpers" posted on TGR years ago, no?
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
TGR?
Maybe I need to draw up an ad:
Ski the whole of the 14/15 season for free in Scotland. You and a friend (or 2 or 3) have a great opportunity to ski in Cairngorm, all that we ask is that you help out on the building sites mon-fri. In return we will give you a company van to get you to and from the various sites, a season ski pass for Cairngorm (you are free to use the company van to get you to the mountain), digs can be arranged if required. Getting here and what you consume is up to you. You are free to ski every weekend if you wish.
Couldnt advertise it in the Jobs Section though as it isn't a job???
If you can afford chalets in Klosters, Gstaad and New Zealand then surely you can afford to pay your staff
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Interesting changes to Swiss employment laws that are affecting UK chalet operators. Free accommodation and lift passes are not recognised in Swiss law as part of a remuneration package. Minimum wage laws now suggest that chalet staff should be paid the equivalent of GBP34k a year.
The exchange of "services" or helping out at weekends/half term/Christmas/New Year/whatever for accommodation and lift passes that this "offer" represents may well not stack up if the arrangement came to light. I'm not sure stating that "we are all friends, helping one another out" would hold up to even a light amount of scrutiny.
mtsuit, poses the potential risk above. Others have too. No cast iron details or guarantees have ever been offered/reasonably provided AFAIK in the event that the authorities ever investigate.
ansta1 wrote:
If I put aside the legal issues that have been raised (I've no idea how valid the points are so will leave that to the piste side lawyers). On the face of it, the deal sounds good. I thinkthe the main reasons there are so many scepticism and doom mongers (again putting aside any legal issues) is that in all the years this has been running, and presumably the position filled. There has not been a single 1st person response or post saying how good/bad it turned out.
From this we must conclude that Nixmap ensures that there is a cast iron confidentiality clause somewhere in the arrangement, either that or all previous helpers are either
a. Still locked up in the basement
b. locked up in some Swiss gaol.
If not a or b then why would Nixmap at least not allow nay encourage some positive feedback which would make next years 'Nix factor' easier to fill.
One might consider that final point a reasonable one, and one that could probably clear up most, if not all, the concerns raised.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Next year Nixmap might do well to follow Sting's example and charge people to work for him!
It's often asked and never answered, why don't your previous encumbents ever post about their experiences? You seem to go through the same mire every year, some feedback from a personal viewpoint would surely help?
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
ansta1 wrote:
Nixmap,
It's often asked and never answered, why don't your previous encumbents ever post about their experiences? You seem to go through the same mire every year, some feedback from a personal viewpoint would surely help?
I not making any excuses for privacy or lack of feedback, its exactly how we like it, and I don't feel compelled to have to answer anymore than that.
It's easy to confuse privacy for something is sinister, but once you know enough and see it from the other side of the coin, you would understand that personal privacy and security are not easily separated.
I suspect the reason you get no feedback is that previous volunteers see both sides of the coin.
Maybe if you tried to imagine it from our perspective you might think the same.
Nix
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
albinomountainbadger wrote:
Next year Nixmap might do well to follow Sting's example and charge people to work for him!
Not really a bad idea, just think how pointless it makes all the jobs-worth arguments , technically sting is just advertising renting accomodation ultra cheap
Of course I couldn't do that on here as it would be advertising.
Better I stick to 0$ so as not to annoy anyone and stick with the snowheads spirit.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
pam w wrote:
dode ....clearing up is a very substantial chore. As is the planning and shopping needed beforehand to ensure that you don't run out of something vital. I should know - I do it a great deal, as does pamski. My quarrel with this arrangement is with making out that keeping a big chalet clean and doing all that is really nothing at all. If that were true then yes, they wouldn't need anybody else (let alone two anybodyelses) to do it for them.
Oh come on Its not that hard.. I mean a little laundry and washing up.. 2 dinner parties a week, its not exactly a tragedy , and for some who enjoy a little cooking... well its part of the entertainment.
How hard can it really be , Pam_w I think you are just making out that it is harder than it really is
I was determined not to read this thread this year as....
1. Really envious and would love to go
2. It amazes me how many negative people are out there
Bloody gone and read it and yep....still the same
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I was determined not to read this thread this year as....
1. Really envious and would love to go
2. It amazes me how many negative people are out there
Bloody gone and read it and yep....still the same
After all it is free
After all it is free
Quote:
I suspect the reason you get no feedback is that previous volunteers see both sides of the coin.
Maybe if you tried to imagine it from our perspective you might think the same.
Sorry - I still don't get this - what is the other side of the coin? What privacy is "lost" by posting about what working with you (or living with or whatever you call it...) is really like? Why wouldn't the volunteer post something about their experience - good, bad or ugly?
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You won't get it. Not Until you have enough info to get it.
By which time you would also choose not to share it.
Catch 22
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
