 Poster: A snowHead
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Surely we can do a better job than the post office!
Post up menus/prices from your favourite restos, bars, ski schools etc
This is a strange survey. Quite frankly SnowHeads would do a better job…
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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And here’s the exchange rates
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This is going to be difficult. Firstly we need benchmarks. For instance lift passes (in the tables it shows Tignes as a full price Tignes/Val Pass, the 3 vallies resorts are individual passes not 3V). The ski boot hire looks like walk up prices, you can get up to 50% off online and et 6 days worth for 70 quid at say Mountain Story. We then need to define what is a lunch, what type of beer (craft vs Eurofizz) at a resto with a view or a shed in the town square. As for ski schools, a group of 6 with a Brit or 18 in an ESF snake!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Here’s Verbier:
5 morning ski school Peak Season =chf350 or £311.92
6 day lift pass 4V = 389chf or £346.56
6 day ski and boot hire (test = top category) = chf335.20 or £298.59 (silver = lowest category) chf182.15 = £162.29
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| chocksaway wrote: |
| This is going to be difficult. Firstly we need benchmarks. For instance lift passes (in the tables it shows Tignes as a full price Tignes/Val Pass, the 3 vallies resorts are individual passes not 3V). The ski boot hire looks like walk up prices, you can get up to 50% off online and et 6 days worth for 70 quid at say Mountain Story. We then need to define what is a lunch, what type of beer (craft vs Eurofizz) at a resto with a view or a shed in the town square. As for ski schools, a group of 6 with a Brit or 18 in an ESF snake! |
Ok define your categories. I would propose decent quality as in what you would recommend someone to us so not bargain basement. For Verbier I put the ski hire shop we send guests too and it includes the 20% online discount available as long as you don’t just walk-in. For ski school I put ESS that my kids use but it’s good in CH and prices are similar for the UK schools. Lift pass should be full area to be comparable across the decent ski areas.
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Impossible. I thought the "ski school" prices for basic groups looked high so looked up the cost of the (French) ski school we used for years. Maximum 10 in a group. 5 days lessons range from 120 to 175 EUROS, depending on period, with the 4 French winter holiday weeks the most expensive.
All it shows, really, and all that the Snowheads equivalent would show, is that individual choices about resort, accommodation, how you feed yourself and what you choose to drink make more difference to the cost of your holiday than which country you go to. One of the cheapest resorts (Bardonecchia) and one of the most expensive (Cervinia) are in Italy!
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| pam w wrote: |
Impossible. I thought the "ski school" prices for basic groups looked high so looked up the cost of the (French) ski school we used for years. Maximum 10 in a group. 5 days lessons range from 120 to 175 EUROS, depending on period, with the 4 French winter holiday weeks the most expensive.
All it shows, really, and all that the Snowheads equivalent would show, is that individual choices about resort, accommodation, how you feed yourself and what you choose to drink make more difference to the cost of your holiday than which country you go to. One of the cheapest resorts (Bardonecchia) and one of the most expensive (Cervinia) are in Italy! |
It’s relative so put peak season prices as most people travel during holiday periods
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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It's too complex to be meaningful
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I find it all a bit pointless.
Flight + Hotel + Liftpass + Transfers. That is all that matters to me.
Anything else depends on my budget! I'll happily grab items from the bakery before getting on a gondola & stuff my face at breakfast if money was tight.
I usually take water with me, so anything else is optional.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Well, from my trip last week, on-piste prices in Switzerland, Quatre ValléesCafé au lait - CHF 3.60 (£3.20)
300ml Beer - CHF 3.40 (£3.02)
Vegetable soup, & bread - CHF 8 (£7.12)
Goulash & bread - CHF 10 (£8.89)
Spagbol - CHF 17.50 (£15.57)
Croute aux Champignons - CHF 20 (£17.79) I had a beer and soup at CHF 11.40 (£10.15) for lunch, then coffee or chocolate as a break (£3.20).
Self-catering groceries at resort supermarketFresh croissant - CHF 1.60 (£1.42) [that's cheaper than at our local baker in Brighton]
300gr fresh baguette - CHF 4.10 (£3.65)
1L 2.5% Milk - CHF 2.10 (£1.87)
500g Rösti Packet - CHF 4.40 (£3.91)
1L veg & tomato soup carton - CHF 3.15 (£2.80)
420g can goulash soup - CHF 5.70 (£5.07)
4x 330ml Local IPA can - CHF 10.80 (£9.61 - £2.40/can) Interestingly, far higher were the prices at the airports: Café au lait - CHF 6.90 (£6.14)
Cheese Baguette - CHF 9.90 (£8.81) Other costs, per person1 day adult skipass - CHF 56.00 (£49.81)
1 day adult assurance - CHF 3.00 (£2.67)
Flights, easyJet SpeedyBoarding, front, seat+cabin+hold luggage - £130 return (I think, not certain and will check)
Transfers CH - CHF 102 (£92.50) adult return (train+télépherique+bus) using SBB Saver Day Pass Accommodation
If you were renting our apartment 68m², 2 bedrooms, underground parking, 30Mbps broadband, CH+HW, shared laundry, sauna and boot rooms - CHF 700 (£623) / 7 days (that's the off-season rate)
Comments
When we went in the summer, petrol at our local Swiss 24x7 self-service was exactly the same price as at the Shell garage round the corner at home. Wine and beer was similar to home. Groceries were otherwise much the same, really, given the preferences we applied which are to be price-conscious but we're not going to go to extreme lengths to get the cheapest.
Spending any time at the airport is intrinsically expensive: our 6-hour delay ran up almost as much in refreshments and meals as we'd spend in four days of on-piste lunches.
Overall, as @pamw says, there are so many decisions you make that affect the cost it seems to me that it's not useful to make your primary selection on the basis of your perception of how expensive a country is. Of course, you may prefer a particular country, but that's another issue. And if you're looking at TO prices, then correlation is not causation - an equivalent-looking holiday in one country may be cheaper than another, but it doesn't mean that the country is the cause - there are so many other factors involved.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ive just spent 3 days in Chamonix and a week in Verbier.
The supermarket, ski pass and eating out/ up mountain in Chamonix were staggering and my appraisal is that Chamonix is now more expensive than Verbier.
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@Jonathan Bell, which supermarket? Ski pass and eating out up mountain unquestionably expensive. We never eat up the hill (at least, not in SERAC/CdMB places).
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You know it makes sense.
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| chocksaway wrote: |
| This is going to be difficult. Firstly we need benchmarks. For instance lift passes (in the tables it shows Tignes as a full price Tignes/Val Pass, the 3 vallies resorts are individual passes not 3V). The ski boot hire looks like walk up prices, you can get up to 50% off online and et 6 days worth for 70 quid at say Mountain Story. We then need to define what is a lunch, what type of beer (craft vs Eurofizz) at a resto with a view or a shed in the town square. As for ski schools, a group of 6 with a Brit or 18 in an ESF snake! |
100% right.
As you know, I sort out some of the details for my group in Tignes, and there is no way anyone in their right mind is paying £174 for skis/boot hire.
Your 50% off is absilutely right.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Although I would say that price is probably for first level skis - you can pay whatever you want, which is why these surveys are a bit flawed.
For a number of years some of us got "deals" via tourops, the skis were cheap, lots of 241s etc but of awful quality.
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Poster: A snowHead
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This is indeed the sort of thing snowHeads would be great at... if only we could figure the criteria for comparison.
For example:
My personal experience of Tignes over the couple of weeks of recent bashes, was that in general, folk are greedy, money grubbing and short sighted when it comes to how they treat their customers. Often style is used to excuse charging way too much for too little substance. Paying 9 euros for half a mug of hot chocolate should elicit at least a smile on delivery, if only out of the smug satisfaction of having successfully mugged another sucker.
OTOH, the twin restaurants of Les Marmottes and Les Cascades deliver excellent value, serving up Goulash Soup for a mere 7€ (rivalling Italy for value!) - with one of the servers, looking at my pile of slowly sinking emmental, declaring with glee "You don't want some parmesan too? The cheese is free in our restaurant!"
Just these 2 examples would appear to place it simultaneously at opposite ends of the range for value.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| admin wrote: |
This is indeed the sort of thing snowHeads would be great at... if only we could figure the criteria for comparison.
For example:
My personal experience of Tignes over the couple of weeks of recent bashes, was that in general, folk are greedy, money grubbing and short sighted when it comes to how they treat their customers. Often style is used to excuse charging way too much for too little substance. Paying 9 euros for half a mug of hot chocolate should elicit at least a smile on delivery, if only out of the smug satisfaction of having successfully mugged another sucker.
OTOH, the twin restaurants of Les Marmottes and Les Cascades deliver excellent value, serving up Goulash Soup for a mere 7€ (rivalling Italy for value!) - with one of the servers, looking at my pile of slowly sinking emmental, declaring with glee "You don't want some parmesan too? The cheese is free in our restaurant!"
Just these 2 examples would appear to place it simultaneously at opposite ends of the range for value. |
I agree.
Do you think this has worsened since the first lockdown, in that greedy vendors are making a no holds barred dash to ‘compensate’ for two lost winters?
A regular taxi journey we took in Salzburg was €100 up to 2019/20. Overnight, in same old VW cab and the same personable driver, the price is now €150.
Where I can in general I always vote with my feet, rarely stung twice. With a conveyor belt of far-better-off than the average Joe punters, I suspect many Alpine businesses don’t care one jot.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The criteria is the problem, here in Montalbert one Michelin listed restaurant (Union) 7 course tasting menu €75.00 The Restaurant next door (La Luge) Sirloin steak chips and salad.€16
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@boredsurfin, then, for instance, a list of "standards" e.g. "ordinary steak and chips"
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| boredsurfin wrote: |
| The criteria is the problem, here in Montalbert one Michelin listed restaurant (Union) 7 course tasting menu €75.00 The Restaurant next door (La Luge) Sirloin steak chips and salad.€16 |
...and even then, in some places, a 7 course tasting menu at 75€ would be an utter bargain.
I'm not averse to spending more if I get something better for it: good value though, can be present or absent at any price point.
The place at the top of the funiculaire in Tignes has a Michelin star. I've not eaten a full meal there but the bits and bobs I've had from the venue suggest the premium they add for their 'style' is rather more than I think reasonable. It's also rather difficult to get your change from them as they tend to assume, assertively, that you'll leave it with them as a tip.
I believe the owner's son runs the place in Val Claret that has a star: I have eaten there and, compared to other Michelin star places I've experienced, it was overpriced by about 40%. A fact they appeared to hope was obscured by theatrical smoke and mirrors.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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What this shows is the value of recent personal recommendations, resort by resort. And the more granular it gets, the more pointless the "inter country" arguments become.
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@admin, rumour has it you’ve been to a few resorts. Post up a few on mountain / resort restaurants that you would consider an equivalent experience and I’m sure someone can add some prices.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I would imagine eating in Switzerland will be the most expensive in the Alps by a margin. But there are exceptions.
IMO the 4 best on mountain restos in Verbier are Dahu, Chez Dany, Carrefour and Marmotte.
You can get a pint in Marmotte for 6.5chf.
Pizza in Dahu is 25-30chf but it’s damn good.
Crepe downstairs in the self is 10chf.
A renversée (latte) is usually 4.5chf
Glass of wine starts at 5chf.
For a fillet steak you’re looking at 45-55chf.
Rœsti Creblet at Carrefour is 35chf (i think?) but it’s magnifique
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Well as a direct comparison, I enjoyed a fillet last season at Refugio Emilio Comici, on the Sella Ronda near Selva for a mere 35€.
They actually specialise in seafood but the guys I was with weren't fans of that so the massive sharing platters were out and I had to 'compromise' with one of the best fillets I've had. The service was very far from Italy's finest but the food was top notch.
Not a bad setting either...
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Tue 27-12-22 12:32; edited 2 times in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@BobinCH, Wengen very similar.
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@BobinCH, thats a bloody bargain for wine in CH - especially the stupid 1dl serving (British brain expects a bucket, even after 8yrs). I thought 7chf was a bargain in St Moritz
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You know it makes sense.
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And there are some bargain options like Mayentzet or the Dahu self-service
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Val Cenis lift pass is €204, €221 if you get the Haute Maurienne pass allowing 1 day in La Norma, Bonneval, Aussois and Val Frejus. Up from €170 3 years ago, but still good value and empty pistes outside of holidays. Cheap but limited eating out too.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Looking at those prices from this side of Atlantic ... 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I think @BobinCH's examples illustrate very well that for uk travellers at least, much of the "expense" of Switzerland is down to the weakness of the pound (and strength of the CHF). At what were historical norms, e.g. £1=2.4-ish CHFs, that 20chf lunch is a bit of an £8 bargain ...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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£2250 for a family of three week before Christmas on lift passes and food/drink. 3vallees passes, based in Meribel. Lift pass was £960 of that. £100 spent on cakes 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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One day skiing in Glencoe midweek in perfect conditions £30-£35 for adult, petrol costs return £10-£15, own skis boots and kit. Packed lunch. Total £40-£50 per day.
I would not buy 6 bottles of beer, and 6 glasses of wine, and 6 cans of coca cola due to the queues for the toilet. (plus driving regulations)
There could be some other costs, but this is the basic marginal cost! 
Does it get busy at Glencoe sometimes? - of course, I think the new chair might help with lift queues.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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We seem to spend about £1000 per head on a decent ski holiday no matter where we go. Normally self-catered with decent table service lunch each day. Italy is somewhat cheaper in general for food and drinks on mountain. We don’t find Switzerland noticeably more expensive than any where else, and come away feeling we got good value.
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| Jonathan Bell wrote: |
Ive just spent 3 days in Chamonix and a week in Verbier.
The supermarket, ski pass and eating out/ up mountain in Chamonix were staggering and my appraisal is that Chamonix is now more expensive than Verbier. |
Just not seeing this, sorry. Totally agree that food up the hill (esp if Serac) is overpriced and rubbish. Supermarkets (eg SuperU at Pelerins) way cheaper than any Migros shopping I've done in Geneva (not supermarket shopped in Verbier for a couple of decades, but it can't be cheaper there). Also Restaurants, prices for a decent Italian in Chx way lower than those in the menu shots above, and if you know where to eat 'around' Chx then cheaper still. Finally ski passes, this cheap day pass site discussed on various threads means Chx prices are again way lower than Verbier.
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Zermatt ski school is wrong - the price is completely incorrect for the swiss ski school and also they are full day (not half days as per the criteria in the survey), so taking 3 full days as a fairer comparison it is just about £310 (or c.£430 for 5 full days)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I do sometimes take six large cups of coffee in a flask in my backpack, as the queues for the coffee shop just waste my skiing time and this is limited in Scotland at this time of year due to the sun setting early in January. Much longer ski time in March.
Use the toilets at the base, and watch out for yellow snow!
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| Quote: |
I do sometimes take six large cups of coffee in a flask in my backpack,
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| Quote: |
watch out for yellow snow!
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Are these correllated?
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FAQ
