 Poster: A snowHead
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slowboarder, it sound like you are doing everything right! 4 wheels stacks are fine, just ensure they are dry and maybe cover with a blanket to make sure they are out of direct sunlight. Rubber does deteriorate over time, I would suggest that you will be fine for a good 5 years but after that get them inspected at your local tyre fitter every year before fitting. There is no set rule as the tyre manufacturers say different things about their product, Michelin state their products are good for 10 years - although I would imagine that most drivers will wear them out before then!
Road salt wouldn't damage in the short term, but is definitely worth washing off before the summer storage period!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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tyremen, slowboarder
I am not trying to be clever or pedantic here, it is good to see somebody from the tyre trade that is actively promoting the use of winter tyres, we took the decision a few years ago to buy our own fitting equipment and have somebody trained up, by Michelin, to fit our car, van and truck tyres because I was fed up with the rubbish service and misinformation we got from local tyre companies here, so you are a welcome change, but just to point out that Michelin's 10 years is from the date of manufacture, which could be well different from when the tyre was fitted / first used. They do indeed recommend that after 5 years, again from manufacture date, that you get them checked annually.
For me personally I think 5 years is enough, but then it does not cost me so much to change the them.
tyremen if you have a link or something to deciphering that code maybe you could post it up, I am writing this on my phone and inserting links is beyond me I am afraid.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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feef, I have heard that snowsocks are not good in standing water - they can aquaplane easily which is not a problem with chains. Given you cant always stop where you want to remove them - it would be nice to know - any experience.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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chocksaway, I have 4WD, winter tyres and for emergencies (sheet ice on steep winter hills and summer tyre mud etc), Rud 'Soft Spikes' which are a snow sock wound with a steel wire mesh. Having used chains & socks on ice, slush and snow & experienced the uneasy, wobbly feel with both, I'd hate to imagine going fast enough with chains or socks that aquaplaning could actually be an issue.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
I'd hate to imagine going fast enough with chains or socks that aquaplaning could actually be an issue.
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+1!!!!!!
We have used snowsocks on our S-max through some serious snow, work well and quick to fit, would not go back to chains
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| chocksaway wrote: |
| feef, I have heard that snowsocks are not good in standing water - they can aquaplane easily which is not a problem with chains. Given you cant always stop where you want to remove them - it would be nice to know - any experience. |
I think it unlikely that any vehicle would aquaplane at speeds lower than 30mph. If you're going faster than that in conditions which warrant autosocks or chains, you need your head examined 
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Hi there tyremen. Not really winter tyres, but i have a renault trafic which i have Goodyear Cargo G26 on. They're on it because the van came with a matched set, and I've just stuck with them. They do however have minimal grip on anything other than perfect road surfaces. I surf a lot, so end up exploring unfinished roads, fields etc where grip is really poor and have to say the small amount of ice/slush we had over here last year lead to some sphincter twitchers.
I'm not looking at winter tyres, but wondered what improvement an all seasons tyre would give in terms of grip in poor conditions, and what if any drawbacks - noise, dry grip, economy etc.? For some reason I'm drawn to the Vredestein Comtrac All Season - any thoughts or suggestions appreciated.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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rogg,
We ran a Fiat 3.5t van with Vredstein Comtrac Winter tyres, I am not sure whether they still use the same name, for a couple of years winter and summer. Did not really notice any difference except that driving on muddy fields, and obviously snow, was a lot more successful, which was the reason we left them on. Tyre life was not really a problem but what we did, and still do with the 4x4 and truck tyres, is sell off the tyres on ebay when they reach the end of the snow tyre depth marker. There are always people looking for what they term "decent" part worn commercial or 4x4 tyres to get them through an MOT and it gives you nice new tyres sooner than you would have otherwise. I know this doesn't really answer your question but maybe it helps.
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tyremen, I have a set of Pirelli Ice & Snow 265/70 R16 fitted for the Winter months on my 1981 Series III Land Rover, weight is approximately 1,500 kg, what tyres pressures would you recommend?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Socks seem to be great on 'cold' snow but on mixed conditions with slushy material on the road the mixture of ice and water dues not move out of the way as quickly as water does, so you will 'plane' at much slower speeds. Slushy mixed conditions going downhill, i think i would be happier staying on chains.
The fitting speed of the chains very much depends on the design of the chain.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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tyremen, Bit of a random one:
Our last car was a 2006 Nissan Murano with only Dunlop tyres available - so winter boots were iirc Grandtrek WT3 225/65/17 (sizes may be wrong.
Our current is a Murano 2010 which is somewhat revised and seems to favour Bridgestones, slightly different size which seems more common at 235/65/17 (or thereabouts). Winter boots are Blizzak LM-25.
Allowing for sundry other changes... I felt bombproof on the Dunlops. 3 winters (we live in Geneva/Chamonix so we do need snow tyres!) and almost felt like driving on a dry road when in snow. Not the same security on the Bridegstones -very squirrelly, etc.
Would you expect such a difference in performance?
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tyremen, Thank you for temperature confirmation; I find only a slight loss of Performance when driving in a "sporty fashion" and gain better MPG because of less rolling resistance from the narrower winter tyre. I run two vehicles on Michelin and will PM you when I need a quote. But for winter the Continental is fantastic.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
The fitting speed of the chains very much depends on the design of the chain.
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Yes, but also on the fitter. I have done quite a lot of chains, over ten winters, but always have a practice before setting off for the mountains, to ensure I've not lost the knack. I always fit my chains with bare hands, as it's far easier - as long as they go on fast, before frostbite sets in.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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tyremen, Have just bought an Audi Allroad 3.0tdi Quattro (late 2006) and will need winter tyres for ski trips. It currently has 225/55/17 W rated Pirelli P6 Allroad tyres, on rims which I suspect are 8J. The handbook states that chains can be used on front wheels only, but only on 215/55/17 tyres on 7J rims! (which would have a smaller rolling circumference surely?)
Any suggestions on the best way forward?
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Poster: A snowHead
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rogg, an all season van tyre sounds like a great solution for the use you describe! skitow is quite right that a winter van also offers great winter and light off-road traction without sacrificing mileage, however these new all season van tyres are made specifically for year round use so would be better still. They still have the aggressive directional tread pattern and compounds that will give improved traction in slush or snow. I've looked at the ratings values for standard van, all season van and winter van and they are all pretty similar. The fuel efficiency info is the same across the board, the all season and winter products have slightly greater external noise but this is not likely going to mean dramatically greater noise inside the cab.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Spyderman, I'm afraid that none of my tech books list these vehicles, either look in the handbook if you have it or I'm sure one of the Landrover forums would have opinions on that one. Sorry!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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under a new name, interesting to hears about your experiences with your Murano's. I think there are a couple of tyre related things that may have an impact in the change of handling. Nissan could of course have made changes that could affect the handling also.
1. change in tyre size - when it comes to winter tyres the narrower the better so if the old model had a narrower tyre then this would have helped (although I wouldn't have expected 1 size to make a vast amount of difference.
2. tyre brand - I really don't rate Bridgestone winter tyres, although they are a well known manufacturer they don't seem to have mastered effective winter tyres, they never seem to come out well in all the European tyre tests.
A combination of the 2 could have the noticeable effect you describe.
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RobinS, it's not uncommon for vehicle manufacturers to suggest a smaller size when using chains, this allows for a bit more room between the tyre and body work to ensure that the chain doesn't catch.
My first question would be, "why are you bothering with chains?" an Audi Quattro, fitted with winter tyres will be amazingly effective in the snow and would negate the use of chains!
If you really need to use them then going for the smaller size tyre would be fine, its only 1.7% smaller, if your speedo says 70mph then you'll actaully be travelling at 68.79mph so no problem. You would of course need to change all four wheels to this size and yes these would be fine on a 7" rim, or even a 7.5" rim also.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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tyremen, we are sometimes required to fit chains by the local police, as carrying winter equipment is obligatory in many Alpine regions. If they say we have to put on the chains, then it doesn't matter what sort of tyres you have on, although I've never had to fit my chains so far (4x4 with Continentals)
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Hells Bells, yes I know that signs can on occasion mandate chains also, just from what I gather this is fairly unusual as generally it's one or the other. From the skiers I speak to I often hear the same as you, that chains have been purchased but never used! However, sensible to be covered for any situation.
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tyremen, if you don't have them, and they decide you have to put them on, you won't be able to go anywhere. Ours have been out of the bag once to make sure they weren't damaged, and to try them out. We are on our third car with the same set.
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Hells Bells, My understanding is that the flics will not mandate chains if you have proper snow tyres on a 4x4.
We've been 6 years in Geneva/Chamonix without chains...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I have a Jaguar XF, which as brilliant as it is in the summer, is appalling in the snow, being a big, heavy rear-wheel drive. In the past three winters I've had some Continental Winter tyres fitted, which are better than the summer tyres but still get beaten by even a fairly gentle incline.
Do you have any suggestions for the best brand/model to cope with snow for my car. The tyre dimensions are 245/45 18. I appreciate that performance will never be great with my type of car, but any improvement will be appreciated.
We don't get markedly more snow where live than in the SE of the UK, but regular weekend trips up to the mountains means that I will come into contact with it more often.
I appreciate that you won't get any custom from me unless you are prepared for a long drive, but your independent advice is invaluable!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Whitters, Continental make a cracking winter tyre so if that hasn't done the trick then you should explore other options. Some versions of the XF will take a 17" wheel which would use a narrower tyre which would make a big difference as the narrower the better. If you want to PM me your vehicle reg and I can check to see if it's possible for yours.
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| under a new name wrote: |
Hells Bells, My understanding is that the flics will not mandate chains if you have proper snow tyres on a 4x4.
We've been 6 years in Geneva/Chamonix without chains... |
Agree with this totally in terms of the practical application of the law. Likely that it still doesn't negate the legal requirement to have the chains in the vehicle though.
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You know it makes sense.
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tyremen, thanks for the quick reply. My car is now Swiss-registered so I don't know if my old UK registration details will help. I'll try and dig them out.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Whitters, actually the engine size would suffice.
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Poster: A snowHead
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tyremen, OK, it is a 2.7
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Whitters, perfect, you can use the 17" wheel on those! You can drop to a 225/55R17 tyre which is a couple of sizes narrower which will really improve your winter traction. If you PM me I can point you in the direction of a perfect product if you want to consider such a change?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks tyremen, I've just ordered the Kumho's 'cos I found them at the cheapest price....
Any recommendations for a proper winter tyre in 205/65/16 ? (Renault Trafic)
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Jeez someone who knows what they are talking about and is helpful - that's going to spoil all the fun 
So tyremen, interested in your opinion - after some faffin in previous years, I now leave my Winter Tyres on all year. I can't honestly say I have noticed a difference in performance/grip/excessive wear etc. Running Continetal on a SEAT Alhambra so never a sporty drive at best of times.
Thoughts?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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stevomcd, winter van - I'd look at Vredestein (good all-rounder), Michelin (modern product, hard wearing but expensive) or Hankook (O.E quality at sensible prices).
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Boris, we have many people that do this with no ill effects. In fact the tyre manufacturers themselves are now saying that if you are going to use 1 type of tyre year round then you are best using a winter tyre as opposed to a summer tyre. The logic is that the trade off is less:
winter tyres - great in the winter, not too bad in the summer either
summer tyres - shocking in the winter, great in the summer.
I can see where they are coming from!
You just need to make sure you have a decent product to start with, I certainly wouldn't want to run budget winters year round, but certain tyres will work particularly well without running off quickly. Just best to opt for a pattern that isn't too aggressive.
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| tyremen wrote: |
| rob@rar, thanks for the welcome! Our position is that we would never recommend budget winter tyres, winter tyres are designed to offer enhanced safety in cold conditions and budget offerings simply don't offer this. All the independent tyre test reports that we see always throw a budget winter tyre into the mix and they always come our very poorly indeed. Their performance in all testing disciplines is often shocking and generally not much better than a standard summer tyre - avoid! |
I appreciate that there is a big difference in performance in the tyre tests that get published each year, but I wonder in real world driving rather than controlled tests how much that difference in performance actually means and whether it justifies the price between the cheapest and most expensive winter tyres?
I'm a reasonably experienced driver in alpine conditions and found that the budget tyres I fitted to my Kia Sportage last winter kept me moving very easily in very bad road conditions (just before Christmas when there was chaos on the roads throughout the Savoie). Spending double the amount that I did on a set of Vredsteins wouldn't have noticeably improved the driving I did over those few weeks because the budget tyres did a perfectly decent job in the worst conditions I've known in 20 years of driving to the Alps.
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I've also been running ours with winter tyres since December last year. (Continental Winter Contact 4x4? I think) Have two almost new Bridgestone Dueller H/P Sport in the garage (used for one month) which our neighbour (Nissan factory emlpoyee) says are now standard on new X-trails, but I didn't consider them to be good enough for winter use in the Alps. Was I wrong? I'm thinking of selling them, as they're taking up a lot of room.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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tyremen, Looking at fitting winter tyres to a Subaru Forester, 2006, 2 litre 215 60 R16. Would be interested to know your recommendations, would prefer towards the lower end of the price range! It will be mostly for UK driving but we also spend 3 weeks in the Alps. Thanks
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Hells Bells, no you were quite right, the HP Sport would not be suitable for driving in the Alps. Maybe give good old E-Bay a go, the second hand market seems pretty strong these days so you should get something for them.
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FAQ
