 Poster: A snowHead
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Guys has anyone ever invested in one of those electronic muscle stimulator things? If so are they worth it? Any ones to recommend stay clear of?
I've now not had full use of my leg since the end of September and have another op to go so need all the help I can get!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Grizwald, Hi - I bought a Compex Fit 1.0 - Used it for about 8-9 months then sold it.
I used it only to build the quads on my injured leg before and after the op - Yes I think it worked - It was pretty painful as you built up the intensity levels - I think it was more useful pre op.
Used the Tens and massage options occasionally - When I was struggling with weight bearing for sure it helped build up the muscles- once I was up and about I found it tedious and not that useful - hence I sold it -
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Grizwald, yes I did. ..I persuaded myself it helped..it didn't really
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Yes. They work for maintenance, when the muscles aren't firing properly themselves, when you can't get to the pool etc. Between ops I'd say is ideal, but they are not a substitute for proper exercise if/when you can do it. I used a kneehab which you can rent. It is quite sensitive to proper placement - sometimes a gently clench, others a cramping vice-like response, but there is no doubt that your muscles will be in better condition for using one if you are unable to do anything else that really engages them. The kneehab fires in the order that your muscles engage during straightening, making sure the muscles do not learn the wrong pattern. It is particularly good for the VMO, which is the one that goes first when you get some swelling.
On the other hand, if you don't use one it will simply take longer to gain the strength back. They are not essential and, to a certain extent, the answer depends on your financial circumstances.
It helped me, because I had scarring and couldn't do anything for 7 weeks post op. If I hadn't used the kneehab I would have been further back.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi All ...
Not a club i ever particularly wanted to be in ... but here we are!
ACL and Meniscus rupture in Verbier 2014, repair done in May 2014, took 2015 off (i was a bit scared!), but am back this season! Went to VT for the day in January to boost confidence (it went very well) and have just booked a week in St Anton for March ...
Anyhow ... My Question ...
What insurance do you have? Pre-ACL i used Direct Travel Insurance (who were brilliant and covered all my other medical issues without quibble (torn/repaired shoulder ligaments etc). Anyhow, they now appear to have shut for new business and for my day trip to VT i really struggled to find anyone who would cover the ACL repair .... anyone with online medical tickbox thing just rejected me straight away and of the 2 companies i phoned, one was extortionate and the other said "No Sirree". In the end, as it was a 1 day-er, I winged it with a Carte Neige and bog standard insurance.
Obviously i want to be properly covered in St Anton .... so, any recommendations for a company that will cover an ACL repair and not quadruple the price in doing so?
Cheers Muchly 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Thanks for the replies there are some of the ones you mention @22 dropout, 2nd hand on Ebay that may be worth looking at.
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@magic_hat, thankfully I can get travel insurance via my work under salary sacrifice which covers pre-existing conditions. Does your work offer anything like that?
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Hi! I'm so glad to find this thread as I think I need to join the club ….. . I tore my ACL and MCL in the powder at la plagne 6 days ago. I knew before I hit the ground what had happened. I got repatriated on the Tuesday (AXA insurance were fantastic) and we paid to see OS on Thursday who has confirmed the tears. MRI due next week to see if I'm going to join the unhappy triad club. Sitting here with ice, leg raised, brace on. The leg just feels totally unstable - it even wobbles with the brace on sometimes if I don't put my weight centrally on my foot and with the brace off, it's hopeless. Anyhow, I desperately need to hear positive stories that I can get back to the piste (and even the powder?). OS says you can get back to skiing without surgery particularly if you're experienced (but he may just have been being nice and flattering!). Current advice is I should give the physio a really good go and decide at 3 months whether things are going well enough not to bother with a reconstruction. I'm 52 and female - have skied 30 years without serious accident so really gutted at the moment. Aaaaargh! All advice and positivity welcomed ….. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@legalista, Sorry to welcome you to Snowheads under such circumstances. You will get lots of advice and support here. All the very best.
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@legalista, get to a sports injury specialist who sees the injury in the context of the person rather than someone who sees a date/age and then says conservative pathway. An unhappy triad will not heal by itself, although the physio before the reconstruction will help restore as much range of movement as possible which is always a good start point.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@legalista. So Sorry to be welcoming you to the club. I tore my ACL in a dog walking accident. And my mcl. And broke my leg. And then broke my leg again. It is a long story, but there is life at the end of the tunnel. I had an ACL repair in July with a donor ligament , recommended due to my age and accident history. I have been told by my surgeon that he would like evidence of my skiing in April, having been told by my physio that my leg is stronger than before. I worked hard before and after the op. I am 62 and was told to change my lifestyle by the NHS to accommodate my lack of ACL. No way. Too much life in front of me yet (I hope). NHS recommended leaving it, and doing physio. Surgeon said no way that would have worked. The op is not so bad, and afterwards you have something to work at. Much better than waiting for your knee to give way again. Get good medical advice from an expert!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@legalista, I ski powder now a lot better than I did before rupturing my ACL and having the op (after 20 sessions of physio which my French doctor told me I had to do first).
Snapped the ACL first week of February. Had the op in May. Was given the all clear in November and was skiing early January (albeit more slowly and nervously than before). Physically there was no problem and it was all in the mind. Now it's as if it never happened. It's really, really not as bad as it seems right now. Don't be fobbed off and if you need to pay to get some speedy specialist advice then do so. Good luck!
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You know it makes sense.
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Wow - thank you all so much! Just got myself up, bathed and downstairs to my beloved bag of frozen peas and it has given me a huge lift to see these messages. I will do exactly what you all say - first physio appointment is on Tuesday so I'm getting going on this and am highly motivated to do everything asked of me. My husband is brilliant ; children are grown up and have left home - how a single parent would manage in these circumstances doesn't bear thinking about. I managed a day at work on Friday , with help in being driven there by a colleague, and having my leg elevated through the day. There's a good local orthopaedics service (although I'm working on the basis of paying for it) and my consultant has a lot of ACL experience and in fairness isn't just assuming I'll want conservative treatment - he just says give it 3 months and see, which is sensible. I understand 3 months is the optimum time for surgery anyhow. One of the features of all this (presumably you've all done the same!) is that you end up trawling all the medical websites for information.
All in all, my situation could be so much worse, but I'm sure you'll all empathise with that even though rationally, you know there is a resolution to all this, it doesn't stop things seeming rather gloomy/frustrating/soul destroying at 2 am when you can't sleep and turning over is a major exercise.
Hey ho. Hearing from you all has just been fantastic!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@legalista, check your travel insurance. ..Mine has £500 for physio
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Poster: A snowHead
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Alas, it doesn't (have just checked) but good thought - thanks!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@legalista, oh dear I'm sorry. It will get better, but the first week or two is rough. Why me, I'll never ski again, how could I have been so stupid, I'm a useless skier, will I ever ski again… Then it gets better as you put skiing behind you for the season and life takes on a different, slower routine focussed on diagnosis, rehab and enjoying things at a slower pace. I convinced myself of two things. Firstly, that I probably didn't have a whole ACL at the time of the accident, and secondly that my first ACL lasted 48 years and so the second should see me out. I also determined that I would never be found wanting for knee strength, health and protection ever again.
I agree with @Samerberg Sue, who talks a lot of sense and has had a lot of experience. I went down the sports route, which is all about getting back to your top level. Their view will likely be to operate though. I did not lose stability at all and skied before my op, but had a graft all the same.
Save some money. There are things that can help post op that will cost a bit. Otherwise, get the swelling down, and only then get some strength up, especially in the hamstrings and VMO as they get a little hammered by the op and prepare for a year of getting back to your best and the sport you (by the sounds of it) love.
Oh, and you will love it even more for the effort you have put in to getting back to it
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Wise and supportive words, which I'm taking on board. Thank you so much.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Wait for MRI, did mine 5 weeks ago today, fortunately only level 1 on ACL and Medial. Keep moving to stop things seizing up. Just be very gentle. If it really hurts or very swollen be very cautious. I was walking/limping without brace after fortnight. Cant jog yet but physio is quite confident of my recovery
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Seems like the club has a new member - my first serious injury in over 25 years of skiing. I was playing on the ridge at the side of the piste when my inside ski submarined, broke left and stopped. My left knee went down in the middle. I'm sure my old Fritschis would have released earlier but my Dynafits hung on until the heel finally released. Nothing went pop but my knee was a bit sore so we skied down to the gondola and packed in for the day. Back in the flat we gave it plenty of RICE but this morning it had stiffened up and was barely up to walking. Did the touristy bit round Aosta - at least there's something to see but the lift office wouldn't give me any money back on my on used days 'cos I didn't buy their insurance. Ho hum.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@legalista, Sorry to hear that your another member of the club. I am a bit older than you -won't go into my experience too much as I am sure you will have read all the 29 pages on here - if not = its worth the time seeing how many different ways people have dealt with the injury.
If I could suggest just one thing that I could/should have improved on it would be to not concentrate too much on the damaged knee and to look after your whole body - and mind - and just give things time. Keeping a sense of humour will be your best friend.
Best of luck.
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There's been a frustrating delay in getting the results of my MRI due to some computer problem at the hospital, so I still don't know what I've done to myself. I veer between convincing myself that there's nothing much wrong and I am limping due to wearing a brace (which I daren't take off until I know what I've done); alternatively that the pop, swelling, instability and floppiness of the knee mean that everything possible has ruptured. It has been useful to read through everyone's experiences and try to treat all this as a marathon, not a sprint.
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Hi everyone, new member of the club here. Did mine on 2nd morning of skiing (Tuesday 19th Jan), knew I'd done something by the distinct 'popping' sensation when I did it. Side sliding down a red with the ski tip rotating without me being able to control it was different to say the least. Physio appointment that afternoon when they told me I hadn't done a ligament and that if I could perform a prescribed set of exercises by the end of the following day I should go and buy myself a brace and ski lightly on Thursday, which I duly did. Only managed half a day as it was really hard work trying to stabilise my lower leg. Managed to ski another 1/2 day on Friday and a 1/2 day lesson on Saturday wasn't too bad. Upon return to UK I saw my usualu physio and left feeling rather deflated when she told me that she was 95% certain I had ruptured my ACL. Paid for a scan which confirmed her diagnosis along with a meniscal tear and MCL sprain.
It seems that I have probably been existing without a fully functioning ACL for quite a while so current thinking, considering the knee has never collapsed, is to do strength and stability exercises and see if I can function without the ACL. Walking is starting to feel a bit more normal now and I'm up to 20 one legged squats. Resigned myself to having to ski with a brace in future and will see how I get on next month in US.
Probably lucky that I have strong legs from competitive cycling at a young age and do a job where I'm on my feet all day so I guess I'm in a bit better position to cope without it than a lot of people.
I'll report back upon return and if it's none too good get in the queue for a reconstruction!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Welcome hairy biker! Sounds as though you are doing really well - hope the recovery continues.
MRI results for me finally in . Not great - ruptured ACL, MCL and tear to articular cartilage. Only good thing I can think of is that this makes there no real debate about need for operation - already pencilled in for 15 April. Still on braces and using crutches and wishing I'd never skied that afternoon. Arrrrgh.
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@legalista, Glad you now have a plan, anyway. It's definitely worth seeing a physio soon if you haven't already seen one, and take advice on getting your knee as strong as possible pre-op. I remember that 'wish I'd not skied that day' feeling, only too well. It will get better, but it does take time.
@andyg9053, @altis, & @Hairybiker, Sorry to hear you have all entered the club too.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Thanks genepi! Have indeed seen physio and am being totally compliant with my exercises. That's not a problem as my knee feels better after I've done them. It really does help to know that others have been through this and come out the other side .
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@altis, what news?
@Hairybiker, I am interested in how you get on in the US. Where are you going there? It doesn't sound as though you are relying on insurance down the line? 20 one-legged squats is impressive, but you might want to get the swelling (the thick feeling) down first. The squats will be aggravating the swelling and, as the old-timers on this board know, swelling is the most important thing to address as it impedes the function and development of the knee muscles. Did you have any tibial plateau fracturing or was that clear.
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@22 dropout, well, I'm walking about although quite obviously limping after it's stiffened up overnight. Been to see the quack today (cold hands!) and she's booked me for an MRI which will take 2-3 weeks. When it's loosened up it doesn't feel too bad but I'm still wary of walking down stairs. Looks unlikely that I'll be out again at Easter though - which was the original plan.
@legalista, sounds like you've gone the whole hog. You have my commiserations.
With luck mine's just a tweak and not a tear (will find out after MRI) and I can get away with just being a country member. All together now: "Ah yes, we remember!"
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You know it makes sense.
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Just had the actual MRI report (had just had a phoned through summary before). ACL tear . MCL grade 2. Complex tear of the body and horn on the lateral meniscus, existing on to the inferior articular surface. Extensive subchondral marrow oedema and soft tissue oedema. Operation should be 15 April.
The recovery starts here. Have ordered self an exercise bike and am doing all the physio. I am a total wimp and loved miranda's account of the op in France (morphine etc) but I'm seriously worried about all the post op pain, going to the loo in the night, being non weight bearing (house is old with loads of steps and no downstairs toilet). All tips for how to get through all this would be gratefully received.
S****ing myself if I'm honest.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@legalista, you have time to plan how you're going to manage this.
First up, you said you had a brilliant husband and that helps a lot! Also, this might sound a bit full on but these are things that I think could make your life easier...
If your bathroom and loo are upstairs, you may have to live upstairs for a little while so plan now how to make that cosy and nice. Move the TV + DVD player and books upstairs. Download talking books and podcasts in case you can't sleep but are too tired and wired to read. You and your husband could start batch cooking, portioning and freezing meals now etc. so it's really easy to whack something into the oven/microwave (I was ravenous in the weeks after the operation)!. If your husband is going to be out at work think about how you can have a stock of food up there during the daytime + kettle for pots of tea. Do you have a spare bedroom? (If possible better to sleep on your own in the bed as you'll want pillows and cushions to elevate the bottom of the bed and I also found the most comfortable position was on my good side with knee propped up on pillows). Also might be nice to have a different room to sit in during the day than the one you're sleeping in. I would invest in a cheap mini ice box for your bedroom and have ice packs in it so you can easily swap them in the night - keeping the knee iced numbs pain as well as treating the swelling and just makes things a whole a lot more comfortable.
Your injury is more complicated than mine but I still had a full-on knee op and was able to walk to the loo fine in the night (no stairs) straight away on crutches. You're only going to be non-weight bearing on one leg, right?
I can't remember now what sort of painkillers you get sent home with in the UK? I got an excessive amount of drugs and still have loads left as it wasn't necessary to have anywhere near that much (is it illegal to post them to you...? Probably!) But you could think about whether you have access to anything better than paracetamol... actually I'll let Hells Bells advise on that side of things!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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^ have to say I was a bit worried about the loo thing, not least as I had experienced "the French" approach to medication, but copious pots of chamomile tea really helped. I got given laxatives as part of my enormous prescription pack but never needed to take them, despite all the codeine (this feels a little 'tmi' to post on a public forum but, hey, these things are important)! Sue's probably right to say it's worthwhile having some to hand in case.
I actually didn't end up using my cyrocuff much at all and personally found the sort of wrap around sleeve/bandage thing you slipped ice packs into more convenient - that said I don't regret buying the cyrocuff as enough cycling/hiking/skiing guests have used it over the years to have made it worthwhile.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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thank you, miranda and samerberg sue! I have now got my mojo back and am viewing things rather more in proportion. Thanks for the tips - I can indeed use one of the (grown up) children's rooms and prepare for the nights with some audio books etc. Will also try to get a cryocuff. Will also give the camomile tea a go and have some stool softeners to hand……
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@legalista, your mojo will come and go over the next few months - just remember that it's par for the course and it will always come back quickly. Even when things were going really well for me I'd have the odd 'oh this is really crap, if only I hadn't...' moment. It doesn't last long. You will be skiing next season and you will be skiing off-piste the season after that (possibly earlier but there's no benefit - physically or psychologically - from trying to run before you can walk so just take that as it comes).
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@legalista, While my injury was different to yours, I was non-weight bearing for 2 months and had similar issues to you re stairs in the house and loo. I did a bit of a blog on progress from the day it happened to when I got back to skiing. If you can bear the tedium of the 30 odd pages there is some practical stuff in there which might help. NB: Graphic image in 1st Post
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?p=2273161&highlight=snowhead#2273161
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@legalista, are you getting everything done? One op or two? You are getting excellent advice above. From my experience, use the pain killers and stay on them for the full course, as it will help with doing mobility exercises. You will have one or two crutches, which you can use for getting around quite easily, but, as others have said, stairs are something to be minimised. The routine of changing ice packs, going to the loo, doing exercises etc. takes up a surprising amount of time and the first couple of weeks will fly past. Only be mobile when you need to be, which means taking any assistance you can (and enjoying doing so while you can!)
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@altis, may he rest in peace. Interesting thought to knowingly have a partial ACL. do you think that would make you back off at times or just forget about it?
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@legalista, very good advice above about preparing to have all essentials on one level. With a bag round your neck you can carry things like phone and books. For cups of tea etc I worked out a series of staging posts between kitchen and my chair. everything took ages, as stated above so the time flies!
Good luck with it all 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@legalista, When you do stand up, it's worth spending time to get your leg/knee into a good position before setting off - try to straighten it as much as you can & walk as normally as possible - with heel lead, and good posture. If I hurried things too much, it hurt more quickly. We had lots of stairs in our house, so every trip to the loo from the sofa was up four steps & down them again, so getting my position as good as it could be first was helpful You'll probably find you won't need the 2 crutches for very long, and as others have said, time flies! I think it's the combination of drugs and routine of ice pack change & exercises that does for you 
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Thanks - useful insights about the time flying! Yes , I am going to be a one stop shop for sorting out the meniscus and having a new ACL whilst I'm there. So, I will prepare the nest upstairs, sort out audio books etc and generally dig in. Also useful thoughts re getting leg into good position before I start. I'm able to work at the moment (barrister, Court provides me with a box and pillow to rest my leg) but I'm thinking of four weeks post op not working? Over the top? Not enough? Luckily, I can get around by train as I live near a station. Thanks all for your comments and positivity which are much appreciated.
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FAQ
) I can now ski happily and knee is stronger than ever.
