 Poster: A snowHead
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I think SB sound absolutely disgraceful.
If nothing else resolves it you could try the power of the media I suppose. http://www.bbc.co.uk/watchdog/gotastory/
I hope pandora, Osmum and snowjoke get a resolution they deserve though. No-one should have to put up with that utter s**t.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I was prepared to consider that they might fix the situaiton, they might offer a sincere apology and find a way to make good. JimW, agree completely with your post above.
Following that response I'll never book a Ski Beat trip. Ever. That's probably 20 years yet of ski trips that they have no chance on earth of me ever taking. I bet there's a lot of others who feel the same.
What a godawful complete farce of an attempt at customer service. Now we know who recruited the shouty reps in resorts clearly.
Knobheads. The entire company must be filled with them.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I can see their point. The poster has slagged them off at length for things which were outwith their control, and posted the names of staff with whom she had a problem on a public forum before she even bothered to contact the company and well before she could have expected a response from them. This is hardly the correct way to go about making a complaint.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| pandora wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It takes that long to get from the Tarentaise to Milan. Or did you expect him to teleport? |
Lizzard, we're not sure what we expected him to do. But by some miracle, all of the other tour operators collecting people from Milan that day MUST have teleported, as they were there! Or maybe they set off once they heard the flight was going to Milan instead. Whatever. |
It has already been pointed out on various occasions that Skibeat only operate in Tarentaise, maybe other tour operators have a set up in Italy/Milan and were able to react quicker.
The bottom line is that Skibeat did their best which was not good enough for you (and would not have been for me), and their staff were rude which can not be excused under any circumstances, but reading between the lines I think your group had (rightly so) also become a bit shirty and started to give it the 'big I am ...'.
Your actions, in coming on public forums and the manner in which you have addressed the issue, has imho removed you from the morale high ground and you no longer are going to them with 'clean hands'. In such circumstances (and as a result of this) goodwill on both sides has become negligible and you can not expect anything from Skibeat except for the most basic of responses, which it seems they have now provded. You are financially covered by your insurance and the possibilty of any (corporate) apology that you may have wanted or expected disappeared the minute you posted on here and that mumsnet (or whatever it is called) forum. You had a choice to deal with this in private or deal with it in public and you chose the latter; you have had your pound of flesh by criticising Skibeat in public but it seems that due to these actions you unfortunately will not get a further apology or explanantion.
The only thing I suggest is that you the take some comfort in the fact that you have inflicted considerable 'PR' damage to such an extent that some people have said they will not book with them in the future.
Quite sad all round really 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Whilst having empathy with the way Pandora and group were treated. (With a young family, I would not wish to be in the same position). The main learning point I have gained from this extended thread is as rayscoops says
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the possibilty of any (corporate) apology that you may have wanted or expected disappeared the minute you posted on here
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If I am ever unfortunate enough to be in a similar situation where I feel I have justified complaint, I shall make my formal complaints in private, and pursue this until either fully resolved or receive final rejection.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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rayscoops, Lizzard, 100% agree. Any chance of a favourable settlement has gone. An initial post mentioning being shouted at by the reps - not naming them by name - and mentioning the coach driver's behaviour, as well as an indication that they were pursuing the matter formally would have been enough.
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stoatsbrother, Agreed but I wouldn't even go on the internet in the first place, you give Ski Beat the opportunity to make amends in private. If they don't then you name and shame them on every internet site existing. To try it the other way round shows incredible naivety on pandoras part.
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thefatcontroller, That would be the normal way to expedite these issues. The way it was done doesnt suggest naivety but a different agenda. With the benefit of hindsight I suspect even SB would have handled this differently.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Irrespective of how it got onto the internet the situation is :
Pandoa and co have lost all they are going to lose.
There is no downside risk to them in leaving things as they stand, or indeed continuing with a campaign of negativity (as long as they stick to facts).
Ski Beat will continue to lose unless they change their stance.
They have an opportunity to either halt or reverse the situation.
You can't put the genie back in the bottle, no matter how many sanctimonious postings appear here (albeit they may discourage others in future).
Instead of advising how things should have been handled, how about some of you experts work out what happens next?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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JimW, wot you already said in your post of 00.32 and have just repeated: it's not too late for Ski Beat to salvage some of its lost reputation. It's up to Pandora and her party whether they wish to pursue a claim. My instinct would be that such a claim would be doomed to failure, not least because of the possibility of a successful counterclaim.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Hurtle, yeah I know, buit no-one seemed to be listening cos it was at the end of the page 
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Ski Beat will continue to lose unless they change their stance
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You think? One or two people on here might not book with them, but plenty will if the price is right, and the company already has a legion of satisfied guests (I've met lots of them).
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You know it makes sense.
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JimW, fair enough! Nobody listens to anything I say either (maybe because it tends to be short.) 
Just a few of the things that Ski Beat could do:
1) apologize and offer some money;
2) explain why there was nobody at Milan Airport when the O/P's party arrived;
3) apologize specifically for the poor behaviour of some of their employees/representatives;
4) explain their Company's relationship with the dangerous driver, what (if anything) could or should have been done about that and what sort of measures were being taken against the driver's employer (such as never using them again?);
5) explain why it took so long for them to respond to the complaints (personally I suspect that that was because they were taking legal advice);
6) state what lessons have been learned and the ways in which they propose to tighten up their act in the future;
7) do a bit of PR on this site (but not before 1-6 have been dealt with).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| My instinct would be that such a claim would be doomed to failure, not least because of the possibility of a successful counterclaim. |
and whether successful or not, what Pandora & Co have done by going so public is given Ski Beat grounds to make a defence & counterclaim. Then the ball is firmly back in Pandora & Cos court. Do they expend the time, money and energy pursuing someone who will in any case have PI insurance in place for just such an eventuality and who might win? I think not, they'll give up. Ski Beat's business won't be affected; most of their regular customers won't be aware of this and nor will the majority of prospective customers. People looking for last minute deals won't care a hoot. Reviews I've seen on t'Internet seem to suggest that Ski Beat are pretty good and this thread only appears on page 2 of a google search for Ski Beat. Personally, I'd be fascinated to meet the shouty rep. What's his story?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Hurtle, totally disagree because once the 'gloves are off' there is no turning back and everything has to be strictly by the book.
edit - I think most on here have empathy with Pandora and Co., I know I do
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Sat 13-02-10 11:58; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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rayscoops,
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once the 'gloves are off' there is no turning back and everything has to be strictly by the book
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 That would imply that there are never any out-of-court settlements
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I think most on here have empathy with Pandora and Co., I know I do
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Their experience was undoubtedly horrendous.
thefatcontroller,
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In my days of waiting on tables we had several non confrontational ways of dealing with said person, spiting in their tea, adding nasty things to anything they would eat, warming the side of the cup they would drink from so you knew they would burn their lip, so much you can do without having to shout at the nasty one
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How utterly and absolutely disgusting and stupid.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Mattgcp, Perhaps the customer was a c*** .
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
thefatcontroller,
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In my days of waiting on tables we had several non confrontational ways of dealing with said person, spiting in their tea, adding nasty things to anything they would eat, warming the side of the cup they would drink from so you knew they would burn their lip, so much you can do without having to shout at the nasty one
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How utterly and absolutely disgusting and stupid. |
yeah, criminal, warped, sick, get help.
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thefatcontroller, just insert a few more laughing emoticons, that'll make such filth acceptable.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hurtle, Bode Swiller, if you would like someone to render you a service, it pays to treat them politely.
Not that this excuses minging behaviour like spitting in someone's tea, evidently.
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Hurtle, I am sure you are incredibly polite at all times however you genuinely would not believe how some people treat waiting staff. On those occasions what I saw happen didn't worry me.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| Hurtle, Bode Swiller, if you would like someone to render you a service, it pays to treat them politely. |
we know.
I wasn't there but I can categorically guarantee that the shouty rep would not have shouted at me *
* courtesy of Inflamatory Wind-ups Inc.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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You know it makes sense.
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Is Pandoras holiday the worst holiday ever? Still don't think so.
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No, thefatwaiterfromhell, because Pandora said "Plan Peisey was great, the chalet was OK"
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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JimW, I am not sure people are being sanctimonious. Just pointing out that a good 80% of the stuff the OP complained about (including the coach driver) was out of the control of Ski Beat, and that the remaining issues might have been resolved better on a formal private basis - with posting of details here only if - say - there had been no resolution within 2 weeks. Even then - posting the full names of the reps was perhaps unwise. And we really don't know whether the OPs description of events is objectively accurate and we never will.
But it is clear Ski Beat have got their approach to dealing with this thread, and the complainants, totally wrong. I would never book with them based on that alone.
I'd certainly think very carefully about being rude to a waiter before I received my food. The practices TFC describes are - anecdotally - pretty widespread. But good staff make it easy for one to be a good customer.
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Poster: A snowHead
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thefatcontroller, you have already indicated that you are concerned by the comment "lets get back to the topic shall we" and by the fact that you are trying to distance yourself from the incidents that you described - suddenly the "we did" turned into "they did".
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Lizzard, agreed. I have worked in a variety of service 'industries' and, without exception, the clients who were polite to me got the best service out of me. That's human nature. Equally, nice as it would have been to tell a few of them to f--k off, I needed to retain even the rudest people as clients sometimes, and neither shouting at them nor indulging in the sort of disgusting practices thefatcontroller describes, would have achieved that.
thefatcontroller, I have had the experience, working for a chalet company, of clients being very rude to me. Spitting in their soup did not occur to me as being the best solution.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I stayed in a chalet once where a bit of Hurtle spit might have improved things.
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Bode Swiller, blimey, it must have been bad!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I wonder why anyone goes on a chalet holiday as the spittng on food seems so wide spread. Looking forward to my self catering ski holiday.
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what does the law say in Italy about public service vehicle drivers doing so whil (a) over etheir time limit, and (b) texting while driving ?
Occurs to me taht SB may well be breaking some rather serious law here,
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Everyone's had sh*t happen. I've missed flight connections, lost stuff etc. If you have a genuine complaint, you need to make it in a proper and courteous fashion. That's the way to get compensation / results etc. I would be very careful about posting libellous comments on chat forums. I don't think I would be embarrassing myself by shrieking at chalet staff who, quite frankly, all appear to be just out of school.......
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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sev112, only if they directly employ the bus driver - which seems unlikely - probably a hired coach. Another thing out of their control. Unlike their reps which are wholly their problem.
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After this horror story I would no longer consider ski beat a viable company for my family, but more importantly things can and do go wrong on occassions and companies which stand out are those that apologise and admit mistakes and do their best to rectify mistakes which I don't think SB have done, and it is for this reason I would never consider them. Just wanted to add a number of people asked opinions and ski esprit /mark warner vs ski beat in the last week and I was able to reccomend ski esprit and mark warner and also ski famille but catagorically told them to avoid SB. Another parent (possible a fellow SH) at my sons school was talking about SB and reciting a very similar story, so the word is getting out.
Reputations can be very hard to regain once lost and this is something a company such as SB should consider as word travels quickly.
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FAQ
