Poster: A snowHead
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Im currently doing a report into the biggest problems that we face as snowboarders.
Things such as but not limited to, cost, distance from the mountains, ability, flats or bad equipment advice, may be your biggest issue or even online social media or lack of for the snowboard community.
I’m hoping to produce a definitive list of the most common problems, and really need your input to help compile it. Id love to hear what thing or things bug you the most!
By the way, if you are interested in my findings, pm me and ill happily send you a copy of the report when its done.
Thanks
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Not get the response you were after on TGR?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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The biggest challenge I seem to face as a snowboarder, is that I'm a crap snowboarder.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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TGR gave you most of the answers - the douchebag/clueless nature of many snowboarders not exactly contributing to a positive image. I'd add to that an industry/retail market that assumes everyone is a flippy spinny kid who wants a short arsed symmetrical board - bring back the mansized swallowtail.
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The inability to spot the series of poles that mark the edge of the piste, and sitting somewhere near them when you stop.
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davidoak
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I’m hoping to produce a definitive list of the most common problems
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Sitting down in the middle of the piste ......
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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davidoak, Surely the biggest problem for snowboarders is .....Flats?
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geoffers, thats never been a problem for us
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Boredsurfing wrote: |
davidoak, Surely the biggest problem for snowboarders is .....Flats? |
Heelside traverses - very few are skilful enough to access a long marginal traverse hence general screwing up of the traverse and skiers getting all the best lines.
For every Craig Kelly, Terje, Jeremy Jones, Xavier De La Rue there's hundreds of boring jib gangsta pros.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think actually the biggest problem is getting off chairlifts. It must be, because we have met a number of rather spiffing chaps who have told everyone that would care to listen on the entire way up a chairlift how gnarly their switch nollie was on the last kicker, and how they could do this professionally or something, only for their arrival at the top of the chairlift to result in a complete inability to travel approximately 10 feet in a straight line with their back foot resting on the board.
Can it be that hard? These fellows are clearly experienced snowboarders, they told us so. Skiiers seem to get this from pretty much day two of ever skiing, along with getting across flat bits.
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Monium, your comments reveal that you are a clueless skier who knows zip about boarding. What are you doing in this thread?
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You know it makes sense.
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I haven't done a great deal of snowboarding I admit, it just didn't have the same appeal for me as skiing. These were the problems I found:
• Having a 'blind' side
• Having to walk and carry across flat bits
• Getting on and off lifts, the full duration of drag lifts
• Not being able to stand and chat
• Not having poles for stability and gesticulation purposes
• Baggy clothing does not look good on fat people
Amen.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Having a sport that does not fit into a competitive sport model yet when very rich buisnessmen see the chance to milk more money from it and end up making crap events run by muppets!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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When learning IMHO the biggest problem is ski resorts are marked for skiers.
Blue and green cat-tracks should be marked as triple black diamonds , where as reds should be marked blue/green.
I recon flats and cat-tracks are the biggest reason people fail to enjoy snowboarding. If beginners are told to avoid those tracks, im sure loads more people would persevere than currently do.
Its instinctive for new people in the mountain to look at piste map and try and go round the hill on cat-tracks... after half a day they are ready to either go back to skiing or get back on the plane.
Tux
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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tuxpoo, Agree!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Like anything, you get more out of it once you have some skills but when learning and taking it easy, flats will be tiresome. I like the idea of a piste rating for boarders for the amount of flat they may encounter. The Genepi run at Tignes is a classic example. Awesome if you are happy to carry speed. The worst run ever on a board, if you can't carry speed.
The media image is also a problem. I am 47 and like to think I am a normal bloke who loves boarding. I am not some scrote with my trousers buckled around the bottom of my back bottom. I realise this is fashion and I am just old, but the sport's media doesn't need to perpetuate this image.
Overall, there are far more positives than negatives and I get more out of boarding than I did out of skiing, so I can see things that could be better but don't have any real complaints.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Monium wrote: |
The inability to spot the series of poles that mark the edge of the piste, and sitting somewhere near them when you stop. |
I've had, about 4 times, a turn-the-air-blue torrent of abuse for "sitting in the middle of the piste", when what I was - in fact - doing, was tearfully trying to regain the proper function of my pulmonary system after a massive rib-smashing crash.
PROTIP for other skiers: try saying "are you ok?" rather than "get out of of my f*cking way".
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Surely the biggest challenge for snowboarders is the prohibitive cost and questionable ride quality of split boards, resulting in either excessive boot packing or looking 'different' hiking in snow shoes.
Result: skiers get better snow and more interesting lines off piste, with the exception of those who have access to skidoos / helicopters.
Oh, and the way you guys stack looks like it hurts. A lot.
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I'm not sure I agreee about skiers getting better snow and more interesting lines off piste. With the exception of the extreme end (ie. wathcing free ride competions on tv where I agree I think skiing looks to have more exciting lines) I think it is quite the opposite in fact. To be honest when I watch skiers off piste in powder it all looks rather dull and repetitive and a case of them bouncing left and right in a leg burning mundane S pattern just to stop themselves sinking, as opposed to the nice float you get on a board allowing the rider to float down their own line.
That said I do agree that that its very hard to hold a long marginal traverse on a board as I fatbob mentions above.
It is hard during your first few weeks of riding, but flats on a board you can overcome simply with practice and confidence. If you aren't confident on flats then simply force yourself to do them (every day and several times a day) rather than avoiding them which is what most people do. There's very few times I have to get off and skate now, though it is annoying when it happens.
As for fatbob's earlier comment about "douchebags" (I think he must be using some retro American dictionary? ) or whatever he was mumbling about I can only assume this is tongue in cheek. I thought the rather immature skier/snowboard superiority battle had died off 15 years ago when folk generally grew up. To be honest about half of my thirty/forty something group boards and non of them fit any of the "generalisations" mentioned (douchebags, clueless, gangsta ?!?!), nor do the majority of boarders we see whilst out and about.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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zammo, load of old rubbish - i can go anywhere a skier can go....often quicker than skinning - especially in spring snow conditions when its hardpack.
and enjoy marginal conditions more
splitboards are no more than a ski touring setup.
also most touring setups I have seen skied are a compromise as well - seen lots of bad skiing in the Backcountry due to skinny skis etc.
at the end of the day its all about the down - doesn't matter how you get there.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Quote: |
• Not being able to stand and chat
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Why couldn't you do that?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Mr Technique wrote: |
Monium wrote: |
The inability to spot the series of poles that mark the edge of the piste, and sitting somewhere near them when you stop. |
I've had, about 4 times, a turn-the-air-blue torrent of abuse for "sitting in the middle of the piste", when what I was - in fact - doing, was tearfully trying to regain the proper function of my pulmonary system after a massive rib-smashing crash.
PROTIP for other skiers: try saying "are you ok?" rather than "get out of of my f*cking way". |
One person on their own lying in a heap is treated as a casualty. A line of 7 people sitting tip to tail across a piste, right on the other side of a blind ridge is idiocy.
You would get more help and positive feedback if only some of your peers didn't act like complete cockheads.
Might I also respectfully suggest that having a massive rib-smashing crash is possibly a symptom of being out of your depth a little? Maybe if you had an instructor with you they could help to avoid such problems. Or just use some skis.
I will, however, concede that it's not just boarders that make an obstruction of themselves on the piste. Not kidding, I nearly crashed headlong into a piste patroller with about a dozen kids lined up on the middle of the piste in a completely invisible spot. I didn't even know the dip was there. The air turned a bit blue there as well. The only thing that prevented the accident was me keeping my speed in check because I wasn't 100% sure that the piste was clear.
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Monium wrote: |
Or just use some skis. |
I always stop to ask "ca va?" of my fellow stricken slope user, regardless of what they or I have under my feet (usually skis).
But then again, I'm one of the most courteous people you will ever meet on the slopes.
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You know it makes sense.
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Lizzard,
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Why couldn't you do that?
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unlike on skis it's HARD WORK standing still on a board, as you have to balance on an edge and you don't have centrifugal / centripetal force as a result of tracing a curved path to help you. So if you're not moving you have to sit down (also explains some of the sitting down on the piste - though most boarders try to sit at the sides rather than the middle).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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OP:
biggest problems IMHO are that (in no particular order):
1) the idea that you are/have to be 17 / gangsta / phat / fly to be a boarder, and therefore...
1(a) ... other people/skiers think you are or wannabe gangsta / phat / fly. We are not just sk8terboyz on snow, and some of us have a lot in common with your average skier and why we are in the mountains.
1(b) ...that there is very little focus by board and clothing manufacturers, the industry, film makers on the normal boarder out there. and particularly the (still young enough to want to look stylish but too old to be a phat gangsta with "bum me" trousers) fairly normal 25 to 40-ish rider. I'm smack-bang in the middle of that demographic.
2. lack of watchable films: whilst it might be impressive, Theoretically, to see Jeremy or Xavier fearlessly fly down a 60 deg Alaskan monster mountain or huck 50-foot cliffs, that is in reality SO far removed from anything you will ever be able (stoopid enough?) to do, that you just cannot identify AT ALL and thus less watchable. and a soundtrack that is something other than gangsta / metalhead would be nice every once in a while too. I'm not asking for Mozart here, just something that might be ncie if you looked away. Sadly, "snow porn" is quite an accurate description of most films.
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Poster: A snowHead
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SooperSlyder, it's not that difficult - I stand up on the thing all the time. And you've reading far too much marketing garbage aimed at 14-year-olds - all of the boarders I know are way outside your 'phat gangsta' image (which is probably totally last week, Grandad, especially if someone like you knows about it).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Quote: |
the biggest problems that we face as snowboarders
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People calling it "boarding".
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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it's just a PITA standing up.
and so are all the boarders I KNOW too. but there are a few in resort, I'm sure (though I guess more likely in the park than the gnarl). Anyway, get out your bifocals and go buy / download a snowboarding magazine and see who it's aimed at.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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ps - I wouldnt know if they're there though, coz I prefer my 180s in the pow, not the park.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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More seriously:
1) Quality hire equipment - every shop has a huge choice of skis of all types and standards but often only one generic snowboard, which will inevitably be a floppy POS with horrible bindings.
2) Instruction/ability - hugely more snowboarders than skiers are self-taught to a greater or lesser extent. I think this shows in ability levels on the hill. Sure, snowboarders can zoom around the place pretty quickly (and in control) but most people's riding plateaus big-time because they lack some technique basics that would allow them to progress.
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davidoak, I think ultimately as all the resorts in Europe were designed by skiers, there are areas which are not snowboard friendly. Even the design of the piste map which don't show the direction or gradient of the runs - or even if there's a flat area. There are some runs which you need to walk along no matter how much speed you start it with like the run into Val D. Also I dont think green, blue, red and black go far enough. There are so many variations in a single resort where you can find a blue run which has red type areas and green runs which are more like blues. This will never change I expect but when you're learning the more info you have the better.
I hear in the US that there are more benches where we can sit and strap-up. I found one or two in Flaine and found it very civilised, though I still had to shimmy over to the slope.
Better quality hire. I see the poo-poo my mates ride on and it cracks me up. I bought my own after the first time I went. First boots then a board and bindings I found 2nd hand. I haven't looked back since.
Lastly are drag lifts, they should be outlawed. I don't really have a problem with them myself I just hate them and avoid at all costs. I went on one in Flaine recently and remembered how much I hated them. Went up to the jam park as its the only way.
Just to finish, I don't find a problem standing but choose to sit at times to rest if needed. I find the most ignorant of people who stand in the middle of runs are the skiers. I am not attacking skiers here, this is just my experience. If I run into boarders I might tell them that they could cause an accident and normally they move out the way pretty quickly. Skiers on the other hand look at you as if they have a divine right to be anywhere on the mountain and I, as a boarder, don't!
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Quote: |
Anyway, get out your bifocals Cool and go buy / download a snowboarding magazine and see who it's aimed at.
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14-year-olds, as I already said, which is one reason why I don't read them.
The tall Ts and baggy pants types are mostly lurking in the park on twin-tip skis at the moment, in fact.
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stevomcd wrote: |
2) Instruction/ability - hugely more snowboarders than skiers are self-taught to a greater or lesser extent. I think this shows in ability levels on the hill. Sure, snowboarders can zoom around the place pretty quickly (and in control) but most people's riding plateaus big-time because they lack some technique basics that would allow them to progress. |
If the number of snowboarding lessons that I see is typical I think that's right. Many, many more ski lessons compared to snowboarding lessons taking place. While I'm not a snowboarder so maybe not in the best position to comment, I do see a very high proportion of boarders who rely on kicking their board around with the backfoot and a lot of sideslipping to get around the mountain. I see fewer skiers relying on the equivalent low level technique to get around the place.
So maybe the key thing which is generally holding snowboarding back is a lack of available instruction and/or the perception that lessons aren't necessary to get better?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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rob@rar wrote: |
stevomcd wrote: |
2) Instruction/ability - hugely more snowboarders than skiers are self-taught to a greater or lesser extent. I think this shows in ability levels on the hill. Sure, snowboarders can zoom around the place pretty quickly (and in control) but most people's riding plateaus big-time because they lack some technique basics that would allow them to progress. |
If the number of snowboarding lessons that I see is typical I think that's right. Many, many more ski lessons compared to snowboarding lessons taking place. While I'm not a snowboarder so maybe not in the best position to comment, I do see a very high proportion of boarders who rely on kicking their board around with the backfoot and a lot of sideslipping to get around the mountain. I see fewer skiers relying on the equivalent low level technique to get around the place.
So maybe the key thing which is generally holding snowboarding back is a lack of available instruction and/or the perception that lessons aren't necessary to get better? |
Lessons are for SQAURES, tight-pants!
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Mr Technique,
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