Ski Club 2.0 Home
Snow Reports
FAQFAQ

Mail for help.Help!!

Log in to snowHeads to make it MUCH better!
Username:-
 Password:
Remember me:
durr, I forgot...
Or Register
(to be a proper snow-head, all official-like!)

Climate Change?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I apologize if this has already been discussed to death but reading this NYT article about how the Winter Olympics will have problems finding new venues in the future has made me wonder what snowheads' opinions are. Is it universally agreed upon here that climate change is currently going on? If so, is there disagreement on the severity of it?

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/01/11/climate/winter-olympics-global-warming.html
snow conditions     
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
It's happening. Whether it is caused by human activity is a different question. Whether the measures being taken are actually addressing the main causes is also questionable. As I understand it we will all have to become vegetarians if we are going to make any difference!
latest report     
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@südtirolistdeutsch, It has been discussed. My penny -
1- the climate is changing, it is always changing, always has been
2- is the current rate of change faster than other periods before? Maybe, we're looking at a short period that geologically is a blink of an eye. I don't think that current methods have the required resolution to assert this, OTOH we are living in period of relatively fast change, and that is a worry
3- Is it man made? I think that mankind has an impact, as most do. However, I think that too much blame gets put on CO2 emissions and that the suggested "solutions" are bonkers. We're talking about electric cars without talking about nuclear power, we're talking about preservation and recycling but we're not talking about population growth (how much heat are 3 or 5 more billion bodies generating? How much heat are a few million more houses retaining? How many acres of forest are gone to make room for those houses, roads, place to grow food for them?). Yes, we should recycle, think about the impact of our actions, but we should also tackle the less pleasant and politically correct issues.
I can tell you that I have 2 boys. When we thought about a 3rd child, among other issues (it is a complex matter and I'm certainly not criticising people that made different choices) the impact of the population growth came up (it wasn't in the top 3, but it was there)
Maybe the non vaxxers are on to something Twisted Evil
snow report     
 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
Pretty much as @sugardaddy, said. Except family planning issue (!)
snow conditions     
 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@peanuthead,
Quote:

Except family planning issue (!)

I know it is perceived as controversial, but I think it needs to be addressed before Nature addresses it (as it did in the past - the plague, famine) or another large scale (world) war
snow report     
 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
@sugardaddy, Completely agree, unfortunately no politician will grapple with it for fear of being called genocidal. I think BoJo did mention it once.....

Likewise there is a climate change industry and many academics rely on research grants, so the final recommendation is always more research.

Finally, we do not understand the sun, we have never been there and unlikely to ever send even a basic probe. We have less than 100 years of observations that are academically credible. As the sun ultimately drives our weather we need a lot more data on its effects to decide how much man is affecting the weather. That said the less stuff we pour into our very thin atmosphere the better. It is sobering to think that at the top of the Grande Motte in Tignes you are already about a third of the way to leaving it.
latest report     
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I'm a big fan of what Nassim Taleb calls the "Precautionary Principle" w.r.t. climate change. It goes roughly like this (my words):

1) We want to assure the continuation of human civilisation.
2) The earth's climate is critically important to the stability of human civilisation (e.g. if everyone needs to leave Bangladesh, where do they go? Can the vast institutions that provide us with food etc. actually survive even moderately rapid change?).
3) We *do not* understand the earth's climate well, especially over the long timescales that we need to consider for continuing civilisation.
4) We *do* have strong evidence in models and in observations that changes in atmospheric concentrations of CO2 and some other gases can cause significant change in the climate.
5) Therefore, we should not be making large changes to the atmospheric concentration of those gases, not because we know what will happen, but because we *don't know*.

Don't mess with critical systems with complex behaviour that you don't understand. Elon Musk puts it succinctly "[Burning fossil fuels is] the dumbest experiment in history".

If your goal is less grand than continuing human civilisation, e.g. just skiing up until you drop dead, then of course the above logic might look different.
snow report     
 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@skeksis, fully agree with that.
latest report     
 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
And of course electric cars are clean. They cause no pollution through their lithium batteries and, of course all that electricity is clean because it is conveniently forgotten about because it is distant from the vehicle.
The earth's climate has always changed as has its land masses due to continental drift. We were once a tropical country-well the bit of ground upon which we currently exist................
snow conditions     
 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
@chocksaway, don't these count?

https://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/

https://sdo.gsfc.nasa.gov/
ski holidays     
 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
meh
I remember when it was called global warming....

Just an excuse for educated professors to get funding for gainful employment.

IMO its all cycles and cycles within cycles & cycles within cycles. Maybe we are contributing somehow, maybe the cycles are big enough to absorb what we do.

People then point to extreme weather. Well our Sun & Moon has a big impact on our weather. We know little about both.

I wont take 100 years or 10,000 years of scientific data when it it is just a small sample of a planet that has been here for billions of years.
Just look at the cycle during the day to weeks to months to years, in your lifetime, its always different. No 2 days are exactly the same.
latest report     
 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
südtirolistdeutsch wrote:
Is it universally agreed upon here that climate change is currently going on?

Is that a serious question? Please don't tell me there are still people who don't believe in human induced climate change (Trump aside obviously).

The question of what we do about it, is for sure more complex and difficult.

But it's not an excuse not to try.
latest report     
 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Quote:

Just an excuse for educated professors to get funding for gainful employment.

Yeah, who needs experts rolling eyes

Quote:

Just look at the cycle during the day to weeks to months to years, in your lifetime, its always different. No 2 days are exactly the same.

Like Trump, you are confusing climate with weather.
snow report     
 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Mr.Egg wrote:
meh
I remember when it was called global warming....


No you don't because the two were always different things to anyone with the slightest understanding of the topic. Global warming is only one element of climate change. The ice ages are of course another.

Mr.Egg wrote:
IMO its all cycles and cycles within cycles & cycles within cycles. Maybe we are contributing somehow, maybe the cycles are big enough to absorb what we do.


There certainly are cycles that have significant effects. How much relative to other inputs is of course the trillion dollar question...

@sugardaddy, @skeksis, good points. The Gaia hypothesis slant is an interesting/reassuring/absolutely terrifying one, though of course it's easy to attribute things to it without them really being so...
snow report     
 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Mr.Egg wrote:
maybe the cycles are big enough to absorb what we do.

Whatever we do will be absorbed. It's a question of eliminating human suffering and maintaining a viable habitat for ourselves and future generations. Why wouldn't you do something if you could?
latest report     
 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Layne wrote:
Mr.Egg wrote:
maybe the cycles are big enough to absorb what we do.

Why wouldn't you do something if you could?


because I am only here a short time & my job is to look after myself.
snow conditions     
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Mr.Egg wrote:
Layne wrote:
Mr.Egg wrote:
maybe the cycles are big enough to absorb what we do.

Why wouldn't you do something if you could?


because I am only here a short time & my job is to look after myself.

Selfish prick.
snow report     
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Mr.Egg wrote:
Layne wrote:

Why wouldn't you do something if you could?


because I am only here a short time & my job is to look after myself.


That really is very selfish.

Humanity would not progress very much if nobody cared what we're leaving for our descendants.
ski holidays     
 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
musehead wrote:
Mr.Egg wrote:
Layne wrote:

Why wouldn't you do something if you could?


because I am only here a short time & my job is to look after myself.


That really is very selfish.

Humanity would not progress very much if nobody cared what we're leaving for our descendants.


well im leaving them a corpse & financial headache NehNeh
ski holidays     
 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@Mr.Egg, ah, I was a callow youth once as well. I think I have grown up a little.
snow report     
 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
Layne wrote:
südtirolistdeutsch wrote:
Is it universally agreed upon here that climate change is currently going on?

Is that a serious question? Please don't tell me there are still people who don't believe in human induced climate change (Trump aside obviously).

The question of what we do about it, is for sure more complex and difficult.

But it's not an excuse not to try.


http://youtube.com/v/C5AUOWNg_sE

8.30 on is interesting
snow report     
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
chocksaway wrote:
Finally, we do not understand the sun, we have never been there and unlikely to ever send even a basic probe.


Well apart from the SOHO probe which under a new name's link shows has been observing the Sun for 22 years and the SDO which has been observing the Sun for 7 years, it's now only 195 days till the scheduled launch date of the Parker Solar Probe, which will approach to within 4 million miles of the Sun's surface Shocked , having to withstand fierce heat and radiation conditions. Cool
snow conditions     
 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Man made climate change is a reality. The global temperature has never changed as fast as it has in geological history ( since fossils were laid down) otherwise the rapid changes currently impacting on Great Barrier Reef etc would be seen in fossil record. For those deniers citing the “climate change industry” do you not think that if the wealthy coal and oil industries could find a CREDIBLE scientific community to disprove climate change we would know about it? Climate change means more energy in the atmosphere; warmer and soggier (like the current ski season) for most of us but impact on ocean currents etc could mean droughts for some. and major impacts on food production amongst other things. What we do about it is another matter. Lots of tokenism eg electric cars (but needed for NOx reductions) and anguish over airline flights. We get far more and dirtier emissions from cargo ships bringing all our manufactured goods from China and elsewhere. Population growth and industrialisation of third world and developing countries als have a massive impact
snow report     
 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@On the rocks,

And cows farting
snow report     
 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
under a new name wrote:
@Mr.Egg, ah, I was a callow youth once as well. I think I have grown up a little.


Like i said, i remember when it was called global warming. That should indicate im no yoof
snow conditions     
 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@Mr.Egg, yes indeed, methane (very powerful greenhouse gas) from cattle has a surprisingly large impact, particularly in US and Australia
ski holidays     
 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
You do all realise that the earth is flat, don't you?
ski holidays     
 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Climate change and man's influence is not controversial. It is scientific proven, widely accepted. Problem is that we don't like science anymore, we prefer markets, we prefer competition.
It is presented as controversial by oil companies and other lobbies. Just as the tobacco companies did 40 years ago. They are being sued already.
Oil companies are following.
ski holidays     
 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Stand corrected on probes chaps but my point remains valid - we don't understand it and 7 years of data is only a tiny fraction of 1% that would be required.
latest report     
 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Found this very interesting study on snow in the Swiss Alps from 1931-1999, not too sure what to make of it though.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/joc.912/pdf
snow conditions     
 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
The scientific consensus is there.

I'm in BC now and we've Alaskans moving here for the snow because they think it isn't as good as it was ten years ago up there.

What we can meaningfully do as individuals, apart from vote, is a different matter.
snow report     



Terms and conditions  Privacy Policy