the last thing I need is a bunch of SCGB members turning up on a bash expecting it to be 'like Fresh Tracks but better' as it wont be and grumpiness will inevitably ensue.
bash and grumpiness...oxymoron, surely?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
PeakyB wrote:
@admin,
Quote:
the last thing I need is a bunch of SCGB members turning up on a bash expecting it to be 'like Fresh Tracks but better' as it wont be and grumpiness will inevitably ensue.
bash and grumpiness...oxymoron, surely?
You might not think so but I'm sure you can corner @dadmin at some time and get a low down on various diva-like behaviours, strops and flounceos that have occured. And outright ejections. And then he can tell you about people other than me....
Tell me more, tell me more, were they lobbed very far?
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Layne wrote:
I see Snowheads as more of a DIY trip I'd organise for my mates whereas Freshtracks is more of a TO experience.
I've done neither though.
I've been on quite a lot of Freshtracks holidays and also many TO holidays. They're very different beasts. In many ways, the Bash I went on felt more like the TO holiday than the Freshtracks holidays did.
Some of the Freshtracks holidays I went on felt like they'd been put together as DIY affairs (which is basically the case), with the slight flaw that the person who did all the DIYing and hence understands exactly what arrangements were made isn't on the holiday. While there has generally been a SCGB Leader either on the flights, or as a minimum meeting people at the airport, they probably do this trip once a year at most, so all they have is a printout of the arrangements to work from.
Also, I've never been on a TO holiday where I've been told to meet outside of the boot room ready to go at 08:30 sharp And I got very funny looks a few years ago when I decided to stop skiing after lunch, and skied down on my own. (The SCGB Leaders aren't meant to leave you on the mountain - we agreed it was fine as he left me at the top of a mountain railway). I got even stranger looks when I said I'd really enjoyed my solo ski down.
felt like they'd been put together as DIY affairs (which is basically the case), with the slight flaw that the person who did all the DIYing and hence understands exactly what arrangements were made isn't on the holiday.
I'm confused. How can it be a DIY affair if one Does it Yerself but are not on the holiday? I may be being denser than usual.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
PeakyB wrote:
@sugarmoma666,
Quote:
felt like they'd been put together as DIY affairs (which is basically the case), with the slight flaw that the person who did all the DIYing and hence understands exactly what arrangements were made isn't on the holiday.
I'm confused. How can it be a DIY affair if one Does it Yerself but are not on the holiday? I may be being denser than usual.
All the bits booked separately, from different providers, with the onus on making sure they all fit together being on the person who booked them all. That's not great, when the person who did the booking isn't present.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@sugarmoma666, thanks. I'm getting confused with terms. To me, DIY is when you book everything yourself. A TO package is where a 3rd party do the work for the traveller, by bringing separate elements (flight, accommodation, transfers) together and offering it under a virtual umbrella ella ella ella.
A SnowHeads Bash to me is a bit of a hybrid between those two. The accommodation gets booked en bloc, sometimes with food, sometimes not. You usually DIY travel. Except SnowHeads sometimes organises handy airport transfers. You don't officially get a guide but you often kinda do, by stalking people who are going somewhere you fancy. Well that's just me really.
I'm not sure what Fresh Tracks is. Previously sounded to me like a specialist package which was a bit more regimented than a SnowHeads Bash or even a typical TO package.
One thing Snowheads Bashes sometimes have in common with another strand of snow holidays, ie chalets, is cake, which is a good place to leave this comparison of models.
As long as I slide down snow I don't really care.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
PeakyB wrote:
@Dave of the Marmottes,
Quote:
outright ejections
Tell me more, tell me more, were they lobbed very far?
Basically across the piste then hung round by the bins every night
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
@PeakyB, it's probably me confusing the terms really It's not so much that the Freshtracks are DIY. It's more that they feel that way, but without having the control.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
sugarmoma666 wrote:
@PeakyB, it's probably me confusing the terms really It's not so much that the Freshtracks are DIY. It's more that they feel that way, but without having the control.
You're not selling it to me
But it does beg the question why have you been on "quite a lot of" them?
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Dave of the Marmottes,
Quote:
Basically across the piste then hung round by the bins every night
Hope someone threw the poor victim a few scraps of Tomme de Savoie, capers, pitted olives and several raw diots.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Layne wrote:
sugarmoma666 wrote:
@PeakyB, it's probably me confusing the terms really It's not so much that the Freshtracks are DIY. It's more that they feel that way, but without having the control.
You're not selling it to me
But it does beg the question why have you been on "quite a lot of" them?
Perhaps I can explain. I recognised what was meant by Freshtracks holdays sometimes feeling like DIY and I have also been on "quite a lot of them". I am keen to ski off-piste as much as possible but my wife and family do not want to. SCGB used to provide opportunities for off-piste skiing led by their reps but sadly no longer. I need to ski with other people who all have roughly the same level of competence and fitness. I also like to use a mountain guide or instructor who can help to find the best slopes and minimise risk. Freshtracks try to meet those needs, although it sometimes proves difficult. I hope to use them next season. I was too slow to book a Snowheads off-piste trip. To arrange my own personal mountain guide would be ridiculously expensive. Hope this helps.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Layne wrote:
sugarmoma666 wrote:
@PeakyB, it's probably me confusing the terms really It's not so much that the Freshtracks are DIY. It's more that they feel that way, but without having the control.
You're not selling it to me
But it does beg the question why have you been on "quite a lot of" them?
Some of the trips used to be good value, with flights from Heathrow. Heathrow is pretty convenient for me and it was easy to book the trips without having to find anyone to go with. The Freshtracks long weekends flying Heathrow to Zurich worked pretty well.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@sugarmoma666,
Quote:
Also, I've never been on a TO holiday where I've been told to meet outside of the boot room ready to go at 08:30 sharp And I got very funny looks a few years ago when I decided to stop skiing after lunch, and skied down on my own. (The SCGB Leaders aren't meant to leave you on the mountain - we agreed it was fine as he left me at the top of a mountain railway). I got even stranger looks when I said I'd really enjoyed my solo ski down.
Fits my perception of Freshtracks being a bit more regimented than other models perhaps?
Did you used to get many expletives ending in 'off', or did clientele paying for this experience tend to enjoy being told what to do and when?
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
PeakyB wrote:
@sugarmoma666,
Quote:
Also, I've never been on a TO holiday where I've been told to meet outside of the boot room ready to go at 08:30 sharp And I got very funny looks a few years ago when I decided to stop skiing after lunch, and skied down on my own. (The SCGB Leaders aren't meant to leave you on the mountain - we agreed it was fine as he left me at the top of a mountain railway). I got even stranger looks when I said I'd really enjoyed my solo ski down.
Fits my perception of Freshtracks being a bit more regimented than other models perhaps?
Did you used to get many expletives ending in 'off', or did clientele paying for this experience tend to enjoy being told what to do and when?
No one ever complained about being told what time and where to meet, which is often agreed by consensus and in consultation with the guides/instructors at the welcome meeting anyway.
I realise that good organisation and punctuality is seen as a bit ‘unkewl’ by some people though.
‘No one really knew what was going on, but it was all working well by the final day’ someone describing their experience of a sH bash to me a few years ago.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Gerry, having taken a wrong turn, I was once abandoned by a rep on a Freshtracks holiday in an area which was new to me. When I tried phoning her on the number she had given out, it turned out, at the end of the day, that she had supplied an incorrect number. No apology was forthcoming for any of this. Luckily, while I was considering my options over a coffee, I met another group with a very nice rep and skied with them for the rest of the day.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Gerry,
Quote:
No one ever complained about being told what time and where to meet, which is often agreed by consensus and in consultation with the guides/instructors at the welcome meeting anyway.
I realise that good organisation and punctuality is seen as a bit ‘unkewl’ by some people though.
‘No one really knew what was going on, but it was all working well by the final day’ someone describing their experience of a sH bash to me a few years ago.
I agree, an appropriate amount of good organisation, in consultation with clientele's needs, is needed and beneficial.
I'm an ex-SCGB member and hope the organisation can recover from the apparently sticky period it's experiencing. As Michael Jackson, that well known skier said, 'I'm a lover, not a fighter'
I find the perception that a client received 'even stranger looks when I said I enjoyed my solo ski down' a bit disconcerting.
As for the alleged quote from from someone describing their experience of a SH Bash a few years ago. I can only relay my own experience of several bashes. The organisation has been excellent. Unobtrusive in style, reminiscent of a graceful though slightly hairy swan, paddling like hell against all sorts of adverse swirling currents and somehow getting over the finishing line, to the astonishment and satisfaction of the vast majority of people who placed a bet at odds of about 25/1 that they would.
@PeakyB, I’ve been on loads of Freshtracks trips where people have done their own thing and don’t remember anyone getting queer looks.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Hurtle wrote:
@Gerry, having taken a wrong turn, I was once abandoned by a rep on a Freshtracks holiday in an area which was new to me. When I tried phoning her on the number she had given out, it turned out, at the end of the day, that she had supplied an incorrect number. No apology was forthcoming for any of this. Luckily, while I was considering my options over a coffee, I met another group with a very nice rep and skied with them for the rest of the day.
PM me the name of the Rep. I do seem to remember researching the other side of the story once but I’ve forgotten the details. A name might jog my memory.
@Gerry, splendid. Now let’s all be kind to each other, celebrate the common interests we share and stop casting nasturtiums.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Gerry, thanks, but water under the bridge after all this time. But thanks for the offer.
After all it is free
After all it is free
PeakyB wrote:
@Gerry, splendid. Now let’s all be kind to each other, celebrate the common interests we share and stop casting nasturtiums.
Yeah man, peace and let's chillout, flower power!
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Alastair Pink wrote:
Yeah man, peace and let's chillout, flower power!
In principal, I agree but reconciliation first.
Some of you might have received an offer aimed at new members today offering 18 months for the price of 12:
Quote:
GET A BUMPER MEMBERSHIP FOR A BUMPER SEASON
Dreaming of the mountains? Join the Ski Club this spring and get a whole summer free!
Packed with events, incredible offers and exciting Member Meet-Ups, we can’t wait to help you make the most of your time in the mountains, through this summer and into the winter. That’s why we’re excited to offer you the chance to join the Ski Club during May and receive an extra 6 months free.
Join us for a series of member-only talks on mountain safety and the best kit for winter, and don’t forget you can get the latest kit and equipment for your next outdoor adventure with exclusive discounts from Snow+Rock. Our Reps will be hosting events across the UK’s indoor snowdomes and dry slopes, and with our new Ski Club mobile App it is easier than ever to meet fellow members.
Our trusted Ski Club Reps will once again be heading to resort to meet our members and we are excited to launch both the Reps and ILG programme soon. And of course, you can book your next adventure today with our incredible range of Freshtracks holidays, available earlier than ever before!
"Bumper Season" they have a crystal ball, "Packed with events" check website for distinct lack of events, "incredible offers" like?, "exclusive discounts" available to anyone who asks - I could go on. Despite a whole year in which to reinvent the offering and make it irresistible to the likes of thee and me, they trot out the same old stuff repackaged with truth-stretching adjectives. And what about those existing members who shelled out membership fees and got almost nothing in return during the lost season? - I would expect them to be taken care of first, like other membership organisations have done either by way of discounts, deferments or part-refunds. But nothing. I have mentioned this more than once.
There's a Zoom meeting Wednesday, which I'm not able to attend, but I hope someone brings these things up. The new Council Servant will love it
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Hmm rejoin now with your 18 mth bumper membership or wait til November for a regular membership at the same price when you have a clearer idea of how the chips may be falling/dominoes toppling/biscuits being circle jerked on. Not exactly a compelling offer - "incredible" indeed that suckers will bite.
Here's a challenge for Council/GM slave - set out a list of 10 bullet points without hyperbole or artistic licence that are clear, compelling, honest and specific about why someone should join/remain a member without reference to peripheral things like great discounts or insurance.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Pruman wrote:
...There's a Zoom meeting Wednesday, which I'm not able to attend, but I hope someone brings these things up. The new Council Servant will love it
The advert for the servant is still there and openly linked, although it does have a passed expiry date.
Perhaps they intend to dispose of this one quickly too, in which case they should just script a rolling date a few months hence.
--- hmm
The site's "history" page goes as far forward as the 2010s and says that their "mission" ended in 2019.
The site has a stale feel about it. Is anyone home?
Looking at the wayback machine frequency of change is interesting:
Perhaps they don't have enough staff to keep their site running as well as hanging around here spreading sweetness and light?
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
The one, and only, Freshtracks trip I went on I recollect loosing them at 1.00pm. It was an off-piste trip although I think I lost them as I was flaffing at the lift with my gear. Got to the top and they had all disappeared. I skied up and down the closest piste and about an hour later saw the whole group coming out of a restaurant. Had a nice lunch am told. No one said we were going for lunch and why the f..k did no one wait for me!!
Recently cancelled my membership. Had a look at the current crop of hols.... what a price!!
I would rather do SH trips, go with mates, or arrange my own accomodation and enjoy a well run Snoworks trip. Found the group pretty fusty.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So big Zoom meeting this evening then. Who had the authority Jackie Weaver?
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I'm surprised no-one else has commented on the new appointment, which is discussed on Facebook as being James Gambrill - no sign of a press release on the SCGB web site, nor on any of their social media channels. Also interesting that he started a new mountain sport networking venture recently, on which he was interviewed at http://youtube.com/v/ZL5WB4Hk94Q - I wonder if this is a part-time role, as befits the salary on offer?
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
...and more importantly, is he secretly a Snowhead, and if so, will he admit that on here and unmask himself?
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
ousekjarr wrote:
...and more importantly, is he secretly a Snowhead, and if so, will he admit that on here and unmask himself?
Useful because he's hopefully read all of the above opinion and maybe it helps?
From what I'm told - About 200 people on the zoom meeting but only about 50 visible – Amusingly someone commented at the end: "We claim to be a club for everyone, why does everyone look the same? Why can’t I see any young people, or people from other ethnic groups?" Met with embarrassed silence.
Some really alarming takeaways in my view:
The Council is recommending that they pay £300,000 to get out of the office lease! £300k. Just like that. Actually, I'm surprised it isn't more. The landlords must have another tenant lined up. But that still leaves the club needing an office - no comments on that or how much etc.
Evidently it was stated that the financial mismanagement of last few years has cost the club --- wait for it --- FOUR MILLION POUNDS. I'll leave that one right there to sink in. (Source: Tom Jarman on Facebook)
An IT expert who is a club member and who has taken a good look at the IT says it is "in a real mess". Normally that is code for "£££££££££££££££££££££££££££££" further unplanned expenditure.
One big message was "We want to get back to being a club for members, and away from being a holiday company" thereby neatly removing the Club's best chance of making money if done properly.
And there is a Commitment to reintroduce volunteer member-led skiing particularly in France , through 'Social Reps' linked to the Ski Club app. That, quite frankly, is madness given that the same thing has been found to be illegal by a French court and I can foresee 'Social Reps' spending Christmas in le nick.
The new GM was revealed as the aforementioned James Gambrill. Question I have been asked is whether he'll run his trade show Listex or if that is a dead duck. Can't see how he can do both properly because the task of making SCGB relevant again is gargantuan in my humble experience. But I certainly wish him luck.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Pruman wrote:
Some really alarming takeaways in my view:
The Council is recommending that they pay £300,000 to get out of the office lease! £300k. Just like that. Actually, I'm surprised it isn't more. The landlords must have another tenant lined up. But that still leaves the club needing an office - no comments on that or how much etc.
I thought I'd read that the club had the option of terminating the office lease a year or so ago at no cost, but allowed the final date for doing so pass without taking any action?
Pruman wrote:
Evidently it was stated that the financial mismanagement of last few years has cost the club --- wait for it --- FOUR MILLION POUNDS. I'll leave that one right there to sink in. (Source: Tom Jarman on Facebook)
If that's the case then it's an eye watering amount to lose, which certainly puts the club's future in a perilous state.
Pruman wrote:
An IT expert who is a club member and who has taken a good look at the IT says it is "in a real mess". Normally that is code for "£££££££££££££££££££££££££££££" further unplanned expenditure.
Didn't they already spend about £400k on their website? Well, they've now closed the forum so that won't take any more expenditure. I don't know how important it is to upgrade the rest of their website? I would have thought the vital IT aspects would be things like membership records and communications, membership payments, staff employment records and wages and expenses etc. If the software for that is in danger of becoming obsolete/unsupported then yes I can see that additional expenditure may be needed.
As you say, good luck to the new GM, with that backdrop he'll certainly need it. It brings to mind the well-known joke about a tourist in Ireland who asks one of the locals for directions to Dublin. The Irishman replies: ‘Well sir, if I were you, I wouldn’t start from here’.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
James Gambrill - no sign of a press release on the SCGB web site, nor on any of their social media channels. Also interesting that he started a new mountain sport networking venture recently, on which he was interviewed at
Fair play to James Gambrill. Challenged to a 25 min+ interview with the USA's mountain sports' industry's answer to Alan Partridge, he passed the 'straight face, no sniggering' test with aplomb.
That could be a key skill in his new role. I wish him well.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I think it's safe to assume that anyone "in the business" in the UK would at least be aware of this place and capable of googling themselves.
An organisation whose leaders openly visit here to insult strangers definitely needs sorting out - I wish him well with with that.
+1
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
ed123 wrote:
philwig wrote:
An organisation whose leaders openly visit here to insult strangers definitely needs sorting out - I wish him well with with that.
+1
+ another big fat 1 - throw him out.
philwig wrote:
The LISTEX/ "Mountain trade Network" looks like a switch of focus from B2C to B2B, and is a start-up.Their 1st accounts were end 2019.
I think Listex Ltd has been going 10 years:
Quote:
Mr Simon James Gambrill holds 4 appointments at 4 active companies, has resigned from 1 companies and held 1 appointments at 1 dissolved companies. Their longest current appointment spans 9 years, 11 months and 20 days at LISTEX LIMITED. The combined cash at bank value for all businesses where SIMON holds a current appointment equals £0, a combined total current assets value of £3k with a total current liabilities of £12.1k and a total current net worth of £-60.5k.
Being kind, after 10 years running Listex Ltd, it is a tiny business doing badly, and that is pre-pandemic. Hmmmm.
After all it is free
After all it is free
I missed that one. He's not currently a director of it, according to companies house. It may have been dissolved? A remarkably consistent CV I think.
Those cache sites are out of date ("next accounts due 2020"). I have had problems with some of them as they are breaking the law by scraping personal data from companies house and publishing it around the web. Because it's "public data" doesn't make it not "personally identifiable".
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@philwig, you've got the wrong entry - Companies House is not very good at master data management, so even though they have the full name, date of birth and address of a person, they still have multiple "person" records for them because the system didn't join the dots.
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
And I got very funny looks a few years ago when I decided to stop skiing after lunch, and skied down on my own. (The SCGB Leaders aren't meant to leave you on the mountain - we agreed it was fine as he left me at the top of a mountain railway). I got even stranger looks when I said I'd really enjoyed my solo ski down.
