Hi all, couldn't resist adding my 2p! The only time I have ever been reasonably sure of my speed was coming down the Hanneggschuss section of the Lauberhorn run in Wengen. It is a controlled (e.g. roped off) descent on one of the steepest parts of the course with a long run-off area to slow down. And it has a speed-gun displaying your speed. I was in slalom skis and measured 90kph (55mph). I am willing to bet that the average holiday skier on-piste has no idea what 55 feels like on your face and underfoot. A good test would be to stick your head out of the window in a moving car at 55 (preferably as a passenger!). I would not want to catch an edge at that speed, that's for certain.
Following that experience I am now pretty sure that most people will be way overestimating their average speeds on piste. Following the FIS code (Rule 2) is always advisable over wearing a speedo and there are certainly times when it is possible to schuss at 50-60mph if it's quiet enough and the terrain allows it. However, if you are regularly attaining these speeds in a resort then I would also agree that you are taking a very big risk and should probably think twice about the possibility of something going horribly wrong- even if you are Svindal or Von.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
dsoutar wrote:
These people find it challenging enough to ski down a course at speed where the gates don't move
LOL, pro race courses are extremely challenging and nothing at all like blasting down an easy piste, an empty piste of course. All this reference to professional racing vs skiing fast on an easy piste is nonsense IMO. They are totally different things. I can thrash down a nicely groomed soft blue run at 40 mph+ with relative ease, yet I wouldn't dream of attempting the same thing down an icy WC GS or DH course. These guys are cornering on the absolute limit, not just carving hero turns across a blue run! If people can't see the difference here, then I'd question how much skiing they've actually done.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
uktrailmonster wrote:
dsoutar wrote:
These people find it challenging enough to ski down a course at speed where the gates don't move
LOL, pro race courses are extremely challenging and nothing at all like blasting down an easy piste, an empty piste of course. All this reference to professional racing vs skiing fast on an easy piste is nonsense IMO.
I do laugh at all this bollux about people who are experts or race trained are going to be capable of skiing balls out down a busy piste.
Has anyone actually suggested that? Quotes please or it didn't happen.
eddiethebus wrote:
you may have been responsible for planning everything from his breakfast to his underwear but if you think that "true experts" never go down pistes at high speed you're crazy!
primoz wrote:
On the other hand, it's possible to ski safely at such speed even when other people are around. Believe it or not, I can see and I regularly check what's happening around me even at 80 or 100km/h, and with courses wide enough (and not completely full), you can easily avoid other skiers wide enough, that even their unpredictable moves or actions doesn't influence you
Need any more ? There are others further up this thread
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Here's a video of a typical piste cruising day - average snow. Ski Tracks App shows a peak speed of just over 50 mph, but most of it is actually well under 40 mph and some just under 20 mph. If it's dangerous, then I've been very lucky over many hundreds of days. The first run is slower on a Canadian green, the second run from 1:58 is a slightly steeper pitch, but hardly the challenge of a WC GS/DH course! Not many people around and you can see for miles.
I do laugh at all this bollux about people who are experts or race trained are going to be capable of skiing balls out down a busy piste.
Has anyone actually suggested that? Quotes please or it didn't happen.
eddiethebus wrote:
you may have been responsible for planning everything from his breakfast to his underwear but if you think that "true experts" never go down pistes at high speed you're crazy!
primoz wrote:
On the other hand, it's possible to ski safely at such speed even when other people are around. Believe it or not, I can see and I regularly check what's happening around me even at 80 or 100km/h, and with courses wide enough (and not completely full), you can easily avoid other skiers wide enough, that even their unpredictable moves or actions doesn't influence you
Need any more ? There are others further up this thread
Where's the mention of a "busy" piste? Or skiing "balls out"?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Bodeswell wrote:
Hi all, couldn't resist adding my 2p! The only time I have ever been reasonably sure of my speed was coming down the Hanneggschuss section of the Lauberhorn run in Wengen. It is a controlled (e.g. roped off) descent on one of the steepest parts of the course with a long run-off area to slow down. And it has a speed-gun displaying your speed. I was in slalom skis and measured 90kph (55mph). I am willing to bet that the average holiday skier on-piste has no idea what 55 feels like on your face and underfoot. A good test would be to stick your head out of the window in a moving car at 55 (preferably as a passenger!). I would not want to catch an edge at that speed, that's for certain.
Whist skiing at speed, put your lightly gloved had out to the side, palm into the airflow and gently 'squeeze' the air. If it feels like you're squeezing a nice, firm TIT, then you are in excess of 55mph. If it feels like a roof tiler's nail bag, then you're only doing around 35mph.
For added realism, put a current in the centre of your palm.
Hope that helps.[/img]
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Tue 9-02-16 13:52; edited 1 time in total
After all it is free
After all it is free
Quote:
Likewise, who is suggesting this then? You seem to have made up an analogy that nobody suggested
oh I think the tone of primoz's posts above are pretty much consistent with it "we're really good so we can ski really fast safely around other skiers"
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@jedster, well considering in all these years, I never had not even close call, even less that I would actually run over someone's skis or even ski into someone, I guess I'm right, or? On the other hand, there's bunch of people on these forum, who manage to crash into someone else in their 5 days/year, so someone is doing something wrong, and I doubt it's me.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
uktrailmonster wrote:
dsoutar wrote:
uktrailmonster wrote:
dsoutar wrote:
I do laugh at all this bollux about people who are experts or race trained are going to be capable of skiing balls out down a busy piste.
Has anyone actually suggested that? Quotes please or it didn't happen.
eddiethebus wrote:
you may have been responsible for planning everything from his breakfast to his underwear but if you think that "true experts" never go down pistes at high speed you're crazy!
primoz wrote:
On the other hand, it's possible to ski safely at such speed even when other people are around. Believe it or not, I can see and I regularly check what's happening around me even at 80 or 100km/h, and with courses wide enough (and not completely full), you can easily avoid other skiers wide enough, that even their unpredictable moves or actions doesn't influence you
Need any more ? There are others further up this thread
Where's the mention of a "busy" piste? Or skiing "balls out"?
RTFP
If you ski at 100kmh and don't think it's balls out then you probably should be representing GB; but of course you probably do
and as for thinking that the phrase "not completely full" doesn't allow for plenty of people on the piste
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@primoz, It's hard to define 'empty piste', but I'm talking about something like a clear 100-200 metres in front. Relative speed is also important. Two skiers skiing parallel at 60kmh may be less dangerous than a fast skier overtaking a much slower skier.
I do also have a slight gripe about 'expert' skiers who will pass slower skiers sufficiently close that while they may rightly, or wrongly, be completely safe they fail to take into account the effect that their passage will have in terms of upsetting a less able skier. In my opinion, even if you are passing behind another skier then you need to leave enough room for both safety and to be considerate.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
jedster wrote:
Quote:
Likewise, who is suggesting this then? You seem to have made up an analogy that nobody suggested
oh I think the tone of primoz's posts above are pretty much consistent with it "we're really good so we can ski really fast safely around other skiers"
That's certainly how I read them.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Ok before this goes on forever and I will look like most dangerous skier around (even with my record of accidents which is contrary to most of you still at 0 (zero) ), here's how empty course looks for me, and I actually manage to get 90% of my skiing time on courses like this:
http://www.photosi.eu/stuff/course_empty.jpg
And again... take it as you want, I know how I'm skiing, I know how much time I spend, and did spend on skis, and I know how many accidents I had. Basically, I really don't give a damn if you think I'm skiing dangerously. If you do, it's fine with me. Luckily there's very little chances, we will ever meet on course
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@uktrailmonster, I haven't really understood most of this topic, but I did recognise your skis. What do you think of them?
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Look, it's simple I'm the fastest skier on the mountain everyone else is just trying to be the first runner up.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@uktrailmonster,
fair enough - looking at the vid I don't think you were skiing very fast. You were putting loads of turns in on friendly slopes. Nowt wrong with that - looked a nice ski
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@johnE, I've had the Le Fers for about 3 seasons now and to be honest they are an acquired taste. Sometimes they are brilliant and sometimes they can be a bit frustrating. They are pretty stiff and don't tolerate much other than pure carving (straight cut tail with zero taper) and they like to be skied on their natural radius, requiring a lot of effort to bend into a tighter arc. Also while the numbers suggest a slalom turn radius, it definitely feels more GS like to me. If I'm in the mood and the conditions are good, they are a total blast to ride (which is specifically why I bought them) but if I want to ski a bit more casually or get too tired they can quickly become hard work. They are not as versatile or forgiving as say a Head Titan in this respect (which has very similar dimensions) but they can certainly keep up with pretty much anything on a groomed piste! I use them specifically as a groomer day ski when I want to be skiing fairly quick and feel some nice powerful rebound, but I wouldn't want them as my only ski. As for build quality they are excellent, I love Movement top sheets - they are so tough compared to the average.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
jedster wrote:
@uktrailmonster,
fair enough - looking at the vid I don't think you were skiing very fast. You were putting loads of turns in on friendly slopes. Nowt wrong with that - looked a nice ski
That's right, speed would be like I said. Slopes are very friendly (although slightly steeper than they look in the video). I do enough skiing, road and mountain biking to know what these sort of speeds feel like and what is and is not reasonable. Ski Tracks GPS doesn't give any results that are surprising providing you ignore the odd obvious spike. One thing the video doesn't really show is the radius of the turns. They look a lot smaller radius than they are in reality. I don't have a suitable photo to hand, but those are far more like GS radius turns than SL. I'm not scrubbing any speed off in most of the turns, just using the pitch of the slope to set the natural speed. Racing on a much steeper slope at those speeds or much faster would require a totally different skill level which I don't have - which was one of my points earlier.
Here's a video of a typical piste cruising day - average snow. Ski Tracks App shows a peak speed of just over 50 mph, but most of it is actually well under 40 mph and some just under 20 mph. If it's dangerous, then I've been very lucky over many hundreds of days. The first run is slower on a Canadian green, the second run from 1:58 is a slightly steeper pitch, but hardly the challenge of a WC GS/DH course! Not many people around and you can see for miles.
No, I wouldn't have said that was remotely dangerous. Nice elegant skiing too. It's hard to judge from a gopro, but I would have thought your speed in most of that video is in the 30's. To touch 50mph I think one needs a pretty straight flat slope and a tuck. Only thing that worries me is that you don't seem to have any friends.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Quote:
To touch 50mph I think one needs a pretty straight flat slope and a tuck
Me too. I don't think you can 50mph carving nice shortish GS turns on a blue run. The only time I feel I'm pushing that is straightlining a steepish section with an open more gentle run-out. My reference is cycling where I can hit 50mph on the drops on a steepish hill and it feels very fast to me.
To touch 50mph I think one needs a pretty straight flat slope and a tuck
Me too. I don't think you can 50mph carving nice shortish GS turns on a blue run. The only time I feel I'm pushing that is straightlining a steepish section with an open more gentle run-out. My reference is cycling where I can hit 50mph on the drops on a steepish hill and it feels very fast to me.
Of course not, I said a PEAK speed of 50 mph in that video, probably at about 3:30 when overtaking the snowboarder where the piste drops down to the right before flattening out into the slow zone. Maybe also just about hit 50 mph in the middle of that run too - which would be an easy red in Europe, not blue. The first run in that video is a "Euro" blue. My reference of biking is the same as yours by the way, so we agree there. Average speed in that video is probably around 30 mph ish. Again based on feel and GPS data. You know what it's like cruising at mid 20's on your bike right? Well this is considerably faster than that for the most part.
Anyway the main point of this video is to show that I'm actually cruising fairly casually here, not by any means riding "balls out" at the ragged edge of my ability. I'm sure I could add 5 maybe 10 mph to those speeds without getting out of my comfort zone, but like most skiers I get more of a kick out of the constant loading and rebound out of the turns. As we all know carving skis like to be on edge anyway, not totally flat. I remember Graham Bell in a video once mentioning how dangerous it is to keep modern skis totally flat on the snow. Even the slightest edge hold is far more stable and safer.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Quote:
Even the slightest edge hold is far more stable and safer.
agreed but it slows you down quite a lot on anything but boiler plate.
In any case I think we may have been at cross purposes - touching 50 for fleeting moments is very different from skiing at 50mph for long sections which is what I took from some of the macho posturing (not aimed at you) on this thread.
After all it is free
After all it is free
I mean I'd never describe myself as cycling at 50mph just because I touch that speed every now and again.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
uktrailmonster wrote:
Here's a video of a typical piste cruising day - average snow. Ski Tracks App shows a peak speed of just over 50 mph, but most of it is actually well under 40 mph and some just under 20 mph. If it's dangerous, then I've been very lucky over many hundreds of days. The first run is slower on a Canadian green, the second run from 1:58 is a slightly steeper pitch, but hardly the challenge of a WC GS/DH course! Not many people around and you can see for miles.
For added realism, put a current in the centre of your palm.
line of the day
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
extremerob wrote:
good choice in gloves!
Definitely! And they last forever too.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@extremerob,
Off topic but I'm in the market for some new gloves - what ones are they (can't watch the YouTube video in the office to see if the make is more obvious)
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I wonder how long it might be before the impact of Strava is felt on piste skiing. I use it all the time for running and a bit of cycling, so it was natural for me to record my half term skiing week on my GPS watch and upload to Strava.
At the very least it inspired me to ski from the top to the bottom of a few pistes which I'd normally take a breather on part way down the slope. Its surprising how short a period of time you actually ski for when you see it recorded afterwards (e.g. Tourmaline at Flaine on a busy afternoon, took 5m20s to ski from top to the bottom).
Having said that, I was then inspired to try to better that time on the one morning when we got up to Tete de Saix on the first lift so blasted down in 2m46s averaging just over 31mph from top to bottom, without a soul in sight (so only dangerous to me!).
On top speed, the fastest I've recorded myself using a GPS was a few years ago in Val Thorens / Orelle on the Mauriennaise red piste down to the Rosael lift station where there is a nice steep section followed by a long flat runout. I just crept over 60mph that day, and I doubt I'll ever reach those speeds again as it was scarily fast.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I routinely ski at GPS-verified speed in the 40-50 mph range, peaking in the low-50s mph while skiing on most on-piste ski runs (when uncrowded) throughout a typical day. For a brief few seconds I typically peak at around 50 mph during several runs that I ski every day, amounting to hitting 50+ mph several hundred times throughout my 30-40 day ski season. For me, skiing at 30 mph is brisk, but still a relaxing pace; above 40 mph feels aggressive, but not unreasonable; above 50 mph starts to get really scary very quickly and 55 mph is utterly nerve-racking.
However, I cannot seem to ski faster than 57 mph (which I hit only once) and typically max out around 55 mph. Want to hit 60 mph just once, then call it good and then dial it back for good-measure.
I have fallen in 15 inches of deep powder at 51 mph, which left me slightly-dazed for about 10 seconds, but that was all. Another time, my skis slid out from underneath me at 45 mph down on an icy short-but-very steep groomed double-black diamond run, but I did not endure even a slight scratch. The few times that I have fallen while skiing off-piste extreme terrain, I have always been able to self-arrest quickly and spin around back onto my skis, like some intentional 1980s breakdancing maneuver. My last "yard sale" was skiing at Beaver Creek in 2009 and bombing-down Centennial - back in the days in which I (embarrassed now) previously had called myself an "expert skier, but I just don't do moguls". I was very stupid back then, and while I cannot ski zipperline, I learned to ski moguls and learned from mountain locals what it really means to be an expert skier. Today I ski all terrain, all conditions.
While I do not plan to fall at higher speeds, I have the perception that the best position to fall on-piste would be to curl up in a ball and try to slide it out, and not cartwheel or rag-doll it. Hopefully if I can react in a millisecond if a discovered that falling is imminent, I hope to be able to get into the proper crash-position in time.
A skiing acquaintance who previously raced downhill purported to have crashed, allegedly going 70 mph, which cracked her helmet and gave her a concussion. I am cautiously accessing 60 mph as the upper-end threshold, that if skiing while I am the only one on the ski slope at the time, under perfect conditions, would be close to the fastest speed before risk (both probability of crashing and the consequences of crashing) starts to outweigh reward.
I wear a full-face ski helmet (a POC Cortex DH) with MIPS (Multi-directional Impact Protection System) technology to protect my noggin. Still, it surprises me sometimes how I just cannot release my edges long enough to crack 60 before losing my nerve. I can certainly attest that 55 mph is darn fast on skis.
This thread needs a 'nervous skiers look away now' warning! I think this is one of the scariest threads I've read for some time - to think that we are sharing the hill with nutters doing the speeds reported these 8 pages, no wonder when collisions occur folks get hurt. Folks will say 'well there is not a problem if we are doing it safely'. At some of these speeds skiers are severely closing the gaps between them and skiers in front of them quickly and if the skier in front suddenly does something unexpected, i.e. catches an edge and falls rather than continuing as the fast skier behind might be assuming as they work out their 'line' I just wonder how fast some of you could stop!!
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Wow, I'm impressed. With the quality of willy waving.
@markgerardy, I just hope I'm nowhere near when you are trying that. Very glad to see the pistes are empty in that shot.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Hurtle, clearly Mr Gerardy has the biggest willy though....or is the biggest willy, one of the two.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@SnoodlesMcFlude,
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
It's skiing Jim, but not as we know it.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Shared the Olympic chairlift at Heavenly a couple of seasons ago with a fellow who was boasting about how fast he was skiing and was aiming to go faster, all recorded by some application on his mobile telephone. I saw him doing laps of the run and decided he was a serious accident waiting to happen - little technique, even less control, too much bravado.
By no design, I ended up on the same lift with him again later on. He was still boasting. I told him to slow down, that he was danger to others and that he was a 'w*****'. I think he was quite pleased as he didn't appear to know what that meant so it was wasted on him, I fear.
A little later, I was much heartened to see him being threatened with removal of his lift pass by a yellow-jacketed piste patroller.
The moral of this tale, if there is one: please slow down for all our sakes!
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
On the other hand, there's bunch of people on these forum, who manage to crash into someone else in their 5 days/year, so someone is doing something wrong, and I doubt it's me.
