Trip costs - reality check

A snowHead

As usual I'd like to plan the family trip. Various reasons have meant it's all been left too late etc.
Usually we drive to an airport far from where we live in the SWest, fly with a package and drive home again. It's never ideal, sometimes with a 5 hour drive in the UK.

To cut a long post short the cost for family of four package to ski over easter in France from Bristol seems to be in the region of £3.5K including equipment and lift passes. I've done variants of this calculation including better or worse accommodation but it still remains around £800 for lift passes and equipment hire on top of package price of something like £650 PP.

So what if I were to drive but hire a car?

Here's my guess but could anyone tell me how realistic these prices are?

Hire car costs around £500 for a week*
What would fuel cost to the French Alps? Estimate £300??

Chalet hire = £600 ?? < not fancy but not a shoe box either

Equipment lift pass as above = £800 < three pairs of skis, three pairs of boots, family pass.

Also do I need snow chains and can I get these hired in UK (AVIS, HERTZ people)?

TOTAL: circa £2200 < Does that look about right?

Any advances or reality check inputs into my last attempt at costing a holiday.

*hire car as I don't want to drive my oldish and gas guzzling 4x4 so would be nice to have someone else take the burden of the car reliability/wear and tear.

A snowHead

Hire companies can be fussy about crossing borders so that might be an issue for you.

I also think you have underestimated the chalet hire cost. You might be able to rent an apartment for something like that, but it won't be fancy.

You do need to possess snowchains, but you probably won't need to use them

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

johnnyh, you will need chains, but I doubt you will be able to hire them in the UK. Make sure they know you are planning to drive the car abroad, as the insurance requirements may be different.

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johnnyh, unless I missed it, does that chalet cost include the catering/food i.e. half board?

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johnnyh, your biggest challenge is going to be finding a car hire company that will let you take the car out of the country. Can you swap cars with a friend for a week or so?

You are missing:
- ferry crossing
- motorway tolls in France (plug a route into www.viamichelin.co.uk and it'll tell you the tolls)
- food

Accommodation cost looks too low IMV.

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FlyingStantoni, my mate hired a Golf and drove it to Morzine - just under £200 including the EU insurance etc.

After all it is free

Thrifty let you take a car abroad. There are milage limitations, but will allow it. They are a franchise so you can negotiate with your local dealer.

FlyingStantoni, Ferry crossing / motorway tolls very good point, I knew there was something.

Car hire websites seemed to indicate that additional costs apply for crossing borders but it's around an additional £80 so I can factor that in.

Accommodation was approximate based on something which was nice but not luxury but I take all the points that it will probably be more.

I'm just trying to work out if there is significant saving in driving even if I add hire car costs. Also considering we could take food in car so self catering is likely. What about parking in resorts is that a cost I need to worry about?

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And when you say "chalet" for accommodation would an apartment do (as there's four of you)? This place (to which I have no connection, it's just it was suggested to us as overflow for a catered place we were considering next door):

http://www.ownersdirect.co.uk/france/fr5754.htm

Looks like it's £750 for a week at easter.

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A Mondeo estate would be a good car.

Last year 4 of us drove in a petrol version from Holmfirth to Termignon. The car covered 1918 miles using 233.11 litres of fuel at a sterling equivalent cost of £329.11. That’s 37.4 mpg and a cost per mile of just over 17p. The total cost of french tolls was €169.10. More details and ideas here:
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?p=2027068

We're doing the same this Easter.

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johnnyh, alternatively, go to Austria and drive through Germany - no tolls but possible issues with winter tyres. One benefit of driving is that you can consider accommodation that might not be adjacent to the slopes or even on a bus route provided you choose a resort with an adequate car park. Driving to the slopes with your skis in the boot is far more civilised than fighting for space on an overcrowded ski bus.

Chalet = apartment = hotel room yes, anything really. Thanks, andy from embsay,

altis, interesting break down of costs. At least I can start to get a better idea of the overall price.

You know it makes sense.

OK I live in the Midlands not the South West but my costs at Christmas were IIRC £400 for fuel, Tolls, and Tunnel. I think you will be doing well to get the lift passes and equipment hire for under £800, but I suppose if you only ski for 6 days instead of 8 it may be possible. For food and drink I budget £10 per person per day, but that doesn't include eating out on the mountain or in the evenings. Some people advocate shopping in the hypermarkets on the way but I always just use the resort shops. You should be able to get a 1 bedroom, 40m2 apartment in Les Arcs for about 550 euro over Easter (23/3/13), see http://www.alpes-horizon.com or visit the resort website. So I reccon you could do it for about £2000 plus car hire.

Most resorts will charge to park in or near the resort. Once again the resort web sites carry the information.

Just buy the cheapest chains you can find for the car you are hiring. It is unlikely you will need them but when you do you do.

The only real problems as I see it are:

1/ For some reason ski resort web sites are the worst designed web sites in the world.

2/ Driving from the South West to the Channel.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

Don't forget euro insurance, euro breakdown cover, then various bits you need to have in the car for driving in france......

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Don't forget food! We spent close to €300 on a weeks shop close to resort for family of 5 (ok quite a lot of that was the wine!) if you're going to eat out at any point it will be close to €100 for anything reasonable with a bottle of wine.

Check what apartment includes, may be another €100 for bedding and towels

Lift passes you can sometimes get good savings if you are booking through resort tourist office, also check if there is a family pass as this often provides a small discount.

Depending on resort, but for sake of argument in Les Arcs you'd struggle to get lift passes and ski hire for your budget.

Chains you may well need them, plus legal requirement of course.

Bottom line is skiing isn't cheap with a family - I just hand over the credit card and try not to look at the bills!

Apologies if missed it, but why hire car to drive there? I would guess that taking own car is cheaper and less hassle

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andy from embsay, ah so I did miss it Embarassed

Unless it has a reputation for unreliability I'd still prefer my own car though, with decent breakdown cover as back up, but accept that's personal view

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I'm sure a suitable apartment could be found for under €400 in many places as Easter doesn't seem particulary busy in France. I'd suggest Termignon:
http://www.termignon-locations.com/pages/bienvenue.htm
This is easy to drive to (no windy roads), and there is a lift into Val Cenis from just at the edge of town:
http://val-cenis.haute-maurienne-vanoise.com/
An adult lift pass is €156 for 6 days but there are some promotions too.

I'm sure Les Sybelles will be fine at Easter too, although I'd avoid St Jean and St Sorlin as they are right in the sun. La Toussuire or Le Corbier should be fine and I've never got as far at St Columbin as it's right out on a limb.

After all it is free

Don't know why many of you say taking hired UK car abroad would be an issue. Done it with Hertz and no problems at all. You just need to tell them in advance (24-48 hrs I guess) and then make sure they give you some sort of additional insurance papers you take with you. Most of European countries require driver to have driving license and insurance while in the car (from what I know this is not necessary in the UK). You'll pay for that extra insurance too (I don't remember exactly but it was around 15-20 quid a day for Ford Focus).

You can buy snow chains while on your way to the resort. Many companies charge some ridiculous money for them. I drove to Baqueira last week and found out I could buy them cheaper (less than 40EUR, 15" wheels) at a petrol station than renting them from Sixt (around 50EUR afair).

Check (AA website?) in which countries winter tyres are compulsory. I don't think you will get them in here. Not even for an extra charge (unless you hire in Highlands on something). This may narrow down your selection of resorts.

Shoe box S/C in Tower block in Tignes, I once got flat for 6 for 4 at people £36 per head for a week this was negotiated there. Forget about the flat think of the skiing need good snow late think Tignes. Or if it is forget all the logistics and go Club Med.

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All great and useful responses. Thanks.

As I say hire car is really for peace of mind and to a lesser extent economy; with my car doing about 19 miles to the gallon and also near 100,000 on the clock, although it's as reliable as one might expect for an old truck it would probably be just my luck for the timing belt to go half way between Calais and some mountain. (Just had the timing belt changed but using that as a worse case example).

As I'd be doing all the driving a new vehicle would be a bit of fun too. I guess I'd need to factor in a Formula 1 stop over as well in my pricing. Still feel as though this might save me the all important £1k or so bringing the holiday in at a more sensible, recession factored and me being a student size budget.

Still worried about snow chains a bit. Are these easy to pick up in France? Wife speaks French so no problem asking but I'm not sure driving around trying to find "Le Halfords" will go down too well.

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Any half-descent supermarket will do.

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I always reckon the cost of my return trip, driving to the alps, is not far off £500 - possibly more if making an overnight stop anywhere more upmarket than Formule 1. That's taking no account of vehicle costs - and my car is a reasonably economical diesel. With the extra costs of car hire on top, £20 a day extra insurance quoted above etc etc it doesn't really add up.

Your best bet might be to wait for a last minute bargain package and be flexible about where to go. It won't be cheap, but since when has family skiing been cheap?

johnnyh, genuine offer - I'll do you accommodation in a very nice catered chalet (including great food and unlimited quantities of nice wine!), 6-day lift passes for 4 people and equipment hire for 3 people for £2,030. Get yourself here for £500 and you've saved a grand off your total above! (For the week of 6th April - sorry, jammed for the other week of Easter!).

You know it makes sense.

Look for snowchains at petrol stations closer to the mountains. I could get them in Catalunya (along Barcelona-LLeida autovia) so I can't see why you wouldn't get them in (close to) French Alps. Or try Intermarche.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

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A rough idea of how our lads' trip (next week) is expected to work out. 6 of us this year with 3 items of luggage checked in (others have hand luggage only) flying Easyjet from Birmingham or Stansted. 2 hire cars (one medium sized for luggage/ski carriage, one small for people) staying in our apartment which is charged at the rate we would have earned from the agency if it were let. Off peak weeks would have been a bit cheaper.

All figures GBP and approx.

Flights 600 (obviously those with checked bags pay more but mine was only £85)
Cars 475 (hire, fuel, nil excess insurance)
Apartment 450
Food 250
Total 1775 (so 296 per person)

Add on ski hire (70) lift passes (200) and it comes in around 566 per person plus lunches/drinks out of the apartment etc. We'll get 7 days skiing so comfortably under 100 per day

Same exercise with 4 people would have been around 600 (only one hire car but apartment split 4 ways)

As far as driving out goes it usually comes in around 350 (petrol, tunnel, tolls plus a third of the cost of a Swiss vignette) which is what we do on family trips. Admittedly Chatel is a relatively short trip and we branch off the peage at Langres most times so the tolls are lower. Coming from further in the UK would add a bit more (we only have 110 miles to the tunnel from Colchester). Put the apartment in at the same price and it would be just over 500 per person.

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Passes are the things to save money on, as they're the biggest expense. I just booked Portes du Soleil passes at €200/adult and children free via the Les Gets tourist office. I'm sure you could get an apartment for under €500. Ski hire is what it is, but pre-book using Alpinsports (or similar).

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Trip costs - reality check

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